In all seriousness what would you guys have done differently?

You proposed an impossible to win situation, what the fuck were you expecting?

>fun alt history
that's the problem with alt history. How far am I supposed to suspend my disbelief? If I don't suspend it enough then I'm not "playing along" properly, but if I suspend it too much then I'm just being stupid. Trying to find whatever goldilocks zone of fantasy you want is hard enough, let alone actually managing a discussion within it.

Moscow.

>impossible
as I said you can leave this thread anytime now

this isn't fun alt-history because it's been done to death and it was a no-win scenario
try something different next time like say, you wake up as Vercingetorix in 52 BC, what do you do different?

Also, stop killing civvies and instead encourage anti-Soviet partisans to cooperate. That means of course giving up some part of the lebensraum idea.

>you can't its already under way
This is what made it impossible. If you want to make victory feasible, then you need to change the scenario.

Napoleon went straight for Moscow, which failed due to the distance they were from supplies. The real way to nullify the Soviets superiority in tank numbers would have been to cut off their oil supply.

that is the best broccoli

>now he bashes alt history in general
ugh you guys must be fun irl

Make peace with the West if at all possible, offer full liberation of France and the Low Countries and for the USA to be the arbiter: make these offers publicly so the Brits can't simply ignore them. Under no circumstances declare war on America, and denounce Japan for doing so. Listen to my field generals and don't issue pointless no retreat orders. Encircle Stalingrad and just starve it out, don't try to capture it. Put much more effort into push to the southern oilfields.

just because someone told you another way doesn't mean others wont shed some light on other areas aswell.

Thing is, Hitler has already broken every treaty he ever signed at that point
Why would anyone trust his word on anything

You've given us only one possible outcome, this isn't a fun game to play when the only option is losing.

you never read about any alt history do you? by the way you can still leave the thread if you don't find it fun.

>if you were ceaser what would you do differently
>you've already been stabbed

interesting idea user why didnt herr hitler think of this i wonder atleast untill the war was over?

I wouldn't have broken the Munich agreement. In diplomacy it's important to be seen as a man of your word

Get turkey somehow into the axis. Its the only way to reach baku

Well, I guess I would bleed out.

why should I care about what some /pol/ack posted in their desperate attempt to get me to write up paragraphs of how "hitler could have really won guize xD" instead of them themselves actually doing their own homework?
this is a shit thread, saging it would have been better

I love to hear all kinds of different interpretations. Something your narrowminded kind could learn one day

Go for Moscow instead of Kiev
>inb4 battered and underequipped Soviet troops in the south being able to launch an effective counterattack

>war starts with Soviets
>start moving as much stolen gold and art to Spain
>set up new identity as Spanish merchant for myself and my family
>fake death in allied bombing raid along with family
>flee to south america with my riches with the final goal of migration to the USA or Australia

Why even try to win? Just escape with everything you can carry. Maybe write an autobiography that can be anonymously published after your death.

They're multiple people calling you retarded you faggot.

This exact topic has been done to death. Stop bitching that people aren't playing along on a thread we've had pretty much weekly with the same exact outcome for years before Veeky Forums was even a thing.

oh boy it's this faggot again
>hey let's just leave literally a million men on our already overextended flank while we run our exhausted forces another couple hundred miles away from their logistics lines!

after operation Bleu (the assault aimed towards Stalingrad/the Volga) started going to shit Hitler ordered all the panzer army groups that were making great gains in the Caucasus on their way to Bakus oilfields north to Stalingrad as well as a general hault in the Caucasian front, much to the chagrin of the leaders of the German Caucasus region, given that diverting their panzers to capture a relatively unstrategic place like Stalingrad when the capture of baku was practically guaranteed was retarded.

Send my troops to attack every single neighbor and then

Ignore Leningrad and Stalingrad. Blitzkreig straight ino Moscow before the winter. Kill Stalin. Russians are free from tyranny. Red Army is now allies.

1. Prepare my troops for a prolonged campaign.
2. Deviation of Army Group Center towards Kiev was a good move, it resulted in the largest encirclement in the history of warfare, trapping 700,000 Soviet troops, disregard the autist generals that want me to head straight to Moscow.
3. Set up a puppet Tsarist government centered in Ukraine, do not allow Einsatzgruppen to operate in the East, ethnic cleansing can wait until the war is over.
4. Enjoy partisan support due to treating slavs leniently, Nazis are now seen as liberators rather than psychopath invaders.
5. Focus on bombing the Baku oil fields. Turn them into lakes of fires.
6. Do not delay the attack on Stalingrad, this delay gave the Soviets key time to bring reinforcements and build defensive trenches.
7. Pray this is enough to succeed in nearly unsurmountable conditions.

>the last major transport hub before the Caucasus isn't important

>Prepare my troops for a prolonged campaign
That's not much of an option - the german supply system wasn't going to be able to cope with an extended campaign

>Focus on bombing the Baku oil fields. Turn them into lakes of fires.
Except Germany needed that oil more than the Soviets did

>Do not delay the attack on Stalingrad, this delay gave the Soviets key time to bring reinforcements and build defensive trenches.
again, not realistic - Stalingrad was mostly occupied by the Germans by the time Uranus was launched. The Germans may have been able to take the empty husk of Stalingrad, but that wouldn't have stopped Uranus from annihilating the 6th Army.

>5. Focus on bombing the Baku oil fields. Turn them into lakes of fires.
This, holy shit, this. Also prioritize long-range fighters & bombers to bog down the trans-siberian railroad, killing off the possibilities of lendlease and denying Siberian resources to the Soviet war effort. Your factories can't build tanks out of corn and straw, Ivan.

>strategic bombing
>meaning anything with the industrial capacity of Germany
It was all they could do to keep the Luftwaffe afloat and provide the bare minimum of air support for ground troops, let alone wage an offensive air campaign

A bit of a deviation from the thread's purpose, but would an Ostwall have worked? Like, still blitz the Soviets, but don't stretch your supply lines too far, and then dig in. With the grain in Poland and Western Ukraine, Germany wasn't going to starve. Could they have bled the Russians White like they did in WW1?

That's dumb though, another user made the point that Germany needed the oil. Besides why bomb it when you can capture it? It was hardly defended

You're asking us to do an alt-his in which we shoot ourselves in the stomach. The answer is to die, slowly.

Tanks cannot take cities user

What if Stalin leaves also now you've lost about 25% of your army and 30% of your equipment with no major resource aquisitions.

But how do you take Baku without fucking your supply lines? That's the question. Like, could they have D-Day'd across the Black Sea and dropped an army off in Batumi and blitzed across the Caucasus? Paradrop them in like with Crete?

And then the oil, how to get it to Germany? You'd need a lot more territory than Germany ever occupied to safely carry it over land. Ship it out across the black sea? Was the black sea fleet of the Red Navy worth talking about?

I think the wehrmacht forces *in russia* would have needed it, let alone Germany itself which could have gotten it's supply from romania

Because of the offer of American arbitration. They wouldn't be relying on my word. Of course getting the Americans to agree to this would be difficult to say the least, so I don't expect such attempts to make peace would actually be effective.

Stalin was never going to leave Moscow.

That being said, if Moscow was about to fall, his Politburo would've shot him in the head and set up shop somewhere like Yekaterinburg/Sverdlosk. Vladivostok would be a decent candidate if it weren't for the Japanese.

Were the Romanian shipments enough for Germany's industrial consumption? Obviously the tanks need fuel to run, but they also need to make it to the front and the Russian rail system was still relatively primitive.

The fallback capital would have been Novosibirsk.

Armies don't run on crude oil though, it needs to be refined somewhere and historically the Soviets sabotaged their refining equipment when the Germans got close so it couldn't be used.

Halt offensive to Moscow when severe winter weather sets in, prioritize supply lines and cold weather supplies. Hold the line until spring. Feign weakness and lure the Red Army into multiple offensives in the spring, and a la Kharkov encircle and annihilate them. Don't attack oil fields instead focus on Leningrad and a renewed Moscow offensive. Hope for the best.

also like other posters have suggested treating the Slavs and Balts well, setting up puppet governments for all the occupied republics with their own police forces, to satisfy Himmler and the SS autists those forces can handle partisans and Einsatzgruppen shiet, use the extra SS manpower at the front.

I've always seen this thread x10,000 times before and on sites with a lot better historical analysis and opinion, the result is always the same. There's always that one wehraboo who is telling us 50,000 things that the Germans could have done better by x%, and everybody else informs them that that is not 1) ideologically possible, 2) materially possible, 3)wouldn't work, 4)if it does work, it won't make much of a difference anyway, 5)it'll just make things worse (see: every time somebody says "They should just have gone to Moscow").

White peace with minimal demands

>starting shit with the soviets in the first place with France and Britain already breathing down your neck.
>France

>Encircle Stalingrad
>the city lies on a river
>literally half of it is across a river
>Germans only control one side of the river

>white peace
>demands

People say to go easier on the local populace but how do you reconcile that with the need to take their food so you can keep your troops and civilian populace supplied?

Take half the food
Rape half the women
It's ez

eat the jews

>I think a guy on the internet might have better insight than the United States War College

you might be retarded son

getting bogged down in Stalingrad was bad.

bad was letting Lend-Lease continue thru Iran, Archangel & Siberian railroad

>bad was letting Lend-Lease continue thru Iran, Archangel & Siberian railroad
Yeah they should've taken Iran and Siberia...wait they fucking couldn't in a million years and in fact didn't get anywhere close to those places.

>sign a peace treaty with USSR
>be free to take over Europe without USSR interference
>attack USSR anyway
>make same mistake as Napoleon
Is Hitler the most retarded leader?

Come to think of it, he had to do it because good always triumphs over evil. If he hadn't Europe would be Nazi Germany to this day.

They tried to defeat Britain for a solid year and got nowhere close. Taking down the USSR was their only chance at winning the war.

...

>soviet railway
>primitive
Hell. Fucking. No.

It wasn't primitive?

>its another episode "i could lead nazi germany to victory because i'm such a brilliant strategist"
you faggots are pathetic

Nuke Moscow, Stalingrad, and Leningrad

i think knowing what happens in the future kind of helps too

Promises of land ownership after the war.

Rush through africa and the middle east and attack the soviets from behind, killing Stalin

They already had that fucking brainlet. The economy was based off of collective farming.

turtle and tech up to nukes

cut all ties with japan and italy, try to get america in on the action

>collective farming
>land ownership

brainlet

This

ignore manstein and let guderian do everything.

>le hitler made bad decisions
which i guess is true in that he listened to mansteins ideas and then agreed with them

Listen to Trodt and Bismarck's angry ghost and don't make war with Russia, it's like a baby trying to take on an adult.

>you can't its already under way
Oh fuck you, let Guderian do his fucking work then instead of being a dumbass armchair general, also don't alienate ukranian pro-german sentiment but capitalize on it, work with them until the soviet threat is dealt with.

Also forget the fucking Balkans and Crimea, keep the force on track and make a clear way to Moscow before the winter.

Fpbp

I don't know how well promises would work when their shit is being pillaged at the present and they're going hungry because of it.

me love alt history
alt history is huge fun!

Drop Memensraum immediately, act like the liberators all the non-Russians hoped for

...

Be nice to the conquered Russians instead of letting your autism alienating them and promise them to give them their own country without commies after the war.

Don't declare war on the US, they will still supply the UK but still better than fighting them directly. Tell Japan to either attack in the far east or fuck off, you get nothing from being allied with them and that can be used when negotiating with the UK about peace in europe.

>become chancellor of germany with nothing but your own charisma and cunning/
>revive a country that just lost a world war, and has spent the last decade stumbling between economic crises.
>invade Poland, much of Scandinavia, France, and the Balkans, giving Germany complete supremacy over the mainland (despite your strongest ally being nearly useless).
>as a result of their mobilization against you, invade the strongest and largest military in the world, absolutely humiliating them and stealing vast swathes of their land.
>lose to three superpowers, and a coalition of over a dozen nations besides.
>get called a retard by commie larpers and pseudo-intellectuals
poor hitler

i dont know why some faggots sperg out in this thread. Its not like they are forced to participate

Fpbp

Id put rommel in charge.

>>lose to three superpowers, and a coalition of over a dozen nations besides.
>>get called a retard by commie larpers and pseudo-intellectuals
So much this. I never got that Russian/American/British pride in WW2 victory. It's like a pack of wolves being proud they killed one wolf after a shitload of fighting. If anything it shows how much weaker you are.

>he's implying people who DON'T read fantasy alt history wank are the brainlets

O I am laffin

Capture Moscow, stalingrad, and Leningrad

Dig in in fall 1941 before the winter and remain defensive
Streamline war production
Give Japan the option of invading the USSR (even just Vladivostok to bind forces) or end the alliance
Equip the Romanians and other allies with proper anti-tank and other heavy weapons
Treat the occupied peoples like humans and recruit soldiers from them
Conduct Case blue like they did but don't try to capture Stalingrad at any cost, rather focus on the oil fields
Don't declare war on the US and hope for the miracle that they won't either
Offer a peace treaty when you still have the upper hand
Stop with the Nazi autism

somehow blow up the stavka and kill stalin before moscow causing huge disarray and possible victory

First: Try to win over the population of the occupied lands. Hopefully a deal of food plus tiny pay will get a lot of male population to join pioneer cops. This lead into the second point...
Have plans in place to stop the offense when the winter starts setting in for the year. Moscow inside the first year is off the table if no other reasons then supple line can not go that far that fast.
Second: Around Oct 25 give orders for winter barracks and trench lines to start being constructed. Have the army keep fighting actively for about 5 or 6 days then have them fall back in said trench lines, have them burn everything they leave during the fallback.

This lets your armies resupply, rest, repair their equipment, and refocus for next years spring. The red army will either have to leave yours mostly along for the next few months, do assaults over a good deal of open ground into trenchs, or build trenches in frozen ground.

In every event no fun for them.