Could Rhodesia have won the Bush War eventually if they hadn't surrendered politically?

Mugabe's government seized a bunch of white farmers' land and "redistributed" it to friends and political cronies. The average black and white in Zimbabwe are united in their hatred of Mugabe.

Only if the British had lifted their sanctions.

"kill the boer" vs "No white person will be allowed to own land; Whites will never come back"
WEW FUCKING LAD

no, for me 2 things needed to happen for rhodesia to win the bush war and neither of them were in their control.

>mozambique stays portugese or at least neutral
>south africa continues to defy sanctions and provide some military support.

this wouldn't halt the eventual change and the need to shift to majority rule but it might keep the country out of the hands of ZANU/ZAPU.

>Could Rhodesia have won the Bush War eventually if they hadn't surrendered politically?
Not unless portugal didn't give up, Israel did more than shekelgrub with their obsolete surplus, or LBJ/Harold Wilson weren't nigger marxists.
unbisnet.un.org:8080/ipac20/ipac.jsp?profile=voting&index=.VM&term=sres232
unbisnet.un.org:8080/ipac20/ipac.jsp?profile=voting&index=.VM&term=sres221

You can however govern people who refuse to learn how to read. It's made harder when commies give them arms and propaganda.

Because they got more than market value by doing so.

It was more than the british, although they are the ones that initiated and advocated for them.

>No, there was just too much popular opposition to minority rule.
Following the enactment of the 1961 constitution, there were two voter rolls that were available to voters. The 'A' roll was the more important, with qualification dependent on meeting a financial and educational means test; voters had to be 21 years of age and possess either an annual income of 792 Rhodesian pounds [18,600$ (modern USD)] ( or more or real estate property worth at least 1,650 pounds [38,700$ (modern USD)]– this qualification was lowered to 528/1,100 pounds [12400$/25800$ (modern USD)] if the voter had completed a primary education, or 330/550 pounds [7740$/12900$ (modern USD)] if the voter had completed a four-year secondary education.

Appointment to the office of "chieftain" or "headman" by the government gave automatic access to the A roll. Despite a certain flexibility, the vast majority on the A roll were European. The 'B' roll had a lower set of financial and educational qualifications; voters had to be 18 years of age and possess an annual income of 264 pounds [6190$ (modern USD)] or property worth 495 pounds [11600$ (modern USD)] (reduced to 132/275 [3100$/6450$]if the person completed two years of secondary education, 198/385 [4650$/9030$]if the person was 30 years or older, or 132/275 [3100$/6450$] if the person was over 30 years of age and had completed primary education). Ministers of religion as well as Kraal chiefs with a following of at least 20 heads of families automatically gained access to the B roll. The vast majority eligible for the B roll were African, although a few were European. African nationalists rejected the constitution and successfully persuaded most eligible African voters not to register.

Which roll an elector was on affected the value of their vote in a constituencies and districts. Both the rolls voted for each type of seat. For the constituencies, if the B roll total exceeded one-fifth of the total votes, it was devalued to a maximum of one-fifth. In practice, this never happened, due to the African nationalist campaign to boycott elections. For the districts, if the A roll total exceeded one-fifth of the total votes, it was devalued to a maximum of one-fifth. This was always the case.

>tl;dr
Nothing stopped blacks from being on the 'A' roll, nothing stopped whites from being on the 'B' roll.
Tribal niggers refused to be educated and refused to participate in society, so their influence in the government was limited by their own choices.

Stealing these ideas for brazil

rhodesia.me.uk/UDIConstitutionandFranchise.htm

>tl;dr
niggers got more than they deserved, and then rioted when they didn't get everything.

Also keep in mind the pound mention is the Rhodesian pound, which was worth ~2.8 1960 USD

Opposite question: What if the South African government remained intransigent, let's also say Mandela dies in prison, and the country devolved into civil war in the early 1990s?

Commies don't have spare boats to give to commie niggers.
Whites win.

There were tax bracket and property requirements to be included in the A roll, which effectively barred poor people (mostly black) from qualifying. The mere fact that they had weighted voting instead of normal universal suffrage is obvious evidence of de facto apartheid.

I converted the amounts into modern USD. Your argument is bullshit.

And you didn’t give any data about how achievable those numbers were for the average black person, so just showing how much money they needed doesn’t mean anything. If things were so good for blacks then there wouldn’t have been a war. Comfortable and happy people don’t start a guerilla war just because a KGB agent tells them to.

Also to clarify, before the constitutional amendment, there was only the 'A' roll. The 'b' roll with it's lower requirements was added in order to give those who had difficulty qualify for the 'A' roll, the ability to participate.

Explain how voting requirements that are incredibly easy to achieve and have no racial component result in de facto apartheid. Also universal suffrage is shit and a practical and moral standpoint.

Most countries don't have voting laws that outright say "if you're not this race you can't vote!". Countries with flawed democratic systems always set restrictions on voting in order to discourage or limit certain demographics from voting. The voting system is a response to already existing demographics, by no means was it ever developed to do more than allow whites with colonial money to have more power in politics.

>If things were so good for blacks then there wouldn’t have been a war
Stupid tribal niggers are stupid and believe propaganda. ZANU and ZAPU forces weren't recruiting in the population centers. Commies wanted the ores.

>Comfortable and happy people don’t start a guerilla war just because a KGB agent tells them to.
That's because the comfortable and happy blacks were civilized an integrated into society. That's why there were so many blacks in Rhodesia's armed forces.
youtube.com/watch?v=85jA4rJHvYw

>And you didn’t give any data about how achievable those numbers were for the average black person,
Considering that there was free primary public education, the highest minimum requirement becomes $12,400 modern USD annually.
pdfproc.lib.msu.edu/?file=/DMC/African Journals/pdfs/Journal of the University of Zimbabwe/vol2n2/juz002002005.pdf
Here is a source
$1 (rhodesian) in the paper = $11.72 modern USD
1 pounds = $23.44 modern USD
By my math about 8% of africans were eligible for 'A' roll, or ~65,000 africans, based on annual income alone. And if they didn't meet the annual requirements, they could always just hold land of sufficient value. (hint: most people don't buy a house all at once)
To put that number into perspective, there were only 103,500 europeans working in the cash economy, and they wouldn't all be eligible for 'A' roll.

>The voting system is a response to already existing demographics, by no means was it ever developed to do more than allow whites with colonial money to have more power in politics.
The voting system was put into place in 1918. All the voting requirements have ever mentioned were land, income, age and education. The more educated you are, the lower your land or income requirements become.
The older you are, the lower your land or income requirements become.
The addition of the 'B' roll was to let those who didn't qualify for the 'A' roll to have some limited influence.

Yes, Whites always win when they decide they want to

Both apartheid states that supported each other. Israel's got America by the balls though so it won't disappear as long as America doesn't collapse.

>apartheid
We're talking about Rhodesia, not SA

Rhodesia was property requirement to vote instead of being explicitly racial but it was effectively still White rule.

See: The split was ~3:5

>Support:
Israel

Wait, so libs are right when they talk about Israel being an Apartheid state?

Huh, learn something everyday

Ian Smith did nothing wrong

>Stupid tribal niggers are stupid and believe propaganda.

Lmao do you honestly think that rebellions can be manufactured out of thin air? They can only occur where the population is always dissatisfied.

>That's because the comfortable and happy blacks were civilized an integrated into society.

And yet there were clearly large numbers of people dissatisfied with their conditions, enough to the point of rising up. That’s proof of bad governance on the part of the Rhodesians. A well governed country doesn’t descend into civil war.

>Considering that there was free primary public education, the highest minimum requirement becomes $12,400 modern USD annually.

Great, so now give me statistics on average income among blacks, job opportunities, upward class mobility etc. to show me how viable making it onto the A role actually was.

On top of all this the problem could have been solved by simply removing or drastically lowering the property requirements. The Rhodesians brought this on themselves due to their shitty policies.

Except the terrorists were from Zambia to the north
Rhodesians became less and less content because being in a state of war on the homefront is awful

>Lmao do you honestly think that rebellions can be manufactured out of thin air?
Yes.

>They can only occur where the population is always dissatisfied.
So tribal african niggers?

>A well governed country doesn’t descend into civil war.
It wasn't a civil war.

>Great, so now give me statistics on average income among blacks, job opportunities, upward class mobility etc. to show me how viable making it onto the A role actually was.
Follow the link nigger faggot.

>to show me how viable making it onto the A role actually was.
Well, if you did more than menial labor, the figure skyrockets to way higher than 8%.

>On top of all this the problem could have been solved by simply removing or drastically lowering the property requirements.
You mean the introduction of roll 'B' and the additional lowering or roll 'A'? You know, stuff that they did...

>The Rhodesians brought this on themselves due to their shitty policies.
Are you a leftist or something?
Do some firsthand research. There were no governmental policies that explicitly favored whites, all the policies that mention race are against white interests and very heavily favored Africans and colored people.

Easily. The only reason why Rhodesia, and South Africa + Portugal, lost because they got embargo'd to death by the west.

they could have. but it would have been nearly a fight to the death. but once Portugal lost Mozambique, the war got too hot, too many resources, too much conscription, too many casualties. most people would rather just give up than die.

as for white rule, it would have ended eventually. although the white population was increasing due to immigration, the black population very upwardly mobile. the whole war was completely unnecessary. the blacks would have had rule by the 1990s or so.

sadly no. Its hard to keep your country running when you are being sanctioned, and have almost no allies.

Israel sided with every one of /pol/'s guys in the Cold War

>Rhodesia
>Apartheid SA
>Portugal in Africa
>Pinochet
>Stroessner

etc.

>Could Rhodesia have won the Bush War eventually if they hadn't surrendered politically?

No because the minority whites would want to stop fighting because the war was taking valuable time from men who should be working into fighting

>as for white rule, it would have ended eventually.

You mean if there was no war? According to unesco only at 2050 with the rates rhodesia was going at would blacks be the political majority under the devised system.

>That's why there were so many blacks in Rhodesia's armed forces.

Lol wrong. Theu only joined the forces because that was the only jobs black had that paid a decent wage.

one very good sources on Rohdesia

unesdoc.unesco.org/images/0001/000161/016163eo.pdf

Also seeing as

>The election was held using two electoral rolls, an A roll, which was largely white (95,208 whites and 2,256 black Africans) and a B roll, which was largely African. Although both rolls could vote for all 65 seats, A roll votes were given higher weighting for the 50 constituency seats, and B roll votes higher weighting for the 15 district seats.

Was extremely discriminatory to B Roll voters. In constituencies B roll Votes were capped to a 25% in voting power.

wtf I love Israel now