*Grants you citizenship*

*Grants you citizenship*

Other urls found in this thread:

harvardartmuseums.org/art/287370
youtube.com/watch?v=k9ku4S5Q2kY
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

>just to tax you so that he might fund his alexanderboo programs

Hey mane, thanks for the citizenship. Where can I apply for them benefits because Brunhilda and my nine children ain't gonna feed themselves.

Danke. Now where the latina wymin at?

Thanks
Now I finally can take a bath in your nice bath houses youve build in rome recently

Why doe he looks like a mexican?

Mexicans are Roman that's why they invented the Caesar salad.

Thank you for your benevolence, Emperor

He was North Africano+Levantino.

He looks Mediterranean

I'm half Jewish and I look a lot like this guy.

Oooga booga were da Rum wymn at?

Did the Roman empire have border control?

There are no physical descriptions remaining of Caracalla. So, it's basically just guess work. Historians do acknowledge he looks racially different than the common "Nordic" phenotype of past emperors

>"Nordic" phenotype of past emperors
WE

I'm not really sure what the proper term is for light skin, light eyes, and light hair. That's why it's in quotes.

We have records detailing the appearance of most early emperors, but Caracalla.

>the common "Nordic" phenotype of past emperors
This is all so tiresome

The image is based on this statue. Also known as "le disdain for plebs face."

>light skin light eyes light hair
Light skin sure, but many emperors were red-haired (grecian) and had darker eyes.

I know what it's based off of. I'm saying that there are no written descriptions of Caracalla, which makes it guess work. Historians however do acknowledge he was racially different than earlier emperors, so the guess work is probably close. Maybe a bit too dark, since he was only a fraction Middle-Eastern

Fuck he even looks like an asshole

Plenty of blondes in Northern and Central Italy. It's not some big mystery. Many Italians have always had blonde and red hair since the beginning of time, throughout the Rennaissance and into the modern era.

Only retarded mallsharters think Italy is some place with brown people and stereotypical Mario Bros characters.

Nordic doesn't mean what you think it means, nor what /pol/ tells you it means

Not even going to lie, I actually really like that reconstruction. It's not wewuzzy and it lends a lot more humanity to Roman artwork.
On that note, why haven't there been more tests to determine if paints were used on busts like those?

I'd consider red-hair to belong in the light hair category.

Yep

All you had to do was literally read 2 posts down. Try finishing the thread before posting next time?

This. Even the Greeks knew this; southern Italy up to about the range of the Etruscans was mediterranean by way of migration and colonization from the coast upwards, while from the north downwards was what we'd consider stereotypically 'European'
By the time Rome consolidated power in Italy, the two groups were highly mixed.

Except red/auburn hair was also used to describe brown hair as well

I don't really know if we should take written descriptions of emperors that seriously
See this thread

Okay. And....? What's the point you're making?

I mean...instead of anthropology pseudo-scientific guesswork about migration patterns, you could just pick up a book and read what they wrote about themselves

Luckily,

1. There are hundreds of sources outside of what your little picture could probably show

2. The words of ancient historians (although they may have lived far after and may exaggerate at times) are still more reliable than the guesswork of fat dweeb on Veeky Forums

Relevant

>1. There are hundreds of sources outside of what your little picture could probably show
Source? I dont doubt you, I'm actually curious
>2. The words of ancient historians (although they may have lived far after and may exaggerate at times) are still more reliable than the guesswork of fat dweeb on Veeky Forums
I guess they are equivalent desu, considering the circunstances

Dude was Berber and clearly had some SSA ancestry

>read what they wrote about themselves
If you mean the Romans, most Roman biographies we have today were written by people who lived well after the subjects they wrote about, and were (allegedly) compiled based on previously written information now considered lost.
But the Greeks were writing about ethnology as far back at least as Herodotus, who proposes the model of Anatolian origin for the Etruscans that later Romans would use to validate their Aeneid lineage (though Herodotus failed, like most Greek ethnographers, to deduce the origins of Hellenic peoples as Pelasgian).

Basically, people aren't good at writing their own ethnography.

>ethnology
Ethnography*

Right but that's not fucking Nordic, look at her big nose and the mouth. She's just a typical Italian looking girl with paler skin and light eyes

That user admitted he didn't mean Nordic, he meant 'northern European'

>I guess they are equivalent desu, considering the circunstances
no, no one on this website is the "equivalent" to Plutarch, Seutonius, or Pliny, or anyone for that matter. I know this website is full of stupid outcasts, but I didn't think they were stupid enough to compare themselves to ancient historians
>Source?
Source for what?

Right, but their works are the closets we've got. It's wrong to completely shit on them.

>respectforpatricians.jpg

I imagine the original colors being really gaudy and ugly to the modern eye. The colorless busts we see now probably look way better, but to an ancient it would feel unfinished.

I was replying to him that Italy has plenty of blondes without them being "Nordic". Precisely, your point is the same as mine.

The most common hair color in North Italy is light brown, in fact.

>no, no one on this website is the "equivalent" to Plutarch, Seutonius, or Pliny, or anyone for that matter. I know this website is full of stupid outcasts, but I didn't think they were stupid enough to compare themselves to ancient historians
Read that thread again. You're literally thinking that they are right just because they are "ancient historians". They were just people that could wrote what they want, including lies and propaganda. Suetonius btw is heavily criticed by a lot of scholars. I dont know much about the others, but thats not really the point.
>Source for what?
For your claim that there was "hundreds of sources outside of what your little picture could probably show"
Again, I dont doubt you, I'm just curious

I'm the original guy who called them "nordic". although Italy that color might be more common in Italy, it's wrong to use modern statistics to try to identify people who lived so long ago.

That just ventures into the real of pseudo-science

There is no break in continuity friend. Historical accounts from Ancient Rome, throughout the Rennaissance and into the modern era describe red, blonde and light brown haired people. Genetic testing shows little to no variation in Italy'a population.

A + B = C

It's the same people.

>For your claim that there was "hundreds of sources outside of what your little picture could probably show"
There are hundreds of detailed descriptions, and the ancient never bothered to compile them into a single passage, so any source is going to be about specific people only

A funny story is Verus sprinkling gold dust on his already blonde hair, to make it ever more blonde. Harvard's art museum talks about it
harvardartmuseums.org/art/287370

Another interesting story is the Athena Parthenos statue. It's the largest indoor sculpture in the western world, and was designed exactly how ancient source described it (pic related)

These are just a few light humored examples

>youre literally thinking that they are right just because they are "ancient historians".
I know they are not 100% right. But, they're opinion should be respected for above any regular person like you or me

That might be so, but you still shouldn't really use a modern example to try to draw attention to an ancient people

>There are hundreds of detailed descriptions, and the ancient never bothered to compile them into a single passage, so any source is going to be about specific people only
>A funny story is Verus sprinkling gold dust on his already blonde hair, to make it ever more blonde. Harvard's art museum talks about it
>harvardartmuseums.org/art/287370
>Another interesting story is the Athena Parthenos statue. It's the largest indoor sculpture in the western world, and was designed exactly how ancient source described it (pic related)
>These are just a few light humored examples
I don't really get your point, since we were talking about the emperors especifically. I never denied that there was blonde people in ancient Rome.
>I know they are not 100% right. But, they're opinion should be respected for above any regular person like you or me
Sorry, but I don't take seriously what a historian writes about the physical appearence of someone that wasn't even his contemporary. Maybe he got from someone else, but at least I don't know from whom.

Just to add, I agree, obviously, that ancient historians are more credible than us, but I don't believe in what there is other reliable evidence except his words.

"Original" Athena was definitely black-haired. It's likely a Mycenaean goddess (or maybe even Minoan). Only later she is described as golden-haired (same with other heroes from the dark ages).

>But I dont believe in everything they write if there is no other reliable evidence
Fix'd

I just gave you a physical description of an emperor.

>Sorry, but I shit on ancient historians
Then you're a fool trying to sound smart. Nothing more to it really. You won't impress anyone talking like that

Well, she's a mythical goddess who takes on characteristics of her worshipers. Just like blonde Jesus in the 1600s. Art is just example of the reflection of what ancient people thought about themselves

>Medshits getting triggered by facts yet again

>Art is just example of the reflection of what ancient people thought about themselves
Athena is described as blonde by poets who lived in the Dark Ages after the alleged Dorian invasion.

>Maybe a bit too dark, since he was only a fraction Middle-Eastern
The other fraction was punic-numidian user

Yes, you gave a story about the description of one emperor.
>>Sorry, but I shit on ancient historians
>Then you're a fool trying to sound smart. Nothing more to it really. You won't impress anyone talking like that
Dude, that's literally not what I'm saying. I'm talking ESPECIFICALLY about their descriptions on physical appearences about those particular emperors. You're ignoring all the arguments against their credibility. Why would I try to impress anyone in an anonymous imageboard?

This girl has clear Celto-Germanic features, pic related is an actual Italian girl.

WUZ

>That nose
Can confirm, the big shnoz us Italians all have is literally called a "Roman Nose."

Caracalla had a Syrian mother. His father was descended from Italian colonists from Umbria and could have had some local Berber or Punic (Phoenician) ancestry.

>it's wrong to use modern statistics to try to identify people who lived so long ago.
pretty sure there was a genetic study which basically says that modern italians are the same as romans though

*puts Peloponnesian war military reenactors with period weapons and armor in the vanguard*

I wonder if this was the only time in history that military reenactors were actually used in combat.

You're not wrong, but that's a south Tyrolean called Dorothea wierer, not really an italian

>Dude was Berber

Nope

>clearly had some SSA ancestry

Ancient Berbers didn't have ssa admixture

He looks like an Arab, not like a real Med.

What do real Meds look like?

Spanish and North Italian. Notice the lack of Semito-nigger hair like in the OP.

North Italians aren't Meds, brainlet.

>real med
>styled hair
>no beard
>smooth exfoliated skin
Lmaaaaooooo

we need mo denarii fo dem programs

Your point?

Hello Ahmed.

>Meds aren't Meds

north italians aren't meds you complete retard

>People falling for the Mediterranean race meme
Spaniards aren't Med either. Just Catalonians, Valencians and Andalusians are.

He was half Arab Syrian. Back then Arabs and Berbers had no nigger blood in them though.

>Meds aren't Mediterranean

Based Caracalla

Funny because that guy had Portoguese ancestry

>Moortugal
Again, your point?

I'm not the one that said spaniards were meds

>broad geographical region = distinct ethnic group
Northern Italians had more in common with the Northern and Western European phenotypes

>spaniards onlu control a small portion of spain
>andalusiab identity still exist
>valencian identity still exist
>iberian people never existed before muslims

>Northern Italians had more in common with the Northern and Western European phenotypes
It's like Mediterraneans are Europeans or something. Arab rape babies and Seminiggers don't count as Meds.

>my nose kinda looks like that
>i have slightly lighter eyes and the same hair color
>I'm 99% nordic
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
I share several other facial features with my dad though, so don't make any cuck jokes

Spaniards are dolichocephalic you absolute tiny skulled subhumans.

A lot of ancient Greeks and Romans had curly hair

He was Syrian but not Arab

sure, north italians are basically scandinavian

north italians are 100% blonde and germanic

those are from Milano, this one is from Venice

Mark Antony has a typical Italian look.

Here's a reconstruction of him
youtube.com/watch?v=k9ku4S5Q2kY

subflavum means yellowish/ slightly yellow
gray means he was old and his hair was grey

im guessing this is what they meant by subflavum

Handsome man

Both of these look very Italian.

I didnt say they didnt, im just mocking all the retards acting like north and south italians are two different species

>Northern Italians had more in common with the Northern and Western European phenotypes

No they fucking don't lol. The genetic blueprint of Italy has changed very little over the last 2000 years. Any """Nordic""" features you see in Italians today are from Globalization and Europeans immigrating to other European countries like Italy over the last few centuries.

hurrrrr
>beats head with club

>another compensatory WE WUZ CAIZARZ N SHIET thread from our local amerimutts and snowniggers

>race
>identity

>2000 years
2000 years ago Proto-Italics(Nordic) and Proto-Celtics invaded Italy.

So, the Romans weren't nordic?

Strange how the most "inclusive" empires were also the most brutal conquerors.