Chinese empire

The Chinese strategy of conquest:

1) emigrate
2) breed like locusts
3) displace the original inhabitants
4) repeat

China/Japan were Europe tier, correct? Why did the far east and Europe develop so equally/highly and the middle east/India falter so hilariously (besides islam)?

Did you ever hear of the Qing? Or better yet, the Tang, who were a native Han Chinese dynasty.

China has literally never had a united regime, why would they start now? Also they did explore East Africa

Southern China, Tibet, Inner Mongolia, and Xinjiang were all militarily conquered. The colonists moved afterwards.

Historically the Chinese are loathe to emigrate, ranging from the ancestral/economic ties peasants had with their land to the smug self assurance Chinese peasants and elites had that they live in the most civilized place on earth. Only merchants sending relatives abroad to secure a foothold in foreign markets and refugees fleeing trouble did that.

In fact, many colonists in the frontier weren't immigrants at all but either soldiers sent to man military garrisons or convicts sentenced to exile.

>map doesn't include the 20th century Kuomintang warlordships
Very disappointing, it's an underrated era of history

Chinese land is really fucking good. pretty warm, lots of rain, fertile soil. up north it gets really fucking cold (on average North Korea is one of the coldest countries on the planet), Tibet is even colder and mountainous, Southeast Asia is a clusterfuck hilly forest and really hot.

why expand farther? it's just a pain in the ass to maintain. I don't even know why they hold onto Tibet. probably to protect their western trade route.

Because the Cliques were informal divisions of China. Everyone in them pretended that they lived in a unified Chinese republic. Except my clique hates your clique and we totally are the legit government.

Not like Dynastic Divisions in which actual tangible Dynasties showed up to duke it out.

>Xianjiang and much of Manchuria is relatively new.
Did you ever hear of the Protectorate of the Western Regions? Manchuria is more acceptable, but if we include non-Chinese dynasties they had since the Jin, over 800 years ago. They also got Manchuria today through the Qing, who are Tungusic like the Jin.

>All of China South of the Yangtze is relatively new as well, only 800 years old.
But this. THIS

Holy fucking shit, you brainlet. Have you ever heard of Nanyue?

>And even without those inclusions it's already the size of America waaaaay back before modern communication and roads.
No it's not. Xinjiang and Manchuria (do you include Outer Manchuria they lost to the Russians?) account for almost a quarter of its area. Modern China is still smaller than modern the USA btw

Was the Chinese Soviet Republic an informal clique like the other warlordships?

It expanded outside of what is China proper. Mongolia/Xinjiang/Tibet/Manchu are not traditional China. Withe xception of Manchus, all three of the others don't consider themselves Chinese and have different culture/language/history/identity.

What the fuck are you talking about. The Arabs and Tibetans only won talas because the Turks betrayed the Chinese and the Chinese had to deal with a 30 year rebellion

How is chin proper defined? their borders have shifted so much over the years and the first imperial dynasties had less territory than the china proper in your pic?

Taiping Heavenly Kingdom did nothing wrong

The China proper is defined as the 18 inner provinces (if you include Machu conquests) or 15 inner provinces if you're going by Ming. In these region, the main identity is of Chinese identity. One which reveres the Emperor/language/religion/customs/etc. Its the Han culture basically. Machuria became part of this culture when Manchus themselves heavily married Manchus to Chinese to legitimize their rule over China. They lost their separate identity as a result and became inner Chinese.

The non-proper Chinese don't have that outlook. They don't have the Chinese identity, culture, language, or history. They didn't revere the emperor. This is what separates them from the China proper. They're, essentially, not Chinese as an identity, but rather "Chinese" politically due to geographical conquest.

>Why has China never expanded outside its traditional borders?

Mountains and deserts.

Nah, it was a political movement. It did acquire some warlords along the way.

>China never expanded outside its traditional borders
Stop reading there
Sage

lol thats a really exaggerated map

This. But as for right now, it doesn't really need to expand anymore with how massive it has become.

I see. They've all been a part of china so long, that it feels strange to divide the country like that, especially whit Taiwan which has been a part of china for less time than the bits that aren't China Proper. That said while Inner Mongolia and Manchuria are fairly weel intergrated Tibet and Xinjiang really aren't.

You do realize China proper is full of minorities like the Yi or Zhuang? Although concentrated in the southwest, large parts of China south of the Yangtze were non-Han. It was only during the Tang era and later, when migration triggered by revolts and foreign invasions by the Khitans/Jurchens shifted the demographics dramatically.

It's really not. It's just that many of those areas were under the rule of Protectorates, who, especially the ones in Central Asia, were independent in all but name.

If you ask any mainland inner Chinese what they think of inner mongols(any of the non-proper Chinese), they'll tell you (if you're close enough). They see those as barbarians that either need to integrate into Chinese(aka Han) culture or one with disdain. Even if Inner Mongols have embraced some of the Han-ification, the inner Chinese won't see them as such for a while(identities need to be acknowledged/forged over centuries).

Not strong enough to resist Han cultural pressure. Their natural identity isn't robust as the others.

More like they got a lot of shit in the modern era. Hell, Guangxi is an autonomous region, the only one in proper China. And let's not talk about the autonomous-prefectures within regions, like Yunnan.

Let's be real here.

Chinks are the weakest, most beta, low-test race on Earth.

And you expect them to somehow go up against Mongols, Japanese Samurai, Turks, Iranians, or Muslims? All of whom have a reputation for being warrior cultures?

Kek

Because conquering land that is worth conquering (for example the middle east or europe) was pretty hard and it was not really worth it for them, because they already had a huge empire that was hard enough to keep stable. Also, China was generally more developed and richer than those, so there was even less incentive to conquer. It's basically the same as why rome stopped conquering northern europe or africa.

The Chinese warrior culture died and gave birth to intellectual culture ~2400 years ago.

Unironically this

China was always the wimpy little nerd in school surrounded by alpha Chad bullies like the Russians, Mongols, Turks, Huns, Scythians, Arabs, Iranics, Japanese, etc.

...

How did they become the most successful group people on earth?
Was it really just harsh climate?

...

How many times was Luoyang rebuilt?
Reading John Keay's "a history of china" and it feels like its getting sacked burned down or rebuilt every couple pages.

>Guy on the left
Ya know I had to do it to em..

...

I’m CCP

Tbh they aren't that far from the truth.
They had their moments but aftet that the rape train continued.

Someone post the subhuman Chinks pasta about them being overrun a hundred million times by different versions of mongoloid slant eyes.

Also post the one about plummeting into generations of famine due to retard logic which resulted in major ecological instability.

Got this one

Europe is very fertile and Indo-Euros got to claim all of it

>Tang
>native Han Chinese

Nope. Tang was mutt Chinese at best.

>the "5 barbarian" tribes rampaged across China for centuries
>northern China was conquered and ruled by the "5 barbarians" for 300 years
>the native northern Chinese got raped and impregnated by the foreign conquerors for 300 years
>one of those foreign-ruled northern dynasties eventually conquered the rest of China

Basically, the founding emperors of Sui and Tang were larping sino-barbarian mutts.

>Nope. Tang was mutt Chinese at best.
By this logic the Jiankang emigre elite who intermarried with the native Wu and Chu vernaculars were mutts as well.

The Guanzhong region had a hybrid aristocracy though neither Imperial dynasty traced their patrilineal ancestry to foreigners.

In fact, China may have discovered America before Columbus during the voyage of Zheng He. And the
current borders of China are far larger than the "traditional" borders, thanks to the Qing.

This one?

Mao Zedumb

>Why has China never expanded outside its traditional borders?

What you call 'traditional borders' is literally the Chinese conquering everything in the area. They're the third largest country in the world. Sichuan, Yunnan, Tibet, Xinjiang, Manchuria, Inner Mongolia and formerly Mongolia etc etc etc etc.

>Tibet, Xinjiang, Manchuria, Inner Mongolia and formerly Mongolia

All conquered by the Manchus. Guess what else the Manchus conquered? China.

China proper is a misnomer,if anything the Central Plains/States was far more paramount. The Chinese heartland has always been the north,while southerners were always considered non-Han until the ascendant Ming dynasty.

>Why no great journeys of discovery?

stopped reading there
read a book nigga

Different rebellion

too many fucking people
and enough land that didn't find themselves wanting much (at least not the higher classes).
age of discovery Euros wished they had a empire the size of China

the Yuan and Qing dynasty must've got shit done they were huge.

Qing yes.

Yuan dynasty is a bit difficult. Technically Kubilai and his ilk are Khagan of the Mongol Empire. But really tgeir rule was just in China and whichever Mongol/Steppe group feels loyal to them.

Inner Mongolia was conquered by the Ming. And Tibet has been effectively a Chinese suzerainity since the fall of the Tibetan Empire. None of the other dynasties but the Qing felt like conquering that place.

...

what's it like believing your own ideas which are contrary to observable, historical fact?

Human wave attacks can only get you so far...

I've seen that map animation a dozen times, it's actually a bit inaccurate, it uses the greatest extent of Yuan and Qing but not Qin, Han and Tang. Han and Tang were not as big as Qing but already quite big.

I find this is a common issue(or double standard) of western perspective, they often use the greatest estimation to portray the territories acquired by "barbarian dynasties"(only 2 actually) but not for dynasties built by locals. It's almost like ((they)) have some sort of hidden agenda or bias.

youtu.be/-foZ5RcCm8U

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>They had their moments but aftet that the rape train continued.
That's Roman Empire.

You can tell those sexual-fluid "honkey supremacists" are really butthurt and insecure about China overtaking their degenerated hegemony, they really try so hard to demonize us.

>Slavs are a force of nature
my sides are in Kamchatka

Impressive.

With this most recent achievement, fate has in a single stroke, marked the decline of the west and spelled a new era of wondrous prosperity and peaceful global dominance for the Chinese dragon, which promises to firmly stand in sharp contrast to the historically bloody ascent of western powers and the cruel subjugation it brought to the humbler nations of the world. The blessings of Chinese plasma stealth technology, quantum direct-current electricity, gamma titanium mono crystal turbines, quantum aircraft carriers, near-space ballistic air-to-air missiles, and quantum enhanced railguns will be the instruments with which China affirms its noble stewardship of 21st century world politics and offers the non-western world a different option; an humanist alternative to the depredations of Western leadership and the opportunity for a more equitable and dignified multilateralism.

>implying you would rather live under Chinese hegemony than American hegemony
careful what you wish for

Go back to China and get eaten by other chinks.

>you would rather live under Chinese hegemony than American hegemony
Yes.

Based copypasta!

>actually believes modern China is smaller than modern USA.

Stop including territorial waters, mutt. Fourth place is only bad in Asian countries.

Still had more control over them than the French or the Germans had over their kingdoms due in the same period.

I'm not American.
So then it's not an exaggerated map.

>that far west in the 7th century
I wasn’t aware we were posting fantasy.

Because the Chinese were beta weaklings who got repeatedly conquered, raped, and enslaved by alpha horse riding nomads. The last dynasty of China wasn't even ruled by the Chinese. That should tell you something.

Its to put pressure on india.

The Romans actually went on their big conquest sprees because they were literally retarded(As in they were particularly incompetent even during their day) and couldn't maintain an economy without constant infusion of new lands and resources. European powers colonized the new world mainly to obtain a lead in the struggle and warfare between different kingdoms. There was really no reason to for China.

Well the conquerors always end up larping as Chinese so its turns out fine and dandy anyway :D

>Why has China never expanded outside its traditional borders?
Tibet, Manchuria and Xinjiang are not what has historically been considered China

>Why no great empire pushing into the middle east like the Mongols did?
the Tang and Qing did

>Why no great journeys of discovery?
the Ming did

>Will China's modern military be able to accomplish these things?
yes

>Project China's might far beyond its borders?
Africa and possibly Latin America

But that's truth, you just too ignorant and stupid to know it. Did you not see the border was constantly changing? It even has description to explain how they acquired these lands.

>That should tell you something.
It tells me you're shitposting again, probably sinopobic or hate China as well. Only 2 unified dynasties were established by "barbarians" , and Manchu used to be Ming's vassal, but perhaps this is too difficult for you to understand.

>Only 2 unified dynasties were established by "barbarians"
>unified dynasties

Not him, but there's a serious flaw in your logic. Only "unified dynasties" count? The times when China was fragmented don't count then?

Okay. By your logic, non-unified Han Chinese dynasties such as the Song dynasty are irrelevant too... because they weren't "unified dynasties", right?

Don't be an idiot. Many of the non-unified barbarian dynasties were extremely important and lasted centuries. As someone mentioned above, the barbarian-ruled northern dynasties were responsible for conquering all of China, leading to the Tang dynasty. After the Tang dynasty fell, northern China once again went to the barbarians such as the Khitans and Jurchens who ruled half of China for centuries and cucked the living hell out of the Song dynasty.

You're fucking retarded. Then why did chink dynasties collapse so frequently? Also, half of Chinese history was spent quelling rebellions and dealing with famines.

Lmao if you don't think Roman history is filled with civil wars and backstabbed emperors.

I never said it isn't, chink. I'm just saying China was worse.

>worse
By what metric?

>there's a serious flaw in your logic
Nah, it's you have serious logic problem or bias or lack of basic knowledge about Chinese history.

Officially, usually and traditionally there are only 13 dynasties(夏商周秦漢新晉隋唐宋元明清) recognized as "Orthodox dynasty" which inherited or represented the central authority of China(aka "mandate of heaven"). Only 2 of them(Yuan元 and Qing清) were established by the so-called "barbarians", nothing is flaw there. Even if we count in the "Five Barbarians Sixteen Kingdoms五胡亂華" period(which isn't a singular political entity or dynasty, and they co-existed with 晉Jinn dynasty btw), there is only 3 period in total.

So nothing is really flaw of it, and certainly no such honkie horseshit such as " muh got repeatedly conquered, raped, and enslaved by alpha horse riding nomads, because those nomads were also constantly conquered and subjugated by Chinese empire.

China bounce back every time, while Roman Empire is long gone.

I see you still don’t understand what “dynasty” means, honkie. You talked as if Roman Empire didn't have "dynasty", but they did have, many actually.

>chink dynasties collapse so frequently?
Why Romans had so many different dynasties? Why they changed their political system multiple times? Why Romans emperors were assassinated so frequently? Why they split into WRE/ERE? Why WRE was collapsed and never recovered? Why ERE was also collapsed and never recovered? You need to try harder, honkie.

>"official"

Do you realize how retarded that sounds? No such thing as "official" when it comes to history, stupid. Such a typical chink answer that demonstrates that chinks are a soulless hive-minded race of bugmen, incapable of independent thought and ideas, only capable of regurgitating whatever their masters beat into them.

>retarded poltard is a retard
And no one was ever surprised

Roman imperial dynasties
>Julio-Claudian - 95 years
>Flavian - 27 years
>Nerva-Antonine - 96 years
>Severan - 42 years
>Constantinian - 54 years
>Valentinian - 28 years
>Theodosian - 78 years
(Byzantine period)
>Leonid - 61 years
>Justinian - 84 years
>Heraclian - 85 years
>Isaurian - 85 years
>Nikephorian - 11 years
>Amorian - 47 years
>Macedonian - 189 years
>Doukid - 22 years
>Komnenid - 104 years
>Angelid - 19 years
>Laskarid - 57 years
>Palaiologan - 192 years

Chinese imperial dynasties
>Qin - 15 years
>Western Han - 215 years
>Eastern Han - 195 years
>Western Jin - 52 years
>Eastern Jin - 103 years
>Sui - 37 years
>Tang - 289 years
>Northern Song - 167 years
>Southern Song - 152 years
>Yuan - 97 years
>Ming - 276 years
>Qing - 268 years

Hmm, seems to be some kind pattern here.