A place for discussing all things vegan ethics, politics & health
Meat consumption is ruining the environment. - Pollutes rivers - Forests cleared for livestock - Causes soil degradation - Massive inefficiency - Major contributor to global warming.
The most common and well known argument is the argument from marginal cases. Loosely speaking, the argument contends that animals as sentient as retards should have the same moral status
Morality is relative? - Science, logic, mathematics are all based on axioms that are not proven, what is different about morality and moral axioms? Think this argument through before arguing for it, it is not as simple as you think. (most philosophers are moral realists and believe moral propositions can in fact be true)
Meatcucks please realise the difference between normative ethics (what we ought to do) and descriptive ethics (what beliefs do people have). Normative ethics is what is being discussed with regards to veganism and morality.
e.g. - people should not eat animals for x reason (relevant normative claim) - people eat animals for y reason (irrelevant descriptive claim)
>morality isn't real >calling meat "rotting corpses" or calling the slaughter of livestock "murder" is just an emotional appeal >while the standard american diet overconsumes animal products, there's no environmental or health need to eliminate them completely, with a significant reduction of animal products most negative ramifications of the animal agriculture industry are eliminated
Easton Wilson
OUCH! vegans BTFO
Liam Nelson
Its actually Dead flesh tho
And morality is real
Ayden Scott
>morality is real
Evidence?
Adrian Kelly
the kind that abstains from poultry, pork, and only occasionally (once a week) consumes game, red meat (gelatinous, "poor" cuts like oxtail or stew meats mostly) or offal (liver, heart, tripe). Fish or seafood once a week as well, generally.
Most meat is healthy if eaten in modest quantities, with special care towards high quality, well raised animals.
Angel Lewis
Also, I live in a rural, mountainous region with most "farm" land only suitable for cattle grazing, so any red meat I eat is local, outdoors and grassfed, no industrial grain fed, mistreated animals here. The dairy is very high quality too, being from the same happy, healthy bovine. I buy raw milk from a local dairy farmer and ferment it into kefir. Very healthy and nutritious. In addition to the probiotics, kefir has much higher amounts of vitamins (especially B vitamins and vitamin K2) as bacterial byproduct. The long protein chains are also broken down into shorter peptides, which are absorbed much quicker and more efficiently than longer polypeptide chains (although raw milk also contains many enzymes and peptides that help break them down better)
If you're a vegetarian, I highly recommend sourcing local, raw dairy and prepairing it in various ways (it's non homogenized, so you can separate the cream and make butter/buttermilk with it too) It's fun and incredibly healthy. Also generally cheaper than industrial dairy as the farmer is selling it directly and pocketing all the profits.
Good day, gents.
Blake Moore
Morality is something humans make up. You are a faggot.
Oliver Turner
Like mathematics, right?
Ryder Rodriguez
I love animals guys, animals. And attention and stuff, and I love animals I love em! Have you ever tried cuddling a dog, getting down and dirty with one, relaxing it a little? Well I have, and I'll tell ya its very rewarding guys. Very rewarding indeed.
Robert Russell
Are onions vegan????????????????
Landon Sanders
STOP MURDERING PLANTS
Oliver Edwards
I eat food. I don't get all this labelling and hope you guys feel good what your doing. Laters.
Noah Reed
humans are natural born hunters, we have eyes forward unlike herbivores who have them on the sides pic related
Hunter Baker
/soyboygeneral/
Mason Sanchez
Animals display morality, humans made ethics, and defined morality
Brayden Clark
>animals display morality
please elaborate, you fucking chump change manual laborer, enlighten us with your deep philosophies
Ethan Fisher
Please explain how all primates have forward facing eyes, independent of diet, then? The actual explanation is that when you live up in the trees, having depth perception is much more usefull than range of vision, thus simplified, our evolution favored those who could grab the next branch without falling to their death over those who had larger field of vision in dense vegetation where you are not likely to see much anyway.
James Wood
I grew up on a farm and I don't get it. How do vegans think fields are fertilized? Are they not aware that husbandry is required to produce vegan food too?
Ayden Fisher
That's a bull not a cow. (see the horns)
Jordan Long
Still waiting on that evidence
>o-other things are based on a-axioms too!
Irrelevant. I'm not arguing whether or not logic or science or whatever is real. I'm saying morality isn't real because there's no evidence of any magical force determining right and wrong. You only believe in morality (through emotion I might add) because humans evolved to abide by collective standards and to generally take displeasure in seeing death or suffering.
Where is this magical force that determines right and wrong?
Joshua Martinez
>Please explain how all primates have forward facing eyes Eyes located on an animals head are to do more with whether or not they are prey or predators. Prey's eyes are located wider apart for more field of vision so they have a higher chance of seeing predators coming at them. Primates are not prey animals.
Levi Morales
There are alternatives such as synthetic fertilizers, crop rotation and where you grow nitrogen fixating plants among your other crops(don't remember the name). So no, it's not required, it's just often the case because of how agriculture works today.
Jackson Bennett
Cows have horns, city boy.
Elijah Murphy
Cows can have horns.
Luis Smith
Just because its subjective doesnt mean its not real.
Robert Bailey
>synthetic fertilizers Literally the waste products from the petroleum industry. That shit is the devil, my friend. OP argued that meat consumption was bad for the environment. >crop rotation I'm sorry, but my father is 0.5% above the profit line. It's not possible for us to do anything less efficiently than we possibly can. We're not going to let the soil lay in tread a minute more than we need to. >nitrogen fixating plants among your other crops What's this? You mean we're putting some bushes every 5 yards in the middle of a wheat field?
William King
Sure morality as a concept that individuals and societies make up from emotion and abide by it exists.
As an actual thing outside of conscious perception it doesn't exist.
Justin Brooks
yea but It literally is never eaten in modest quantities in the western world + processed meats such as bacons are literal carcinogens.
how retarded do you have to be to use this argument. Yes humans are predators congratulations on uncovering this mystery. The only fucking predating you are likely doing is picking up meat from the supermarket cunt.
what the fuck does this have to do with anything
Aaron Bailey
>crop rotation
do u know what u can do to let soil recover fast as fuck
yeah
u can let cows walk around and shit there
really makes you think huh
Asher Wood
Proud Rob reporting in. Just had some deer sausage for breakfast.
Ethan Cook
Morality is objective.
Bentley Jones
Your dad should grow weed instead
Jaxson Fisher
Cows milk is literally redpilled
If you can't handle it I think you might be pic related
Easton Murphy
>what the fuck does this have to do with anything
>asks a question >question gets answered HURR DURR WHAT THE FOOK DOES DIS HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING HURR DEE DOUURRR
Jackson Sanders
wrong, I go hunting for my food. I am a predator.
Christopher Hughes
Im dont know shit about morality. Reccomend e some good books on the subject?
Blake Jackson
Rob Travis here - suck my dick
Ayden Gonzalez
>eyes are located wider apart for more field of vision so they have a higher chance of seeing predators coming at them.
I already said this, that doesn't explain anything when it comes to primates.
No, this only goes for animals living in open environments, not in dense vegetation
>Primates are not prey animals.
Lol yes they are, pretty much only humans and the common chimpanzee(not bonobo) hunts. In the case of the chimp it's very, very limited hunting and they are prey animals for jungle cats and reptiles. Gorillas, orangutans and bonobos do no hunting and neither does other primates yet pretty much all have forward facing eyes.
Leo Johnson
>Most meat is healthy if eaten in modest quantities, with special care towards high quality, well raised animals. no tho
Colton Kelly
That pic, that post, the bitter self-nurturing sentiment. My sides have achieved stable geosynchronous orbit, telemetry good.
Sebastian Rogers
excellent point, as always, my dear faggot-kun >that's exactly why nobody takes you seriously
Liam Moore
All shitposting aside I’m a little bit of each one, they all have things I agree with.
Also The Chad >eats pizza and drinks milkshakes in front of vegans. >they’re cool with it because they’re already dead and it would be a waste
Justin Roberts
Based rob and travis
Robert Ortiz
I'm doing just fine without your diet advice. I don't need you to take me seriously
Easton Bell
Learning about ethics on your own is pretty hard, I have tried doing so myself and you end up favoring the plausability of specific theories while trying to balance your intuition and non-ethical knowlege. There is no clear cut knowlege in ethics so far, it's just stronger and weaker theories.
Starting with some school text book on philosophy in general is probably a good idea before going into ethics.
Joseph Foster
Evidence?
Noah Harris
I don't want some shitty ethics debate I just want examples of your meals in a normal day and recipes that are vegan. I'm sick of my typical Western diet.
Jeremiah Miller
This. What point is there in posting bullshit that adds nothing to the conversation and just starts arguments? Does the idea of people eating plant-based diets annoy you so much you feel obliged to protest?
Jayden Morales
I fucking love this meme
Carson Clark
>I don't want some shitty ethics debate I just want examples of your meals in a normal day and recipes that are vegan
this
>I'm sick of my typical Western diet. I come from a country where our diet is the mediterranean so pretty neat, none of that americanized globalist cancerous diet. people in the EU eat better but too bad our traditional kitchen is being assaulted by them.
Samuel Gonzalez
Rob reporting in from /k/
Eli Robinson
How much can any of you actually lift? No e-statting tell the truth
Jayden Walker
Is pic related really the only way to get protein as a vegan? I'm honestly struggling to eat enough every day.
Samuel Mitchell
You're not welcome here. Please kill yourself.
Jason James
Lots
Isaiah Howard
Vilanising meat eaters. With this kind of thinking makes you as dangerous as religious fundementalist.
More and more I come across vegan propaganda, the more I'm repulsed by the way they think, they are forming cult like thinking.
"if you are not with us, you are against us" these are the rotten appels among vegans. you really should not support them.
Christian Gonzalez
...
Dylan Young
You shouldn't come to Veeky Forums of testosteronous behavior doesn't appeal to you.
Joseph Flores
>drinking pus-filled cow tit juice is redpilled
I'll take veganism, the black pill.
Joseph Roberts
I choose sweet potatoes and tofu or some kind of legume as the bulk of my meal. Then I add more carbs and veggies.
Low fat high carb baby
Dylan Morris
>I'm honestly struggling to eat enough everyday
I highly doubt it. I stuff myself literally everyday, never feel hungry, and am getting cut up faster than ever. What the fuck are you eating to not feel like you're getting enough?
Dinner for me might be 3-4 sweet potatoes, a block of tofu, an onion, a stalk of broccoli, mushrooms and some cabbage.
Lunch is either 4-5 bananas, goji berries, and some walnuts or a green smoothie.
Charles James
Fact: Decent meat is usually 20% protein, 2% fat, 0% carbs = Perfect food for anyone who needs to reduce kcal in. (It's also great source of protein without those solvent-dripping industrially produced "vegetable fats".)
Luis Wilson
Why do so many awful human beings represent veganism?
Gabriel Peterson
>muh macronutrients
fuck off, brainlet
Hunter Brown
For example?
Jace Walker
daily reminder to take your b12, calcium, zink, iron, fish oil, vitamin d and creatine
you meatcucks jealous you'll never be malnourished?
Sebastian Perry
The only people who get deficient are stupid women that eat oreos and other junk food. Vegans eating whole foods won't be deficient in anything.
Logan Garcia
Rob
Ryder Lewis
Are onions vegan?
Asher Jones
No, onions eat meat
Ian Williams
Meat consumption is ruining the environment. - Pollutes rivers - Forests cleared for livestock - Causes soil degradation - Massive inefficiency - Major contributor to global warming
This is so fucking stupid. You do realise that modern agriculture is the one destroying the environment. The whole list applies to modern agriculture. All the vegan shit you eat is shipped to you by cargo ships. 15 largest cargo ships in the world pollute more than all the cars on earth combined. The only truth and salvation is LOCALLY PRODUCED food, permaculture and a tribalist society. A man could not survive on a vegan diet in the far north, he would die in a matter of months because of malnutrition. He must hunt and grow what he can. We don't kill animals for joy. Taking the life of an animal is a survival mechanism for us. If we'd kill animal for the hell of it we would soon starve to death.
Most likely though the planet will be reduced to cinders and we've all perished before any permanent change for good is made.
There are a couple others but I can't remember their channel names.
Angel Adams
Duran Rider is the only true cunt on that list.
Carter Morris
>be me >name is actually Rob >hunts deer
Huh...
Isaiah Williams
>mfw veganfags
Jackson Hernandez
Or just eat fish from time to time And go outside for any length of time
Aaron Kelly
You don't need to eat fish when nuts and seeds exist. Stop being autistic.
Luis Miller
thank fucking god, someone actually contributing to the thread over pointless debates. i appreciate it user. i swear to god these generals should be renamed to "ethics in farming"
Carson Scott
You don’t need to be exclusive when both exist. Stop being autistic.
Anthony Thompson
Dave
I'm a "Dave"
>can't wait to help the old man prep thanksgiving in like 5 hours.
Gavin Roberts
Why should we give a shit about animals when we can't even get girlfriends?
Evan Ramirez
>typical vegan 'males'
Angel Howard
>wah the big bad vegans hurt my fee fees
Eli Watson
(You) are not vegan. (You) are a shitty refugee troll from (YOU HAVE TO GO BACK). (You) are probably chowing down on all-meat pizza, or a bacon cheeseburger, or Hot Pockets, or Thanksgiving turkey (if mom will make it for you) while you were posting this drivel. (You) are wasting our valuable time with this shitty attempt at 'trolling' you keep trotting out. (You) are, as usual, a gigantic faggot, and someone should rape your face. (You) should, for your crime of Cancerousness, become An Hero, so no one has to see your ugly-ass face ever again. (You) have failed. Leave. Now.
Nathan Ross
"Vegan villains" have convinced me to only eat meat/dairy 1 day a week. Not all of us meatcucks are wimpy pussies like him hahahaha
Hudson Wilson
VEGANISM IS A LIE.
What do vehicles with petroleum-burning engines, and anything electric have in common? They're all powered by
FOSSIL FUELS, which come from dead animals. Vegans aren't allowed to own or use ANYTHING that came
from an animal -- therefore any so-called 'vegan' that drives a vehicle or uses anything electric is CHEATING and
is NOT VEGAN. They may as well stop kidding themselves and go eat a steak, they all FAIL.
So-called 'vegans' also suffer from progressive cognitive deficit due to chronic amino acid deficiencies from
malnutrition. That's why vegancucks don't make sense, their brains don't work correctly anymore. People I've
known who were vegan then gave it up and went back to eating animal products regularly showed positive
changes in their personalities and started being able to think more clearly again.
Vegans brains are so addled that they think you can raise an INFANT as vegan and expect it to be healthy and
develop properly -- which it will NOT. Any pediatrician will tell you that you should not feed a baby a strict
vegetarian diet, it will sicken, fail to develop, fail to thrive, and ultimately DIE. Pediatricians who encounter parents
who insist, against all professional medical advice, in feeding their infant a Vegan diet, are reported to the police
and to Child Protective Services, because it is legally considered CHILD ABUSE. What does THAT tell you?
Face it, vegancucks: humans are OMNIVORES, even many vegans admit it, and your meme 'lifestyle' is
anti-health, anti-HUMAN, and exists as a political statement more than anything else, erroneously placing dumb
lower animals above humans, which is pants-on-head stupid.
More evidence that Veganism is a LIE and actually hurts humans in the long run: Veganism DESTROYS the fitness of pro athletes blog.bulletproof.com/carl-lewis-vegan/
Actual psychopath here. Literally tastes better when I killed it myself.
Jaxson Murphy
>somehow conflates "exposing lies" with "futility" LOL the malnutrition is so advanced that your brain isn't firing on all cylinders anymore, vegancuck; or are you just so massively butthurt that your lies and anti-human agenda are EXPOSED in the light of truth, that you now have to flail about uselessly, utterly frustrated? (You) are the ones who are 'futile'. We will not tolerate your lies and your anti-human, genocidal agenda; (You) are the ones who will perish -- ironically, by your own hand, from disease and dysfuntion fuelled by your suicidal level of malnutrition.
Connor Rivera
>Retarded cityfolk that claims women can have penises
Screw veganism, but all Americans need to cut down on meat consumption by half or more.
Samuel Butler
No idea what you fucking clowns call me. >eat chicken and their unborn >eat cheese, don't really fuck with dairy stuff, just don't like most if it >eat a bunch of plants, gotta get those micros Either way vegans are fucking retarded, be a veggie but don't cry over your food or refuse to eat it because something that was going to happen anyways did and someone got a product. (milk production, ect.)
Jordan Rodriguez
Omnivore Normal Whichever Always sage
Caleb Baker
I eat meat because it tastes good, is a cheap source of protein, and because frankly I just don't really care that much about animals.
Thomas Roberts
>Be me >Travis >ketofag >all eggs & meat all the time >zerocarb >living that fat fast/ketogains life >dick harder than diamonds ever since ketoadaptation >suck it, vegancucks
>PS: looking for low test low muscle tone vegan cuck to turn into trap fucktoy >max age 21
