Dr. Jordan Feigenbaum, M.D, was recently banned from r/fitness for daring to critique their circlejerky love for 5/3/1. This highly educated, well-respected, and very,very strong man was berated by the reddit community for speaking his mind on what he asesses is a sub-optimal program, and he was treated like dirt for expressing a dissenting opinion on that disgusting, echo-chamber of a website.
Don't be reddit
Reminder to not be like reddit 5/3/1 dickriders, and take the SS pill
Explain in more detail for those of us who don't browse that garbage pile
a user made a thread about an article feigenbaum wrote and video alan thrall made criticizing texas method (the vid isn't about TM but the article is) and 5/3/1, which is apparently infamous on r/fitness because 5/3/1 literally makes their pussies wet. Jordan came into the thread and defended himself from blatant misinterpretations and tried to reiterate his points, but was insulted and downvoted to oblivion, something that happens to you if you dare stray from the intellectual hegemony on plebbit
We do not currently know the "justification" for his ban, but nothing posted from Jordan's account in the thread breaks any of the subreddits rules. Hopefully our questions will be answered on his next instagram live
link to the post?
reddit.com
I'm warning you now, it's cancerous
holy shit reddit is fucking stupid, from the white guilt bullshit to the r/fitness idiots the whole site is trash.
This whole argument makes no sense. You're comparing apples to oranges to bananas. 5/3/1 is an advanced-intermediate routine when with progression being in the period of weeks. Texas Method is an intermediate routine with weekly progression. SS is a beginner routine with session to session progression. Regardless /r/fitness sucks ass and is a joke even on leddit.
He also compared the original version not the current up to date version. Wendler has changed since then
I think part of the argument, and this is also his argument against TM, is that if a base program has to be modified so much in order to reflect appropriate training volume, it was not a good program to begin with. The fact that original 5/3/1 was named I'm Not Doing Jack Shit pretty much tells you that this program doesn't have proper volume
And he's comparing 5/3/1 and TM because those are the two most popular programs that are run by people after completing SS
I'm running Triumvirate right now, AMRAP sets every day and high volume auxiliaries tell me you're talking out your ass
Of course Aint Doing Shit is low volume, he specifically says to only do that if you have no time
startingstrength.com
Here's the critique of 5/3/1 and TM.
As someone that does 5/3/1 I even have to admit reddit's love of it is kinda stupid. The users of /r/fitness just fall in line with whatever routine is being pushed in their wiki it wasn't too long ago that they would fervently defend starting strength.
We always circlejerk like mad, too. It's just not as noticeable because we don't have ebin le upvotes.
>he has an MD so just automatically believe everything he says
Tell me you people aren't this dumb
There are other factors to consider than just volume. Like tonnage, which 5/3/1 trium provides less of than SS in 2 lifts, about the same in one lift, leaving the only lift with significantly more tonnage as the deadlift, meaning that LESS training stress is being incurred than would be on a novice program. Not good
Also, is it really such a good idea to do AMRAP on deadlifts? Aren't you just asking for form breakdown at that point? And part of Feigenbaums argument is that grinding out reps in training is not optimal for long term development, which includes AMRAP
where in the post did op indicate that exactly?
Feigenbaum and the whole Barbell Medicine movement may be the single best thing that's come out of Starting Strength.
I don't agree with everything Rip teaches, but Baraki, Feigenbaum, and the others do a good job of actually talking about their ideas and their rationale - they come across as a lot more accessible and a lot less dogmatic than Rip does.
Jordan even says in the comments that many of the SS coaches like 5/3/1. He just has critiques with it personally. I think that's fair.
Yeah Jordan has said in one of his ig lives that SSOC can kinda be an echo chamber and he gets some shit talking behind his back for some of his methods. I personally like his programming style, I don't get why people flame on him so badly, he's not particularly controversial or even that well-known.
The first sentence
simply stating that he's a doctor is not the same as saying "believe him unconditionally because he's a doctor," you retard
why the fuck are they comparing SS and 5/3/1. They're completely different.
none of these have enough bench volume
to show that the training variables in 5/3/1 (volume, intensity and tonnage) are not significantly higher and in some cases actually lower than Starting Strength. The argument is that an intermediate program (5/3/1) should have greater training variables than a novice program (SS), which 5/3/1 does not have, which is why jordan argues that 5/3/1 is not a good program
Exactly
I think you know exactly what OP was implying, as I did, and you're just being a contrarian faggot because you're so insecure irl you never get the chance to let your aggression out.
feigenbaum wasn't arguing for any of these programs to be used for intermediates. The fact that they DON'T have enough volume is precisely why TM and 5/3/1 are not good intermediate programs, and why an intermediate would not benefit from SS
Why would a intermidiate do SS?
Yeah man, I bet he's a virgin, too, and that he got low grades in the subjects of math and history, furthering his inferiority complex. I can also tell from his post that his cousin's name is Anthony.
What is this kind of mentality or behaviour called?
Ever since I was little I remember hating people who acted like this, where they would get violent if you disagree with the popular opinion of a group. English not my first language lel which is why i ask
they wouldnt. Feigenbaum never said that they should, he was simply comparing them to intermediate programs to make a point that the intermediate programs in question did not impose significantly more training stress than the novice program
hive-mind or groupthink
I got that I was just Joshin you
I think he's talking about the aggression part, too.
>"how does it feel to be the Dr. Oz of resistance training?"
why are they so pissed at this guy? seems to me he just wrote an article criticizing something they like, but some of the nastiness in the thread seems uncalled for for leddit
Ledditors aren't actually nice, they just pretend to be when no one's made them grumpy.
what the fuck is a tonnage
it's no different from here or bb.com back when it was new. criticizing ss was blasphemy until zack came about
when you do 1set of 10 reps at 100kg you did 1000kg tonnage.
tonnage is just another training variable measurement. basically volume × intensity = tonnage
>something that happens to you if you dare stray from the intellectual hegemony on plebbit
I remember zach sort of being a testament to the method when he was around. Sure, it was fun to meme about how bad he looked, but after all SS+GOMAD did make him strong fast just like rip said
have you guys seen this nsuns shit that gets their dicks hard
is it nsus or ivysaur that shits all over SS? I can't remember which one
yeah he made the ssfags double down on muh strength but everyone else's delusion was shattered. to be fair ss is a good program, it's just that rip is less qualified than a fucking tumblrina when it comes to dietary advice
that's why he has jordan and austin answer all the nutrition questions at the seminars lol
ivysaur. i cant believe someone can be so delusional
literally the only person I've ever seen advocate linear periodization in a novice program, and he doesn't even know how to program linear periodization. Apparently varying rep ranges = periodization
>squats once a week
lmao no thanks
you must be young. me knees cant take that much abuse anymore.
YOU FUCKING PUSSIES. Veeky Forums WAS NEVER GOOD BUT THIS SHOULD BE A RAID ON r/fitness.
What the fuck is wrong with you? You call yourselves men? No one is even asking you to go to war you faggots. Just raid the fucking board.
BURN.
IT.
DOWN.
raids are soooo 2007
>What the fuck is wrong with you? You call yourselves men? No one is even asking you to go to war you faggots. Just raid the fucking board. BURN. IT. DOWN.
>You call yourselves men?
>men
Get a life, you fucking loser. I don't have time to dedicate to reddit's opinion of a workout program.
p edgy over here lad, you mad about your stepdad Randy or something?
but squats shouldn't aggravate the knees, they aren't a knee extension, theyre a hip extension
Mob mentality
>someone named feigenbaum posts something mods don't like
>their response is "SHUT IT DOWN"
It's a real man bites dog story.
Not gonna lie, it was pretty cool to see this.
My boiii! Post a time stamp.
...
wait what. is this a LARP
pls be real
It's 22:33 here in sleepy Santa Cruz. I've actually never been on Veeky Forums before.
so you wouldnt know that the name function alone isn't proof enough. we're gonna need so visual identification, LARPer
write hi Veeky Forums on a piece of paper with the date and post a picture.
being a newfag is no excuse for being a larper
...
instapost now
my nigga
>info@barbellmedicine
NOT A LARP CONFIRMED
...
Hope it up in a selfie, holy dubs.
Also why do my pics rotate the wrong way. Sorry, I'm the worst on 4 chan.
DUBS DON'T LIE
That's excellent
I've been saying American programs in general, but especially those of Mr. Wendler are garbage for years.
I'd say that in general, I agree with you- especially historically.
However, guys like Mike T, Mike Zourdos (will he ever be Mike Z), Bryce Lewis, Eric Helms, etc. are doing well for the ol' stars and stripes
OH SHIT, ITS REAL GUYS
wait this is legit the guy in the op
how many SS memes do you have saved on your pc
That's Zach. Never met him and that was way before my time with Starting Strength
Can I make the push press my main pressing movement in the bridge 2.0, and alternate the press and layback press week to week?
RPE system is good (especially considering it is really only an adaption of systems from Mr. Prilepin, Abadjiev et al.) but his actual written out programs? Eh... It seems to me at least project momentum was poorly managed (perhaps tuned for "enhanced" athletes as is so common in USAPL)?
uh no that's not zach, it's chloe grace moretz, open your eyes
>shilling SS just because you want to be contrarian to le reddit ecks dee
How unsurprising.
JORDAN HOW DO I GET GOOD AT MEASRUING RPE I SUCK SO HARD AT IT
You could, particularly if you want to get way better at the push press. However, if that was your goal I'd probably push press twice per week and press the other time and be consistent with it.
That's a reasonable interpretation, especially from the outside. That said, I've seen a lot of the data from that project and it's pretty useful in altering management strategies for lifters (enhanced or not) IMO.
What the fuck, have you been lurking this whole time
Please take the time to make a trip code.
Simply type # followed by something unique after your name on the name field.
Also click on the person's post number to quote them
It's a practice thing! And additionally, I would caution someone from using RPE do rate "how hard the set was" compared to rating "how good was my performance based on previous performances". In other words, you do a weight (either a target weight based on previous training or a warm up for that target) and you determine, did that performance feel harder, easier, or about what I expect? You keep doing that and you get better at rating RPE. Going in without target weights is tough though
>implying reddit isn't bad enough that you have to shill against it to make anons hate it
Nah. A guy from IG sent me the link to this place about 30 min ago.
>mfw jordan feigenbaum becomes the new scooby
Just went to /d/ and I really like that board. Think I'll come to Veeky Forums more often.
Hopefully he'll bully the board into what it needs to be.
I definitely didn't post that.
IS GIGACHAD NATTY
after reading the book i thought the 5% increase on load wasn't representing the 0.5 point increase on RPE, but then again i never calculated RPE before in my life. Had some weekly progress and will do another cycle to see what I get.
Real Jordan needs to take another timestamp but this time confirming which trip is real
Just click here to reply to post Doc.
I more so wanted to use the push press to help my press/classic press, I figured I could make it my main press for two cycles, then switch to the classic press as my main movement. Also what if I want to be a hipster fag and do power cleans instead of pause deadlifts?