Crypto in a bubble argument

Don't ever forget - you coin is only worth what someone else is willing to pay in fiat.

Unless you believe in the tech behind the coin and you think it has a future, all of this is just speculation. At the end of all this, someone has to lose.

Bitcoin is in a bubble by definition. It's value exceeds its intrinsic value of zero. But it's hard to explain. I can't take a bitcoin to a theoretical planet in another galaxy and use it. I can take gold and use it to reflect heat. Or silver to make electronics. Etc. But bitcoin doesn't have a universal use. It's no more useful now than it was at 1 cent. People buy it because they expect it to go up in value. If it becomes an official government backed currency, then sure it has a use. But yes, definitely a bubble right now. But it's a bubble made of very strong material and its not popping any time soon

It's absolutely a bubble. The price of Bitcoin (and with it, practically all alts) has gone up by 10 in the space of a year, rather than a more moderate and rational gradual increase. And most of that is in the past 2 months.

This will probably come down hard, and sooner rather than later.

lol silly to live in the present like you. "so little real world uses". like this is a fucking game to see who can collect the most grocery money, this is the new world order and when we zoom out in 25 years the 9000s on this chart will be like dots in the big picture. no real world uses this guy says, lmfao. yea let me just pee on your little tree hugger money there little pal-o, buddy there

You are right. Blockchain will be the new order. But sorry, this will happen without bitcoin.

none, everyone is a bubble. And everyone hopes to find a chair when the music stops playing

nobody is saying bitcoin is about to die, so don't link that bitcoinobituaries shit link.

Also, you are comparing dicks to carrots

...

Who gives a shit if it's in a bubble! Bubbles are great for making money. Just lock in some profits by placing a stop loss and youll be fine

Nigga I've paid my coffee with doge.

Ask them "How is bitcoin different than any other piece of promising start up technology that has enormous potential to change the world? Don't those companies usually start at a low valuation with a lot of uncertainty, but then acquire more investors as they become more established and prominent when they finally go public?"

And "If Bitcoin does become a global currency, what would it be worth?"

Without bitcoin? So who will be the leader then?

"Nuh-uh"

>How is bitcoin different than any other piece of promising start up technology that has enormous potential to change the world?

Oh please, Bitcoin is the most bubbly crypto there is. Even bitcoin maximalists acknowledge that the tech is shit and people are buying because of the store of value meme. They speculate that the price will rise even more because of the "normies" and "institutions". They even shit on altcoins like Ether because apparently tech doesnt mean shit and Bitcoin is king. What you're describing is Ether.

Check out the other blockchains that are floating around. Nearly everyone is better than bitcoin's. Bitcoin is just the first thing newfags and normies is coming up in their head. 90% doesn't even understand the blockchain technology at all.

Who will win? I am no guru nor i am trying to fake one. It's clearly not bitcoin, that's for sure.

>Without bitcoin? So who will be the leader then?
Isnt it fucking obvious? Ethereum.

Proven laws of physics don't apply to something created by a psycopathic user.

There isn't. The percentage returns on BTC have now outpaced the .com bubble. It's going to implode.

the functional use of gold has little to nothing to do with its value.

this.
if u dont realize we are in the mania Phase u are retarded .

everyday its in the media, i visit a bodybuilding, poker and travel forum - all have suddenly huge crypto threads.

everyone thinks he will get rich and this is normal growth.

I think this wouldnt be so bad but there is still one problem.
after nearly 10 years there is still no use for bitcoin. it even became unusable and a "store of value " . nearly all the altcoins are shit too.

Dude I agree that we're in a bubble dumbo

I say speculation will take it to 10k and then its going to crash back to where it 'should' be (comparing it to the trend)
I estimate that woupd be around 7k for now

>But gold has physical properties!

so does lead, shut the fuck up

largest transfer of wealth since the oil and gold rush times

Really? What kind of device did you just type that statement from right now?

>rather than a more moderate and rational gradual increase.
What is more rational and moderate with respect to cryptocurrency? With other commodities you can expect them to rise gradually at least according to inflation, but for crypt to rise by 10% or by 1000% is equally rational. There's no underlying justification for either.

Bitcoin is a bubble. It's undeniable that it's being flooded with normies who don't have the slightest clue about the crypto market or blockchain technology. They're basically buying it solely because it's going up.

I still believe crypto as a whole is greatly undervalued though.

>he thinks gold is a good electric conductor

literally everything else is in a bubble too

> it even became unusable and a "store of value "

no it did not. Bitcoin is growing as long as global digitization is growing.

Didn't you hear
The entire universe is a bubble

Pic related

>What is a CPU

GTFO brainlet.

>no real world use cases

yeah except I can buy all kinds of shit with it
hide my money from the tax man
protect my money from being seized by the government
transfer money way faster than through the banking system
so yeah its totally useless really

I guess then fiat has intrinsec value because you can always wipe your ass with it. Pretty expensive toilet paper tho.

How can "everything" be in a bubble since things are only measured relative to other things in terms of trade. This makes no sense.

Trips wasted on a retard.

>central banks print infinity money
>pump money into stock market
>give out cheap credits
>prices of everything goes up
>value of money goes down

tl;dr its the jews fault

The jews will take the blame and everyone will blame them.
Nordic aliens are the ones at fault.

I miss 2011-2013 bitcoin where you could make a transaction with essentially zero fees.

Its a pretty decent application that you can own bitcoin, fly to japan, pay for your meals/drinks with bitcoin avoiding having to convert your currency to the local currency sidestepping some fees.

Nope
The masons
The Third World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences caused by the 'agentur' of the 'Illuminati' between the political Zionists and the leaders of Islamic World. The war must be conducted in such a way that Islam (the Moslem Arabic World) and political Zionism (the State of Israel) mutually destroy each other. Meanwhile the other nations, once more divided on this issue will be constrained to fight to the point of complete physical, moral, spiritual and economical exhaustion

We shall unleash the Nihilists and the atheists, and we shall provoke a formidable social cataclysm which in all its horror will show clearly to the nations the effect of absolute atheism, origin of savagery and of the most bloody turmoil. Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, disillusioned with Christianity, whose deistic spirits will from that moment be without compass or direction, anxious for an ideal, but without knowing where to render its adoration, will receive the true light through the universal manifestation of the pure doctrine of Lucifer, brought finally out in the public view. This manifestation will result from the general reactionary movement which will follow the destruction of Christianity and atheism, both conquered and exterminated at the same time.4

Playing devils advocate: The total market cap of cryptos is 290 billion. If its being compared to the gold industry with a market cap of around 2 trillion, there's still room for growth.

One thing I don't like about this infographic; comparing the number of world currencies to cryptocurrencies is meaningless in the same way its meaningless to compare the number of paper files to files stored on the internet.

Why don't they compare market cap of bitcoin to that of USD or any countries currency?

For example The bank of England has over £400bn created on the books. Thats just for the UK.

Bitcoin is used across the world, though granted, there are probably less users bitcoin users than users of GBP.

But then again, the BOE has also been printing money like crazy so its hardly surprising that bitcoin's price has been going up in relation.

this is wrong and ill explain why.

currently. the only institutions that distributes money and regulates it is the government and the banks.
lets say for example the government decides to raise taxes from 10% to 35% in one day. no consent from the citizens. it means that the money you earn at work is now worth less and is less valuable.
keep in mind, the government can already invest your pension in money in anything it wants, it can take loans with your money as backing, it can do lots of irresponsible shit without your consent. and most of the the government worldwide already done that.

so my point is, politicians,regulators and bankers have the ability to screw over millions of people with no repercussions. this is where crypto comes in, the ability to send money anywhere around the world without some jew fuck banker or cop interfering is unprecedented.

You got it. When very bad news comes around the bubble will pop, back to 2k-5k, and that's where you should be buying, either bitcoin, other promising projects or top 10 coins. Crypto is here to stay and grow, you just gotta hold and find the right horses.

>this is where crypto comes in, the ability to send money anywhere around the world without some jew fuck banker or cop interfering is unprecedented.
Are you saying BTC is the best option for this? lmao. People are buying BTC for ponzi-like reasons.

Be honest with yourselves now and think really, really hard why people are holding bitcoin. Even the hardest believers out there are holding it or promoting it to make massive gains.
What possible other reason there is? The idea? Yeah, beautiful on paper, but no one is holding it due to it's idea.
Even as an idea it's useless as the legal status of money comes from the governments that pass the law.

You mean Ethereums dumb contracts because of which investors lost 250M in Parity hack? Money of the future everyone!

no, actually bitcoin is the worst at this.
im talking about crypto in general, we already have crypto's that are pound for pound the same with visa in terms of capabilities

Monero is great, but not everyone is a pedo :/ so it will always have niche use.

>People are buying BTC for ponzi-like reasons.
Exactly. I held some. It was to purely make money. For absolutely no other reason.
Remember - someone is going to be a loser here. It's a zero sum game.
If you put aside $100 each month to a piggy bank, at least you'll have 1200 at the end of the year. It is not certain with bitcoin and you know it. Gold and silver, albeit being manipulated to fuck is the elite's choice of value storage - they won't crash it hard. It's also going to be a good store for value. Bitcoin is a ponzi scheme, however, you will see it soon.

...

>There isn't. The percentage returns on BTC have now outpaced the .com bubble. It's going to implode.

How is that possible if Bitcoins marketcap is tiny compared to Nasdaq composite in 1999? Does not make any sense.

I don't think any crypto currency will ever see widespread use so long as the market is so volatile. How can I accept bitcoin in payment when that may only be 50% of its value tomorrow? How can I pay in bitcoin when I might be paying twice as much as something is worth?

>I say speculation will take it to 10k and then its going to crash back to where it 'should' be (comparing it to the trend)
I estimate that woupd be around 7k for now

Dude, when "bubbles" crash, they don't crash 30%, they crash 95-99%, so the price should be under 1000$ after a proper crash derp

you simply create large enough supply so the price remain low
see: ripple,iota

All kind of active is bound to being demonetized, after Brexit referendum, GBP crashed hard and still has not recovered. Gold

Assuming bitcoin is a bubble is assuming bitcoin will be demonetized in the future, and I see no reason for it to happen unless we get another Mt. Gox.

A quick rise in price does not mean "bubble", WalMart stocks went from 11 to 50 dollars in almost no time and it never went down, BTC is way more disruptive and global.

Bubbles are usually artificially inflated actives such as the housing bubble produced by artificially low interest rates or the dotcom bubble created by the Reverse Plaza Accord, unless the Tether issue proves true, bitcoin has been exposed to the free market constantly during a decade and the trend was always bullish.

>the ability to send money anywhere around the world without some jew fuck banker or cop interfering is unprecedented.

Except when the person you send BTC to exchanges it for fiat.

Probably because its the market you're least likely to get shafted in?

>Savings?
enjoy that 1% ROI which is probably lower than inflation.
>Bonds? Stocks?
same story, with the risk that some banker is going to fuck you over. Even then only paltry 6% gains or lower after trading fees unless you pick a winner in which case prepare to get fucked by the taxes anyway.

Gold is overvalued by 99% by your logic.

It's consensus value. Pure supply and demand. People agree on utility as a store and exchange of value and that is it. Just like seashells, gold, and paper money.

So is everything else in the world but you're just mad you can't into these sweet crypto gains

It makes absolute sense...problem is...USD BUBBLE IS POPPING!!!

So everything else suddenly costs MORE

Correction: Supposedly some bonds returned 14% last year.

are you the fag spamming that fucking gold bar image all over the board? Go the fuck back to /x/.

>Probably because its the market you're least likely to get shafted in?
How do you know that? Do you know the future? People are in it to make money, not to be "least shafted". The ones that are going to be "least shafted" if things go well on Planet Earth hold real value assets like real estate in good places and rent it to good people, have good homes themselves and make sound investments that won't crash through the floor. They invest in themselves mostly.

People already selling their house for BTC.

Bitcoin shouldn't be used to buy fucking groceries but rather to buy real estate, lambo's, hookers, etc, the good stuff in life.

Go to Aldi or Walmart if you want to spend your precious fiat.

*sigh* this is further proof this market is being flooded with people who have no idea what the fuck they are doing.

"At the beginning of 2015, Bitcoin was trading just above $300. In early November this year, the Bitcoin price topped $7,600. That translates to returns north of 2,200% in a matter of 1,041 trading days.

By comparison, the NASDAQ index was up 391% after 1,041 trading days from the start of 1995. Returns on the NASDAQ index peaked just shy of 1,100% after 1,326 trading days.

Bitcoin’s run has far outpaced the tech bubble, and its returns have already dwarfed dot-com mania."

businessinsider.com/bitcoin-price-bubble-in-4-charts-2017-11

>Are you saying BTC is the best option for this?

No, doge is better

He copied and pasted this somewhere bUT he forgets even the elite insiders know nothing is absolute and things can change

Having your own bank account you can access at any time without some govt locking you out is obviously worth a lot to people. If you're a sheep normie who trusts authority blindly then it might have no utility for you.

>Remember - someone is going to be a loser here. It's a zero sum game.

How is it a zero sum game? I don't understand. If people stop hoarding gold that much and start using e-gold (crypto) instead then it means new influx of capital. How is that not positive sum game?

>As people heard stories of acquaintances making unheard-of profits simply by buying and selling tulip bulbs, they decided to get in on the act – and prices skyrocketed. In 1633, a single bulb of Semper Augustus was already worth an astonishing 5,500 guilders. By the first month of 1637, this had almost doubled, to 10,000 guilders. Dash puts this sum in context: “It was enough to feed, clothe and house a whole Dutch family for half a lifetime, or sufficient to purchase one of the grandest homes on the most fashionable canal in Amsterdam for cash, complete with a coach house and an 80-ft (25-m) garden – and this at a time when homes in that city were as expensive as property anywhere in the world.”

Normies didn't get into bitcoin for years because they expected it to get hacked or broken and worthless. Now that it's proven itself for a decade it has some worth. Why don't crap coiners realize this, are you all new to crypto this year?

>Assuming bitcoin is a bubble is assuming bitcoin will be demonetized in the future, and I see no reason for it to happen unless we get another Mt. Gox.
>another Mt.Gox
You mean Mt.Finex

>Bubbles are usually artificially inflated actives such as the housing bubble produced by artificially low interest rates or the dotcom bubble created by the Reverse Plaza Accord
You mean just like artificially created Tethers prodiced by the omni layer?

Yep somehow it's not even in the same ball park market cap wise. We need to expand a lot in order for me to cry bubble.

Btc has out performed every other asset class on earth like 8 years running. Bubbles do not last that long

>same story, with the risk that some banker is going to fuck you over. Even then only paltry 6% gains or lower after trading fees unless you pick a winner in which case prepare to get fucked by the taxes anyway.

What are index funds

>How is it a zero sum game?

>/g/fag buys it at $3 in 2010
>normie guys it at $9.3k in 2017
>crashes down to $7k

Buy high, sell low. That's how. People are here to make money. That's the only reason it's being held. Someone makes money, someone loses it.
It's not that hard to understand - crypto isn't sex, both parties can't be happy at the same time. Someone is going to get some day hurt whether you see it or not.

>By comparison, the NASDAQ index was up 391% after 1,041 trading days from the start of 1995. Returns on the NASDAQ index peaked just shy of 1,100% after 1,326 trading days.

>Bitcoin’s run has far outpaced the tech bubble, and its returns have already dwarfed dot-com mania."

But it simply makes no sense. The market cap of Bitcoin is not even real, because it is much less than what you see on coinmarketcap.com

Many bitcoins are lost and not traded, so the market cap is a very unreliable indicator.

So it makes no sense how it can "outperform", if the total market cap is much lower than Nasdaq had in 1999 when USD was WORTH MUCH MORE. Explain this and I will believe you

The usd facilitates all the bubbles because of how much they print. typically this would happen because of inflation but since the dollar is the world reserve currency and is forced to be used to buy things like oil, inflation is no longer localized and is instead basically spread through everyone.

Your entire argument relies upon conspiracy theory
Lmao
Is that all you got? Do you really think tether took bitcoin from 1k all the way to over 9000?

dont think so

>The ones that are going to be "least shafted" if things go well on Planet Earth hold real value assets like real estate in good places and rent it to good people, have good homes themselves and make sound investments that won't crash through the floor.
In general I agree with you, but I would like to point out that you need over a certain amount of money to invest in real estate outside of a financial product.

With bitcoin you can invest much smaller amounts and see returns

>your argument relies on the idea that a few people are able to keep a secret, you're clearly a paranoid schizophrenic
Really nigga?

trustnodes.com/2017/11/22/bitfinex-reveals-new-polish-bank-account-panama-registered-company

What if the value keeps rising? In your book, someone buying bitcoin is losing when someone selling it is winning, in reality they are just completing a trade. You're assuming BTC is a worthless commodity that eventually everyone's just going to wake up and move on. What if this never happens? What if instead it becomes a real currency that is used to purchase goods and services?

The "market cap" doesn't matter you fucking moron. We're talking about the ROI which has been absurdly high. If you can't grasp this basic concept you deserve to lose your money.

Google's IPO was $85 in 2004. Today it's $1,056. It took 13 fucking years to 10x. And Google is exponentially more useful than Bitcoin.

This is not healthy growth. It's speculative mania.

Tether couldn't pump bitcoin that hard
You're an idiot
Its just a tiny littl3 drop in the ocean

If Bitcoin is being recognized as a legitimate decentralized store of global value your argument evaporates

That means people are simply buying to hold and exchange on a limited basis

It isn't a company, it's simply a completely new concept and that means early adoption is lucrative

>tether
>tiny little drop in the ocean
>cant pump bitcoin
hahahahahahahaahahahahaahahahaha

Yes it can. And it's no coincidence new tethers were minted before many of the BTC pumps, and that bitfinex was the price increase leader.

Who do you think went long against the shorts right before those pumps?

For that I can only say - government.
I know, the response would be - but bitcoin is anonymous, etc etc. You still need to cash it out to fiat - you cash it - uncle Sam sees it and you know what happens then.
I mean, I would love to believe in it, I really, really do, but given long enough time it will be taken away one way or another. Governments like to fuck us in the arse hard, very hard. Happened with gold before, will happen with cryptos too. After all, it needs internet to work and we all know how anonymous internet really is there days. At least I hope we know.
>With bitcoin you can invest much smaller amounts and see returns
Well, at least we agree on that - it's purpose is to make money, the thing you can buy something that is of value.

daily reminder that tulip mania never really happened the way it's described

>If Bitcoin is being recognized as a legitimate decentralized store of global value

Stop falling for this meme, it's never going to happen. Nobody with 2 brain cells to rub together is going to trust their wealth to a wildly speculative and volatile asset.

Furthermore, Bitcoin was not designed to be a store of value. It was designed to be a goddamn currency. The BTC cultists have all but admitted this will not be the case because it's too fucking slow, can't scale, and has transaction fees worse than the goddamn banks... so they're pushing this "digital gold" bullshit.

I can literally drive a chunk of gold to my local jewelry store and get cash for it before bitcoin can even finish a confirmation FFS.