/5eg/ Fifth Edition General

Mage Hand: if the bag of rats/daggers weighed less than 10 pounds, sure.

Thief: yes.

Barely 9 posts in and we're knee deep in faggotry.

I genuinely don't understand you people.

>tfw you'd actually pay for a full classics sourcebook of the old kits that core doesn't really cover too well
Literally that and the Ravenloft CS are the only supplements that really interest me.

The bag of daggers spills at your opponent's feet.

Your opponent picks up the daggers and prepares a perfect throw, smirks, and says "nothing personnel, kid"

Does he juggle them first? If he's juggling them, he doesn't limit his actions by drawing them individually.

Planescape/Spelljammer

I guess I generally allow the thief/arcane trickster to supplement their attacks with pseudoattack bonus actions. They deal 1d4 damage, if they don't have an effect (like alchemist's fire). Is that unbalanced? It doesn't seem too crazy to me.

Frankly, Foe Slayer should've just been a part of Favored Enemy. Why it's 20th fucking level is beyond me.

Not sure what you'd replace it with though. Maybe some buff to spellcasting or something.

>Sign up for a CoS game
>Finally get to play my favourite, fun class in a long while
>We trudge through what I believe is the Death House - as I've been trying to avoid spoilers
>4 sessions in we've beaten the shambling mound

>See no game scheduled for our usual weekly slot
>Ask if we're playing like 2h before the game just to feel safe
>GM cancels on my prompt and short notice because of RL, which is fair enough

Actually feel relieved because I am not enjoying rolling dice against stat blocks, pretending I am a singular fantasy character surrounded by other cliche fantasy characters and waiting for my turn to pop up/trudging through the boring dungeon doing boring dungeon things

H-help me Veeky Forums. I don't know what's wrong with me. I thought I want this. I thought I enjoy this.

Naval combat rules. made some, but they're really only workable for my campaign.

Magitek bullshit.

New archetypes, maybe; new classes only if concept is completely unworkable otherwise.

> Psionics should be a sorcerer archetype

For the thief t would even be okay to allow them to use alchemist fire. For the trickster it's weird that you let them since that isn't a sleight of hand check. Other than that it's basically letting them have an off hand dagger.

Nah, rogues per turn damage isn't all that great in the first place. Adding an extra 2.5 damage is hardly going to tip the scales.

Sounds like free-form is your game son.

There's no shame in it. Go, blossom in your own special way.

...

Doing something with the intent of harm is an attack. So throwing a bag of X across a room to flip a switch? Fine. Throwing a bag of X to incapacitate or wound an opponent? No. Otherwise why shouldn't I be able to use Fast Hands to "use" my rapier to stab as a bonus action every round? It's just using an object, right?

Nice table shading.

I mean yeah, there might be an skill check or ability roll involved to see if they hit.

I guess I just don't see the appeal of this meme. It isn't like pic related.

You may want to try different games. DnD combat can be kind of a slog if your DM is still getting used to thinking on their feet. There are other games that are more supportive of new DMs, like FFG's star wars games.

>using fast hands to use an object "rapier"

Sure, but you deal 1d4 damage.

>tfw I run a 5e campaign for 5 of my best friends in a homebrewed setting and highly personalized stories for each of the players
>tfw I would never remotely consider playing D&D online or with randos at a hobby shop
It's not he hobby, it's the way you're playing.

Give me a new Monster Manual. The current one works fine, but now we have a good time to understand the balance.
That, and we get the minutae contained within the dnd bestiary

Inevitables

Why does this bitch have four ears?

...

>thief spreads caltrops in a fight
>counts as an attack because he has intent to hurt people

Well, since 'object' has an in game definition, no. You are using a weapon.

Making a sleight of hand check still doesn't allow them to use an object at a distance like that. Or to use an oject at all for that matter.

>Making a sleight of hand check still doesn't allow them to use an object at a distance like that. Or to use an oject at all for that matter.

No it doesn't. That's their class feature (use object on a bonus action or use magic hand to use object on a bonus action). The sleight of hand check, or possibly spell attack vs ac depending on the situation is just what I require to see if they're successful.

Maybe I am the problem. I've been GMing for so long that being restrained to acting as one guy - in a game where people actually find fighting random encounters and generic ghouls fun - is just not doing it for me.

I'm even playing a wizard and trying to creatively use stuff like ghost sound, grease. Others appreciate it. I seem not to.

I'd definitely love playing with tightly knit group of friends. But all my RL friends are:
>Lawyer normals
>Live in Fuckinghamshire, 2h and 20 pounds commute away
>Already tried P&P and either don't find it fun or can't take it seriously
>Combination of the above

Page reference for the definition of object, please. 5e isn't 4e, folks. They use real words to be interpreted by real people, not keywords to be mechanically processed by a DMbot. Excercise some judgement.

That's certainly possible. Talk to your group about their expectations and wants for the game.

Do all Monks have to have come from a Monastery? I'm trying to tie being a Monk into sticking around my family in Yartar.

Would receiving training from one Elder/Sensei/Teacher be sufficient? Fluff is important to me fuck you.

No it doesn't. It allows them to pick a pocket. reverse pick pockets, and pick locks. Nothing else. Otherwise the thief's ability would be basically nothing.

>Doing something with the intent of harm is an attack
An attack is anything involving an attack roll and anything else that is specifically called an attack.

It also lets you control the mage hand as a bonus action. Go read what mage hand can do.

Check the description of the use object action. It's for objects that specifically require an action to use. To use a rapier, you take the attack action.

Otherwise retards like you would be like, 'wel it says i cin in-tur-act wif one object per tern. attacking is in-tor-ictin wif a wipon rot?'

>A spectral, floating hand appears at a point you choose within range. The hand lasts for the duration or until you dismiss it as an action. The hand vanishes if it is ever more than 30 feet away from you or if you cast this spell again. You can use your action to control the hand. You can use the hand to manipulate an object, open an unlocked foor or container, stow or retrieve an item from an open container, or pour the contents out of a vial. You can move the hand up to 30 feet each time you use it. The hand can’t attack, activate magical items, or carry more than 10 pounds.

The hand can manipulate or stow objects.

The mage hand ledgerdomain feature lets you do all this as a bonus action, while the hand is invisible.

The thief's class feature is nothing compared to magical ledgerdomain.

Oh sure.
You were trained in your art by an elderly master in your small little farming village, who swore never to use his hands to harm ever again after killing a man accidentally. He brought with him his finest keepsake; a locket filled with medicinal herbs that can heal wounds, which he gives to you after you finish your training.

And then some asshole steals the head of your Buddha statue.

O always thought you could use it for the 3 things it lists in the tricksters entry. Otherwise the thief is an almost useless sub-class.

>Fuckinghamshire
Why would you ever leave?

>useless sub-class
Welcome to WotC "class balance".

Called an attack by whom? If I say my Fighter stabs the orc in the face, is it not an attack roll if my DM calls for a Strength check? Or did it become an attack when the DM understood me to mean I was attacking the orc by way of stabbing? Getting pedantic about crystal clear hard definitions just leads to shorty rules lawyer garbage. You know damn well if you were attacking or not, and so does everybody else at the table.

>thief
>useless

Supreme Sneak, Use Magic Device, and Thief's Reflexes are all fantastic.

No, they don't. I was working on a homebrew a while back that addressed this, but it's pretty possible for monastic type traditions to arise from peasants who develop ki usage as a way to cope with day to day tasks.

Do it Drunken Master style.

> Homebrew archetype for what should be, at most, a Background Feature
user.

Use magic device and thief's reflexes are useful, but they are both high level abilities. Plus you aren't going to get enough magic items in 5e to make real use of use magic device unless your DM is a retard.

Supreme sneak is useless garbage. I don't want a 10th level ability to give me something that I can attain with low level spells or magic items without having to crawl on my belly through the dirt.

>all monastic traditions should just be background features

user...

Do you even 36th Chamber?

>aarrgghhh someone came up with a very very slightly novel trace of backstory, how painful

>I don't want a 10th level ability to give me something that I can attain with low level spells or magic items without having to crawl on my belly through the dirt.

Invisibility requires Concentration, which is a serious fucking problem. I think 3e has ruined people's brains to the point that they can't wrap their tiny brains around how much of a problem Concentration is.

We have a pretty good GM for our hobby shop game, and I brought my A Game for roleplaying and it seemed to bring everyone else up to the challenge.

Now we have a ridiculous party dynamic and hilarity ensues as we clash with Strahd's minions and the bullshit of the lands locked in mist.

You know that town, Vallaki.

Fuck that town. Before we leave we are probably burning it down.

>advantage on sneak is useless
>on a rogue

Wizard is my favorite 5e class. I understand concentration. It's only a problem if you are mentally challenged. Plus a cloak of elven kind does the same thing.

Also invisibility doesn't give you advantage on stealth checks. But it's play that you didn't know that, being mentally challenged and all.

Are people STILL bitching about things that've been true forever (except in 4e, where the caster/noncaster line is... ambiguous)?

Especially when probably the most powerful class is the rogue, who is great in and out of fights?

Concentration isn't a problem. It's a solution.

>advantage on sneak is useless on a class that rolls minimum 18 on every sneak check by level 11.

Yes, actually it is. Mathematically the advantage is worth maybe +1.

You can get advantage on stealth checks many different ways, and the ability makes you move at half speed, thus forcing you to make twice as many stealth checks before reaching a destination.

>Plus a cloak of elven kind does the same thing.

Any argument based off "hope the DM spontaneously decides to rain manna down from heaven upon thee" is pointless. In the off chance you do find your nice specific magic item, then its not remotely a negative to have two people in the party who can sneak (since showing up alone to a fight meant for a whole party is suicide), and you can always use your cloak for something else.

>backstory
...Hence, background feature.

Yes, but concentration is absolutely a problem for the guy having to ... concentrate, since it renders flying, invisible, mind controlling wizards to one of the above, or none of the above if anyone decides to attack them.

What are you talking about? You do know that you can roll higher than 10 after you get Reliable Talent, right?

You only make one stealth check, the total of which is used for all perception checks to see you.

Reposting from the old thread as I failed my perception check to notice it was autosaging...
So I'm gonna be running the Death House adventure to see if we enjoy it enough to be worth playing the full Strahd module.
What is the effect of the mist? It doesn't say in the pdf.
Also, anything I should prepare for? I've warned people it looks pretty deadly to put them on edge for the horror atmosphere, whether it is, we shall see.
Do you think the struts in the underground dungeon should prevent diagonal movement? Looks like that's the idea.

>make one stealth check
>forever invisible
>move around free from danger for all eternity

That makes perfect sense.

>I failed my perception check to notice it was autosaging

>You only make one stealth check, the total of which is used for all perception checks to see you.
Yup, one stealth check lasts until you stop hiding or are discovered

Eventually, the rogue will either have to do something that breaks stealth, or he will be irrelevant and isolated from his party forever. Either way works.

>What are you talking about? You do know that you can roll higher than 10 after you get Reliable Talent, right?

Yes. But reliable talent makes advantage less useful. Mathematically, advantage is more useful the less of a bonus you have to hit or succeed. I.E., the more variance there is, the more useful advantage is. Reliable talent significantly reduces variance, and therefore significantly reduces the effective bonus advantage gives you.

It just redirects you back to where you started and gives you a level of exhaustion.

PHB 177 in the Hiding section:

"When you try to hide, make a Dexterity (Stealth) check. Until you are discovered or you stop hiding, that check's total is contested by the Wisdom (Perception) check of any creature that actively searches for signs of your presence."

>Until you are discovered or stop hiding

A MM2 also means more variety and maybe more setting specific monsters.

Yeah, the effect is lessened, but it's still there. That hardly makes it "useless garbage".

No, that's the half move speed.

Boo fucking hoo.

Supreme Sneak
Starting at 9th level, you have advantage on a Dexterity (Stealth) check if you move no more than half your speed on the same turn.

Hiding
When you try to hide, make a Dexterity (Stealth) check. Until you are discovered or you stop hiding, that check’s total is contested by the Wisdom (Perception) check of any creature that actively searches for signs of your presence.

You only need to move at half speed one turn for each time you use the ability, not the whole time you're sneaking.

Going back a bit, speaking as someone who is actually playing a Thief right now (currently 8th level), Second-Story Work has actually been incredibly useful. While the +5 ft. to jump distance isn't all that much, the ability to Climb at full speed is amazing when combined with the Rogue's general ability to Dash as a bonus action.

If you're a thief, and you can't make good use of what amounts to a 90 ft. climb speed, you're doing something wrong.

Cool, thanks anons.

Not who you're arguing with but I have a question.

What if the rogue (not even necessarily thief) uses his action to hide and decides that his hide attempt was not good enough? Can he use his cunning action to try again? How about on his next turn? Would that be metagaming?

>Can he use his cunning action to try again?

Yes.

>Would that be metagaming?

Not at all.

>what are Slippers of Spiderclimb
>can climb and can run across the ceiling at full speed
Although with Second-Story Work, you do get the climb speed without having to sacrifice a boots/attunement slot.

If you're a ranged rogue then that's hardly a problem. You're probably hunkered down in a shady area 50+ feet away, waiting to get your next shot off while the rest of the party is keeping the enemy busy.

Outside of combat, it basically means you get advantage on sneak all the time.

>what are Slippers of Spiderclimb

A magic item that not everyone is going to have access to, and a thief is good enough at climbing that there's no real drawback to giving the slippers to another party member.

Guess you misunderstood my post.

Get the fucking magic mart out of your head. It's not a thing in baseline 5e.

You must be great to play with that "pray for DM welfare" is your answer to every tactical consideration.

>wizard decked from head to toe in magic items
>just mug him and sell his shit to get rich, no more need to adventure

>be golem
>sell body to magic mart to become rich
>level 1 head with level 20 bling

Manipulating an object is not the same as taking the 'Use Object' action.

>playan new session
> got 3 magic items at level 1 already, (though they're all just small utility items that have no effect on combat)

How fucked are things going to get for a DM that gives magic items out the ass in 5e?

>barbarian
>take magic initiate for create bonfire
>grapple opponent (reckless doesn't work for this because it only applies to melee weapon attacks)
>shove him prone

Next turn, cast create bonfire in the square he's in

following turns just beat him senseless

After how good and well-designed the 4e fighter was, 5e going back to old boring fighter mechanics to satisfy grognards was just baffling.

Everything we described is possible with the base functions of magic hand. It's the mage hand ledgerdomain that lets you do it as a bonus action.

Not very. The official modules, for example, are 10x as generous as the DMG guidelines, and a DM who hand picks loot under DMG guidelines is 10x as generous as one who random rolls it.

5e casters are pretty helpless compared to 4e incarnations as well, though.