40k general

So when are the new rules for the flyers coming out ? Do we know what they will be and how they will fit into the regular game ?

>Hi all,

>I already have my copy of the book, and after a quick go-through:

>(As usual, translations may not be 100% correct)

>- There is a new detachment:

>Air Superiority Detachment

>Is formed by 1-3 Flyer Wings*

>Restrictions: All models have to be chosen from the same faction

>Benefits:
>- Air commander; If the commander of the Wing is in reserves, re-roll interception, If you have superiority and your Chief is in Reservers you add +2 to your reserve rolls instead of 1.
>- Combined formation: You choose to make a single reserve roll for the whole formation if you want.
>- Transport that have the hover mode have the Objetive secured rule.

>Of course I need to read the book to know what it all means.

>All the existing flyers have the same point costs and rules as in their current codex.

>The book says that all the flyers described in this book replace their Data Sheets in all the current codex. Seems that this rules are coming to stay.

>FMC are not in this book.

>The datasheets are:
>- Valkyries
>- Stormhawk Interceptors
>- Stormtalon
>- Stormraven
>- Storm wing (Formation)
>- Strike Wing (Formation, 2 Stormhawks + 2 Stormtalons)
>- Blood Angel Stormraven
>- Grey Knights Stormraven
>- Dark Talon
>- Nephilim
>- Ravenwing abductor squadron (Formation, 2 Nephilim + 1 Dark Talon)
>- Stormwolf
>- Stormfang
>- Ice Storm assault pack (Formation, 2 Stormwolves + 2 Stormfangs)
>- Heldrake
>- Razorwing
>- Voidraven
>- Blackheart Talon (Formation, 2 Razorwings + 2 Voidravens)
>- Crimson Hunter
>- Hemlock
>- Shroud of Kurnous (Formation, 2-3 Crimson Hunters + 1 Hemlock)
>- Night Scythes
>- Doom Scythes
>- Oppressor Flight (Formation, 1 Night Scythe + 2-3 Doom Scythes)
>- Blitza-Bomber
>- Burna-Bomber
>- Dakkajet
>- Wazbom Blastajets
>- Ork Skwadron (Formation, 3 of any but Wazbom Blastajets)
>- Kustom Wazmob (1 Wazbom + 3 up to three of any other ork flyer including the Wazmob)
>- Razorshark
>- Sun Shark
>- Air caste Support cadre (Formation, 2 Razorsharks + 1 Sun Shark)

user explain to me how the dark angel fliers will be useful just because the mechanics for fliers as a whole change.
I'm picking up the dark angels codex up today and really want to know how our fliers are not still shit.

>youtube.com/watch?v=HIdGMKqXXDY
Hey yall..

>I will try to sumarize the new stuff:

>All Flyers have now three new Atributes: Combat Role, Pursuit and Agility (the more the better)

>When shooting there are two types of targes: Ground and flying. Flying targets are FMC, other Flyers, Jetbikes and Grav vehicles. The rest are ground targets.

>New rule: Air superiority: If a player has Flyers in Reserve at the end of the Aerial Duel Phase can add +1/-1 to their reserve rolls. Opponent has -1 to reserve rolls.

>Any flyer can now make an additional pivot at any point of ther movement if they roll their Agility or less in a single D6.

>Only Flyers with the Attack Role can have AA when shooting, but they have -1 BS when shooting Ground Targets.

>Flyers do not benefit from cover (Terrain or other models)

>When moving Flat Out you can add your Pursuit to the distance

>The different combat roles give different bonusses depending on the type of the Attack Pattern.

>There are 6 different attack patterns. If I could post a picture of the patterns I would do it, but I think that it is forbidden ...

so are we flyhammer now? can I still play without getting tabled without super special flying hellturkeys and spiky boomerangs?

Thanks. Any particular changes to the stats ? I'm looking specifically at the Nephilim, I hope it's finally okayish.

>To sumarize a litte bit:

>Duel Phase happens at the beginning of each Player's turn. It is optional. It only involves Flyers in reserve or active reserves. If a player wants to skip the phase, roll a d6. Winner decides.

>4 Subphases:
>Interception
>Aproximation
>Maneuver
>Attack

>INTERCEPTION
>Each player roll a D6. Winner (after applying modificators) is attacking player, the other defending player.

>APROX, MANEUVER AND ATTACK
>During each phase each player chooses secretly a Tactic, then compare tactics in a table and apply results.

>At the end of the Attack phase, resolve a shooting phase between both flyers, applying the mods from the previous phases (if any)

Threadly whine about lack of plastic sisters. I see threads from 2010 saying it'll come soon.

What I posted is all that is known for now. But the stats for flyers didnt change at all (outside from role/agility/speed stats. Nephilim is already known to be Fighter with normal agility and greater than normal speed. Those will affect dogfighting)

There's a discord server but it's pretty dead.
discord.gg/0vhztUCQWDoXziLH

Life is pain. Death is the only release short of plastic sisters.

So none of the forge world ones

aka

all of the recognizable flyers?

Just be a little patient, i have heard from good source that they are just around the corner.

I'm a bit worried that Vendetta isnt on the list. Maybe its just a upgrade for Valkyerie (they pretty much are the same vehicle, just like Leman Russes are and Hellhounds)

I was literally just reading a thread from 2010 saying that.

No. FW have to update their flyers with new rules for combatrole/agility/pursuit.

Before that happens FW flyers are un-usable outside of friendly game where you just pick up the values for them with your opponent.

By Valkyries, I can assume it includes Vendetta right?

They were wrong, i am right, you can take my word for it.

Have faith, sister

You can assume that. But we dont know it yet.

Thanks. I will be happy if he finally excels at something or is a good generalist.

Nice, GW replaces the old, incredibly cheap flyer kits with these new ones by throwing in a token sprue and bumping up the price. to match the later released, far more expensive flyers.

Gotta find one more old, cheap dakkajet for a conversion project. After that I'm done. Wonder what upgrade kit they'll invent for the DE flyer to make it more expensive. At the moment it's a great deal for CWE to use as their own flyer. The design isn't even that off from CWE flyers. Just replace the guns, pilot and paint in in craftworld colours.

>own dakka jet from before
>decent 7/10 paint job

might just sell it for like £55 and buy the new kit

Or, you know they mean Valkyries.

yeah. most armies have ground based AA and there's AA fortifications everyone can take.

>most armies have ground based AA
25 PPM Flakk Missiles don't fucking count. They should be free, and thy still wouldn't be enough.

Going to expand my collection so I can start playing 750pts. How does this look for a well rounded league list? I'm not sure how much I need the velocity trackers at 750 points and I'd really like to keep the cadre fireblade since I like them. I know I'm going to see at least one flyrant already at this point level and maybe a voidraven. Lots of bikes too I bet from the DA player. Don't really want to take bigger suits.

HQ
Cadre Fireblade

Troops
Strike Team - Ten fire warriors for the fireblade to join.

Strike Team - Four warriors led by a shas'ui with markerlight and target lock.

Elites
Stealth Suits - Two suits led by a shas'vre with a fusion blaster, markerlight, and target lock.

Crisis Suits - Two suits with two missile pods and velocity trackers led by a shas'vre with a missile pod and Puretide Engram.

Fast Attack
Pathfinder team - Four pathfinders and a Shas'ui.

Heavy Support
A Hammerhead armed with a railgun and submunitions, twin linked smart missiles, blacksun filter, and a disruption pod.

>he dosent have a quadgun

then go the fortification route, there's several options there.
A firestorm redoubt with its pair of quad icarus cannons will fuck 1 or 2 flyers each turn if you really want to get rid of them.

What happened to based Duncan?

Looks solid.

I assume the idea is to "cascade" the markerlights from unit to unit. You might have issues with AV14, but you shouldn't see too much of that here.

Unless your local area is full of dicks, skip the velocity trackers, and just rely on your 12 S7 missile shots. Volume of fire helps a lot against most fliers.

>get rid if King Duncan
>replace him with a 5/10 chink
>has the same voice as my mum

i dont know how i feel about this

Are the new stats depended on their role/classification or do invidual flyers have different stats ?

Hydra, manticore, sabre gun platforms, razorback, traktor kannon, battlesuits, praetor assault launcher, pylons, war walkers, dunecrawlers, agesis defense line etc...

EDUCATE YOURSELF

Pretty sure it's just sky hammer not celestial get that AoS the fuck out of here

>razorback
>good AA

I want to fuck your mom then

Yeah, thats the idea. I was also thinking all the target lock markerlights could help set up for a round of BS4 markerlight fire from the pathfinders if I really need to just cover something with them too.

Thanks for the reassurance about the trackers. I'm going to guess I'll be seeing one flyer every other game, but at least the league rules I looked at mentioned only one flyer is allowed at 750. I'm just really gunshy of flyrants I guess even if theres only going to be one at the moment.

So post removing the trackers I can get a second missile pod on the crisis shas'ui and sensor spines on the hammerhead with twenty points to spare. I guess I could just get support turrets on the strike teams for even more missiles. As for AV14 I don't think I'll see any either no guard in the league and of the two marines players one is using Ravenwing so no landraiders. I'm not being that guy by being this neurotic about listbuilding am I?

Neither is a single solitary quadgun, yet retards post that as a rebuttal all the god damn time.

really? i mean shes a lovely woman, but shes like 56 and kinda on the chubby side. Are you just attracted to english women?

is mediocre AA, but ALL armies can have it, and its a damn sight better than a razor back you tard

Being the attacker or the defender has no difference except if both choose their second option (Tail/Hold Steady).

Since the defender will be scared of that solution it will avoid Hold Steady unless mind games (which he can't do often).

So, for the attacker, Roll Right is the better option because defenders will pick Hold Steady less time.

Of course if you pick always Roll Right, you will be predictable.

I'd say a pile of free Razorbacks is better than a 100 point dual-autocannon.

No one said anything about good aa. The faggot just implied that he doesn't have access to aa outside of some missles. Follow the conversatio m8

given that they're releasing new data sheets wity the neew stats added to the statline they likely vary by individual flyer. There's probably general trends based on role though. I'd bet fighters are usually high pursuit and bombers are usually low agility.

>there is no problem with AA
>everyone can just take le quadgun ;^)

So, there's a chance that Heldrake's are going to get something special to represent them tearing other fliers apart in glorious CQC, right? Right?!

All flyers have different stats
If you read it from the start, you would figure out that they are translated names. Spanish I believe.

What the fuck, I just walked in to a store today to find out they renamed fantasy boar boys "gore-grunters" for AoS.

if you want something better than the quadgun just take it. The quadgun is hardly the only AA fortification option.

they already do. They're the only vehicle flyer that gets vector strikes.

>gore-grunters
How does this surprise you? Games Workshop is awful at naming things. Just look at the Wolf Wolf codex.

With luck, Vector Strikes are going to be factored in. Without such luck Baledrakes are as useless as ever and are forced to eat enemy flyers shooting every dogfight phase.

>user lists a bunch of other aa units
>continue to be a giant faggot about quad guns

Which currently doesn't do diddly for this new "Buy hundreds of dollars of fliers and play rock-paper-scissors to destroy them before they hit the table" phase. I just hope that the Heldrake isn't about to complete its journey into obsolescence.

That retard included multiple non-AA units, and half of his list is IG shit.

>flyrants
Well, honestly, you likely wont be killing it even with a couple of S7 skyfire shooting.

>I'm not being that guy by being this neurotic about listbuilding am I?
Nah, I can garantuee you that pretty much everyone does this. You wouldn't bring a lot of anti-marine shit if there weren't any marines, and you wouldn't bring heavy anti-armour, if no one brings anything higher than AV12 vehicles.

That's just common sense.

Are you retarded? Like actually retarded? Have you never even picked up a codex? Do you even play this game? Literally, I have not met someone this retarded on here since carnac.

>razorbacks
>skyfire
>war walkers
>skyfire

Get back to your tard wrangler, he/she is probably very worried about you.

Dont be retarded and actually play this game sometimes instead of being fucktard in mongolian basket-knitting forums.

the helldrake at least is an especially tough flyer. it's probably going too survive the reserve interceptor phase and make it too the TT.

units don't need skyfire to be AA options. Volume of fire and twin linked can be sufficient.
Sure its not an amazing AA choice, but we're not talking about only amazing AA choices.

>>Only Flyers with the Attack Role can have AA when shooting, but they have -1 BS when shooting Ground Targets.

My Dakka jet gets bf 1 when shooting at ground targets... can´t make this shit up.

>ork players in charge of reading their codex

>Well, honestly, you likely wont be killing it even with a couple of S7 skyfire shooting.
What do I do by the time he has three of them at 1500? Matches are supposed to be organized by players in a friendly manner since its a long running escalation league, so can I just say no to that? I don't really like the look or mobility of missile sides from what I've seen of them and I always hear tau flyers are pretty bad when velocity trackers exist.

>Nah, I can guarantee you that pretty much everyone does this.
That sounds fair I guess, thanks. At present the registered players are using: Necrons, Dark Angels, Space Wolves, Skitarii, Tyranids, 30k Death Guard, Eldar, Dark Eldar, Orcs, and of course my Tau.

I'm most worried about bikes, thunderwolves and long fangs, wraithguard, flyrants, and the choppy necrons whose names I haven't learned yet (lychguard? those cool spider worm things too). No idea what Death Guard even does yet other than be slow and tough. He did say something about wanting to bring a fire raptor at 750 though just to do it.

warwalkers can talke eldar missile launcher which get flak

Don't they get flak for free with their missile launchers though?

Whats your point?
Im pretty sure bf 2 minus 1 equals 1.

I think he means you might have strafing run or something, making it 2 after the +1 and -1. Which still sucks since the new rules are still an effective -1 to your best flyers BS. Guess thats one way to sell new flyers.

You even had a chance to look up the dakkajet datasheet again yet you didn't. Amazing.

The point is that you dont read your codex.
Dakkajets have Strafing Run.

Dakka Jets have Strafe, which adds +1 BS when shooting at not-flyers

ye but dakkajets are BS3 vs ground targets.
besides I'm not sure why you're complaining. everyone's fighters are getting the same nerf.

That crisis loadout is good for 750, you may want to give them different weapons at higher points values though. Magnetising would be a good idea.

that's what I said.
So war walkers are an AA option. Plus you get supplimental AA from dark reapers or swooping hawks.

Basically dumb user is down to saying that SM don't have powerful ground to air options.

Some races can afford nerfs more than others

Wow thanks, i didnt know that. Didnt field it since 5th edition.

given that dakkajets have high volume of fire and twin linked they're one of the races that can afford it.

Magnets, got it. I'll start looking for some guides on that. At higher points I was thinking about deepstriking them with flamers and fusion blasters. Recommendations on loadouts other than that? I really don't know what to think of the plasma, good strength and ap but only a few shots from BS3 models.

pretty sure it had that rule even then.

>orks can afford nerfs
Do you even play the game, or are you just a competitive shitposter?

>I don't really like the look or mobility of missile sides from what I've seen of them and I always hear tau flyers are pretty bad when velocity trackers exist.
Skyrays are really good, and can reliably take care of most fliers by themselves, and have built in velocity trackers. Remember that markerlights make snap fires better, so a couple of markerlight shots on a flier will make your non-skyfire units very good at dealing with it.

>needs skyfire in order to fire at aircraft

>Skyrays
Oh yeah, kinda just forgot about those. I really like the hammerhead so I guess I was just focused on it instead. I'll have to work at least one in at the next points escalation. Thanks for the tip.

i just mean the dakkajetis relatively unaffected by the global nerf.

>just forgot about those
So did GW, when they made a decurion that straight up didn't allow you to include it. From memory, it is the absolute ONLY unit we cannot take in the decurion.

And the 1 we can from Mont'ka, requires 3 hammerheads to get 1 skyray.

Nice trips

Really? Should I just ignore the decurion until like 1750 or 1500 points? Three hammerheads and a skyray sounds hard on points even if the hammerhead is one of my favorite units so far. The only books I have are my core rulebook and codex, I'll start downloading Mont'ka from the OP database now to check it out. Its not super cheesy is it? I like my friends, even flyrant guy.

Just how long can a Custode's name get?