What's going on in MTG right now?

No that's not how it works. These people will infiltrate and destroy any refuge of people who think differently to them.

You should actually hate wizards for pandering.

Thanks for that infographic friend.

The thing that always makes me laugh about this picture is how it's literally just hipster logic - "x was good before it got popular/sold out" - but Veeky Forums claims to hate hipsters.

Which is exactly what hipsters do.

Good thing this ain't reddit, they are banning people for disagreeing with the video, there is a lot of bullshit because SJW know they can get away with more that the standard norm. Why ask for basic respect, when you can get a cake and eat it too, plus all the free veiws these female streams will get from this. Doesn't help that WOTC is in full shill mode, all they care about is selling packs to sjws and rich Indian kids in high school

The popularity isn't what kills the game, it's the pandering to the largest group possible that does.

>women in magic panel
>panel
>not a single male in sight

Why the fuck does anyone take this shit seriously when they can't even be arsed to get a group of people who, from the outset, at least look like they can cover a number of different viewpoints?

Only women are allowed talk about women but fucking everyone gets to inject their two cents when it's literally any other issue.

REEEEEEEE

For a subjective definition of kill of course.

If you're part of the core audience of a game in its infancy, and it changes what defines it in an attempt to appeal to a wider audience, that might end up alienating you. You can't really blame a company for making decisions that lead to more sales.

It's great being a store owner because I take all the business of the FLGS that panders to this shit by allowing TnA playmats, people to dress how they want, generally let them act like free adults, etc.

What's funnier is I get more women in my store than he does. His is literally beta male orbiters running around telling people to not do things.

He kicks people out for concealed carrying too.

Not quite, because the largest group who play Magic are straight white males, by default.

The problem comes from pandering to the minority who are so vocal and incensed about fucking everything, yet don't give a shit about the game itself, they appear larger than they are.

You can't really but I think making the safe bet of consistant nerd income is smarter than a rush of normie income that slows to a trickle after a year.

I can kind of understand that last part since, in the event something were to happen and guns be drawn, even the best of intentions, innocents can be hurt.

I think, personally, it's a bit of an overreaction but I do sympathise, in that case. Bearing in mind, this is all assuming that that is his reasoning behind the policy.

>Magic Panel

the fuck?

So what you're saying is you're a dirty Bernie socialist because that's basic fucking capitalism, mang. You want as large and wide a customer base as possible.

About the problematic Playmats and Tokens:

"If I ask, people will do something that I want them to do. Otherwise they will get in trouble and It wont be on me"
Great stuff really.

You aren't thinking enough like a manager.

The decline isn't relevant because by then you will be doing something else so you can blame it on someone else. What matters is the initial spike that happens because of a choice you made.

Its not really just that.

Imho its the pandering wotc is doing in literally everything and trying to force flavor cards. They're trying to appeal to a wide of an audience as possible and might pull a bilzzard and cave to this. All it will do is create more bad cards for flavor and other shit they'll have to shoehorn in leaving modern and the eternal formats lacking in new cards to change up the meta. Maybe modern wont be too bad and still have the odd meta shift, but too many cards with low power or high power with ridiculous mana costs will starve eternal. Thus they'll have to mess around with the banned/restricted list to change the meta (lodestone rip)

I recently started going to my lgs and the owner is enforcing your same politic and it's great. Everyone is chill as fuck, there are no dramas and everyone from the weeb girl that plays FoW to the MtG grognard gets along, honestly your way of handling store politica is the best one.

...

Literally what's wrong with every industry, holy fuck.

I doubt there is thought behind it, only that it's a leftist policy he believes in

Honestly I have no problem with him running his business the way he wants to though.

I allow it because I carry and feel like a jerk not allowing it. Honestly though if you wanted to carry and I had a sign against it what could I do to stop you?

If you're a socialist, you want everyone or as many as possible to be able to enjoy cool stuff.

If you're capitalist, you realise that expanding the customer base means more income.

If you're a realist, you've seen the numbers and realised that the people whining about SJW and muh hobby are an extremely vocal, toxic and small minority who don't actually contribute that much money while shrinking the audience.

That minority might seem worth pandering to if your market share is nonexistent, but it's mostly just a bad idea.

If you're whining about SJWs ruining things on Veeky Forums and Reddit, you know nothing. But then, you likely are a teenager and it's not like Facebook is much better.

>I lost my edit when my computer crashed

>if you wanted to carry and I had a sign against it what could I do to stop you?
Tell him that he's not welcome in the store and call the police on his ass if he refuses to leave?

Thanks!

Treating people like people really does help a community.

When people complain to me about another customer (outside of cheating or illegal things like harassment) I tell them to just talk to them about the playmat or the rude comment they said.

Obviously if the person is completely toxic and popping off sieg heils I deal with it but people generally can and should handle these things on their big boy own.

That is how it works faggot. We get driven out of our hobby so we start a new hobby with our better experiences and then proceed to have the same cycle over and over.

user speaks truth.

Yeah, ninety seconds in and my suspicions are confirmed. Nobody ever describes exactly where the line is between "sexist" and "not sexist" aside from a matter of discomfort: and never do I hear it described precisely what leads to that discomfort, nor do I usually see any attempt by the aggrieved parties or sympathetic judges to define a specific factor that is deemed unacceptable. So what is acceptable? If I bring a mat that features a fully and appropriately-clad woman in a completely innocuous situation, and my opponent claims they're triggered by [insert contrived grievance], does that opponent have grounds to register a complaint? Does the Judge have to render a ruling in their favor, or can they state that they simply don't see anything offensive and walk away? Can the Judge force me to use a different mat if they can't state a specific reason why the current one is considered "offensive" enough to warrant it, if it can be considered "offensive" at all?

The minute that people can start to expect a ruling in their favor based on the fact that they dislike something instead of it being based on a systematic application of specific and publicly known standards, the Judge system has been broken. If you can't understand that fact then you have no business being involved in competitive play, as a player or as a Judge.

My bad, I meant

>if you wanted to concealed carry etc etc

I can't frisk everybody, that's weird.

Anyways, this is not a productive area of discussion. My bad for bringing it up because it is quite polarizing on this board.

We need more people like you. Just treat adults like adults. The only people who make big deals out of nothing are children anyway.

It's a pretty common life cycle of all kinds of things.

Someone makes something cool, creative and/or weird (magic, warhammer 40k, a band, Star Wars, whatever.)

People like it and it gets fans on the strength of it's selling points and original features.

Then they make a sequel, or continue doing the same thing because it worked so well the first time. They get even more devoted fans who might not really get the finer points or inspiration for the first stuff, they just know they want more of the same (this is the point where people will literally buy anything that has stormtroopers and darth vader in it even if they don't give a shit about samurai movies or whatever other inspiration George stole all his ideas from, they don't want another thing with the same spirit, but a new vision, they just want more of the same forever)

Then the creators start getting greedy and thinking about widening the audience, by filing off the edges of their product and trying to appeal to the most amount of people possible by watering things down a bit and playing it safe.

At this point, some people start getting bored with it, and look for something more original or cooler, like the thing used to be in the beginning, and the thing sheds part of it fanbase that goes for something else, to begin the cycle anew elsewhere.

The only real way to win is to stick to your guns and produce content that surprises and challenges your audience while trying to stay true to yourself. Obviously this is a lot harder than just making more of the same and getting increasingly paranoid about rocking the boat.

This, basically.

Rules and laws need to be clearly defined, an offence needs to be quantifiable. The deciding factor can't just be "how sensitive the supposed victim is"

What about if you have any cards in your deck with "triggering" images or words on them?

Surely just as valid as the picture on your play mat?

Fixed that for you.

...

I seriously don't understand the mindset of these people. I mean, if you really find stupid things like playmats actually upsetting, just leave. Be the fucking adult. It's not worth your time to get upset about this kind of shit. You do not have the right to try and control what people do around you any more than they have they right to control you.

>If you're whining about SJWs ruining things on Veeky Forums and Reddit, you know nothing. But then, you likely are a teenager and it's not like Facebook is much better.

I left 4 for 8 in the second exodus and only returned as 8 has gone to complete shit and their Veeky Forums is dead. I browse exclusively /m/ and Veeky Forums. I can sure as fuck tell you that SJWs have had a massive influence on the Veeky Forums I spent almost 10 years shitposting on.

Many moons ago everything was aggressive and to the point, no niceties just straight up "Fuck you faggot" all the way. Now if you post something remotely aggressive on Veeky Forums you get people replying with "That's toxic" "That's sexist" "it's problematic". And it's clearly not ironic shitposting but actual opinions held by these people. I have left threads purely because I can see the retards posting as SJW-lites at best and just can't be bothered to engage with them or read their shit any more.

Every internet social hub is run by SJWs because they have the most time to invest in this shit. We live in an era where the key "battle" strategy in our society is extremely feminine. A man makes something great, he then proceeds to share it with others, which makes it cool and "profitable" (maybe not in cash but in social status). This draws in the feminine people who want that profit and they use social engineering to get into seats of power and then feminize the site taking away the thing which made it cool. This is 100% visible on Veeky Forums for any one who spent any real time here in the past decade. The nail in 4's coffin was the exodus's to 8. Yes Veeky Forums still exists, yes Veeky Forums has a larger userbase than 8, but all the original anons who were left here fucked off to 8 and carried on anonymous culture pre-chanology faggotry while the normies danced and reveled in their guy Fawkes mask going "we r anonymos XD" on every social media platform they could find.

Hell, if you wanna continue the "contrived excuses" angle, anything's fair game. Let's say girls with purple hair who won't stop talking creep me out, can I call a Judge?

Can you still use this card? Imagine the butthurt that could brew from this.

If they have real statistics found with good reasearch methods that prove that using sexy accessories leads to an increase in men treating women like objects, then I will consider their censorship worth complying with.

As with violence in media, I submit the hypothesis that we will find that non-explicit sexual depections in media doesn't cause people to mistreat each other.

Censorship for the sake of protecting minors in your gameshop is acceptable, but censorship because "I don't think women are mature enough to deal with objectefied women" is bullshit Infantilization.

Sure, Jan.

After WotC caved over the manland issue, I thought fuck are we going to lose the Boros symbol as well when we go back again to Ravinca?

How would anyone even know though? The whole point of conceal carrying is that you're concealing a weapon.

I always liked Kiora's butt...

This. It's not that MTG has started catering to the minority because of >muh SJWism, they're catering to that minority because they're so loud, obnoxious, and constantly in your face that they perceive them to be a majority. They then make changes to the game in order to attract this "majority", unaware (or uncaring) that not only is it a few telephone-pole screamers making all this ruckus, but they have no interest in entering the hobby and are bitching solely to force changes that cause it to crater.

It's not wizards' fault for trying to increase sales. It *IS* their fault for assuming a small but really dedicated shitstains represents the majority.

You see? We can stil have sexy art, even if the loli bikini playmats that made everyone uncomfortable get banned.

You are fundamentally misunderstanding how these people think.

They believe that their opinions are more important than the opinions of everyone else, so if they find something they don't like they are justified in demanding that it change to suit them.

>Then the creators start getting greedy and thinking about widening the audience, by filing off the edges of their product and trying to appeal to the most amount of people possible by watering things down a bit and playing it safe.
RIP Slave Leia

Not him, but most people who I've seen CC aren't half as subtle about it as they think.

Effective cures don't allow the possibility of remission.

Boros Symbol could be taken as a black power fist, it's completely acceptable to these people.

Don't believe this for a second. Wotc isn't catering to these people because they're screaming, they're catering to them because they're leftist and agree with the bullshit they're saying. We live in a super left wing culture since the civil rights bullshit started up and this is the natural progression. Don't be so naive.

Oh, no, I totally realize that. I just don't understand how someone can be so deluded to think their shit opinions actually matter at all.

My opinion doesn't matter. You opinion doesn't matter. We are all faceless voices in a torrent of shit. Such is anonymous. The delusion I don't understand is how people fail to realize this applies to the real world, too.

Why do these people think that having women in the MtG group is a bad thing? I've seen a bunch of girl magic players, none of whom were unreasonable. A lot of them were there because their husband was into magic.

>sexy playmats should be banned
But why?!
>women can wear what ever they want at FNM (tank tops showing cleavage) but should not be harassed
Well, of course.
>how the game needs to be more inclusive
What does that even mean?

Exactly. The problem was never the gender. Gender doesn't matter at all. The problem is the person.

There is no such thing as a "cure" in this case.
The "disease" will always return, the best you can do is isolate the parts that it claimed and remove them, replacing them with brand new parts.
When a community does something worthwhile, it inevitably attracts attention of less talented and less desirable people. The only thing you can do is to isolate yourself from them, either once in a time period (better, but more radical solution), or continiously (a worse, but less radical solution).

Right.

>My opinion doesn't matter. You opinion doesn't matter. We are all faceless voices in a torrent of shit.

Sure but if you shout loud and long enough other voices will join yours.

>What does that even mean?

It doesn't mean anything, it's just a vague allusion to an undefined objective that will never be attained. At what point is inclusivity achieved? Never, these people will always find something to complain about.

I just dislike he ">REE Normies get out!" tone of the comic. Magic won't die because the normies got to it, it's already survived that.

Effectively male women ("bro tier", married, non SJW lesbian) don't really count for this.

Usually when people say "women shit up the place" they mean 15 to 30 year old women with minimal practical life experiences.

Relevant video to the thread.

youtube.com/watch?v=jDiVD-y_cUs

The school system said everyones a winner, daddy (probably left..) and mummy want to be your best friend instead of your leader. When you open twitter and post how crappy your day has been 10 people instantly respond to tell you how great you are and how sorry they feel for you. When you want something you just get on the internet and order it, so everything you want is right at your finger tips.

This is how you create them. You never teach them to grow into adults, they never face any real struggles in life so their struggles become panic attacks over social media shit. This is what helicopter parenting from single mothers creates.

2 things.

1, most people like women in their playgroups. Women get a fuck load of free social points just for existing, any one who denies this is a retard.

2, I hate women in my playgroups and will abandon groups because one joined. Women create drama either by themselves or by the way men start trying to compete with each other when one is around. Many a good guild/clan has been destroyed by a woman joining and suddenly the social dynamic completely warps and it becomes something entirely different. Men can't be men when a womans around, we have inbuilt social responses that change what we're willing to express and how (and the same applies the other way round). As such, I don't like the dynamic shift and will excuse myself to find another group where I don't have to deal with the school yard politics women bring to the table.

I'm sure you will all call me a sexist now and all that other shit. I will call you a creationist because you believe a sexually dimorphic species is exactly the same except reproductive organs and so adding a woman to the group is just like adding a man.

>Now if you post something remotely aggressive on Veeky Forums you get people replying with "That's toxic" "That's sexist" "it's problematic".
kek

Fuck off faggot.

In formats where its legal, I dont see why not

Wow, seriously? Do you even realize what the current year is? That kind of attitude is toxic to the precious Veeky Forums community.

Funny claim, seeing how SWJs don't tend to be involved in or contributing to the communities and hobbies the take issue with.

No one ever got bullied or shat on for their hobbies. You were bullied because you were anti-social, and your continued inability to accept anyone different than you proves it.

>We live in a super left wing culture since the civil rights bullshit started up and this is the natural progression.

There's a really huge step from "let's start treating these people like actual people" and "I don't like thing so anyone who does is hitler and must be punished"
Civil Rights Movement was about Equality. This feminazi bullshit is promoting Inequality that people much more liberal than I seem to find acceptable for whatever reason.

I'll take "lying on the internet to try to prove my viewpoint" for 300, Alex

So much this.

Video makes sense, but I dislike how desperate it's trying to market itself. I mean, that doesn't invalidate the points it makes, but still.

I understand your sentiment, but there's a difference between "sexually dimorphic" and "a women appears, suddenly all men change behavior radically". I never have seen that in action and all the gaming groups I've been in had at least two women.

The one time a group fell apart, it was because the DM had to be all mopey and awkward after a breakup.

Lastly, you seem to believe that men changing behavior around women is somehow the woman's fault.

You need to step-back and realize you're defining "effectively nale" as anyone you don't want to fuck. Maybe you're just letting your lust poison your ability to enjoy yourself.

>civil rights bullshit

You're going to have to explain that one, user.

>Why do these people think that having women in

I'll stop you there. That isn't the problem.
The problem is the mentality and ideology based around identity politics, and making mountains out of molehills to create artifical outrage, that these people bring in to a community.

There hasn't been a single sane person that ever said "women can't be in this group." Ever. You wouldn't think that was the case if you listened to these lying hypocrites, and they have mastered the art of lying quickly and on a massive scale through social media and sensationalist headlines.

It isn't "REE normies get out", it's a complete disregard for the core tenets and purpose of the group from the new crowd.
The only thing was asked from the original crowd was to respect the core tenets of the group, and that really isn't much to ask for. The problem doesn't lie among the girls who are there primarily to play games. The problem lies among the people who are not.

Those are the people that should be leaving "card game #464 group", not the people who want to play the game.

>I paint socialists as the most moral and just group out everyone

Socialist SJW detected.

So basically the solution is,

We don't talk about fightclub

Oh damn, you got us, user! That one guy's lack of experience with bullying sure invalidates the millions of contradictory experiences posted on this anime image forum.

Try asking the same question to people who grew up in poor, inner city schools where no one got along in the first place.

I'm criticizing what that comic says. What it literally says. "Women join to get male attention while disrespecting the hobby".

I'm not listening to anythng, I'm just taking what was said at face value.

Not going to lie, but you have a point, talking about Anita gets 404 on /v/ and AVGN vs Ghostbusters gets deleted on /tv/

>If you're whining about SJWs ruining things on Veeky Forums and Reddit, you know nothing.

haha no.

So toxic, I love me a poz load though ;)

Equality is a bullshit idea though. People are inherently unequal and you're forcing YOUR way on people at gun point through the government.

Lets say I own a business, I've payed all my taxes, stayed within the law so far and I want to hire a new employee because I need a second pair of hands. When I was 12 I was beaten up by an Asian gang, they stole my wallet and since then I haven't been comfortable around Asians. Why should YOU get to decide if I'm allowed to say "No asians" when I put out my job application? What gives you or the government the right to control who I can and cannot hire based on my personal experience? You're literally saying "Do act on your own interest or we will kill/imprison you for doing so". Which is frankly tyranny, where is such a thing as "nice tyranny" and it's one of the most dangerous forms of it because people like yourself don't see the gun you're pointing at people to demand they act how you want them to. I believe Tolkien even said the most dangerous thing in LOTRs was if Gandalf took over the world because he would be acting in "people's interest" while lording over them like a tyrant and no one would notice this until they ran into his wrath.

Equality is bullshit and I don't agree all humans are equal or deserve to be treated equal. I believe some people are better than others and some don't deserve the air they breathe. We have limited resources and we're chasing ideas that waste resources and drag society down because of it.

You must be on a different Veeky Forums, then. People keep talking about somethin I've seen nothing of.

You're an obvious troll.

Women do change the way some men behave.

I do not like this change when we're hanging out and, often, they don't like modifying their behavior either.

I do not see how it's wrong to not let women join our fun.

>I believe some people are better than others and some don't deserve the air they breathe.
When will you realize that you're one of the latter?

And you're obvious bait.

tbqh I think they are hammered for same reason as redeemed succubi threads are killed here

Shitposted to death and nobody really gives a fuck over sperging that somebody brought the thing up.

1987fag here, grew up in upper-middle class predominantly white suburbia. People will bully each other for any reason they can think of: MtG got people bullied at my middle school and high school, which I mostly escaped because I had other friends. By the time I was in high school though videogames were already the norm, so that point is valid: it's just not related to Veeky Forums.

That's equally true for every demographic of people, every category has derogatory terms, and its universally understood to only include the objectionable stereotype, and the people that match said stereotype. The only people who DON'T get that are those that fall within the term, or want to appease said people.
Niggers, those damned kids, jews, red necks, wet backs, faggots, its all the same shut..

Have your fun without going into a FLGS or tournaments, then? As far as I'm aware, "ladies/guys' night out" not forbidden is it?

>inb4 some faggot going "BUT IT WILL BE REEEEEEEE"

Just because you can't keep your shit together when a girl's around? Women don't change your behavior, you guys do.

Prolly a cheap way to deal with a few threats in legacy. Cheap alternative for a sideboard in the right meta