So, why does everyone hate rogue halflings?

Halfings are good boys they dindu nothin!

Is there someone else who doesn't understand halflings? Because I kind of don't. People tend not to give them any niche beyond slightly sneaky midgets, so I don't really get what the appeal is

same

Never understood why halflings AND gnomes existed. Just struck me as 'lol race=culture that's why we need nerdy short people AND ...regular short people'

I don't think everyone hates them. But I do know there is something of a reputation. Halflings and other small races are typically associated with disruptive, lolrandum assholes who think playing a pint-sized maniac is hilarious. I've found from personal experience this has merit, but I don't know if it's indicative of anything larger. Rogues are also often dismissed as a "douchebag" class. Afterall, how many (often fake) That Guy stories involve some Chaotic Stupid rogue who pickpockets every guard and says "I stab the mayor, lel"? Which I think is unfair, because rogues are a lot of fun.

There's also the association with Kender, which are objectively awful.

Because kender flashbacks are painful agony

I just hate short people.

Yes my main board is Veeky Forums.

"race=culture" is precisely the reason in D&D (hence the 99 flavours of elves). For all other systems, they're just copying D&D.

The Rogue class is kinda pointless. Think about it: skills (which are the Rogue's focus) are mostly used out-of-combat, while the Fighter is mostly about in-combat. Separating them into two different classes just leaves one or the other not participating fully in half the game. The Rogue still has his backstab or sneak attack, but that's just a fighting style, not a distinguishing feature. The Fighter still gets some skills or nonweapon proficiencies, but I think it would be better to have the character perform well in both situations.

Play better editions.

stab him in the spine idiot.

also all halfling players are terrible and should be killed on sight.

>Kender
TRIGGERED

No one ever understands how a halflings height works. They are not just short, they're the size of a 7 year old child. You can't play them as a 5 foot manlet, their height is almost a disability in a world made for medium sized creatures.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I just hate halflings in general. Maybe hate is too strong a word, it's more like I never think of them, at all, unless someone else brings them up. If I'm world-building for a fantasy setting and I'm writing out race details, I never think to include a place for halflings in it, or how they interact with the other races or where they live or what they as a people do. Then a player reminds me halflings exist, and I'm like "Oh, I guess they're in, too." and leave it at that.

Same. Because they don't really have the same iconicity as dwarves, elves, orcs, etc. They don't have any cultural traits or stereotypes to play around with or embrace. They're just crime midgets, and only foisted into things because people like D&D

Seriously user? Halflings are literally fucking hobbits. You know, the iconic Tolkien protagonists. They are exactly as iconic as dwarves, elves and orcs. The published LotR books probably describe more cultural traits and stereotypes for them than any other race.

Yes, but D&D has slowly been stripping them of their Hobbit-ness over the years. The modern halfling is just sort of a 4ft tall void where a hobbit legally can't be.

Then develop them as hobbits in your setting. Copyright laws don't penetrate your basement.

>Yes, but D&D has slowly been stripping them of their Hobbit-ness over the years. The modern halfling is just sort of a 4ft tall void where a hobbit legally can't be.

The modern Halfling is a gypsy in much the same way Dwarves are Scottish stereotypes.

Gnomes, over time, have stolen the "tinker/machinist" trait from Dwarves and the "lolwackyrandom" shtick from the trickster aspect of Halflings.

That's nice, but mechanically they only get a -2 modifer to strength alongside a +2 modifier to dexterity alongside the Small size modifier.

That's probably the reason. Dwarves and elves are dominated by a few cultural traits and stereotypes making it easier to put out an identifiable character using very little background.

Y'all can't blame halflings for lender, you can't blame anybody except maybe Weiss and Hickman, and even then they couldn't have known what it would lead to.

>Kender not lender
Stupid phone.

Most Settings basically made every Hobbit a Thief or a Thief at Heart because they had one Burglar as a Hobbit. Nowadays you'll see the Hobbit race as jolly, delightful, friendly folks, who'll rob you blind if you take your eyes off of them for a second. Its would be a bit more believable if this was in the lotr setting as Hobbits venturing away from the shire was a rarity and people wouldn't expect it. But the Hobbits in the Movie don't rob people blind, they don't carry around forty daggers, and they honorable people on a day to day basis while Rogues usually have real underhanded tricks for even some of the undeserving enemies.

Athas Halflings where kind of amusing, being feral tribes of murderous cunts that would kill and eat adventurers.

Aside from that, any other setting and they just seemed to attract complete dicks that set out to annoy and irritate everyone... which would be fun if it was act as a foil to a particularly uppity character in the group but 99% of players lack the talent and good humour to actually pull that off.

>There's also the association with Kender, which are objectively awful
He said, after talking about how people hate certain races because idiots play them wrong.

I love kender. Saying shit like "Kender are just an excuse to steal" is fundamentally misunderstanding what kender are. A kender doesn't steal because he wants thing, he steals because he thinks thing is cool and wants to play with it for a bit, and then he finds something cooler and forgets about the last cool thing. When the owner of said first cool thing approaches him about it, the kender doesn't kick him in the dick and run off to keep the cool thing, he gives it back and apologizes.

They are forever-children, full of whimsy and completely uncaring of haggard notions like possession. They're fucking great.

This has to be bait

Prove me wrong using examples taken from the books, rather than the time your friend decided he'd play a kender.

Kidneys aren't that high up.

This "they're whimsical tricksters" defense is straight out of the Dragonlance book. Either this is bait it the guy who actually wrote them is here defending his shitty race.

"Lel I steal from everyone but it's kay cause in just joking" is explicitly written as part of their racial personality. That kind of behavior isn't endearing. It's disruptive and obnoxious.

You hate children, don't you?

Children are fucking garbage dude

Children are shit. We put up with their stupid bullshit because we need them in order to not die out and because of the understanding that they will one day be less shit.

Kender are neither nessisary nor will they ever get better.

I like children just fine. What I don't like are bratty, misbehaved children who were never taught the difference between right and wrong. Which describes Kender to a "T".

Can't speak for you , but stealing was a sure fire way to get grounded when I was a kid. Along with lying. Something Kender also love doing.

...

If you think the Kender hate is because people are mad that there's more than one type of halfling, you're a completely clueless retard.

>50 types of good looking people and no one bats an eye
>Add a second annoying midget race and everyone loses their minds
FTFY

Kender don't throw tantrums or break shit just because they're angry. You keep saying "stealing" when you know damn well and good that the easiest way to get your shit back from a kender is to grab him and say "That's mine", whereupon the kender gives it back no harm no foul.

You bought too deeply into the memeing, Jack.

The funny thing about theft is that you often don't know you were stolen from very quickly, and when it comes time for you to need what was stolen, it may be far too late

One of us read the book, and it sure was not you, whiny bitch.

That sure is a whole lot of angry red words, user. Your opinion is still shit.

racial -2 to str forces you to blow feats on finesse?
Small weapons have worse hit die, which really makes early levels suck?
The fact that rogues are garbo?

Your description there sounds obnoxious to deal with.

Do kender get TREATED like children in your games if they act like them? Eternally swatted away by annoyed pedestrians?

also
>children
>no notion of posession
what universe did you grow up in

>Your description there sounds obnoxious to deal with.
That sounds like a subjective opinion to me, user. Not at all the "objectively awful" that started this whole shebang.

>what universe did you grow up in
The one where I remember what it was like to be seven.

Tolkien did it therefore all fantasy must include hobbits with no exception.

It's also worth mentioning, as far as I can remember from the books, 90% of people in the setting ABSOLUTELY DO NOT LIKE KENDER. Many cities straight up do not allow them in so they have to sneak around.

The only reason The Companions liked Tass was because they knew him for -years- by the time the books happen, and over the course of the story proves himself to be an asset several times over.

You're explaining -why- I like Kender, and how I think they should be played, but it's worth remembering that 9/10 times non-Kender abso-fucking-lutely hate them, and for totally legitimate reasons.

When a Kender takes something, they don't go out of their way to take the most valuable or important thing, they just take random shit they think is neat. They're far more likely to take something that looks interesting than any money or whatever.

A knife wound to the groin works just as well.

Given a choice of targets I'd rather stab somebody in the groin than the back.

It's more likely to prevent their escape for one thing, as they'll be hobbled.

We hope that they'll one day be less shit at any case.

It's in no way a guarantee.

They literally have a passive thing called courage your point is moot.

>Halflings
>No cultural traits or stereotypes

They're literally hobbits user

they live in small farming communities doing nothing but getting fat and smoking tobacco in their rocking chair until they die at age 150.

this is the way I write halflings, and a halfling adventurer should be a truly rare thing indeed.

Found the kender

>the weaboo aspie race
Holy shit. I like halflings but this race is pure cancer. Reminds me of my friend's older sister who is a total bitch. $50 says every single Kender player/liker is a Bernie voting aspie who's 23 years old, lives with their parents and can't drive.

One of my player did a natural 20
His halfling character did a Jordan's slamdunk style backstab

>Ah believe ah can fly... Ah believe ah can touch the sky

because they are halflings. They dont exist in any setting i know.

Why would you aim for the most sturdy part of the body?

...

>The one where I remember what it was like to be seven.
You must have severe amnesia if you don't remember "MINE!" or "It's not fair, how come HE gets X and I don't!"

You know he's just going to tell you Kender don't understand that perspective at all.

Which I guess is technically true, even in the official material Kender don't really grasp the concept of "MINE". They just steal stuff because they're a bunch of manic looky-loos who don't accept personal boundaries.

Because somehow that's endearing.