/5eg/ D&D 5e General

>oversimplify my suggestion to make it moot
Not an argument or a worthwhile contribution to the thread. Also Hunter's Mark is not also on the Paladin lists; are you drunk?

A few minor fixes to hunter, like colossus slayer scaling

Beast hp being max + (4×ranger level) and CR scaling slightly

And that's pretty much it, people tend to enjoy ranger in my games

>Nobody wants the half-baked shit that is Ranger spellcasting.

Just because you don't doesn't mean people share your opinion, nobody I know would at least. You should probably stop assuming people agree with you.

Vengeance paladin gets hunter's mark

Would it work for a familiar to use the censer of controlling air elementals? I already have my concentration gone, so any extra elementals would be brilliant.

Sorry, I'll correct myself: nobody with half a brain wants the half-baked shit that is Ranger spellcasting. Anyone who wants to be an arrow-shooty swift-quiver ranger who isn't brain-dead will play a Half-Elf bard.

Also this. If anything I've been disappointed that Bard was a full caster.

>nobody with half a brain wants the half-baked shit that is Ranger

Being insulting to people that don't share your opinion doesn't really help your case. And there is onviously no further discussion to be found here.

>If anything I've been disappointed that Bard was a full caster.
Why's that a disappointment? Aside from the fact that Valor bards are steaming dogshit

Completely rework it. Split the class into 3 basic archetypes.
1/2 caster
Fighter-esque
Beast Companion

Half-Caster would have Nature domains, more spells etc.

Fighter style would have some extra feats thrown in every 8 levels, as well as a couple of BETTER traits/feats

Beast companion able to act without requiring any actions from the ranger. Be able to get stronger beasts, OR
Beast Maneuvers/Spells the ranger must prepare ahead of time (Caster style)

Regardless of which archetype is chosen, the ranger is a caster.

>Fighter style would have some extra feats thrown in every 8 levels, as well as a couple of BETTER traits/feats
What do you think of the current Hunter Archetype?

You're right, I'm being a dink. I think it would be nice if the spellcasting wasn't forced so that the martial component didn't need to be gimped.

>Fighter-esque
>Not a Fighter archetype
??

Also, archetypes don't have enough power in 5e to make 1/2 spellcasting one, or a good animal companion honestly. I think completely reworking it begs the question of what it is supposed to be to begin with, and while I think beastmaster and another nature caster can work there's no real niche to fill I think.

It's mediocre. There's specifically certain perks that are better then the others.
Colossus slayer obviously better then giant killer or horde breaker.

Steel will is shit and shouldn't even be in there. Multiattack defense is good. Escape the horde is OKAY but why bother when there are FEATS and ACTIONS you can do that negate opportunity attacks altogether?

Multiattack was good for both of them.
Evasion, uncanny dodge, or stand against the tide? seriously? Uncanny dodge is OKAY compared to the other two. Evasion is better, but Stand against the tide is clearly best because if an enemy is misses you, can you force it to make another attack against another creature. That's too fucking good, specially if it's a high damage attack.

Why not? Who gives a fuck what the other classes have done. This is about Rangers and how to make them better. Archetypes do make a difference in terms of power. Assassin is far stronger over Swashbuckler. Battlemaster is far better then Champion. School of Abjuration 10x better then a lot of other classes.

For starters i'd say that "pet only takes an action if I use an action to tell it to" bullshit needs to be skullfucked straight back into whatever hole of shitty ideas it crawled out of.

The whole point of half-casters is that you trade fightan power for magic utility. If the ranger could compete with the rogue and fighter in damage, I'd be worried. Everyone should be comparing Rangers to Paladins.

Ranger brings really really important utility to a group, if you want to hex crawl, you'll need one in your party. If you don't like hexcrawls or outdoor survival, then don't play a damn ranger. A big reason rangers are seen as bad, is because a lot DMs never do outdoor shit or do it horribly.

Perhaps some way of burning spell slots for a combat benefit akin to paladin smiting. Maybe burn a spell slot for a bonus action attack or 2 bonus action attacks if you already get one from dual wielding or feats or what have you.

>Archetypes do make a difference in terms of power.
I mean that it doesn't give enough. Archetypes are about 1/3 of the powers, with the base class being the remaining 2/3. So you can't have 1/2 caster archetypes, you can't have 10 features, you can't have a CR 1/2 beast that attacks on its own, you can't have something that is as good a fighter as the fighter - when the base class has a lot of power as well. You can break that structure but I don't think that's a smart decision.

They're the only class that was built to do that. That's why it's bad. They shouldn't have been built to excel ONLY at that. While I understand that's the core idealogy of their class, it shouldn't define their entire kit. They excel at nothing compared to other classes. There should be no class that falls off on the damage end unless they're suppose to and in that they should still excel at something that can be supportive to the group. Because of that, players will time over time choose classes that can better help the group then a ranger because they don't offer enough to be part of a D&D party.

I love when newbies try to min-max, it's cute.

>What area of 5e aside from the ranger do you think most needs work?
Rogues

The base class is mediocre passed Evasion.
Sneak Attack is a joke after a while, although maybe the SCAG cantrips fix that with Magic Initiate.
Everything requires the bonus action which means that most of the time you just "gotta go fast" or maybe even hide depending on whether the DM likes combat stealth that day.
Skills checks are too random, and too many different proficiencies are required for basic burglary.

All of the subclasses rely heavily on at least one aspect of DM fiat:
Thief depends on DM generosity with magic items.

Assassin is completely at the mercy of DM generosity with adjudicating Surprise, and also having no enemy casters around with basic detection magic.

Arcane Trickster depends on consistent and favorable interpretations of illusions and valid targets for charm.

Swashbuckler loses their utility if they don't know the right languages. It's ultimately just a patch for shitty dual wielding rules and general disincentives for melee.

Mastermind relies on DM social buy in and they still suffer from magic detection until the very end.

Inquisitive is based on whether or not the DM throws Investigation a bone.

Coming off of modern systems where Rogue types can stun and counterattack and debuff, the class feels very incomplete.

>Valor Bard
>bad
Found the 3aboo

Also mainly because less of a caster focus, like in older edition, means more time to focus on things that are class abilities. Inspiration should be the main mechanic of the bard imo, not just a side thing.

Jester and Blade in UA both show what you could do with inspiration as a more key thing.

Stand against the tide is worthless against single targets, spread out enemies, or ranged attacks. Evasion or uncanny dodge will see much more consistent use.

They already have it, the problem is that primeval awareness is kinda shit

What other classes are you comparing them to exactly and what do you expect from them? And what experiences have you had with them?

>Anyway, how would /5eg/ fix the ranger? Not looking for longwinded answers here, just looking to brainstorm with you guys.

You build it like the Warlock, AKA give it two archetype choices.

Warlocks have a cool thing going for them getting to pick both a Pact Boon and a Patron, allowing nine different varieties of warlock. Sure, there's some annoying overlap with the find familiar ritual, but it otherwise works nicely.

To make the Ranger work, you need to give them two choices, Combat and Support.

For combat, let them be Archers, Tempests, or Scouts. Archers get really cool bonuses to ranged attacks of all sorts. Tempests are masters of two weapon fighting. Scouts are a catch-all school for other weapons built around skirmishing, dealing extra damage dice as long as they move during the turn they strike (from the 3.5 class).

For support, Rangers get to be Seekers, Beastmasters, or Striders. Seekers are attuned to the mystical essence of the wild and get druidic spellcasting. Beastmasters get a better version of the current animal companion rules, as well as powers to revive their beast from near death and command it from afar. Striders are skill monkey rangers with neither magic nor animal friends, but they excel at scouting, leading a party in the wild, and using terrain against their foes.

Hooray, you have a class that keeps the Ranger motif while providing distinct roles no other class quite fills.

> primeval awareness is kinda shit

I think your DM is kinda shit. Being able to find those creature types at such low level is pretty awesome and can lead to some fun adventures.

/5eg/ should be renamed /whine/

I am the DM, and while I try and make exploration and general rangering a big part of my campaigns you can't honestly say primeval awareness is at the same level as smite

Cofession time. I trolled one of my more autistic athiest players by making a reward for a long campaign arc be a boon/brand by Pelor I stole the idea from critical role. His character spat on the ground cursing the god and then he chopped his fucking arm off. The player looked super buttmad, how do I have Pelor respond to this? I'm afraid that doing what I think Pelor wouls do with make the player ragequit.

The magic option will trump the other two and then we're back to square one, except now the class is stuck with (presumably) 1/3 casting instead of 1/2.

Additionally, Hunters are pretty flexible now with regards to switching between melee and ranged so enforced specialization would ultimately hurt the class.

Wow "would do will make the player ragequit".

Why do people hate on Halflings and gnomes? They lighten the mood in any given situation

Indifferently

He cut his arm off, that's punishment enough. If anything and you really want to make it sting you can have Pelor cauterize his arm so it can never be regrown.

Either way that player can suck a dick, if I gave one of my players a divine boon and he did something like that out of OOC autismo I would make him be constantly accosted by bands of clerics, paladins, holy avengers and even devas

You could also do the opposite of what says, and give them divinely granted regeneration, no matter what he does, he comes back hearty and whole the next morning, waking only with the sunrise.

>I'm afraid that doing what I think Pelor would do will make the player ragequit.

WWPD

>athiest
5e implies Forgotten Realms implies atheists are fucked anyway.

There are Old Testament and Olympian stories where the God(s) will continuously try to court a hero that rejects them, or indirectly fuck with them (kraken) and then offer another carrot.

Pelor's the god of the sun right? Make it so that wherever he walks there's just a constant aura of shade, like somebody's holding an umbrella over him.

He clearly doesn't want the sun's gifts.

I like that approach too, Pelor's gift becomes like divine herpes

>Pelor
>Forgotten Realms

You're the DM? Jesus Christ, you're an insufferable hot mess, I feel sorry for the ranger in your group. You must be absolute shit if you can't see nor felt the adventuring, derailing and hexcrawling rangers can do. Read the damn DMG on Wilderness, and read up the old AD&D Wilderness Survival guide and Dungeoneer Survival Guides for oldfag cred. Give your ranger some bloops n' bleeps on his radar, make it an aasimar babe.

Anyways, Smite is great burst damage and its kinda paladin's thing, comparing it to Primeval Awareness is very silly.

Because deep down, everyone knows that halflings are the most powerful race on the planet and if they ever rise to power to forge a nation of their own...It's game over.

It's not a radar. It tells you if something, not what or how many, is somewhat nearby you, not where it is. You cannot seek out adventure based on it, it changes almost nothing. Seriously, give me one example of it being interesting or useful. I don't agree they need to be able to burn slots for damage or anything but I definitely don't think that feature is generally good or useful.

You could have the brand remain on his stump maybe. It's a god-given mark, it might not be so easy to get rid of. OT, how is the character justified to hate/not believe in the gods? It's always amusing when players think it makes sense to just not believe in gods, one of my fellow players refused a god since he was so... dumb? and had to run away from her followers and leave the party.

>Assassin is completely at the mercy of DM generosity with adjudicating Surprise
I was under the impression there were hard and fast rules for this.

Sneak attack is entirely achievable, everything specific to the assassination archetype excepting advantage in the first round if you have the initiative is entirely dependent on the DM setting up viable situations, or allowing you to do the same routinely to function.
Yes, that's somewhat true for every situation in the game, but it's more effort on everyones part regarding assassin.

>Annoyed by lack of distinction between Gnomes and Halflings
>Refluf Gnomes to be more colorful, take DMG's tip and make Halflings little mouse people
>can't shake the feeling I'll be accused of being a furry

I think I've been sitting in these threads for too long.

I know it's not radar, I was just being bombastic, but you can triangulate with it(character hirelings are glorious). Good way of finding dragon lairs. Remember, it's UP TO 6 Miles in favored, meaning you can change how big it is.

Read Primeval Awareness, it does tell what the creature types are that you sense, just not the number nor exact location. Did you honesty tell your Ranger "You sense spooky stuff around you"? Oh god hilarious.

Stealth and Surprise is DM fiat land, always will be. Perhaps you should read the book and find out.

Why is Grog so fucking based?

youtu.be/1GY3HTZE5R0?list=PLqTT_VuffgDP0I6accl0jP5p3kxBRPVPa&t=4135

>I started shit and the player told me to fuck off in character
>how should I fuck up the situation more?
Either he's causing problems in your games and you need to talk to him like an adult or you should fuck off with your bullshit. If he wants to play a retarded character, let him (as long as he isn't disrupting anyone else's fun). Don't spit in his face and get upset when he's mad at you.

>where Rogue types can stun and counterattack and debuff
I miss 4e

Maybe it's just the lower levels then, as a half caster with Hunter's Mark being pretty vital in combat Primeval just doesn't do enough at all. At the same time, you were advocating for it based on how powerful it could be on lower levels, so that shouldn't be it. Have you really had someone triangulate the location of a specific creature they're trying to find, on low levels? In that case it seems much easier to just track them, or you know not go there because it's the same as randomly hearing of the location of an ogre lair and just deciding to go there. That's not a reward or benefit from using the feature, it's just the ability to find new plot hooks.

>Perhaps you should read the book and find out.
Well hey! Fuck you too buddy! I was just trying to get you to clarify something you said, based on my memory of the rule books from reading them myself, but if you want to be an ass about it, that's cool too!

Gah, I just got into 5e and just bumped into this show... I'm 10 episodes in and fairly hooked. Travis and Sam are fucking hilarious, I'd watch this shit it if it were just "The Adventures of Grog and Scanlon". Though I gotta say Orion is a metagaming dick most of the time (yes, I know he's gone later on) and half the stuff Marissa says is cringy as fuuuck. Ashley is goddamn adorable but doesn't seem to be fitting into her role very well (does she get better later on?). Worst part of the show for me though is comparing it to my own group... we're terrible and I wish our DM was half as good as Matt. ;_;

I don't get the love for Grog. He's the typical dumb brute character with a player not really interested in anything beyond combat

It's played well, I think that's mostly it. Being clever and creative with expressing and roleplaying a character can make it really entertaining despite being stereotypical.

I'm not that far but how does Orion metagame? If anything I'd say Percy is the worst for that, rollplaying, staying silent and having very few good moments. And I don't quite agree with Sam, he has good moments for sure but the lulrandumb is way too much at some times.

>implying the wall is still a thing
>implying the wall is a thing for people who aren't in the realms
The wall is literally just Ao being a moron.

>Being clever and creative with expressing and roleplaying a character
He's invisible if the party isn't killing something.

>Dumb Childlike Brute
FTFY

Grog likes things other than combat. Like, grog, and women, and beards, and hanging off boats pretending hes flying, and grog, and keylith pretending shes in a rowboat while shes an earth elemental, and grog, and women, and scanlen, and pike.

Hes roleplaying by himself in the video with an NPC trying to haggle.

For the most part, yes. But he has moments where I'm impressed at his wit, like here haggling for a lower price and stuff.

i have to say grog and scanlan are the best in that group; Vax is a little behind them, and the rest just do not work for me. Keylith is a joke half the time, percy is a power gamer, pike is irrelevant, and Vex... I rarely if ever see her do anything character wise.

This. He doesn't hog the spotlight but most of the time when he siezes the spotlight its usually fucking golden.

Orion gets worse and worse as it goes on. He starts coming up with convoluted strategies that he shouldn't really be able to execute, tries to fudge the rules to succeed at things, calls for DM fiat from his backstory and generally obsesses over becoming the main character. Pity, I liked Tiberius best out of the party.

Scanlan a shit. I don't get how anyone likes him. He's interchangeably gross or creepy while trying to be the suave bard.

I did hear that about him, just curious since he said he was at ep 10, I'm at 7 and he's still cool. I liked him best the early episodes for sure, in the city he was great, but good to know.

Scanlan just shat on a bed, I get what you mean there.

I think scanlan grows on you, the pike x scanlan thing goes from creepy to adorable over time. Its like I definitely get its creepy at the start but then you see scanlan repeatedly risk his life for her doing shit a lot of people wouldn't go out of their way to do even roleplaying. I think its because as time goes on he ends up contrasting with tiberius. While tiberius is busy metagaming and trying to become the main character you see that scanlan roled a bard basically for the sole reason to be a bro, he doesn't do the manipulate npcs to be a douche thing that most bards do. You basically never see scanlan face for the party. He also never fights over magic items, never fights for party gold, ect. He just sings songs to inspire allies so they shine in the spotlight and loves pike.

Scanlan is based.

Suggestions for dealing with paralysis?

4/5 of the party have the ability to paralyze the enemy on a save ends and its invalidating nearly every encounter I throw at them

Thanks to a combination of portent and lucky to force bad saves, they took down an ancient dragon at level 7

>I think scanlan grows on you
He really doesn't. He's that guy and not even funny at it. He's an illustration of why a lot of DMs ban short races besides dwarves.

Don't legendary creatures have auto saves on conditions?

How do they paralyze? An ancient dragon has legendary saves, really high bonuses, and is a very large size (gargantuan?) monster. Anyway, if portent and lucky are the problem, more encounters a day could be one solution.

I dunno his songs have been pretty funny so far (though not always). And he's been fucking clutch with Banish more than once.

Tiberius definitely metagames but more annoying is how he just always has to be the center of attention, helping out constantly even when it's not needed. Kinda careless with his fireballs some days too.

Animal swarms are immune to lots of things, paralyze included. Go Indiana Jones on their ass.

3 legendary resistances, 4 casts

And a +9 save vs DC 16-20 doesn't go off that often when met with the above mentioned portend and unlucky

What are those 4 ways though?

And they should not have spell save DCs of 20 at level 7, that's on you.

Yes he does. Scanlan is one of the most powerful and helpful characters in the group. He's been the MVP more than a few times. I get that at the start his jokes might be a bit cringy but as the episodes go by there's no way to not admire how he comes up with a song for every time he uses Bardic Inspiration and how he is one of the smartest characters regarding, making use of his resources as best as possible to help everyone else.

And on top of that, Sam as well as Travis does his best to not metagame and stay in character the whole time, which is more than any DM expects of a player.

Would it be bad to have crits do double total damage instead of just double dice damage? Makes spells a bit worse and crits (champs, rogues and barbs?) a bit better, but champ is the reportedly the worst fighter archetype, rogues already get a lot out of crits so it's a small thing comparatively, and barb has twice the chance in certain circumstances so a very small buff. Is there any other problems? It just seems a lot simpler, I've considered doing the Matt Mercer houserule of doing Dice x 2 + mods, but it would be simpler this way I think.

Rage damage would be doubled I guess so a bit of a bigger deal for barbs than I thought.

Can someone clarify this?

Does this mean I can only start transcribing 2nd level rituals as a level 5 warlock?

>Rounded up
Nigga please

At fifth level, you can transcribe 3rd level spells. Round up, bitch.

Right, that didn't click when I read it.

Thanks.

Why are there so many whores on the table?

And why is there an obnoxious chat on the stream?

Why is the first half of the first episode full of attention whoring and jarring "blahblah is now following!" popups?

I've mostly moved to using retroclones (primarily S&W) when I DM, but I think 5e is the best of the modern (3e onward) D&D versions by far. I'm currently playing in a campaign that uses 5e rules but is very heavily inspired by old school play, and it works very well. Wouldn't have worked half as well with 3.5, and would have been too wargame-y with 4e (which I realize some people like, and which I realize can be compared to the original game's use of Chainmail rules for resolving combat, but the feel is way different since Chainmail was based on historical wargames and 4e feels more like a lighter version of modern sci-fi or fantasy wargames).

Anyway, 5e is very good, and I was wondering if there are any hacks or fanmade supplements that make it more sword-and-sorcery-ish, in particular with regard to the magic.

Anybody got anything for me?

Did someone homebrew Rebuke/Command Undead features for ivul clerics?

I'd like to compare mine with those since I want to throw a Necroguy towards my group, and I don't want it to be OP in case someone wants to use the features in the future.

I think oathbreakers have something like that, you could check that out

>S&W
Spice and Wolf retroclone? Wat.

> Pact Boon
> An archetype choice

I'd guess Swords and Wizardry.

Hmm. Maybe Smith & Wesson?

Already checked, but the level differences are what makes me doubt a bit. I guess it's better to show what I have than explain it:

Channel Divinity: Rebuke Undead (level 2)
As an action, target one Undead creature you can see within 30 feet of you to give it Advantage on Melee Attack Rolls while the Undead is still within 30 feet of you. Also, the creature gains Advantage against Saving Throws against Turn Undead for the duration of this feature, even if it or you move further away than 30 feet. These effects last for 1 minute.

Channel Divinity: Command Undead (level 5)
You can use this if you picked Rebuke Undead at level 2. As an Action, choose one Undead you can see within 60 feet of you. The target must succeed on a Wisdom Saving Throw or obey your commands for the following 2 hours, or until you use this Channel Divinity option again.
Intelligent Undead are harder to control this way. If the target has an Intelligence of 8 or more, it has Advantage on its Saving Throw. If the target as an Intelligence of 12 or more, it can repeat the Saving Throw at the end of every hour until it succeeds and breaks free.
If the Undead succeeds on its save, you can’t use this feature on it again. An Undead whose CR is equal or greater than your level is Immune to this effect.
At level 8, the Undead obeys you for 7 hours. At level 11, for 13 hours. At level 14, for 18 hours. At level 17, for 24 hours.

I think Rebuke Undead is solid, I'm not sure if the Command Undead is. I will add fluff text/fix grammar once I'm sold on this shit.

>play rogue
>have expertise
>play other class
>don't even bother with skill checks because performing skill checks without expertise feels like a handicap