How can anyone win against elves? They live for centuries so soldiers have a fuckton of experience

How can anyone win against elves? They live for centuries so soldiers have a fuckton of experience.

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Presumably there are diminishing returns on experience past a certain point.

Living for centuries also makes you arrogant and cocky.

Elvish forms are naturally frail. This means that they don't have enough testosterone, which accounts for their significantly reduced muscle mass. This also means that no matter how old they get, unless they develop hormone therapy, elves will always look and be like they skipped leg day.

So teach your soldiers to squat. Teach them to bench press. Teach them to grow as men do, and overpower the elves at every turn.

Bullet to face.

Years of experience doing what exactly? Hiding away in your secret little flower village for five hundred years and ignoring everything going on in the outside world, including technological advances far beyond the scope of magic?

Diminishing returns are a thing. The idea that you'll be getting infinitely better over time is silly

That depends more on how frequently their soldiers fight in wars.
It could be that the elvish mindset classifies all wars as either "not in our land, not our problem" or "we can't win and we're tired of living anyway" so they haven't practiced their tactics on anyone but the occasional trespassing lumberjack for ten thousand years.

They use DEX weapons though so you're still dead.

Can't use dex on the initial grapple check user.

Their blades are made of elvish steel and can cut through it like butter.

Or they'd just kill you with magic.

Try again.

I like Roman themed Elves compared to Celtic or Mongolian themed humans and other savage races. Helps drive home that the Elven civilization is really old too.

They're generally gimp-level weak in most settings.

Greek Elves, Roman Dwarfs

I usually have elves as hugely superior to humans. Triggers the fuck out of neckbeard "HFY XD" players.

...

the ones that live centuries are the one that don't fight.

According to Lasalle, any hussar who lived past the age of 30 is a wanker. That means elves are ultra-wankers, spending literally centuries masturbating rather than fighting.
Compare the gruesome orcs, whose average life expectancy is... what? 12?

Besides the combat experience, soldiers also accumulate stress and eventually derangements caused by this stress.

Elvish warrior with 50+ years of deploy would have collected so many kinds of crazy his own people would need to put him down like a rabid dog he is.

If they can't wear 15-25 kg armor then I'm surprised they can move their own furniture.

Eh, they probably develop shitty weebish fighting styles, and their obsession with harmony with nature etc makes them utter garbage at combat.

Even with experience and super speed, they would lose to a equiv or slightly smaller amount of well armed humans.

Lolwut? Elves are arguably the best warriors in most settings despite appearing frail. They have unnatural strength.

What settings are you playing?

Which settings are those?

This is the last thread I expected to see Czterej Pancerni.

because they don't actually spend those centuries fighting. Elves generally lounge around most of their lives and rarely see fit to engage in war. Most elves should know how to fight better than the average human, but only by a moderate margin.

Humans are an especially ambitious race who feel the need to devote themselves to the pursuit of excellence in one form or another, when most elves aim more to appreciate life, as ambition isn't something which much power in the life which spans hundreds of years. It only takes humans like 50 years to realize how little shit matters, and what little there is really worth fighting over.

>drunken dwarves
That's just silly.

Everyone is drunk.

Why not just play an elf, then?

>implying

Elves routinely win against humans DESPITE their lower numbers.

Look at the high elves in Warhammer for example

I have an idea. Let's put those elves in the 40k universe and see how they compare to space marines, chaos, and orks.
Well that was quick, I guess someone CAN win against elves.

>Elves generally lounge around most of their lives
This is cancer that's present in so many settings that it's ridiculous. Authors are just unable to come up with any reasons why elves aren't straight up better than humans, so that's the cop out they go with.

They live that long in peacetime. They're not skipping gaily through warzones in that time. They die like anyone else.

Simple attrition. Elves in almost every setting reproduce too slowly to field massive armies. Even if their armies can inflict twice or three times the casualties against their human equivalents, they aren't going to have the numbers to beat humans. Humans can field armies of tens or hundreds of thousands. Elves would more likely field armies in the hundreds.

R- vs. K-strategy, diminishing returns, senescence, lack of industrialisation, high individualism, lack of political will towards war, and the fact that dying of old age is less of a concern in a medieval inspired setting.

>Let's put a medieval fantasy race in a futuristic high tech setting and see if they lose lol

You're not very bright are you?

Nec Hercules contra plures

Elves are extreme example of minmaxing quality vs quantity

I don't care if your sword is made of elvish steel or it's a weeboo magic fightan stick, you can't cut through plate mail. You can't, and probably shouldn't, as it's just more efficient to pierce it, and considering elves are more bows-and-spears kinda people, so take that angle. It's (somewhat) more realistic to have a spear or an arrow piercing armor than it is a sword slashing through it.

>A bad guy who is evil
>A dragon with treasure
>Wizards who carry spellbooks
>Knights who wear armor
>Swords with sharp edges
>Women with vaginas instead of penises
>Animals who walk on four legs
>Sun that emits light

fucking cliches

That's straight from Tolkien.

How do you know elven blade made from non existing material can't cut through plate that might have different durability from real life one since physics in fantasy worlds seem to work different?

>Look at the high elves in Warhammer for example
The ones that actually don't win against humans ?

Actually the more I think about this, I think this really is how humans beat elves. I know it's not groundbreaking shit, but especially if you're talking about tolkien's elves, where the entire species numbers in the tens of thousands, as opposed to humans in their millions, humans really would just ware them down. If you have an army of (optimistically) a few thousand elves trying to stop an army of 100k+ humans, even if they adopt Fabian tactics or use guerrilla warfare, I doubt they'd be able to inflict casualties fast enough to stop the army from reaching their population centers, especially if it's an army with a lot of cavalry or mages who can help counteract their hit and run tactics. So I guess Mongol Hordes > Elves.

Well they're allies most of the time but the high elves could wreck the empire if they wanted to.

Besides without the high elves humans would have been raped by Chaos.

If we're going to throw physics and common sense out the window then there's literally no point in discussing it. Sure, any setting can Mc.Guffin into the setting a material that CAN CUT STEEL LIKE BUTTR GAIZ, but that's boring, and more to the point it's kind of pointless when talking about elves. They're big thing is supposed to be having an entire army of elite, well trained soldiers, right? If you add in a material advantage component, humans would win by simple virtue of production efficiency over the love-the-land sustainable elves, at least that's the way I see it.

You mean the Eldar that dominated the galaxy before commiting suicide by Chaos God, and can take on SMs one-to-one?

>Implying you wouldn't lounge around all day every day if you were immortal.
Don't lie, you've only got 40 years of peak mental and physical efficiency, and you're already wasting time on Veeky Forums.

Lasalle himself died at 34, though, and he certainly wasn't a wanker.

Poland stronk!

Okay, it's established in lore that no single faction in the warhammer universe other than chaos could stand against the empire (I'm getting this from the Empire and Bretonia's codecies, it's also mentioned in one of the older dwarf codices, and it's mentioned on the warhammer wiki) Is that stupid? Probably. Is that a case of GW's HFY? Probably. But it's true, and it kinda makes sense if you stop and think about it. They have the same awesome heroes and awesome warlords as all the other humans, plus they have borderline industrialization, huge population, and they have some of the most reliable and dangerous military technology in the setting.

This is why nobody can win against elves.
reddit.com/r/worldbuilding/comments/4nt5og/question_a_question_about_female_elven_anatomy/
>I wanna apologize in advance if any of this sounds unprofessional or if I get some things wrong. I'm definitely not a genius on these things considering I'm male.

>So in my world, elves are slender. And when I mean slender, I mean the average elven body type is very thin (obesity in elves can happen though, along with bulking up and curving, though it takes more work than it does for humans).

>Now, one thing I noticed a lot in fantasy is the trend of making women as busty as possible. So, I wanted go reverse that in my elven population. Therefore, elven women are incredibly flat chested. There is substance enough to differentiate from boys but barely. Now, the breasts are important to us because they feed our children and are storages of fat that produce milk. We generally have 2-3 children within at least 10 years and after that we don't really feed anyone.

>Well, what if we only had 2-3 kids within a 10 year range of time—and then continued on living 200 years afterwards? I am trying to find a logical reason, other than just being designed that way, as to why elven women would have such flat chests. Is there? Or does none of that have any correlation to breast size at all?

>Edit: This is slightly related, but what about males? Is there any correlation of penis size to body fat? I'm thinking elven microdicks might've been the reason why breeding between humans and elves never took place in my world

>Therefore, elven women are incredibly flat chested.
>elven microdicks
>73 comments

Citation needed

The Empire has a major problem : when it's not threatened, it will degenerate into petty wars and other noble general shittery, which is why the Empire can't actually steamroll the setting.

Plus, the Empire has enough work into pacifying its own forests and hills, they don't really need to invade Ulthuan.

Already provided? I'm not doing a full MLA citation if that's what you mean.

>reddit

Yeah thats great and all but I got 100 times more guys and they arent that bad themselves.

Just a link to wherever you read that would suffice.

It would be almost impossible for the Empire to invade ulthuan let alone hold any territory for very long.

Mongols love rape, so they have a 2x DAM modifier against elves, who are weak to rape.

Didnt humans beat the other almost humans by out breeding them in real life? Everyone always complains about humans being the average race but the never realize that they are really the numbers race.

Well okay.
warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Empire_of_Man
warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Bretonnia
warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/The_End_Times
Those pages, plus go to wherever you steal your codices from and grab the most recent empire codice, the 7th edition bretonian codex, and if you really really want you can read back through all the dwarf codices to find it. Some of the Chaos codices mention that the empire is the only thing standing between them and the world, too. For that one I can cite 4th edition warriors/demons of chaos book (think it's 4th ed, its the one with the vinyl black marble looking one with the chaos seal on the front), plus that old champions of chaos hero book (think it's 3rd or 4th edition?)

You mean when we fucked with neanderthals?

Fun fact - niggers are the only race with no neandedrthal DNA

IDK experienced people lose to bumblefuck savages on the regular. See the Chinese,Romans and Americans for example.

So many elf loving fags in here holy shit.

Pelinal is disappointed.

Its always good to remember that just because some people are less advanced it doesnt mean they are less intelligent.

In my headcanon I believe elves are more scared to die because of their longer lifespan, so they're overly cautious compared to humans.

Niggers are stupid.

Make them not a playable race like Symbaroum, where they're a capricious potential enemy.

Well, there are supplements for playing certain things for Symbaroum like elves, but they're generally considered to be for more experienced, higher level parties and scarce at that.

>Women with vaginas instead of penises

Okay, some of those are spot on the money and some are a little iffy (sun that emits light, that's a stretch), but this is just absurd.

Nope.

These pages mention The Empire as the most powerful force in The Old World. Which is just the continent upon which most of the human nations reside. Lustria, Ulthuan, Naggaroth, etc are different places.

In Tolkien elves are straight better than men, your argument is invalid

Like to see you invent bows and arrows from nothing but wood and sinew.

quantity >minituization>>>>>>>>shit>>>>>>>quality

good to remember that intelligence =/= experience as well.

Give me a plasma torch and I cut through your plate mail like it's fucking nothing, and look, I'm using the laws of physics, now stop being an autist, if elves (fey creatures that live for millenia, have magical shit, etc) exist dunno why elvish steel can't exist

They're slower breeders, so every casualty hurts more. And they're not hardy as fuck like dwarves to compensate.

I usually run elves in my games as monsters alien in personality and superior to humans in pretty much every way.

They're much stronger, faster, tougher, smarter, sharper in senses, and have natural weapons in the form of retractable claws and more pronounced teeth. They capitalize on their agelessness to become more skilled and knowledgable than any human can be.

They lack any sense of morality or inhibitions and will happily fuck and eat anything that moves regardless of sex or race. Their birthrate isn't low and is only kept in check by the smarter and more powerful elves making sure they don't overpopulate, usually by eating the babies, while most humans just hope that elves don't fuck their day up and eventually take all the land and at best keep humans around for amusement or as cattle.

I started doing this after a couple of my players simultaneously went full HUMANITY FUCK YEAH XD, started buying into le edgy /pol/ counterculture, and actually started using the word "degenerate" in common speech. The butthurt, while petty, was greatly pleasurable to me, especially when one complained and then piped down after remembering I'm the only one around willing to GM.

Depends on the setting

Tolkien elves are literal superhuman in all aspects and are second only to the ainur, and even then not by that much. Fingolfin rode alone to Angbad straight through the Orcish armies, kicked in the gates and held his own in a duel vs Melkor who was the strongest of the Valar before his fall, permanently crippling him before finally getting tired and losing due to fatigue. No human can compare to that.

Typical DnD fluff the average elf is only maybe slightly better than a trained human and they are hugely outnumbered so no they'd get their shit pushed in.

You're actually right. I guess some where in my head "the old" got removed from "the old world." Actually, even looking at the chaos codices, it does say that the empire is the only thing standing between chaos and the Old World too, so I admit I was off.

>Elves are half a step back from superman
Part of me wonders how much of that is supposed to be apocryphal within elven history and mythology. We never see modern elves do anything that badass, and I know they have their whole "elves are a declining race" thing, you also see a lot of that kind of thing when you look at how medieval historians looked at the past. During the dark ages there was this sense that the men of the past (mostly romans and biblical figures) were far superior to the men of that day, and I since Professor Tolkien was a student of history, I wonder if he didn't incorporate that idea into his elven mythology.

Because that implies elves forge metal, when trees and nature are their thing. Leave the mystical metal forging to dwarves, or your elves become Mary Sues (a race that's infinitely lived, better than anyone else, has the best weapons, armor, combat training, diplomacy, metal forging, stealth tactics, and everything else they have are far superior to literally everything anyone else has. And they live in mysterious magical forests protected by forest spirits and magical dire wolves.)

There's nothing wrong with something being superior in every facet. Surely the kind of..."people"...that play roleplaying games see the realism in that.

>Advanced plasma technology thousands of years beyond the elves can cut steel, so muh evlish blade can too!
What? I seriously think you missed a step there. Want to try again? I wasn't saying nothing anywhere can cut steel, I was saying a sword can't cut steel.

In my OC DONUT STEEL setting, Elves live centuries, maybe even millenias, but since time is so stretched for them, they also are slow learners and extremely poor improvisers.

All in all, an Elf my beat a fighter of another race in a duel, or in a battle, but they're fairly easy to deal with if you catch them by surprise since they're simply too slow to react to unpredicted threats and depend too much on command chain and squad discipline

But that's not interesting. How is it interesting when literally every problem gets solved by the elves in a hundredth of the time that your characters would have taken because a race of Mary Sues is apparently completely fine if they have Tolkien backing them.

Suffice advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic and elves do magic

Something something casters and martials

Sufficiently *

But elven fighters and rangers don't use magic. See: hobbit films.

Here's the problem here. I'm looking at this scenario by applying real life rules and assuming that an elf would be a combatant roughly equal to a human in physical capability, but with considerably more experience and perhaps faster, and going from there. You're looking at the combat, and assuming the human is restricted by real life logic and rules, and the elf is a magic supersoldier who can just should MAGIC, MUH MAGIC and fuck the rules. That's fine. Your setting can do that, and many settings do exactly that, but if you're going to throw real life logic out the window in favor of MUH MAGIC without putting forth some kind of rules for how said magic works, why even start talking in the first place?

I can see the parallels and I do agree that I think that's what he was going for but within the setting this stuff isn't actually apocryphal. There are still elves around that were involved in those events even in the third age. Look at Galadriel, she's Fingolfin's niece and was already centuries old when she journeyed to Middle Earth with Fingolfin's host of the Noldor and is still around and active even into the end of the Third Age. There really was an age of great heroes and great villains and fabulous creations but that has all passed and the age of mortals draws near.

Figure out how much the long lifespans warp perspective on events. There is no reason for them not to continually think about long term possibilities because they will live to see the results but this has it's downsides. Prisoner Dilemma situations screw them over as they'll tend towards long term goals over immediate gain, allowing other races to make those gains at the expense of the Elves. They know industrialization will kill the planet eventually so they won't do it. Won't stop a dwarven coal-rolling tank crushing through the gates.

If an Elf is supposed to be Physical perfection how can an elf be born with a shamefully tiny penis

forgot the evidence

Different standards of beauty? Hey, the ancient greeks thought a large penis was for barbarians and savages, maybe the elves think the same.

Man, I could ignore a lot of the problems with that movie, but making elves and draenei ugly was just fucking unacceptable. UH NEED MUH SEXY BLUE FANTASY CHICKS