>adding an increasing penalty to rolls at every 10 or 20% step of hp loss
>surpassing a certain amount of damage of a single hit can deal extra damage (f.e. 6 damage is dealt normaly , 10 or more gets additional 10 damage because it deals a severe wound)
any more ideas?
duh
single-hit damage thresholds that, when exceeded, force a character to make a check to prevent being
1) knocked down
2) knocked out
3) killed outright
Basically what GURPS does. GURPS is the best system I've seen for showing that you don't fight as well when wounded. (GURPS also gives characters a penalty to a wide variety of things immediately after taking damage, simulating the difficulty of accomplishing things when in sudden, acute pain.)
this is good , but i would need some ideas that can be used on higher granularity systems and very different powerlevels
I'd expect that to result in "bazooka tag" combat where whoever got the first turn has a huge chance of winning.
I don't consider that a bug, so long as the turn order stat is costed and capped appropriately.
The first hit makes you smaller, the second one kills you.
Not as much as you might think. It does make whoever gets in the first real hit much more likely to win a one-on-one fight (which is completely realistic - the first person to be stabbed usually loses a knife fight, the first person to be shot usually loses a gunfight).
But that creates incentives to be cautious and focus on defense until you see an opening. Because with GURPS, unless you go all-in with an attack (actually using the All-Out Attack action, either to get two attacks, get a bonus to hit, get a bonus to damage, or get some other bonus), you can make active defense rolls against attacks targeting you.
There's nothing wrong with realism, but if you want your game to be a dungeon crawl death spiral mechanics are going to make exploration slow as molasses
I didn't realize we were talking exclusively about dungeon-crawling. But I think the point still stands, avoiding fights is better than getting into fights, even fights that you are more likely to win than lose. Unless you're playing a system where everything fully resets after every fight, there is value in saving your HP, spell slots, etc., for the times when you really need to use them.
I'm pretty sure that the first hit makes you lose your armor instead.
So your idea is Downward Spiral combat? The first hit someone takes, the easier it will be for them to take the second, which takes more damage?
There's a reason HP exists and doesn't make PCs at 1 HP completely broken-down and useless in combat. And the reason is, because it's not fun. If you're helpless because of how much damage you've taken, why are you still in the fight?
Honestly, I tend to think HP is an outdated system anyway. It's simple and easy to make work, but for almost any theme and style of game you can come up with a system which suits it better rather than just going with the default.
There's also a reason why some systems use wound levels instead.
Not all penalties you suffer from being hit have to be permanent, and presumably every blow you trade with the enemy likewise hinders them.
I feel like the damage system was one of the few things AdEva did right. Every single hit that isn't totally soaked by armor has some kind of impact, which rewards striking first but also discourages charging in like a retard because you might take a worse hit than you dished out if you leave yourself exposed.
Every attack feels tense as fuck because there is no such thing as being safe.
Trying to come up with some fancy revolutionary new damage system is a huge part of why a lot of games turn out mediocre clusterfucks with gaping balance issues.
then pack some medical equipment and potions.
potions have become extremely important and valuable in our current campaign simply because they are the most efficient way to actualy "dungeon-crawl", since damage penalties are a bitch
WoD health levels. You get hurt, you are at a penalty. You have five or six hits in you until you're straight up toast.
GURPS health is also good, though a bit more difficult to understand.
HP by itself is outdated. but wound systems are pretty bad when progressing in powerlevels, and a bit difficult to design around them, they often lack granularity.
finding middle ground and using hp together with penalties through damage has been the best solution this far.
Sounds like a good way to over-complicate a system and drive many potential players away for a silly attempt at "realism'
Just use wounds. Every character has a wound threshold based on constitution/toughness/whatever. Every time he takes a hit which exceeds the threshold, he suffers a wound and gets appropriate penalties. Works wounderful for the dark eye, earthdawn and other systems.
gee , i wonder why so many systems more complicated then using hp alone have become so popular
you are also generalising players into the "afraid of complexity" category, which is by no means correct. you should start working for those companies , einstein
nope
hp based systems
it is in the op. if you cant think of anything , why even post?
They fucking suck for things bleed damage, and if you use exploding dice to counter the "1d8 damage can't hurt a Toughness 9 creature" problem you end up with minor injuries like a 10 foot fall exploding into like 65 damage and turning a player into canned spaghetti.
t. someone who plays a lot of Savage Worlds and wants to adapt the Toughness mechanic to be even simpler and more bounded.
Not that guy, but: Popular among who, exactly? Nobody outside of us weirdos can name any RPG that isn't D&D, which gets less realistic every year and grows correspondingly in popularity as far as I can tell.
Play something that already does this instead of a system where this has literally never been a problem before?
>implying exploding damage isn't one of the greatest things about Savage Worlds
Indeed, stop playing D&D, it's shit.
no
it is not like i am gonna publish my system so you have to break your little head about if you should learn it. other systems are too generalized , and i want to make a system for our own group , and i have fun designing systems
i never played any kind of generalized official system
we just make our own systems
Yeah I just love a constant grindfest of shaken and unshaken that ends with the boss suddenly taking 58 damage because the d4 damage for a dagger decided to explode over and over by some fuckwit who drops it instead of rolling it.
It's still my favorite system but sometimes it drive me up a fucking wall. Bennies, too. And the absolutely broken +2 to hit from shotguns. +1 was more than enough.
According to a random anonymous user who never plays the game irl? Nah, I'll continue to play it with my group because I'm not a simulationist autist.
>bad wrong fun
Unfortunately I've played more D&D than nearly anything else, because that's what people run. Only breaks are when I or my little sister host.
Hitpoints and penalties tend to be mutually exclusive, especially if they hit high-doubles or triple-digits on the regular. 4e had to base entire mechanics around "bloodied" to make it work.
A good idea would be having to spend actions on staying "stable", which lets you act as though you were X points higher. The more actions you spend, the more stable you are, but if you don't, you lapse into unconsciousness. Basically it lets you stand your ground for a while and then get one last good whack in.
>t. someone who plays a lot of Savage Worlds and wants to adapt the Toughness mechanic to be even simpler and more bounded.
Turn the toughness bonus from size into wounds that cannot be soaked.
A lot of systems that aren't D&D do this. Shadowrun's damage spiral is a basic yet very effective way of doing so, as you certainly aren't going to be fighting at peak condition when you are on your last legs.
PC's who are capable of dealing with the average dungeon in one sitting are a relatively new concept.
In OD&D, if you were locked in combat, it means that you fucked up and were now one bad roll away from either dying or losing precious HP that you couldn't afford to lose.
It isn't how it was in 3.PF where a party of PCs either scoffed at most challenges or ended up suffering a TPK if the GM kept the kiddy gloves on.
>How do I make a HP system not a HP system?
I like the Wound system from OpenD6/MiniSix.
You roll resistance against damage. Simply put, without getting in deep with the mechanics, for however many points above the soak roll the damage roll goes, you are either:
>Stunned: penalty to actions for one round.
>Wounded: same penalty until you are cured, and you lose access to your actions for the round you are wounded.
>Wounded Twice/Greatly Wounded: greater penalty, but otherwise same as Wounded.
>Gravely Wounded/Mortally Wounded: unconscious and bleeding out.
>Dead: well--dead.
These levels don't need to have the former to happen. If you're hit hard enough, you can jump straight to Wounded Twice or even to Dead.
Doing away with the hit points makes everything feel way more realistic and engaging, but simultaneously more cinematic. It's very fun, and book-keeping isn't bad at all.
MiniSix has a Body Point system that combines the above with hit points, and I'm not fond of those at all. Fortunately, MiniSix was written to be compatible with the OpenD6 Wound system.
Actually its the big mario that is giant and not the small mario that is a dwarf
>There's a reason HP exists and doesn't make PCs at 1 HP completely broken-down and useless in combat.
The reason HP exist is one of those
1-No one knew a better idea when it was invented
2-developer was clueless and didnt knew a better idea when it was invented
3-copying d&d (most of the time fall into previous reason)
4-simplicity to code
HP was never used for being better, in the same way 3d6 was never select for its "curves"