Rifts

I'm just about to start playing in a Rifts Phase World campaign, but honestly I've not really heard much about the system and setting outside of the rulebooks. I'd be interested to hear Veeky Forums's opinions and experiences.

Also, Rifts general I guess

Other urls found in this thread:

breachworld.com/
tempsend.com/E9B776CF1B/1631/Sav1.pdf
bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=157171
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

I like the Phase World Setting. Its got everything you'd ever need in a Space Opera, and there are no preconceived notions or canon adventures for other media to have to work around.

The system is pretty bad, being cobbled together from AD&D house rules for multiple genres and then smashed together with no real revisions since the 80s. Hopefully the Savage Worlds version will be more playable.

One of my problems with the system so far is that it does seem to be a bit of a mess. The complete skills PDF that the GM gave is is nearly 100 pages long for fuck's sake

Rifts is batshit fucking insane. Currently in a roll20 campaign

Don't let Kevin find out your gm is handing out rifts pdf's!

The tg consensus is that Rifts is a cool world with a terrible system. Almost everyone except that one trollish contrarian will agree on this.

The designers favored a "have a specific skill/class/rule for every possible situation' design philosophy. It's a bit dated, but not entirely a bad design choice, provided your target market has a measure of patience.

So if the system is terrible but one loves the setting, what system should one convert it to?

That's a hard question. Because of the massive amount of information and disparate elements inherent in the setting, any system that tries to do absolutely everything will wind up equally kludged. Rifts is basically like playing Gurps with every sourcebook ever. Your only option when converting to a different system is to trim out large portions of the setting, which eliminates the purpose of playing it at all.

Something that is generic and can be adapted to handle lots of genres mashed together like GURPS or Mutants and Masterminds, or something that is light and doesn't bother with the specific details like Fate or Lasers and Feelings.

Or just wait on the official Savage Worlds version that's being released this summer.

Could someone explain what exactly are the problems with the system? I've been working my way through the Ultimate Edition book and just don't see what people's complaints are about yet.

They also have a retarded concept of making multiple skills that do the same shit but with different fluff. Like the "normal" and "Holistic/Eastern" versions of medicine, or the fifty thousand versions of horseback riding.

After reading the book, I think the system is a piece of shit.

Most of the numbers on the character sheet are safe to ignore. Take out the saving throws that are identical for everyone and things that don't affect gameplay at all, and you get: up to three health pools (HP, SDC, MDC); up to three energy pools (MSP, ISP, Chi); six combat bonuses (actions, initiative, strike bonus, parry bonus, damage bonus, unarmed damage); three critical strike ranges (critical, knockout, death); two or three pseudoskills (charm, intimidate, perception (in some games)); and a variable-length list of percentile skills. That's 12-15 actually used numbers, less than most RPGs. But it doesn't matter, because guidelines for using these aren't given anywhere, with no guidelines for what scale of a bonus matches up to what real-world level of ability, and no guidelines for what level of die total matches up to what level of result.

All abilities can be boiled down to four numbers - Range, To-Hit Bonus, Damage, and Ammo. That's about all that is handled by the system; anything else requires writing a new rule on the spot. New rules are shoehorned in as any individual author thinks of a need for them, with no guarantee that they'll work with the system or be the same as any similar rule written by another Palladium author.

Combat is slow and boring. There's lip service to some of the damage scales but the vast majority of the time there's no point to anything but tank busting MDC weapons, especially when there are tiny handguns that can shoot through buildings. But in spite of that, combat is usually a slog chipping away through hundreds of points of armor. There are tons of hit locations on any given vehicle but the only thing that really counts according to the rules is the Main Body. And since the game doesn’t offer much in the way of combat rules outside of doing damage, there isn’t much tactically interesting going on while both sides hammer away at one another.

Aren't there like five radio operation skills?

There's an official Savage Worlds version coming out in the next month.

Played it alot in the 90's. It's sort of like the culmination of game design up until that point.

Multiple subsystems, endless splatbooks which keep getting worse in terms if quality, content and balance, fluff that didn't really add new shit and didn't even attempt to significantly change the paradigms of existing tropes.

Hey looks Elves and dwarves! ...Again.

tl;dr System is terrible and was poor even when it came out and setting was OK. It's just very...american I guess.

Like Japan source book has ROBOT DRAGONS and ninjas. Just like Japan guys amirite?

England, better have those knights. Etc.

One of the odd things is that the Palladium system has a distinct feel in spite of its flaws. It does not feel quite like AD&D nor BRP, not even like a true mashup of them. It's definitely an old school feel but it's oddly more modern than the systems it was ripped off from.

It's great that Savage Worlds is bringing Rifts kicking and screaming into the 21st century but it will feel like Savage Worlds rather than Palladium. That's not a bad thing but a modernized, cleaned up quasi-retroclone of Palladium would be sweet.

Have the Savage Rifts books been released?

The PDFs are out for backers as of about 2 hours ago, but the website can't handle everyone trying to download at the same time. So far I haven't even been able to log in.

Well damn.

If anyone has it how is it?

Most of the setting outside the first few world books is garbage though.

This is Veeky Forums though. Most of you probably like it

It's funny, because when the game first came out the Japanese islands were wiped out as way to avoid all the weeb cliches that were dominating the genre, then suddenly ROBOT DRAGONS NINJAS KATANAS FOLDED 9000 TIMES.

The setting just got pogressively worse after that, like Kevin just all of a sudden said to himself "Aww who gives a fuck"

The robot dragons and cyber-ninjas literally appeared out of nowhere in-universe. When the rifts happened, Hiroshima and the surrounding area where thrown forward in time.

obligatory GURPS dicksucking

So, Rifts general then, huh?
Well then, I have a question.
I'm GMing a Rifts game and we're all new to the system and role playing in general (most of us only started when 5e came out), and I'm just not sure what kind of adventures play to the setting's strengths and feel distinctly different from D&D.
My idea was to use creatures from Nightbane, using the Dark Conversions book, involving a plot about a Nightlord coming into Rifts Earth, but also wonder if the dark feel of Nightbane isn't good for a first Rifts game, rather than whatever the game's "typical" feel is.

>tl;dr: some GMing tips and advice would be appreciated.

how much could I get for 21 books of this fucking system?

>system
Breachworld is well regarded by those who've heard of it.
breachworld.com/

This is one of the best summaries of the Rifts rules I have ever read. Kudos.

Reading between the lines I see that you've tried to convert the Rifts system to another one, haven't you?

Not much, they're dirt cheap and available in large quantities everywhere in North America. If you're in Europe maybe a bit more, but I wouldn't expect more than $100 for the lot.

My advice would be: if you want to run Nightbane, run Nightbane, not Rifts. They're quite different thematically and in feel. Choose one, don't mix them until you're experienced in running both.

Rifts typical feel is GIANT MECHA AWESOME DINO NINJA PIRATE BADASS DUDES, so be open to new PC ideas, even if they're overpowered.

Classes (OCCs) aren't in the least balanced, don't even bother.

For a first game, I recommend telling everyone to stick to just the core book (either original Rifts or Ultimate Edition). Adding too many books will confuse everyone, unbalance things even more and overwhelm the GM with info.

yep
the system is a fucking mess

that setting tho

How does one run a game with only Rifts Ultimate Edition? It doesn't have any kind of monsters or enemy stats section, do you just design npcs and soldiers using character classes to pit your players against?

Pretty much. NPC OCCs/RCCs are the main antagonists in most games anyway. That's one of the failings of RUE, lack of monsters. You can plunder the other sourcebooks for monsters as a GM, just don't let players use the materials.

>You can plunder the other sourcebooks for monsters as a GM, just don't let players use the materials.
Why not? It's not as though the main book has any character balance to throw off. It already has Glitter Boys and Dragon Hatchings alongside Vagabonds and City Rats.

I wouldn't, I would pick the RUE and one World book of choice.

Because at that point, people COULD just start making shit up. Also, it can really fuck up your plans as a GM if your players asspull things that just wreck your plans. Knowing what your players can potentially pull on you makes it so your four hour planned game doesn't come to a grinding halt because a player used a thing you weren't aware of.

Is it just me, or does anyone else only play Powered Armour Pilots? I fucking love them.

>what is a retcon

I only ever play Juicers who pilot power armor.

Im reading Savage rifts now (I backed it) but I dont have enough savage experence undet my belt to gage power levels.

Cyber knight FYI now have nanobot cyber armor that gives +2 toughness. And their blades due Strengh + 2x spirit... seems powerfull enough.

Yeah I did not back it because of palladiums history with kickstarters, but how did they do technowizards?

Havent made it that far but sounds pretty bullshit to be honest.

For example

Arcane Machinist: Techno-Wizards begin with a variant of the Gadgeteer
Edge which grants enormous flexibility.
As an action (instead of 1d20 minutes), the character produces a magical gadget replicating any power available to Techno-Wizards. To make the device requires a successful Techno-Wizardry
roll at −2 per Rank the power is above
her own. The device has its own pool of PPE equal to half the Techno-Wizard’s normal maximum PPE pool (round down). With a raise, the device gets +5 PPE. The item can only be activated with its own PPE and once used up (or at the end of the session), the device burns out or otherwise becomes unusable. A Techno-Wizard can use Arcane Machinist up to half her Smarts die per session.

... so kinda good.

Sounds reasonable but are there not permanent technowizard items?

Oh I dont know I downloaded it to my phone and Im reading it in bursts on breaks.

Okay bumping the thread with an observaion on Juicers in Savage rifts.

They are going to probbly die in a hell less time than five years.

The "Burn" Mexhanic at the start of the game gives you a default of 8 burn points. At the start of the session you roll a d10. If you roll equal to or above your burn point total. You lose 1 burn point.

At 0 you die.

So its a doom counter in short. You can also spend Burn poi ts as well for a one use extra d10 on top of a single check that acts like any other die in said check for "ace"ing or rerolls... but its permanent and you dont gain burn points dirring the game.

Its a hell of a mechanic that actually makes you feel your rapidly approaching death by burnout in game.

What is MSP?

I think he meant PPE

>Temporary techno-wizard items
>Doom counter for Juicers

Both of these make sense at first blush. Rifts should have had mechanics like these because they fit the fluff of the classes.

I hope the Shifter/summoner has some proper mechanics to go with their fluff now.

I didnt see anything regarding shifters in this book unfortunately. techno wizzards seem to im guessing play like magical mad scientists. They have dedicated Tw creation rules but I'm not there yet.

Bursters... in a setting where MDC is actually downplayed. Fucks shit up with all the MDC. Often without spending ISP except toto make shit burn harder.

I'm still not entirely sold on SW as a better replacement. I want to like it but there's just too much stuff there that I don't like.

Are there hit locations for large vehicles, mecha, giant monsters, etc.? And how does that work if you blow up a mecha's arm or something?

It doesn't mention rules for blowing shit off of mechs. It has crit tables for fucking up compoents however. Maybe its in the savage core which I have yet to read.

>It has crit tables for fucking up compoents however
That sounds promising.

Once you read the whole thing we'll need a full report, user.

One fun thing I'mI'm seeing here is how most non powered armor or vehicles are actually noy considered MDC... MDC being the books flavor text version of "Heavy armor".

This makes things that do inflict MDC such as a cyber knight weapon. Railguns and most things Bursters do seem all the more scarry as fuck. I mean this asshole here melts tank armor with his fucking mind. If someone with some Savage experence can explain how the fuck Heavy armor works. That would be great.

Friendly bump, So a Friend told me that Heavy armor works like it how mega damage works in Rifts, if your not using it, your not hurting it, again MDC weapons are on the caliber of fuck huge anti vehicle weapons and rail guns.

It wasn't a Palladium Kickstarter. Pinnacle is running the show.

There was originally just a couple sentences saying there's nothing interesting there. Then the world book came along and said there actually is interesting stuff there after all. That's the kind of retcon I'm okay with.

Also ninja juicers. The only game of RIFTS I actually played in that didn't just turn into making characters all night was one where our team, me and my bro as juicer ex juicerball athletes (a la mutant league football), a glitterboy that blew himself up, and some sort of magician who took a MD laser to the face ended up with me and my bro saying fuck this we're going back to the mutant league

Arcane Machinist is just for cobbling something together on the fly. There are permanent techno-wizard devices in the equipment section, and rules for doing permanent TW conversions of normal tech.

Again, worlds better than what Paladium did for techno wizards which boiled down to "ehhhh"

Hi guize what's going on in this thread

First book for Savage World Rifts released today. I'd upload my copy but I don't know how to remove watermarks. Will reply with impressions later.

I probably would do a burn point split if for my campaign. Something like reduce the burn number for every four points burnt.

MFW Cyber knights are actually fucking awesome in the Savage Rifts

Someone in the Symbaroum thread described this process:

Okay, I guess I learned how to clean at least rpg drive thru watermarks.
So, if the PDF is watermarked I can try to remove it, if you are willing to send it to me.
I know sending some user something with your watermark on it is nothing you do lightheartedly, but I have at least some proof. I replaced the watermark on my bought Savage Worlds core book with "Veeky Forums-/smg/" tempsend.com/E9B776CF1B/1631/Sav1.pdf

So if you want to give it a shot you can send me the file to [email protected] or if it's too big zip it up and give the archive a password, upload that somewhere and send me the password.
I swear I'll do no mischief with it. But yeah, the word of a stranger I guess.

Hm, well I could also tell you how to do it I guess.
I used mutool to decompress the file, then searched and replaced all occurences of the watermark text in an Hex editor (I guess there might be a text editor that you could use, but SublimeText3 fucked stuff up while saving, so I used wxHexEditor). And then I recompressed the PDF with mutool again.
the commandline arguments for mutool are
>mutool.exe clean -d -i -f PDFInputName PDFOutputName
-d tells the tool to uncompress the data streams, so they are in a readable format
-i tells the tool to toggle the decompression of images, so they will not be decompressed, since that would just bloat the file size
-f tells the tool to toggle the decompression of the fonts

and for recompressing simply use
>mutool.exe -z PDFInputName PDFOutputName

bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=157171

This is a fairly good overview of the Dimension Books - so, Phase World and all that. Wordy, but less so than reading all of them, and it does a lot of comparisons between things.

Is the Tomorrow Legion okay? They sounded pretty twee - and redundant when Lazlo is a thing - plus their Castle Refuge looks stupid as fuck.

Its kinda ehhh. Its basicly meant as a generic hero organization thats trying to protect tolken war refuges

Sell me on Rifts

If it exists in fantasy or sci fi, it likely exists in some form in Rifts.

Dont get me wrong. If you grew up durring the age of 3.x dnd. Then rifts mechanically looks like a massivle pile of percentages, to many saving rolls and combat modifers and "Jesus fuck why"

But for those of of us from the Ad&d era. Its still kind of a cluster fuck with the most gonzo 80s metal world setting on the market.

There are, but Techno-Wizards automatically have a few personal permanent items and the ability to cobble together temporary items out of junk. They can make permanent TW items, but that's detailed way later in the book in the equipment section.

Shifters are going to be in the Savage Foes book as adversaries, and they're going to show up in a future book as an iconic framework.

If you have Heavy Armor, you take no damage from normal weapons. Heavy Weapons deal damage to you normally. Heavy Weapons don't do additional damage to things without Heavy Armor, but that's not usually necessary since Heavy Weapons are usually dealing a fuck of a lot of damage anyway.

I'm probably going to make it something like "When you spend a burn point, roll your burn die. If you roll higher than your burn score, that point was spent permanently; otherwise, it comes back at the start of the next session."

Fuck yes they are.

It's okay. It's basically a narrative decision to solve the "but what do PCs do?" problem that a lot of new GMs run into. You can safely ignore them if you don't want another heroic organization in the game, but I personally like them. It's about fucking time someone decided to start recruiting all those independents into a group to oppose the Coalition.

It has one of the best settings on the market with a terrible system that has now been fixed by virtue of a Savage Worlds version.

The setting is basically a post-post-apocalyptic science-fantasy world that includes everything and a weaponized kitchen sink. If you thought it was awesome when you were 13, it's in the book. Mecha, wizards, mutant animals, psychics, aliens, ninjas, and everything else fighting over the ruins of a broken world that's trying to rebuild to something like civilization while magic continues to belch out monsters from other universes on a nigh-daily basis. Your character is a certified badass trying to make his way in a fucked up world.

It's terrible. Everyone is always going on about "muh setting", but most of the setting is actually shit

The fuck you say. Rifts is fucking awesome.

Why would you do that to yourself?

If you honestly can't tell from the first few pages you are already lost.

He's right though. Most of Rifts' setting is pure good idea/bad idea. Like the Vampires that could be taken out by a handful of firetrucks...or the retarded Horsemen of the Apocalypse that only hang out in Africa.

It's shit. But it's stupid fun shit, like gamma world. Don't take it seriously and pretend you are a 12 year old in the 80s.

I'm not saying you can't enjoy it, but most of it is just the worst kind of schlock mixed in with tired old cliches.

Personally I like well thought out settings but to each their own.

I'll admit that there is some good material if you strip its setting down to its core though. Also NGR and Warlords of Russia are examples of world books done right

>magic native Americans and cowboys is good
>ye old England filled with knights
>south America is furry central
>Eldarado and Atlantis are real places despite both clearly originating in other works of fiction
>phase world and COSMO KNIGHTS
>NINJAS

All crap. I could go on.

Also what this user said

I like well thought out settings too, but Rifts is maybe the most metal setting ever created (except maybe WH40K). That tickles my inner teenager in a way that's hard to explain. It's not an objectively good setting, but it's still *fucking awesome*.

Anyone read the Savage Rifts book out yet? If so what do you think.

I'm about 80 pages into the player's guide, and I think it's pretty boss. The only thing I don't really like so far is the Technical Difficulties setting rule, which I think overburdens character archetypes that rely on equipment.

I can answer any specific questions about it.

One of the Devs touched on this. I guess this only comes in to play when a wild die is used and you critfail in both that die. And the wild die.