Warmachine/Hordes general

Giant Elf Syndrome is a thing in Iron Kingdoms. Goreshade, Issyria and Thyron are examples of this.

Yeah, but from a gameplay perspective, what does he have that makes him deserving of that vulnerability?

He's not as killy as Butcher. He does nothing close to the amazing shit Harby does. What exactly has he got that merits that design choice?

He's big because he's big.

You are over thinking this

...

more benis than you'd ever wish for

Hmm.

I guess what I'm saying is that he seems underpowered for a medium based caster.

Medium base casters often don't have anything to do with relative power.

Beyond that, it does make stuff like reach better on them than on a small base.

wait 'till you see my dick

Yea you're overthinking it, PP starts with fluff for 9/10 of their models. " Wouldn't it be cool to have a big-ass swordsman warcaster?" is the entire reason for him to be a medium base.

Wonder if the Ellowyur Swordsmen are going to be medium-based as well, or if Thyron is just a freak of nature.

Iirc they're a ten man unit, so they're probably gonna be small base. Only trolls get 10 man medium base units

Ok so Hark is pretty much my favourite caster, so he's where I'm starting in Mk3. Going to see how many jacks feels right.

Harkevich - 28WJP
-Black Ivan - 19
-Decimator - 16
-Decimator - 16
-Juggernaut - 12
-Kodiak - 13

Winter Guard Infantry (6) - 7
-CA - 4
Winter Guard Field Gun Crew - 4
Battle Mechaniks (4) - 3
Kayazi Eliminators - 5

Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - 4

So I'm starting quite jack heavy, and chances are good I'm going to have to drop down to 4 so that I can have more breathing room for support. Anyway, Black Ivan is good value for Hark so he's easy to start with. The plan with the Decimators is to use the Field Gun to knock down a target to fix their RAT and then put 4-6 Decimator shots into it - pretty serious threat against jacks, but it might be too janky in actual play. The Kodiak was originally a Devastator for anti-infantry, but I needed the 1 point so the Kodiak subs in. Lastly the Juggernaut is just such a great beat stick, and Hark gives it everything it wants on feat turn.

The rest of the list is all about supporting the jack line. The winterguard cower behind and use the minifeat to unjam, then look for juicy CRA's after. Battle mechaniks keep systems operational and help win ranged attrition, and the Eliminators are a nice little toolbox - part jam, part unjam, all utility.

Any suggestions for change? I get the feeling that dropping one Decimator for some more flexible additions will make for a better list, but I'll be damned if I don't want to make 5 jacks work.

FORGOT IMAGE

So it turns out Ragnor is really freaking good. Like, top tier Troll caster good. Have any of you guys played him yet? Have you experienced the glory of putting a giant pile of unkillable beasts and Champions on the table?

Privateer Press announced a while back that they wouldn't be able to fulfill most suppliers' orders until later in the summer. They didn't even make enough stuff to fulfill the very first wave of preorders, yet thought it would last them through the year.

Played against him.

Killed him turn three with little issue.

I lit don't remember what he does besides cover

Man, Troll players must suck in your meta. Get ready to see a lot of this guy then. It's going to be him, Calandra, and Madrak2 pretty much all the time in competitive events

I'm not buying into warroom, so I haven't played Mk3 yet, that's why I don't remember what he does besides cover.

And I figured you'd say that.

Don't insult my opponent by concluding that he must be bad, without even asking what I played or how I killed him.

With new affliction giving -2 def, have long gunners become a real option for Fiona now ? If she still can field them ofc

Why calandra? One fury change isn't going to change the fact that her best army options took major hits.

Why were the lists? I'm not really 'wowd' by ragnor either

Well, provide evidence that you or your opponent aren't total trash then.

16 inch Star Cross and DEF 14 Arm 20 heavy beasts are amazing

>Base
>Body
>Left arm
>Right arm
>Spear
>Shield
>Helmet
>Left pauldron
>Left pauldron spike
>Left pauldron back
>Right pauldron
>Right pauldron spike
>Right pauldron back
>Back flag

YOU THINK THIS IS A FUCKING JOKE PP?

His list, was off the top of my head, something like this, but with the UA for the stone as well(Conflict won't let me attach it for some reason).

Dunno if this is exactly it though.

you should never play malifaux

As for me, I played this.

Which is where we see the issue, not only with Rag, but with Trollbloods in general. Outside of your dedicated shooting lists, I don't think there's much of anything trolls can do about Aurora. I get to dictate when we fight, and if you don't want to lose your warcaster, you have to play incredibly defensively. Rags more specifically has to pop feat defensively in order to prevent an Alpha from removing half his army, and when he does I can simply just set up for an alpha next turn.

She can't currently, she might be able to in Army of the Kingmaker and probably in the Laelese resistance theme forces. Neither are out right now so no Long Gunners in Mercs right now

However, merc shooting is pretty sick nasty right now and she even gets the commodore so affliction isn't wasted by any means

They were a pretty real option for her before.

I'm not seeing any issues fighting this list. Ragnor can just run into the zone and pop feat and laugh as you fail to kill his army and die to Champion retaliatory strikes.

There's nothing particularly scary or anything here worrisome, it's just dude spam which is garbage in Mk3.

its skorne, of course its a joke

If he pops his feat, I don't have to engage him, man. I can just wait.

And you don't see anything dangerous about the fact that I can put my entire army into your caster, and the only thing you can do about it is try and crowd me out?

>I purposely cut the sculpt into 13 pieces. As a joke.

I mean sure, if you don't want to fight me while I'm in the zone, scoring points, sure that's cool. I'll take the time walk and fight you next turn. You also can't put you whole army into Ragnor. Hes behind a giant pile of armor and boxes and DEF 18 or he's Def 20. CoC dudes can't hit that and if they do he has transfers and the occasional shield guard.

You beat a shitty Troll player dude, it's OK

He has the best troll lock sculpt, that's for sure.

Man, my spell list gives flight and +2" of movement, and my feat gives parry.

It doesn't fucking matter how many dudes you put in my way, unless they're all entirely crowded around Ragnor himself, I can get to him. And if they are, I just kill them first(against, with my parry having, flight having, +2" movement having army) and then I kill Ragnor.

Unles you build a giant fucking box about Ragnor, I can get to him. And if you do, then I'm winning on scenario, not you.

And even better, from the sounds of it you're not planning on having many infantry models on the table, which makes crowding me out even harder. So there's that.

You know it is totally okay to just give up a scenario point if you can out score them or kill them next turn.
Waffleing is a legitimate strategy.

>shitty troll player and meme army player trying to have a dick measuring contest
kek

You know people can premeasure right? It's not all that hard to keep a model X inches away from whatever you want attack with? You should never get to charge a caster with your army unless your opponent is incredibly dumb.

A caster like Ragnor doesn't need to get that far up the table. He's going to hang out just beyond your threat range and murder you with his army. Same goes for anyone else. Your army is pretty predictable unless you're fighting a total newbie. Your threat maxes out at 12 on Angels and 10 on everyone else right? Ooh, so scary. That one unit goes so far!

Robot have no need for dicks, and there are more important things to measure.

Like my assassination angles into your caster to win the game.

Dudespam is not dead. The Dirt Thirty is an integral part of my plan to hate my opponent to death. It also happens to be one of the bester ways to deal with jackspam in Cryx. I've built a three legged stool of "anti-armor, anti-shooting (pow 10), and 'castle' aka The Waffle Cone."

So far I have tested out Scaverous and Denny3 (the waffle) and I'm fairly happy with them. I still need to try out my Venethrax jack list.

Ran this last night. I've only got three games with it under my belt, so I'm still terrible with it, but it's... good.

Ran up against Xekaar beast spam and killed two heavies under his feat. Basically traded off two beasts at a time back and forth (letting him kill the first pair) until I had four and he had one.

Mostly though I'm just a closet treadhead and love being able to throw out a lot of cheap resilient machines on the board, but damn this list is fun and really, really good.

I thought he was scoring on scenario? How's he hanging back all safe and sound while still far enough forward to score?

And with the Diffuser shot, it's 14" on angels, 14" on the Steelsouls, and 12" on the Eradicators, though they can sidestep off of something to get that 14". Perfs can technically get to 16-18". Reductors walk to 13" threat.

Aurora herself has a total threat of 17" with everything in play, though she rarely goes for the caster herself.

And you're right, they can play safe and sound, nice and far back. If they do that, I just go for scenario, jamming them out.

Oh, and the Conservator can threat up to 13" as well.

You know models can score on scenario, right? You don't have to do score with your caster.

>Ragnor can just run into the zone and pop feat

Beyond that, there's not too many scenarios that I can't contest while staying most out of his threat ranges.

This conversation is boring and pointless.

I know, I won already, but the Troll players won't fucking give it up.

Man, I really wanted to limit myself to two, maybe three casters while I transition from MkII to MkIII but with every Ret caster getting changed (except Thyron but the game changed around him in interesting ways) it's really hard to not try everyone. Everyone but Ravyn, Kaelyssa, and Garryth that is...

True/false in both Warmachine and 40k.

That's because your playing a shitty caster and think you've unlocked the game. You're wrong

I'm glad you can tell me why, beyond not being able to tell me why.

Small based single wound user.

New player here. Are y'all sure those pdfs are for mk3? The text on page 3 says "first printed December 2015". Didn't mk3 just release a few days ago?

Mk2 did not release in December 2015.

Please share PDFs

Yea, dunno why it says that. They're the new edition though.

Early drafts

That's probably when it was finished, or thereabouts. But yes, that's mark 3, straight from PP's own site.

(Hexeris 2) Lord Arbiter Hexeris [+27]
- Titan Cannoneer [17]
- Titan Sentry [15]
- Cyclops Savage [8]
- Razor Worm [7]
- Aptimus Marketh [6]
Cataphract Incindiarii (max) [18]
Nihilators (max) [15]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (max) [7]
Extoller Soulward [3]
Mortitheurge Willbreaker [4]
Swamp Gobbers Bellows Crew [2]

This is what I'd use if my opponent wasn't playing a faction resistant to fire like Menoth or Trolls. I can slay your infantry while harassing the shit out of your caster with POW14 Hellfires from anywhere. And RNG16 POW15+3d6 shots from the Cannoneer is very respectable, especially when Black Spot is floating around. I'm not really expecting to crack armour here, rather I want to melt your infantry, tie up your heavies, and go for your caster.

(Makeda 1) Archdomina Makeda [+29]
- Molik Karn [20]
- Titan Sentry [15]
- Cyclops Raider [9]
- Agonizer [7]
Cataphract Cetrati (max) [20]
- Tyrant Vorkesh [6]
Nihilators (max) [15]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (min) [5]
Mortitheurge Willbreaker [4]
Extoller Soulward [3]

Relying on Karn for an assassination is still fine you know. Sentry over Titan because the Agonizer is amazing and once again I don't plan on cracking armour in one activation anyway. Cetrati are underrated since they get up to ARM22 with the Agonizer. Another neat trick against Hordes factions is to use the Agonizer to drop a fury on your opponent's beasts then throw The Lash on them, forcing your opponent to take threshold checks he's most likely going to lose.

Nihilators go in every list because they're fucking NIHILATORS.

I have that 2 player Legion/Circle box set arriving to my house either today or tomorrow. What do y'all think of the box for a complete and total noobie to this game and should I just go ahead and throw away all the MK2 media?

Play with the stuff in the box. The Mk2 rules are essentially the same, so if you learn to play with those the transition will be easy. Learning the broad outline of how the game plays out is much more important than knowing you can't roll tough while knocked down.

Is there an image like this for Tanith?

Interesting. Why did they release a new version of the game if the changes are that minor?

Also do I have to go purchase a Codex for whatever faction I want to play or do I -only- need those character cards?

>tfw you can't reproduce your mkII army because you are one point off

The changes are numerous enough to warrant a new version, but not numerous enough for it to matter to a new player. And when it comes to rules books, you can buy the book when it's released but the entire thing is available free as a PDF linked in the OP. For your army's cards you'll need to get hold of a faction deck which isn't too expensive. Hopefully when the new edition is properly out retailers will be putting Mk3 cards in models they have in stock so you might be able to get away with not buying a faction deck.

Fuck. I just realised that that one point I'm always missing when building a list is because full stone is 9 not 8 points. Screw you, PP.

Are we able to purchase the mk3 cards yet? I'm having trouble finding the decks for purchase.

Did you install the new War Room? If you're trying to get the decks in the old app then you won't find anything.

I like to keep my analog gaming traditional. If I'm unable to buy the faction cards, I guess I'll have to buckle and download that app.

Just drop the elder stone guy
t. Menoth player

Where were you when Alexia became the best gunslinger in the Iron Kingdoms?

The physical decks are being released this Wednesday if you can wait a little longer.

Switched to pBorka and saved on the runebearer and replaced mauler+earthborn for Rok+axer. I think I'm happy with the list now.

How is she any different than before?

>distributors telling stores they didn't get any mk3 kits in
>proud American stores now forced to suffer like poor awful EU stores
This is an outrage. America should not have to be on the same field as Europoors. PP really dropped the ball here.

21 HANDCANNON SHOTS.

IN A ROW.

no
you cant buy hand gun attacks with death magic

Well you could but it's ROF 1 with no reload

Doesn't mean anything.

Reload is required on shit with Focus or Fury because the Additional Attacks rule was changed to only allow you to buy additional melee attacks. If you're not using Focus or Fury, then it doesn't apply.

Death Magic lets you buy any attack, including ranged ones.

Between this and the ranking officer shit letting you put spells on Alexia, it's pretty clear where those three years of playtesting went.

Expect that in the first errata then.

Oh, I'm not saying it won't get changed.

I'm saying it shouldn't even be there.

Won't Alexia just grant Spell Ward to the officer, too?

Skorne Army - 75 / 75 (+24) points

(Makeda 3) Makeda & the Exalted Court [+24]
- the Exalted Court
- Agonizer [7]
- Titan Sentry [15]
- Titan Sentry [15]
- Tiberion [22]
- Aptimus Marketh [6]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (min) [5]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (min) [5]
Praetorian Swordsmen (max) [13]
- Praetorian Swordsman Officer & Standard [4]
Hakaar the Destroyer [7]

Thoughts?

Too many Handlers. Cut down to a single max Handlers, a Sentry for a Gladiator, and bring a Master Tormentor.

does anyone have the cygnar and trollblood card pdfs? I just noticed I dont have them

Skorne Army - 75 / 75 (+24) points

(Makeda 3) Makeda & the Exalted Court [+24]
- the Exalted Court
- Molik Karn [20]
- Tiberion [22]
- Bronzeback Titan [18]
- Titan Gladiator [14]
- Titan Gladiator [14]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (max) [7]
Mortitheurge Willbreaker [4]

Probably better than mine.

The Bronzeback is a memebeast now.

Only if she's in formation. The idea is that turn one she runs out of formation, which removes spell wars in the unit, and then you cast the spell on them. Next turn you move back into formation, regaining spell ward. As spell ward doesn't end spells, only prevents targeting, spell stays up and you're golden.

Then you go make your 21 hand cannon shots