Magic the Gathering: Legacy Central

Every now and then you a spell snare come out the SB from miracles because SFM + Friends are often times 2 CMC. Opposing Snaps in the miracles mirror are 2 CMC. Chalice of the void on 1 is 2 CMC (on the stack). The huge monster in the Miracles mirror is counter balance on double U and being 2 CMC.

I play it in Canadian Threshold from time to time, really depends on what I think is going to be at my shop. I usually have a 2-4 slots in the main that are non-FOW/Daze countermagic, usually spell pierce or spell snare just depending.

Many tempo decks would rather not lose mana efficiency leaving up mana for counters every turn. That said, I run a lot of Spell Pierces in my Grixis/RUG Delver or Show and Tell lists.

>What deck are you playing?
Grixis Delver w/ Abrupt Decay
>What is your list?

4 Delver
4 Deathrite
3 Pyro
2 Angler
1 Clique

4 Force
4 Daze
2 Spell Pierce

4 Bolt
2 Decay
1 Dismember

4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
3 Gitaxian Probe

8 Fetches
2 Usea
2 Trop
2 Volc
4 Wasteland

>What do you want to see?
Decks with weak mana like OP's/Shardless/Eldrazi, combo is usually pretty good. RUG Delver is very favorable as well
>What do you want to avoid?
Lands
>What is the best deck in the format?
Miracles. No weaknesses to exploit.
>When is your next tournament?
Tomorrow night

[OP Here] The greed is real. The greed is also packs all the answers all the time (except for people hating the mana base).

Confession: I do lean on DRS for T2 True Names or Slinging Double Spells on T2.

Confession: DRS is the single most broken card. Esper Green and other decks would not be able to splash without DRS.

The little deathrite that could.

Me waiting for miracles to finish topping.

...

...

My problem with the deck is that almost half of your lands can't cast a Deathrite, and Decay is almost uncastable. Any deck which can pressure your mana should be able to run over it.

That's the funkiest stompy deck i've seen in a while and i love it.

Why isn't Dragon Stompy a more popular deck?

I'll be taking DDFT to SCG Worcester. Just contacted a lawyer to help me write up my will.

>Miracle
>No weakness

Except it folds to big mana decks, like eldrazi. Not saying it's not good tho.

>Miracles has no weakness
Dredgeplayerlaughs.jpg

I used to think this until a turn 2 RiP lands every time with force/spell pierce backup against therapy. It's not like you get to go off with Troll LED Breakthrough Looting every time.

I've been goldfishing a fun little Doomsday deck for under $200 and I love it. Often goldfishes on T3, sometimes T2, with some 3 leftover mana for protection to spare. I should build it for fun and transition towards DDFT once I get myself the LEDs.

list? im building towards the full thing atm

List?

it's not that hard to play. by far the most fun storm deck

>literally only one green source and only 3 fetches for it
>5 green spells mainboard and one in the side
At least put one Tropical Island there.

Yeah, it's really nice in RUG Delver as a way to stop things like Rest in Peace or Baleful Strix that can really bog you down. I maindeck 1 copy.

>green efreets

it's beautiful :.)

Got this list online. It is as follows:

4 Burning Wish
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
4 Rite of Flame
4 Ponder
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Manamorphose
1 Tendrils of Agony
3 Doomsday
1 Night's Whisper
1 Meditate
4 Duress
3 Cabal Therapy
4 Ancient Spring
4 Sulfur Vent
4 Geothermal Crevice
2 Gemstone Mine
1 Chain of Vapor
4 Lotus Petal

1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Doomsday
1 Tranquility
1 Meltdown
1 Firespout
1 Shelldock Isle
1 Emrakul, The Aeons Torn
1 Infernal Contract
1 Chain of Vapor
3 Dread of Night
2 Serenity

Serenity and Tranquility are bad, searching for options. White and Green aren't generated easily in this deck, way better if you can play something on Grixis so you don't need to sac your lands. The original list had 3 IoK, but Therapy is better and now quite cheap.

Not having LED means the most mana you can get out of a card post-Doomsday is +2 B with Dark Ritual, but the sac lands are +1 which helps quite a bit. Manamorphose cantrips and fixes mana fortunately. Since you have no top to leave on the battlefield, Meditate is required over Ideas Unbound.

you have to buy a bunch of expensive niche cards that aren't useful in much else (the Imperial Painter problem), it's not that consistent (which makes it frustrating to play) and it is only good in favorable metagames (which, combined with the Imperial Painter problem, makes it risky to buy into)

Oh I know I've been playing it for a couple years now.

Oh ok sac-land doomsday. I want to build it on mtgo but Doomsday's are like 2o to and thay's more than I want to spend

Dredge can be rough, but it ends up being about a 50/50 matchup.

12 Post is really tough, but you can run enough non-basic hate to equalize it.

Eldrazi is not that bad of a matchup if you pack enough answers to chalice and a blood moon or way to win before Eye of Ugin goes nuts.

One can dump the Doomsday and just run sac land tendrils but I like this better and you can just build towards DDFT little by little. LEDs should fall down in price, which might justify including Top, then fetches and duals, then brainstorm. But this version is quite resilient as is, the only glaring weakness compared to other versions being against LD. Wastelands will fuck you up.

At my shop we call those type of lists "4c Shitpile"

Deathrite does not justify having terrible mana.

I think sac-land dday is better than Sac-land tendrils. More flexible and doesn't fizzle

Does anyone here have a hard or soft lock on the Meta Game @ Squabbles (a store in Maryland)?

Tezzerator FTW.

Got a preferred list? I play mostly Metalworker decks but I hear Tezz decks also like to play Chalice. Shame you play Force so that shuts out Trinisphere though.

I've finally completed my charbelcher deck. I'm ready to wreck everybody's shit until someone gets a Force of Will in their opening hand.

I'm about half way done with my list, lucky my lgs allows proxies for legacy nights. Can't wait to ruin someone's night.

I know it isn't legacy, my friends play vintage.

I want to get in, but I need a weapon that surpasses metal gear-- err, I need a deck that reliably can defeat flash hulk as that is the primary deck in the meta. I also don't want to just fucking clone flash hulk.

The main problem is the guy has immense luck. Like he usually gets the combo out reliably to the degree I think cheating is involved.

I know of a few decks that I want to play, but I want to see what Veeky Forums recommends against flash hulk. I was going to try doomsday but dat turn 0 that shows up reliably worries me.

it does hit a lot but its also not a card that you really want to see more than one of in your hand. like, all game

so you run 1 at most and only a few decks can fit it in

>The main problem is the guy has immense luck. Like he usually gets the combo out reliably to the degree I think cheating is involved.
Make sure he's shuffling well. I've seen a lot of scrubs just pile all their cards up and only mash shuffle a few times then complain when they draw 6 lands in a row.
Other than that he's cheating, the T0 is ridiculously unlikely.
Also Flash is restricted, if you didn't know that.

I know it's restricted, but he either has cheats or god luck hacks. Basically I need to know what works against "The Unbeatable Flash Hulk Deck" if I want to even play in the group. I was thinking maybe something defensive like Oath of Druids, but I need to be able to counter turn 0 bullshit and friends potentially backing his ass.

I just wouldn't bother, they sound like shitty people

Sadly they are the only group I got with my work hours. I work 3pm -11 pm and have off wed and thurs. I want to get back into magic, but at FLGS, they usually only play modern, standard or EDH. The EDH groups are usually not as fun as they claim to be. My friends play in private but on a day that I work but a time that is somewhat feasible and they are the only ones who play vintage or legacy. I now have enough money where I can enter either format but nobody to play with.

So basically it's
>Find deck that is competitive with flash hulk
or
> play formats I am not entirely fond of, with strangers at an LGS

Have you tried MUD or The Deck?
MUD on the play shits almost all 0 turn decks
The Deck... is the deck

>I now have enough money where I can enter either format but nobody to play with.
You suffer of a problem, called the reserved list. sadly, you can't fix it

actually haven't done mud yet I can pull off that

The Deck, I have never heard of.

I am buying two lottery tickets. If I win, I will buy Wizards or Fix it. If not, eh- well it's a problem that I will just deal with.

I definitely wouldn't drop 5grand+ on a deck to only play with cheating scrubs who aren't even playing the actual format
Maybe just proxy up a stack of black lotus, ancestral recall, FoWs and some channels and banefires until they agree to play by the rules

My favrorite Tezzerator lists have solid 1 ofs such as ensnaring bridge, pithing needle, grafdiggers, and other. The lists I like to see played have a playset of the
Baleful Strix which helps can trip and stonewall annoying threats.

Gush Doomsday is a lot cheaper and more fun. Hell if I really wanted to piss them off I could talk to china man, if I heard correctly his cards now pass the bend test and feel test.

mtgsalvation.gamepedia.com/The_Deck

wew lad. I am on my way to making 100k next year but that shit is too rich for my ass. As much as I adore the concept of a deck that uses the entire power nine and has a legit kill condition that is still somewhat viable I would rather take them down with something cheaper.

What is good enough in legacy to take on horse shit like this? I always wanted to build manaless dredge.

Landstill is pretty good against A+B combo like Flash Hulk, and you don't need to buy that much power (really only need Recall to be competetive)

Fish

4x Cavern of Souls
4x Mutavault
4x Polluted Delta
4x Tropical Island
4x Island

4x Daze
4x Force of Will
4x Aether Vial
2x Chalice of the Void

4x Cursecatcher
4x Silvergil Adept
2x Phantasmal Image
4x Lord of Atlantis
4x Master of the Pearl Trident
4x Truename Nemesis
2x Merrow Rejery
2x Edric, Spymaster of Trest

Sideboard:
1x Pithing Needle
3x Submerge
2x Relic of Progenitus
2x Echoing Truth
2x Flusterstorm
1x Blue Elemental Blast
2x Kira, Great Glass Spinner
2x Hurkyl's recall

Haven't played a good legacy game in a while, but went 4/5 at my FLGS a while ago I really wish it were enough of a change to call it something like fish and chips

Meant won 4/5 tournaments at the FLGS, my bad

why don't more people play dredge since it shits on all kinds of things and has a fuckhuge favorable matchup against the retardation that is miracles?

I play a deck that runs 4 Trinisphere. Blow me.

Because the deck isn't all that good. The "fuckhuge" advantge it has over miracles is maybe 55%

How would a non-eldrazi MUD beatdown list do against Miracles? Something like this.

4 Kuldotha Forgemaster
4 Ancient Tomb
1 Blightsteel Colossus
4 City of Traitors
4 Metalworker
2 Sundering Titan
4 Trinisphere
1 Staff of Domination
4 Lodestone Golem
4 Wasteland
4 Grim Monolith
1 Karn Liberated
4 Cloudpost
4 Glimmerpost
1 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Platinum Emperion
1 Staff of Nin
4 Vesuva
1 Steel Hellkite
2 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Crucible of Worlds

Sideboard

2 Spine of Ish Sah
1 Trading Post
2 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Sphere of Resistance
1 All Is Dust
2 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Ratchet Bomb
1 Batterskull
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Steel Hellkite

Its generally favorable, try1-2 cavern

What am I going to need Cavern for?

Pushing creatures through force/Counterspell

Because any deck that wants to can guarantee a decent matchup by dedicating sideboard slots, and even a couple hate cards will ruin your day if you get unlucky.
Even miracles is barely positive because lol RIP
DRS is everywhere, too, and while it doesn't hurt dredge nearly as much as reanimator its still not a particularly hospitable environment

Basically its a bad deck to play in big tournaments because eventually you will run into someone who really doesn't want to lose to dredge or you just get unlucky and they draw their hate early enough every game, and its a bad deck in smaller metas because people will modify their sideboards to hate you specifically.

Haven't tried it, but I'd think you lose a decent chunk of your advantage when you can't run 4 caverns.

FoW and Counterspells. Ignoring Counterbalance is nice, but its really only 4/60 cards and they just side them out g2/3.
A cavern on Eldrazi can turn off another 6, which basically limits them to plows and terminus to deal with your threats, and not having counters to slow you down makes Terminus worse.

At least, that's my best guess. I don't play either deck.

How does the goblin charbelcher work in this deck?

I got too many creature variations to name for it and I can usually just Forgemaster out for stuff through counterspells when early disruption is laid through. Though i'll test it out.

>A cavern on Eldrazi can turn off another 6
>Eldrazi

But user, i'm playing a classic artifact MUD style. No Eldrazi to name here!

If I try Caverns then I should probably cut 1-2 Wasteland from the deck then.

Land tax

Cut 1 city or 1 vesuva maybe. Wasteland is too good to cut

Can't cut the Vesuva's or the City, they're what makes the crazy mana supply happens. I think i'll be safe cutting one or two Wasteland.

4 Ancient Tomb
1 Badlands
1 City of Traitors
2 Creeping Tar Pit
1 Darkwater Catacombs
2 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Swamp
2 Underground Sea
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland
4 Baleful Strix
2 Toxic Deluge
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Trinisphere
1 Engineered Explosives
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Dack Fayden
2 Dimir Signet
4 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Mox Diamond
1 Sword of the Meek
2 Talisman of Dominance
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
1 Thopter Foundry
1 Trading Post

1 Forcefield
2 Spellskite
1 Batterskull
1 Helm of Obedience
2 Kolaghan's Command
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Notion Thief
2 Pyroclasm
1 The Abyss

How does this Tezz list look? I found it on MTGTop8, but I'm concerned by the lack of Forces. It appears to be more focused on Thopter combo than anything.

Oh I see

>What deck are you playing
The new SnS hotness

>what is your list
4 Show and Tell
3 Griselbrand
3 Emrakul
3 Omniscience
3 Sneak Attack
3 Cunning Wish
1 Intuition
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
2 Preordain
1 Impulse
4 Force of Will
3 Spell Pierce
3 Lotus Petal
3 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Flooded Strand
3 Volcanic Island
3 Island
1 Mountain

Sideboard:
2 Kozilek's Return
2 Blood Moon
1 Boseiju
1 Defense Grid
1 Firemind's Foresight
1 Rushing River
1 Echoing Truth
1 Intuition
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Pyroblast
1 Flusterstorm
1 Release the Ants
1 Through the Breach

>want to see
decks without an abundance of Karakas and that don't play Daze

>don't want to see
Death and Taxes, Legend Miracles

>best deck
eh, probably Miracles

>next tournament
next Wednesday, hopefully. working in a game shop leaves me few opportunities to actually play

not samefag but anyway
The best environment for dredge is MTGO
Anyways, getting good at knowing your meta makes wonders of cabal therapy. for me Led dredge is super fun and i have gotten superlucky today with it (just a defeat today). but as you can jerk off on turn 1 (double led and double faithless looting) you can also get very bad hands.

Took Dragon Stompy out for a spin. Went 3-1

RUG Delver: 2-0. He thought I was on Grixis Delver. G1 I dropped a turn 1 blood moon, he had no basics and only 16 points of burn in his deck so that was a win. G2 he plays turn 1 Mongoose and forces my turn 1 Trinisphere, but can't counter my chalice and I ride a Prophetic Flamespeaker victory.

Belcher: 2-1. I win the die roll and mull to five. I drop a 3Ball and he scoops. G2 he makes 12 goblins t1 and I don't have double red for volcanic fallout. G3 Chalice 0 buys me two turns to find my 3sphere.

Merfolk: 0-2. He has basics. He has two drops. My deck does nothing.

Miracles: 2-0 He kept a 1 lander and expected to cantrip into more. Chalice 1 kept him honest, Rabblemaster quickly got there. G2 he kept a 7 with 3 mountains and a bunch of cantrips. He lead with a tundra into top, I drop a magus and he never hits colored mana.

I laughed like a maniac the whole time, this deck is too fun to play

>parfait

fuck yeah nigga. I got this shit foiled out and it is delish.

>What deck are you playing?
Imperial Taxes

>What is your list?
4 Æther Vial
1 Batterskull
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Phyrexian Revoker
3 Flickerwisp
3 Imperial Recruiter
1 Kor Skyfisher
2 Magus of the Moon
1 Mangara of Corondor
1 Mirran Crusader
4 Mother of Runes
1 Pia and Kiran Nalaar
3 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Cavern of Souls
2 Flooded Strand
3 Karakas
3 Plains
2 Plateau
4 Rishadan Port
4 Wasteland
2 Windswept Heath

SB: 2 Containment Priest
SB: 2 Council's Judgment
SB: 1 Cunning Sparkmage
SB: 2 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1 Fiendslayer Paladin
SB: 1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
SB: 1 Magus of the Moon
SB: 1 Manic Vandal
SB: 1 Mirran Crusader
SB: 2 Rest in Peace
SB: 1 Sword of Light and Shadow

>What do you want to see?
Fair decks + derp combo decks. Also anything with 1 or 2 basics.

>What do you want to avoid?
Burn, Oops all Dicks, TES. Basically glass-cannon combo decks.

>What is the best deck in the format?
Miracles, not close.

>When is your next tournament?
um.... sometime next week.

What's the best way to build Miracles?

Here's my list:

10 Fetches
3 Tundra
2 Volc
4 island
2 plains

3 Snapcaster
2 Mentor
2 Jace

4 Plow
4 Terminus

4 Force
2 Counterspell
4 Counterbalance

4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Top
2 Predict

So I've been playing Limited and Standard for about two years, and want to get into legacy/modern. The Thopters deck / Tezzerator looks interesting. How similar are the two decks in Modern and Legacy? Can I start out netdecking the Modern deck, gradually "upgrading" it to legacy, or are the decks miles apart in terms of deck lists?

The legacy version generally runs more like prison elements and has better fast mana. Being able to Chalice 1 on turn 1 is big in legacy. There is some overlap for sure.

Thoughts on Dragon Stompy vs Goblin Stompy?