Daddy issues Edition
What came first: the chicken or the Indomitus? Sub-edition
On the previous thread an Iron Warrior wanted reasons to stay loyal, we talked about the Primarchs' clothing and parenting style, there are whole divisions of beep boops, another Humbling™ happened. 30k rules for filthy xenos were requested, the Black Templars' snowflakeness confused this week's Designated Alpharius and I hope certain user did study for his calculus final. All of that plus much more in the last thread Red Book Links:
sys.Veeky Forums.org/derefer?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww2.zippyshare.com%2Fv%2Fs15Jqk1t%2Ffile.html
sys.Veeky Forums.org/derefer?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmega.nz%2F%23!Jx1UGCTI!vMJN89z7p8tiEC7YOAj477g6RxDtJ7culVLF3q3godg
HH Book 6 - Retribution PDF:
mediafire.com
sys.Veeky Forums.org/derefer?url=https%3A%2F%2Fkat.cr%2Fthe-horus-heresy-book-6-retribution-pdf-t12199249.html
HHG FAQ - pastebin.com
Official HH 7th Edition Errata (Updated January 2016) - forgeworld.co.uk
Other official downloads: forgeworld.co.uk
HH Rules:
Age of Darkness Army List: mediafire.com
Mechanicum Taghmata Army List: mega.nz
30k/40k Rules: mega.nz
30k/40k Rules and more (torrents): kat.cr
30k Black Library: mega.nz
Strawpoll links: strawpoll.me
www.strawpoll.me/10663447
Horus Heresy General /hhg/
Other urls found in this thread:
>We fell and we burned. Not just one, but all. These are the ashes we are left. The splinters of broken glass left of the window through which we watched humanity die. This is not our world, but they are not strong enough. Why? What was His plan? A crumbling ruin, a cruel joke. The blood in the veins is weak. But it is blood and it will bleed. It needs to bleed. To cleanse the infection. Purgation. Pain. Nothing is achieved without sacrifice.
>Was that His plan all along?
-Vulkan.
I am going to post parts from Vulkan's diary logs after the HH and during the Beast Crisis. I am sure some find it interesting.
>Peace is deception. It does not last. It cannot last. The enemy is always waiting. The fight is endless, relentless. A tide that rises. Even when it recedes it takes away. It erodes. Nagging, gnawing, grinding. Slowly, war after war, battle after battle, fight after fight, every grain dropping away, washed into nothingness. Peace is the breath between shouts. The inhalation before the gasp of pain or ecstasy. Why can we not forge peace? Forges make weapons. Only war, merciless and constant, is truth.
-Vulkan
I want a second legion whose primarch can run around without a 1000+ point investment, since i can never run Vulkan without either killing basically nothing at all, all game, or spending a ridiculous amount on a spartan and a firedrake deathstar worthy of the spartan's price. Is this possible with a non-Corax primarch?
>The overture has begun. A while remains until the main movement begins.
>Time is the enemy of peace, peace the enemy of sanity. I do not need to ponder, I have many lifetimes of sorrows to occupy me. Let us be at the matter and bring it to swift resolution.
>But it is not your place any more. That was the disaster. Even before the corruption, we were poor lords. No leader save He alone should be greater than his followers. He must value them more than they value him.
>Why did we not understand that before?
-Vulkan
>They must find their own way, so thinks the father. Mistakes teach us, experience moulds us. Who am I to deny them this? I learnt at the feet of two fathers, and still my mistakes were grievous. I trusted. I hoped. I dreamed.
>The dream became a nightmare.
>Let them find their own path, wayward and wandering. They do not need my dreams to guide them astray.
-Vulkan
>Heat Blast really that crappy?
Heat blast on deepstrike is crappy, sure, but you can't assault on turn 1 anyway so why not use it?
Heat blast while flying (while the payload is busy) could pen the unsuspecting predator.
>I dared what others could not. I knew what awaited me in the inferno and I stepped willingly into the flames. No other could. As above, so below, the fight without and the battle within. Endless torment, unending perseverance. Not one of my brothers could have done it, in body or in mind. It was my agony alone to suffer.
>For what? For maggots to erupt from the corpse of greatness, devouring blindly the very thing that sustains them, consuming all until is spent. The Imperium is a husk; even the rot has eaten itself.
-Vulkan
Morty can teleport and is a nightmare on ZM. Curze can run solo too, but doesn't need to.
>This again? It all resolves the same way, in blood and mayhem and the courageous or lucky surviving to another day.
>Can a legend not just stay dead?
-Vulkan
>Sometimes the dream returns. A fantasy. A phantasm. Just one more year. One more year before Davin. What might have been? What might we have accomplished? Another year before Ullanor, perhaps. Another year in the presence of the Emperor, another step closer to the victory He had seen.
>But it was false, even then. Do not tell me about falsehood. It lies in the hearts of all men and women, waiting to be nurtured by vanity and lies.
>But if mankind were not weak and broken, that would be even more dreadful.
-Vulkan
>And at the end we must face the fact that immortality is a greater burden than mortality. The long death, a slow diminishing of meaning. Why curse us with the knowledge, with the fate that we would outlive all that we built? Did He think to outfox entropy itself?
>Was it a pain that He had to share? Companions for eternity, empty totems raised up in memory of those lost in the mists of five hundred lifetimes.
>And now I am the one that stands alone and I can take no more of it. There is no healing the wounds of the soul.
-Vulkan
>We delude ourselves with promises of a better tomorrow. ‘If only…’ begins the mantra of the weak. We must strive without hope of cessation of effort. We must hold ourselves above ambition, seeking to excel but not to conquer. To build is a fleeting experience, while destruction is eternal. Build not for tomorrow but for today. Fight not for your future, but for the present. The past becomes meaningless in such consideration, but we cannot break free from its shackles.
>The universe knows what must happen but panders to whims that wish otherwise. Recognising inevitability is not fatalism. How I loathe this waiting.
-Vulkan
Curze. Jump packs on primarchs is stupidly strong.
Just buy him a minimum size unit of assault marines for a 600 point rape machine that moves 12" and is practically invulnerable on the first game turn.
>What is the point of an ork? What mishap of evolution or derangement of design would bring forth a creature entirely possessed of the need to conquer?
>What purpose can it serve beyond destruction? And in such state it can serve no other purpose but its own eventual destruction.
>Was that... Was there ever any future for us? Were we intended as nothing more than destroyers?
>And at the end I become what I must. A beast to face a beast.
-Vulkan
>Momentum. Direction. Ruthless aggression. These are the true weapons of the victorious. Hesitation is defeat.
>And we hesitated. When the guns of our brothers roared, shock laid the first blow. We were lax and they were not. The war lasted seven years, but the dream was destroyed in that first second. What was left worth fighting for after? Pride. Foolish pride.
-Vulkan
>Survival begets sacrifice. How long have You sat immobile, my Father? They speak in Your name and know nothing of Your mind. Is this what You wanted? I cannot countenance such a thing. It is a travesty of the Imperial Truth, the epitome of all that we wished to vanquish. Venal, selfish, corrupted. Did we not show the way brightly enough? Did our blood not wash the wounds clean?
>Why do You not speak out? Father, why have You forsaken me?
-Vulkan
>There was never an external threat to mankind that we could not overcome. The greatest foe always lies within. That is the only lesson to be learned. No matter how bleak times become, the power to prosper or fall is held in the breast of every man and woman. The chain is as strong as the weakest link, but mankind has the Emperor to bear the weight of all. And it was from within that the deadly blow was dealt. Deadly. A lingering death, fifteen hundred years of slow pain. How much longer until the corpse admits its demise? Longer than I can bear to witness any more.
>Forget the power of technology and science, for so much has been forgotten, never to be re-learned. Forget the promise of progress and understanding, for there is only war. There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods.
-Vulkan
The last quote is the most important. It shows that Vulkan was guy who said the most famous 40K quote. The very intro of the setting.
S what does he mean by all of this? For me it means that he gave up. Turned his back on the Emperor's dream and peace. He surrendered hope and embraced the dismal situation of the Imperium and the galaxy. Does that mean that Vulkan turned traitor, if not in action, in heart?
I forgot that Morty is a ninja. Morty teleporting always felt weird to me, but he's almost as tough as Vulkan and i like the DG playstyle from what i've seen. I'll go reread book 1. Night Haunter seems kinda underwhelming, but maybe his speed makes up for it. Can you do something similar with any other primarchs, or are they too slow? Ferrus Manus seems like he's functionally immortal, but anyone will just avoid him like the plague, and good luck catching anything
>Ferrus Manus seems like he's functionally immortal
i think vulkan and morty are both more durable than he is
Does 'Ignore Cover' nullifies NL's night fighting shenanigan?
anybody else here tempted to do World Eaters as a second legion after the recent buff and the rumors of a new plastic Kharn model coming out next month? Love the blue and white astronaut scheme.
Old Iron Hands has the same T7 3++ and also the -1 strength to all shooting, so unless its massed lascannons or demolishers, he's pretty durable, and barring another primarch, nothings gonna touch him in melee. Vulkans invincible against melta and plasma, and morty's better against poison, but overall Iron Hands seems insanely durable and has better melee than either. I only know Vulkan, so i might be wrong about Morty's resilience.
How playable is Corax at 2k/2.5k ?
probably easier than all of the other primarchs since hes better off without a deathstar
>primarch
>ZM
what kinda freaky ZM games are you playing?
>what kinda freaky ZM games are you playing?
Mortarion's hunting of loyalist DG remnants on the catacombs of Istvaan III
Just seems like a pretty weird way to play ZM, since at 1500 points i doubt i could kill Morty, and 1500+ ZM games are silly. Unless it was an 'escape the immortal wrecking ball' kinda game, seems hilariously unbalanced
>what kinda freaky ZM games are you playing?
The best kind
>Angron and small squads of red butchers wander through tunnels hunting down Solar Auxilia forces
>Good fucking luck Solar Auxilia
>Unless it was an 'escape the immortal wrecking ball' kinda game, seems hilariously unbalanced
Pretty much. I gave him the choice to either play regular ZM or the one where he must get to the other side to escape and he chose the last one.
He tried to use his dreads as bodyguards, but Morty's speed was good enough.
>Unless it was an 'escape the immortal wrecking ball' kinda game, seems hilariously unbalanced
That gave me an idea.
>Get 1500 points worth of Vorax
>Randomly spread them out over Zone Mortalis board
>Field 1500 points of a regular army with no walkers
>Have to get across the table alive
A group of space marines or something are lost in the bottom of a hive city, the mechanicum decided to say "fuck it" and release some vorax into the hive in the hopes of clearing them out.
Have 2k of vorax and 2 players each with 1.5k of LA, have the Vorax move according to a 2d6 table and attack anything in line of sight. Objective? kill your opponents warlord and bring yours to their home objective.
That's even better. Opponents don't have to be LA, could be Mechanicum or Imperial Army.
>Mechanicum civil war on planet
>Losing side flees into the Darkest catacombs
>Astartes pursue them
>Winning mechanicum just pours a bunch of vorax into the catacomb like scorpions and seals it off leaving their asartes allies trapped in with the Vorax too
>Scoria can be heard laughing in the distance
This is making me start to like Vorax. At first, all I liked were Thallaxii, Domitars, and Castellax. Now I also like Vorax.
Anyone know of some good, cheap generic "panicked civilian" models?
I want blobs of imperial citizens to use in narrative games
I'm a little bit out of the loop when it comes to 40k and 30k especially so bear with me:
What would you take as non-dedicated anti-air for Mechanicum?
NewNightLordRiteOfWarInventingGuy, is that you?
Decided to roll on the legion table from last thread
Legion Specialization
>Elite Core
>Psychic Prominence
>Hardy-Low Tech
>Champion Combatants
Battle Conditions
>Skirmish Conflicts
>Grand Battles
Minor Traits
>Consul
>Additional Special Unit
Special Units
>Veteran Tactical Squad
>Seeker Squad
>Heavy Support
Primarch's Homeworld
>Almost Alone
>Ruled by Monsters
Primarch's Struggles
>Statesmanship
>Defence of the Realm
>Crucial Technology
Primarch's Combat Specialization
>Psychic Power (Rolled Twice)
>Command Structure
Primarch's Weakness
>Resource Intensive
Seems special snowflake as fuck but lets see what I can do.
There are basically none. You'll find pewter civvies here and there, but they're almost all just going to be rigidly standing around OR kitted out with weapons.
Which is real fucking annoying for other games too.
I would literally kill for GW to make an imperial citizen/hive roalty kit
would be kitbash/bit heaven
Don't Thallax have an option that costs 35 points, makes the squad count as an HS option and if they don't move gain Interceptor and Skyfire?
You'd think some historical or skirmish game would have gotten a decent set of civilians out, at least.
But no one seems to care about the non-combatants. Which is a real shame, because THAT would be something I'd actually kickstart, instead of the softcore shit people spam on Veeky Forums.
Wait, so does that mean that the Strike Leader of my Seekers can't take a combi-weapon, simply because he's called a Legion Strike Leader and not a Legion Seeker Space Marine? Because if so, that's kinda horseshit and doesn't make sense.
guess that's one thing my headhunters have over seekers though, so that's something
No, they can take them. That argument was started for no reason and shouldn't have been brought up.
it depends on the exact wording
Wargear options are usually pretty straightforward in how you can allocate them. You just have to read the unit section carefully.
Why the hell would you need ten combi-weapons now that scorpio bolts or whatever are str 5, AP 2 shred?
I thought they could too, but as said, it depends on the wording. Pic related is the options for the Seeker squad in the new book, and the wording seems like the interpretation of the Strike Leader not getting a combi-weapon is correct. I guess I'll just give him a plasma pistol instead? Maybe? I dunno.
Because Scorpius rounds are Heavy, and I'd like the option to have them move and still put out AP2, even if it's just once a game. Plasma would also be better when I have Alpharius in the list, and it also means they can put the hurt on lighter vehicles. It's probably too many points that can be spent on other things, but since I'm going to be using my combi-plas equipped Headhunters as Seekers for the time being, I might as well be playing them WYSIWIG.
What's with this Salamanders faggot
Heck if I know.
All I want is a burger because I'm hungry again because I keep staying up all night on here and /pol/.
Some Canadian was pretending to be a semi-famous Canadian schizo that sometimes posts on /x/, apparently. Chris needs to take his medicine.
It's 25 points and does not grant Interceptor. Everything else about your post is correct.
Morty isn't that tough, hes got the poison resistance, 2+/4++ T7 and rerolls IWND
His real boon comes from the fact that hes pretty cheap, can do his teleport behind you move, carries a weapon with ID that can belt out a lot of attacks, and once hes already among your dudes can start hucking phosphex bombs around (since he has an unlimited supply and double range)
and he gives the entire army stubborn, so DG basically don't even play the morale game if you give your squads Vexillas, though that poison frag missiles thing is kind of wank
He's only 4++? I was assuming he was in the ferrus/vulkan T7 3++ crew. I'm considering DG, but i'm reading through the Edgelords first, and Curze's Fear rules sound like they'd be great fun, and about as opposed to the Sallies as you can get. Also a BaC and some upgrades basically gives me a good start for a Terror Assault
Do it.
His armour's a little rusty, and he's not the most mechanically inclined guy around, so only 4++
What's wrong with poison frags?
Primaris-Lightning can double as anti-air in a pinch, although it's definitely better for blowing up large heavy armour.
3 Terror Squads with meltabombs, a Contemptor, a Chaplain and a praetor in a termie command squad actually works better than any other BaC-only army i've ever seen. Add Curze and possibly drop the termies to add some Raptors and i have a seriously effective force for the cost of BaC+Night Haunter, which is a great model. Maybe grab Sevetar while i'm at it, although he seems seriously lackluster for a dude who can supposedly match Siggy when he plays dirty.
Anything that has a high enough toughness to warrant needing poison to take them down could probably be done better with the krak missiles, which also have better AP
If poison worked on shooting the same way it did in CC, you can reroll to wound if str>=Toughness then they would be really amazing at shredding light targets, but as it stands it only makes them slightly better at taking no hard targets, and still not as good as kraks
I tried Alclad paints before, honestly they are such a pain to deal with.
But you made me remember that the AK xtreme metals are about the same, and are much more forgiving in terms of priming.
What about something... like this? The brass?
Also I guess I can try doing the strips in a matte paint, I've got time to kill until i get the bases and can start posing/assembling the robbits.
At least he has 7 Wounds, not that it's as good as a 3++.
You might be able to get that color with a gold and then darkening it down with Earthshade or Nuln Oil.
Phosphex Rapier Batteries with a couple leviathans and some contemptors.
How does that sound for Death Guard?
Add a tiny bit of some darker green to a bright gold paint.
Thanks, Al.
Run PotL/Primarchs Chosen and use 5-man Deathshroud for troops
Just on foot? Spartans are points heavy.
For the green strips?
And I hope I'm not shitting up the thread with my incessant paint questions.
Primarch's Chosen doesn't have the Elites choice Legion-specific Terminators clause; it's only Vets and plain Terminator squads, even though having the PotL clause would make a lot of sense.
You can jam 5 man squads in Land Raiders, you know. They even got a points cost reduction, though probably not enough to make them viable.
No, for the brassy metal.
No worries man, it's better than the endless Scoria and chainaxe derails.
I was thinking The Reaping would be better. Move through cover would let me skip over the dangerous terrain. Gonna be a lot of small markers strewn about with 2-3 Quad launcher batteries spewing phosphex.
I found something that shows the kind of finish I was thinking of. The exterior of these tubes is the kind of weathered appearance that old brass has, the interior is what it would look like where it gets freshly damaged.
Oh that's a good example. I'll pick up brass and pale brass tonight and see how it goes.
I'm pretty sure a slathering of enamel brown wash, carefully removed with a brush, will make that exact same brown mottling.
Getting that new generator I mentioned in the last thread up. I have a Reigned By table and here's what I got.
>A Tyrant
>A bloody handed taskmaster
>A Patriarch
>A Matriarch
>A daemon in human flesh
>A Volunteer
Are these good or not?
You can fire Heavy weapons while moving, you just hit on 6's. Shame they can't get combi-bolters, TL would help with that.
What's the generator for?
Hey, I recognize my own armless shrugging assault marine! Good to know someone saved it, I guess. The whole squad has arms now, sweet sweet chainaxes and bolt pistols.
How do you actually pronounce automata? Is it aw-TOM-uh-ta, or aw-toe-MAY-ta? Neither one really sounds right
Imperial Militia and Warp Cults.
post your blackshield conversions
I mean, yeah, you can, but to me it kinda feels like you're not doing anything worthwhile snapshooting Heavy weapons. I dunno, it might just be that I'm bad at this game?
Of course, but in a pinch you can snap fire.
Forge World would make a pretty penny from faction-specific bitz sets.
The quotes are interesting but could you maybe post the epub of the beast must die?
Personally, somewhere between aw-tuh-muh-ta, like your first one, and ORE-tuh-muh-Ta - I'd say I put more stress on the "aw" than the "tom".
Been looking at various rules for non-ruled tanks like the macharius or the baneblade variants, I'm at a bit of a loss: the LAADA book, which I think is the newest, lists variants specifically, while the Tagmahta retains the same text as in book 2 which applied to the legions "if there's no specific Heresy-era rules, you can use it".
Seems a weird thing for them to go back on for the marines, but am I right in thinking that the LAADA is the most up to date list? Or was there something at the open day?
The reason why I'm most confused is pic related, which I've seen but without source - it's not the one from book 2, which has tank behind it.
Also I've heard there may be more superheavies in one of the red books, but I have no idea who for
As opposed to what they're doing now with faction-specific helmets, faction-specific weapons, faction-specific shoulderpads, faction-specific chestpieces, faction-specific rhino doors, faction-specific etc. etc.?
Not enough.
>Traitor
Nigga no.
Just mzans that, weirdly enough, seeing so much potential wasted, going to shit, and being able to do nothing but litteraly die trying to make everything you rver stood for live just a bit longer can have some detrimental effects on your overall happiness.
Did you expect him to say everything's fine in the best of the world?
Sorry, I can't get behind Vulkan.
His mind shattered too easily. Demi-god status and he loses his mind after a few meaningless deaths.
Vulkan sure went emo.
>Got a big batch of legion stuff at Christmas
>Only painted 4 marines so far
>Just bought 40 more tacticals and 3 contemptors
Holy fuck send help.
Wouldn't you go emo if Kyme had a monolopy on your legion?
>Buy two Calth Boxes 3 months ago
>Have only completely finished 10 marines
On the bright side, FW bumped my New Legion/Army list books to express shipping for free
Paint one marine a day. Steady progress with no exhaustion.
What is the best super heavy for 3k games?
Falchion? Malcador spam?
It will only get worse.
Well, the Warhound Titan is 750 points...
Best, or most fun? Because I doubt the answer is the same.
You can spam the Malcador Infernus (with Chem Munitions) in an SA primary detachment at any points level but I doubt anyone is going to have any fun in that game. Bonus Lawful Evil points for putting an Auxilia Tank Commander in to give it Preferred Enemy.
Is 3 phosphex bombs really worth it on a destroyer squad sergeant? I feel like they're not going to live long after the first one has been thrown, yet I see people often advocate for 3.
Fuck no, you'd be lucky to get one of them off.
That's a sweet paintjob, yours?
How did you paint that handprint on the faceplate? I wanna do something similar for my WS.
I say this every time you post them, but damn your marines look nice
Yes.
I just painted it with the GW blood paint and a small brush. Thanks for the kind words.
Was anything wrong with the original Kharn model?
What painting technique do you use? Edge, drybrushing, airbrushing?
No, the FW one is great. But I like GW's plastic kits for mostly nostalgic and financial reasons.