Horus Heresy General /hhg/

Raiders of The Pyrix Extasis Edition
BL doesn't want you fapping to Horus and Fulgrim slash fiction Sub-Edition
Forge World you really need to fix the IWfag problems I hope you nigmos know that. Where do I start with the thread though? Oh wait. We had an IWfag gone full metal Iron Warrior, an ALfag needed advice, the faults and pros of Space Marine(the vidya game) of all things became a topic, one user wanted to know if he'd upset anyone using 40k Rhinos, we learned some real life facts about bears, bears are faster than you, bears are going to chase you down and then maul you, the poison huffers and the diet IFs got into a fight, Dark Steel Rain inbound plus much more in the last thread
Red Book Links:
sys.Veeky Forums.org/derefer?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww2.zippyshare.com%2Fv%2Fs15Jqk1t%2Ffile.html
sys.Veeky Forums.org/derefer?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmega.nz%2F%23!Jx1UGCTI!vMJN89z7p8tiEC7YOAj477g6RxDtJ7culVLF3q3godg
HH Book 6 - Retribution PDF:
mediafire.com/download/8aqx9j3a8erqv8d/The_Horus_Heresy_Book_6_-_Retribution.pdf or
sys.Veeky Forums.org/derefer?url=https%3A%2F%2Fkat.cr%2Fthe-horus-heresy-book-6-retribution-pdf-t12199249.html
HHG FAQ - pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8
Official HH 7th Edition Errata (Updated January 2016) - forgeworld.co.uk/resources/fw_site/fw_pdfs/Horus_Heresy/Horus_Heresy_7th_Edition.pdf
Other official downloads: forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads#horusheresy
HH Rules:
Age of Darkness Army List: mediafire.com/download/f0c2pnieoijyrqk/Legiones Astartes Age of Darkness Army List.pdf
Mechanicum Taghmata Army List: mega.nz/#!LFwTjQ7B!mF0eVOY8P1MPT0a-QSXypXo_ZfskhYynD41PrkaTbD8
30k/40k Rules: mega.nz/#F!pFgm0RKR!J06C1gVYcjzNGsF8YNLsjQ!EVh0GZZS
30k/40k Rules and more (torrents): kat.cr/usearch/"Forge World" heresy user:epistolary/
30k Black Library: mega.nz/#F!0RlxDZQC!qAu9BaubWa3KeihJRmOcsg
Strawpoll links: strawpoll.me/10558764
www.strawpoll.me/10663447

>I never get to be "first for"

...

3rd for the third

>Raiders of the Pyrix Extasis
I want the Deathwing to be a WS5 BS5 Termie squad with volkite and plasma cannons, why must they be a RoW?
And why must the DA get grav land raiders but the Custodes can't get grav Rhinos?
Your top(knot)boi said they were for pussies. That he would invent some cab defilotron-somethings.
Didn't pay much attention, I was busy killing an entire sector with only chainaxes.

Still no new Crusade book yet?

"First" is cancer

tripfags are cancer

Fuck off virt/newvirt

>And why must the DA get grav land raiders but the Custodes can't get grav Rhinos?
Because FW wanted to give them something more unique I think.
>Your top(knot)boi said they were for pussies. That he would invent some cab defilotron-somethings.
>Didn't pay much attention, I was busy killing an entire sector with only chainaxe
Alright you made me laugh.

t h e y . h a v e . t o
The AL can't suffer so.
Sniper vets make Headhunters utterly useless.
Seekers make Banestrike even more useless than before -- never thought that would be possibe.
The AL are neither the IW nor Mortarion to get shafted this way. Jesus, FW, when will this madness stop?!

How do you guys use Seekers, in a Legion w/o Infiltrate?

the IW dont even get shafted, they have the best RoW in the game.

they even got their own unique legion robot models

use generic units, you goof

>but I bought the headhunter models
And they make kickas veterans/seekers, which do not have models.

>the best RoW
Ironfire is barely better than any other artillery spam list, 2bh famalam. The slight accuracy buff isn't that great, its the piles of artillery you use with it that are good

nah its pretty disgusting. artillery lists are already broken and all it does it crank them up to 11

Why is Griffith wearing pink armour?

>The slight accuracy buff isn't that great, its the piles of artillery you use with it that are good
Pretty much. Some of the Ironfire lists I've seen would crumble when faced with one or two flyers, or at least 3 deepstriking units.
Firelines crumble when the enemy teleports.

>IW gunlines without iron havocs with flakk missiles and interceptor
must be some retarded IW players

Why yes, not everybody survived the decimation with their mind intect.
Speaking of which, would dual Aiolos Doritos be sufficient anti-air?

assuming you are playing 2.5-3k, yes. it might even be overkill

>must be some retarded IW players
So every Iron Warriors player? On the bright side when someone brings phosphex spamming iron fire I no longer feel bad about bringing three lightnings and three fire raptors. With the new Lord of War rules I may pick up three avengers for more brrrt.

>>IW gunlines without iron havocs with flakk missiles and interceptor
>must be some retarded IW players
What if I give my Havocs HBolters amd/or Lascannons simply because I like how they look?

>Flakk missiles
>not retarded

Pick one

If people cared about overkill then nobody would even think about riding the Ironfire. The only thing flying on my tabletop will be missiles and shells, not aircraft...
>I no longer feel bad about bringing three lightnings and three fire raptors. With the new Lord of War rules I may pick up three avengers for more brrrt.
See? Dual Doritos are not enough!
>What if I give my Havocs HBolters amd/or Lascannons simply because I like how they look?
Properly modeled they would be commendable, yet retarded I'm afraid :^/

>tank hunting flakk missiles with interceptor
>retarded
found the retarded IW player
yeah my next legion is going to be orbital assault, i expect ironfaggot asspain

>yeah my next legion is going to be orbital assault, i expect ironfaggot asspain
Golg's Orbital assault?

No need to worry about me them, mate. I don't like phosphex myself, and would rather large infantry blobs + dreads with quads for the ironfire.

>Properly modeled they would be commendable, yet retarded I'm afraid :^/
Ah well. BS5 Tank Hunters with Lascannons still sounds awesome. And Pinning Tank Hunters HBolters look and sound cool, might be able to kill some lighter vehicles with them.

I just want some official models for the Iron Havocs, I don't really care about Tyrants, even if I am bitter that Fulmentarii are coming out before them.

I hope you run a Damocles Command Rhino in that list. It's so fucking good in 30k and even super reserve heavy armies don't seem to run them, it boggles my mind.

nah, smurfs with vent anus and girlyman. tank hunting veteran squads with meltabombs and 40x combi plasmas that are s8 against vehicles.

troops will be terminators. itll be disgusting

>And Pinning Tank Hunters HBolters look and sound cool, might be able to kill some lighter vehicles with them.
Meh. If you want pinning you could do better by bringing several pinning units rather than a single unit with a lot of pinning weapons, as it will only cause a single pinning test at best.
Against Ld9 base.
If they're vulnerable to pinning to begin with, or don't roll 3 die for morale, or reroll it, or aren't even affected because they're in a transport...you get my point, don't you.
>I just want some official models for the Iron Havocs, I don't really care about Tyrants, even if I am bitter that Fulmentarii are coming out before them.
My iron is with you, brother.

I went for silver vents for my DG.

>See? Dual Doritos are not enough!
If my opponent brings a reasonable list I generally take two lightnings with autocannons or two fire raptors if I take any flyers at all. But spam lists are almost impossible to counter without list tailoring, that's exactly what makes them bullshit.
>Good luck killing 9 flyers
>Good luck dealing with 12 quad mortars with phosphex shells
>Good luck having fun against my armoured breakthrough with 7 predators, 5 sicarans, and 3 sicaran venators

>Meh
I know. But at least I'll always have my dreams and bitterness with me.

>My iron is with you, brother.
Bitter within! Bitter without!

Ive got an idea for my Armies on Parade board

>2 levels

>Upper level is all my EC troops in rank and file, watching Fulgrim up on a small stage giving a speech, flanked by my other EC HQ models
>Marble paneled deck, big EC emblem

>Lower level is stowage. Spartan Tank, rhinos and Fire Raptor, secured to the deck with chains
>Techmarine and human crew inspecting the vehicles
>Behind one of the vehicles ill have several Headhunters being sneaky
>Lower level will be lit with LEDs

I have the urge to paint an IW or Mechanicum unit all rusted up, or like a old bronze statue, sort of like the one in Duncan's video where he shows off how to use Nihilakh Oxide.

Could wave it off as early Nurgle corruption or simply using the armor until it can't be used anymore. Or both.

I don't even care about Nurgle, but a lot of ideas that I think sound fun could be under his domain, lore-wise. Of course, I don't think he has any beef with Khorne, so it's all good, I suppose?

Well, Nurgle did get off from Vraks, and that thing was a huge siege, right?

>huge siege
Hnng!

Eh, really my problem with Nurgle is the whole disease and rotting flesh look. Just don't like how they look. But I could reliably justify rust-marines and such as something he'd be all for. Plus it sounds cool.

Not sure how I'd make paint them though. Don't want to go super rusty, but I don't want to make them look like they're just dirty.

What's the best
> non Legion-specific RoW
> Legion-specific RoW
?

It looks like fulgrim's teaching a martial arts class there. Or doing zumba. Yeah, it's probably zumba, that's the sort of thing the EC might go for.

I think Iron Warriors would look cooler with blue lenses.

Chosen duty is pretty boss
>Best troop unlocks
>Basically no downsides
>Can still take allies

sure you cant take a praetor, but hey, thats fins for my sniper-super force of Alphas

Orbital assault is pretty neat now that it lets you deep strike entire dreadnought talons

>can't take terminators or legion-specific terminators as troops like PotL can
>your 2-wound wimp of a warlord is effectively worth 3 victory points (slay the warlord, extra point from the RoW and denying your extra point from the RoW)

It's shit, bro. Just take a delegatus with PotL if you insist on having a cheapass warlord.

>implying i take terminators
Vet tacticles are fucking ace. The warlord thing can be an issue, but just parking him out of sight in a dev/sniper squad works. 2+/5++ is also generally good enough to keep him safe.

and hey, who dosent want a free MC combi plasma

>Vet tacticles are fucking ace.
vet tacticals are great

until an earthshaker or battle cannon is on the field

>not using cover
I mean sure, its not perfect, but this is a game of war.

out of eight people in the local 30k area, there are five typhons and four medusae that regularly see play. i field both

What a cancerous meta, I'd hate to be part of a group where I can't field half the roster because it'll get obliterated in one turn

we often play ZM these days because no-one wants to not bring their overly expensive resin

Does any1 have CRUSADE IMPERIALIS: ARMY LISTS pdf?

So are Word Bearer Chapters 1000 strong or 10,000?

>Word Bearers
>6.66 MB JPG
>666
Begone, Daemon!

Anyways, chapters were 1,000. There were a lot of chapters.

According to book 2 chapters were between 500 and 3000 marines, there were at least 9 chapters within the legion.
So they would have had at least 4500 to 27000 marines available.
That's assuming the information given in book 2 is complete, it may not be.

They were a pretty large legion, perhaps not as huge the Ultramarines, but very few legions were.

>information

Also according to book 2, Girly Man and Daddy Bob destroyed a perfectly compliant jewel of an Imperial city so panicked neighbors would let Lorgar know the Glimmer Twins were in town and wanted a chat. This level of OTT grimderp just makes the retcon that Legions were ALWAYS composed of chapters (you just didn't "know" it before) seem equally derpy. To paraphrase Alan Merritt, "It's all canon and it's all bullshit." tl;dr:

Chapters are 1000-strong, but WB are a Legion - and Legions are always exactly as populous as the plot demands.

-3 guns (out of 5 in the rules), all different.
-Same cast used for Myrmidon Secutor bodies.

FW please.

Yep, that's exactly what I'm on about. I want to feel that trans-human shock in a space marine game.

Holy edgelord, batman! I would ask for you to provide actual evidence to prove your point, but someone this hostile probably couldn't provide that.

When did I ever say I don't want Space Marines to appear heavy? Dear god, how can you read a series of posts saying "I felt like the marines from Space Marine felt weightless" as meaning "I don't think space marines should feel weighty"? That... I didn't think that sort of thing happened in these threads.
>You like how they got speed, but you don't like how easily they move.
Yes. This is not a contradiction. Look at the great bear webm from the last thread which I'll repost. Look at the heft. Compare it to footage of much lighter animals moving at the same speed, and note the difference in the way they move. The Shadow of the Colossus links I provided last thread are more great examples.

You talk about Gears of War feeling "disconnected", which I find utterly baffling. The way the marines felt in that game is too slow for Astartes, but the sense of weight is perfect. Every impact feels justified. It's only the larger creatures in the series that let the side down. In any case, I think it's fine for you find Space Marine satisfying. I just wouldn't be happy for another game like it, because I didn't feel like a marine playing it.

You hit on a really important point about noise here. Audio is everything in making an aesthetic experience work. There are videos talking about the effort Pixar puts into getting each shoe fall to sound right for each character, and even little things like the animation Dante uses for his guns in DMC requires a lot of little sounds and visual effects, all well-timed to give that satisfying result. This is just my taste, but to me a 40K game isn't worth it without that degree of effort. 40K is about the sheer woodgrain quality of its components.

How did you paint your black?

Finished my DG test model.

I don't get what you're complaining about. It's a shame not all weapons have models, but Secutors and Destructors are literally only differentiated by the weight of their weaponry.

What's the gun?

the rear end of a lascutter

70/30 black/kantor blue highlighted with eshin grey + thunderhawk blue

Cool, I was more interested in how you're using it ingame but then I didn't specify that. Feels like it should be a grenade launcher.

It's an archaeotech pistol

Thanks.

Which primarchs truly loved their sons?

>provide actual evidence

There . You were asked to explain what the "right" way would be and all you could do is deflect it with bullshit.

>inb4 more deflections and bullshit

>When did I ever say I don't want Space Marines to appear heavy?

Never. You specifically want them to be heavy and behave like a big bull, rather than moving with unnatural agility for something so big and heavy like it's described in the fluff. Some people don't want Marines to be the big dumb enemy you defeat by dodging their charge and let them ram into a wall.

>You talk about Gears of War feeling "disconnected", which I find utterly baffling.

Welcome to my world listening to Space Marine lacking in feel. I played though GoW purely because I don't leave games unfinished, but it was not a fun experience. It felt nothing but a series of hot-spots you moved in between of. Even close combat was you activating the chainsaw and then waiting for the enemy to be at the correct close combat position for the cutscene to trigger. If they weren't, then the saw did fuck all.

I have no idea how people found that game entertaining.

Noice.

You link someone asking what the "correct" space marine action game is, when the question you claimed was asked is "what game does weight well". These are completely and obviously different questions. I had well-clarified that what I found dissatisfying about Space Marine was the execution and not the concept, so not only did that question miss the point, but your linking it misses the point further.

At this point I could continue to argue with you, but I have two strong incentives not to do so. First is that you're a little edgelord that thinks using naughty words makes you a good arguer. The second, following from that, is that I have already won by virtue of not spouting ad-hom. Third, I'd be just repeating myself. Yet again you claim I want marines to move without agility, and I am completely done with providing evidence to the contrary that is ignored. You bring up a bunch of irrelevant minutae about the combat mechanics of Gears of War, entirely irrelevant to a debate about aesthetics and the feel of a game and nothing else. I'm not even going to defend Gears of War's mechanics, because they aren't anything spectacularly, but the game felt great. There are games I play for the joy of the mechanics and there are games I play for the crunchy, oozing fun of its feel. Space Marine failed at both for me. All I've tried to do is share with you why, which is apparently verboten.

*three strong incentives, the list grew mid-typing. My bad.

If you complain about the representation of space marines in the space marine game and someone asks you examples of how a "correct" space marine game should be, it takes some pedantic bullshit to dismiss it as "not asking it properly."

End of the day, you have no idea what you want or have no idea how to convey it. You bring up examples and then dismiss whatever people draw from those examples. You demand Space Marine to adhere to your feels while dismissing anyone else's feels as being wrong and not as refined as your feels. You even dismiss my dislike of GoW as petty gripes about minute details, but Space Marine is not a good game because it doesn't feel right to you.

How about next time just don't say anything and save us all a ton of trouble?

Realize I post the list alot, but figured I should post it in a Battle Report. Had to proxy the Dread, Drop Pod and Xiphon, but like this list so far.

Word Bearers 2500
HQ-330
175: Zardu Layak
155: Legion Centurion-Chaplain, Artificer Armour, Retractor Field, Jump Pack, Burning Lore

ELITES-755
120: Apothecary x2, one has an Augury Scanner x1, one has a Jump Pack and Power Sword
395: Gal Vorbak x10 (+5), Power Mace 1x, Power Axe x1, Martyr with Artificer Armour and Power Fist
180: Contemptor-Mortis Dreadnought, two Kheres Pattern Assault Cannon
60: Legion Rapier Weapons Battery x1, Quad Mortar x1 (Frag Shells)

TROOPS-598
235: Legion Tactical Squad 20x (+10), Sergeant with Power Axe
363: Legion Assault Squad 20x (+10), 4x Power Weapon, Sergeant with Power Fist and Combat Shield

FAST ATTACK-220
220: Xiphon Pattern Interceptor, Ground Tracking Auguries, Chaff Launchers

HEAVY SUPPORT-595
205: Legion Sicaran Battle Tank, Sponson Lascannons
155: Legion Artillery - Medusa
235: Kharybdis Assault Claw

Only thing don't like is Assault Squad Serg lacking AA, had to do that for Pts sadly as wanted the Quad Mortar.

He played EC and had:
Eidolon
Primus Medicae in Termi Armour
5x Palatine Blades with Jump Packs, Sonic Shriekers and 3 Spears
5 Phoenix Guard in a Spartan
2 Contemptors, 1 w/ 2 Kheres, 1 w/ Lascannon and Grav Fist
20 Tacticals, Serg with Spear (?)
10 Assault Marines
10 Assault Marines
3 Jetbikes, 1 had MM
1 Fire Raptor
1 Vindicator
Maybe something else? Like me, proxied a bit.

Can you give a orator a jump pack? Would a bunch of assault Marines and tacticals in rhinos, supported by a fire raptor or two be fluffy for Heresy era Blood Angels?

>praetor

Stupid fucking phone.

I was trying to work out if it was a special word bearers thing or something.

I get Turn 1.
Hes deployed pretty spread out, so my Medusa and Quad Mortar won't have as much effect as I'd like. I Drop Pod Assault my Kharybdis over his Tactical Squad in the corner, burning 2 in the process. Assault Squad moves up, same with Sicaran for better view of battlefield. Tactical moved ahead 3" due to Difficult Terrain.
Zardu summons 10 Horrors. Quad Mortar kills 2 Assault Marines, Contemptor kills takes off 1HP from VIndi, Medusa scatters and kills nothing, while Sicaran manages to glance his Spartan 1x.
His T1 involves moving Eidolon and Palatine Blades close to my Drop Pod, moving his Spartan ahead at full speed, 1 Assault Squad moving 12" then running 5" into cover, 20 Tacticals in back moving about and Vindi + Dickbikes moving forward. His Vindi kills 4 Assault Marines, Jetbike MM pens my Dread but I pass my 5++ (hew!). Lascannon Contemptor takes a HP off my Medusa and Immobilizes it.

My T2
Kharybdis unleashes my Gal Vorbak right near the Tactical and Eidolon. My Assault Squad while close, is just out of charge range. My Mortis Contemptor decides to stay still as I expect his Fire Raptor will come in next turn. My Sicaran goes full fury on his Spartan, where I take off 2 more HP due to glances. My Xiphon fails to come in. Medusa kills 6 in his Tactical. Zardu fails to summon anything, but ok with that. Quad Gunn kills 1 Dickbike. My Gal Vorbak declare a charge vs Eidolon and Co, Martyr issuing a challenge. Let me say this, 10 of these guys NUTS. He screams and takes off 1W via rending. while I rend the Palatine Blades to death (Rage on them is nuts), the best part of the combat was the Challenge. Eidolon hits with 3, wounds on 3, and I take 2 TH wounds, he thinks thats enough, but no, T5 and 3W saves my butt. I then SMASH his PRETTY FACE with 3 S10 Power Fist attacks and down he goes! He was not expecting that at all.

See next post

Okay, so we know what Iron Warriors drink, obviously they drink bitter, and Space Wolves have their Mjod aka Fenrisian Ale, but what do the other legions drink?

What was the point of this legion?

Alpha Legion : something potent but mysterious?

EC Turn 2
His Fire Raptor comes in, Spartan moves forward to my side and unleashes the Phoenix Guard in front of Zardus Tactical squad. His Contemptor positions back to where the Gal Vorbak are now just chilling in the open post-combat. Lascannon Contemptor moves up too, his Assault Squad gets ready to charge mine. His Vindicator takes out 5 of my Assault Squad. This was to epic for me, as his Fire Raptor lands on the table, I declare Interceptor vs it with my Mortis. 12 S6 Rending shots go his way. He doesn't think much of it and doesn't Jink thinking 4HP and AV12 will help, woe is him! I snag 3 Pens via rending, and 1 leads to an Explode cause of AP2. BOOM! His 2 Kheres Contemptor unleashes a volley into my Gal Vorbak, doing 3 wounds as I pass 2x 5++ Invuls. Jetbikes make way close, and i think they missed, not really sure. His Phoenix Guard charge Zardu, Assault Squad charges my Assault Squad, and his Tactical and other Assault Squad charge my Gal Vorbak. While great on Offense, strange having them get charged as Rage really makes the unit. His Assault Squad Serg offers a challenge, I accept. He hits with all, but fails to get pass my T5 and then I Fist his face. I focus mostly on the Assault Squad, taking down all but 2, and killing 4 tacticals, while going down to 3+Martyr. Assault vs Assault leads to me barely winning by 2 but he sticks around off a Ld test of 3. His Phoenix Guard lose 1 to overwatch and Zardus Flamer does a W but his Apoth stops it. Zardu gets in a Challenge, takes a W, but his Azurda Char'is doesn't do anything. I lose 9 models and get run down :(

WB Turn 3
My Xiphon comes in, my Kharybdis i forgot about (d'oh). My Medusa aims forward and kills the Jetbikes (with him failing all his Jink saves). My Contemptor fires at his Vindi, taking off 1HP and Stunning it. My Xiphon straffing runs his Spartan, doing 1HP and taking it down to 1. My Sicaran fires at his Las Contemptor, taking it down to 1HP.

See next post

What color scheme did you use for the white?

Vulkan
Dorn
Magnus sort of
Sanguinius

Horus and Lorgar too
Morty maybe?

I keep hearing that retconned undivided daemon prince. If that's the case then what happens to daemon prince Lorgar and Pert?

Continuing WB T3
My Horrors summon 10 more horrors and thats basically it outside of combat. My Chaplain gets lucky and deals a W to his Serg while taking 1 in return. My Gal Vorbak continue to get bogged down, where I kill all but 1 from each squad, and go down to a 1W Martyr and 1W dude.

EC Turn3
He doesn't have much remaining, but decides to charge his Phoenix Guard at the newly summoned Horrors. His 2kheres Contemptor shoots at my Sicaran, taking it down to 1HP and stunning it. His Spartan finishes off my Medusa.
Assaults have my Gal Vorbak kill the remaining Tactical and Assault Squad (easily), and his Phoenix Guard kill my new Horrors. The Assault Marine combat we realize I forgot about Fear on the Chaplain originally, oh well. Combat is drawn where we are both mostly gone.

WB Turn 4
My Gal Vobrak move to his Contemptor, while my Contemptor puts 2 Wounds on his Phoenix Guard. My Xiphon does the last HP to his Spartan. At this point, he calls it.

Victory for the WB!

I like the Quad Mortar in here alot, super simple.
Zardus Tactical is pretty worthless, maybe drop down to 10 and lose the Apothacary? As they really are only there to babysit him. Biomancy on the Chaplain is great, not gonna lie. All start was my 10 Gal Vorbak, but if they don't charge, you really feel it. Xiphon is cool, but not sure if its worth it, as I feel it was ok only because he lacked real AA, and even then, its not great at taking down Spartans (other stuff dies easily). Medusa I adore, even if it wasn't as effective this game. I like the 2 Kheres Mortis Contemptor, but another Sicaran is likely better; shame I lack a 4th HS spot. Killing Eidolon early really helped alot. Fun game overall.

Thoughts on battle or improvements to my WB?

Ferrus did, in the tough love sort of way

Pert is nurgle

What bothers me is that so many other Legion choices are uselessly mediocre - WE Caedre weapons for example - that seem to remain such without any changes across the books. I don't think Headhunters are gonna get buffed, and even then, it's only fair they don't.

Don't open cans of worms. Seriously.

But they are yummy and so juicy.