Do you play unhinged cards in EDH? Why or why not?

Most B.S. Game wipe coming through.

What doesn't work about it?

There currently aren't rules for cards being in multiple zones at once. So we don't know what happens if you have YAAV out with a land on top of your library, then use Courser of Kruphix to play the top card of your library. First of all, would it even be allowed to put a card into a zone it's already in? Secondly, does it count as entering the battlefield since it was already on the battlefield?

Our group agreed to test this card a few years ago, the games were so fun we just made this a custom plane for planechase

what do you use for its planar chaos?

i tried to use an unglued card at my LGS but they weren't allowed unless they're the basic lands

from what i remember unglued was a more broken joke set

>I don't play unhinged cards in EDH because they're not allowed by the official rules.
But they are.

Cheese Stands Alone is a legit card.

Tiskadelewhatsitspelledphobia is pretty damn Unglued-ish.

I want to convince my play group to let me use City of Ass as City of Brass...

>City of Ass as City of Brass
Best use for Un cards. Also using Ass Whuppin instead of Vindicate.

Our group (small town) is largely centered around a local level 2 judge. A couple years ago, people were experimenting with Un-cards, and he was cool with it til until people started rules-lawyering over the Un-cards, so he suggested we stop and we did.
I personally don't care for them. My wife and kid love them.

fucking balanced
Obviously, a land in the library and the battlefield that is moved from the library to the battlefield remains on the battlefield while it ceases to be in the library, thus no life gain.
Being a judge around un-cards can be fun, but there's such a thing as too much fun.

everyone mill a card

only problem we encountered was usually senseis top shenanigans and no real ruling for how tapping cards on top of library, then rearranging the top cards

You tap it by tapping it, as is, on top of the library.
Damn it user, you're making this sound more complex than it is.

sorry should have been more clear

tapping the top card, then using top to rearrange the top 3, then rearranging again to where the previously tapped card is on top again, is it now untapped?

Are you swapping it around twice with one effect or two? Because "put them back in any order" lets you do so once, removing the top card from play if you swap it to a different spot.

You'd need to do it again to put it back afterwards.

Yes

yea two activations, last time this problem came up we ruled that the cards not on top of the deck couldnt be tapped, and when becoming a top card again they were untapped, it does lead to some clearly broken things involving lands in the top 3, and a mana doubler, thankfully our playgroup is rather laid back and never became an issue

JUDGE
does this wipe mythics?

does your group consider mythics rares?

They're mythic RAREs

The official rules stance for any questions about cards from an un-set is basically "sure why not?". It could go either way depending on how your group interprets it.

No.

Okay, so I'm only a rules advisor, but after playing this card pretty extensively (in DC10) it's a lot funnier if it doesn't.

We decided that if rarity were to get rules that acknowledged rarity, it would likely function similarly to subtypes (specifically creature types) where each one needed to be specified individually and functioned independantly.
Hypothetically, a card might say "Rare or rarer" or "with a rarity of uncommon or less" to specify ranges, but "rare or mythic rare spells cost 2 more to cast" or "common and uncommon creatures you control have haste" is more clear.

Alternatively, you could argue that since it takes the rare slot in a boosterand has the word "rare" in its rarity, mythic rare cards should count.
It also seems to be in the spirit of the card, but if you think that matters you're a dirty Vorthos and thus unfit to make rulings.

Judges can only give jokey rulings like this for silver bordered.

>There currently aren't rules for cards being in multiple zones at once.
I'm not sure there need to be special rules for this. Artifact Creatures, Tribal Sorceries and other cards with multiple types don't have special rules, do they?

>So we don't know what happens if you have YAAV out with a land on top of your library, then use Courser of Kruphix to play the top card of your library. First of all, would it even be allowed to put a card into a zone it's already in?
This raises an interesting question in _regular_ Magic that I'm curious about now: what stops you playing a land that's already on the battlefield in order to trigger Landfall effects? Time to grab a judge and prod the edge cases.

>Secondly, does it count as entering the battlefield since it was already on the battlefield?
No. Lands don't use the stack, so they were never in another zone. If you played a nonland creature from top of library, then it would move from the library-battlefield to the stack, followed by going from the stack to enter the battlefield.

>tapping the top card, then using top to rearrange the top 3, then rearranging again to where the previously tapped card is on top again, is it now untapped?
Yes. "Tapped" is only an attribute of permanents on the battlefield. Things that are not permanents on the battlefield do not have this attribute. Things that are, become, or enter as permanents on the battlefield start out untapped (also unflipped, face up, and phased in, for that matter) unless something says otherwise.

>Artifact Creatures, Tribal Sorceries and other cards with multiple types don't have special rules, do they?
What does a card having multiple types have to do with anything? There isn't a zone for each type.
>what stops you playing a land that's already on the battlefield in order to trigger Landfall effects?
Because you can only play cards from your hand, and the battlefield is not your hand.
>No. Lands don't use the stack, so they were never in another zone.
You can't say that because there are no rules governing things being in multiple zones at once.

How about when I draw a card and next one is say, Mulldrifter. Do I get the ETB effect from it?

I must be slowpoking pretty hard, but I've seen this card for years and just now noticed the hand print.

No. Like how animating one of your noncreature permanents doesn't give you "creature ETB" effects, even though there's now a creature on the board where there wasn't before. The top card of your library isn't changing zones from anywhere to battlefield, it's getting the zone equivalent of animation.

you could ofcourse ask mark rosewater on his tumblr, his philosophy is that in unglued its more about the spirit of the card than the letter. (ofcourse in non-un-magic, there is only the letter of the card)

As the idea of the card is "screw your hard-to-get cards", mythic rares, being more rare than rares, should also be included.

This is actually clear in the general rules for things changing zones, it just takes a bit of thinking through the logic.

Basically, rearranging the top card down deeper, then rearranging again to put it back on top works essentially the same as flickering. When something leaves the battlefield, it ceases to exist as the permanent it was. If you then put that card back on the battlefield, it is a new object. So, yes, it is untapped when it comes back to the top. (By the same logic, if you shifted something up and down like that, any "per turn" limitations on use of an ability would be reset, creatures thus shuffled would have summoning sickness, etc.)

No, when a card comes to the top of your library with YAAV, it is changing zones. Or gaining a zone, I suppose.

Animation is a permanent gaining a type. It goes from (for instance) a land on the battlefield to a land creature (still on the battlefield). There is no change in its zoning, therefore it doesn't trigger EtB effects.

Not so with YAAV. When you draw a card and your second-from-top card becomes the top card, it goes from being solely in your library to being both in your library and on the battlefield. It has entered the battlefield zone (despite not having left the library zone), and thus sets off any applicable EtB triggers.

Now, if you had a triggered ability that goes off when the card leaves your library, THAT would be equivalent to animation, because the card does not leave your library when it comes to the top, but rather only gains the zoning of being on the battlefield *in addition to* being in your library.

There's a line through the rarity symbol, so is this card actually a rare itself or nto?

>Animation is a permanent gaining a type.
And YAAV is a card gaining a zone.

Yes, it is entering a zone it was not in previously, as opposed to animation which does not involve any zone changes whatsoever. Therefore, YAAV will trigger effects that care about zone changes, while animation will not.

Animation does not change a permanent's zone, at all. EtB triggers look for changes in zone status, so a noncreature on the battlefield becoming a creature does not trigger them. A trigger that looks for a change in zones doesn't care about changes in types, even if it does care about particular types. It's still the same object, in the same zone, so it doesn't trigger.

When a card goes from second in your library to top of your library with YAAV out, it becomes a new object on the battlefield, a zone it was not in previously. It has, therefore, truly entered the battlefield.

With animation, an object on the battlefield remains on the battlefield, but changes types. With YAAV, a card not on the battlefield becomes an object on the battlefield.

Hyper Meme coming through

Absolutely not, Capsize is bad enough without this shit

>2R: Deal 2 damage to target creature or player
or
>1RR: Deal 2 damage to target creature or player, draw a card
this would be pretty solid but not in EDH

>cast it for madness from Tormenting Voice
>Flashback it for 3R

V A L U E