/srg/ - Shadowrun General

Why not Minotaur? Make him a nosy greek or something.

The issue with Giants is that they are even more giant than most trolls. So it's going to be hard to do much in social situations but loom, and Ghost help you if you meet in a location with a low ceiling.

>being a Greek

You are one step away from being removed

>Why not Minotaur?
Because their maximum natural Charisma is 4, not 5. Giant and Fomorians, specifically, have one higher maximum Charisma than normal trolls.

>The issue with Giants is that they are even more giant than most trolls. So it's going to be hard to do much in social situations but loom, and Ghost help you if you meet in a location with a low ceiling.
Fair. But how do they look in a suit?

>Fair. But how do they look in a suit?
"You're a big troll."

>Giant
>in a suit
GL

>Also, have the police be a lot more militarized for funsies.
More militarised than what? Lone Star has attack helicopters and a slew of military hardware.

Remember the mad dosh you have to spend on a designer-tier suit? Multiply it by ten.

>Fair. But how do they look in a suit?

Like a over ten feet tall human with bark-like hide in a suit. You're spared the horns, though.

>Giant and Fomorians, specifically, have one higher maximum Charisma than normal trolls
It's a minor difference. People were making face trolls with slightly less than 20 dice social rolls long before RF or CF, so it's not like you *need* the charisma to do it.

Probably much less like that after bio & cyber attempts to humanise them.

>getting metatype reduction

>spitting in the face of your troll forefathers

Go jump off a bridge, wanna-breeder

Is there a Sixth World Almanac or 5e?

>spitting in the face of your troll forefathers
"My troll forefather was my dad, a human who goblinized and hated being a troll."

Metatypes don't have long, rich cultures that stretch back hundreds of years. Many don't even have cultures that stretch back more than even a single generation.

No. But not much has changed in the past few years internationally, aside from a different Matrix infrastructure

>Is there a Sixth World Almanac or 5e?
yes in fact there are both the SWA and 5e. you didn't hallucinate either of them
Oh, my mean a SWA for 5e? nope

Normal Troll. Female Supermodel. Also has a day job, actual supermodel for Renraku.

youtube.com/watch?v=FRivqBxbHRs

>Metatypes don't have long, rich cultures that stretch back hundreds of years

Tell that to Or'zet, you bledjeax.

Besides, goblinization nowadays is very rare, and troll lifespans are short with early maturity. Odds are good that a troll family has managed to fit three or four generations into the 50+ years since UGE.

You are mixing up Trolls and Orks. Trolls have regular human lifespans.

>troll lifespans are short with early maturity
They live 60 years naturally - much longer than orks, and barely shorter than humans - and Goblinization began in 2021. Trolls born as trolls, rather than goblinized as trolls, are JUST starting to die of old age for literally the first time in recorded history.

The idea that orks/trolls have some kind of well-established culture is absurd.

>she doesn't make P2.1 videos for subscribers

Check your privilege, keeb scum.

you cant use that word. its OUR word

Troll average is 50 years. Given that they are generally undereducated and on the outskirts of society, it's not unlikely that they'd have families early and often, and IIRC trolls and orcs both go through puberty faster than humans.

Trolls as a whole don't have a well-established culture in the way that say, elves do (though the Black Forest Troll Republic is a thing) but the Or'zet Codex made it's impact. And I don't argue that trolls have some deep and rich culture, but it's equally erroneous to say that they have no culture at all. If nothing else, the books support the idea that trolls bond over the fact that they don't get good jobs, don't fit into the world of the smaller metatypes, and that they practise lost arts like cursive and body scrimshaw for self-expression.

Which of the character creation systems is the most exploitable, and why?

>But how do they look in a suit?
Looming

Possibly even more looming, thanks to the suit - you could look like a big walking monolith

Always karmagen.

Do you mean point buy system?

krauts should really translate all that shit. looks much better than english wiki.

Is Chummer missing Commanding Voice from Street Grimoire? All I see in there is Commanding Voice from Stolen Souls.

I think the one in stolen souls replaces it.

>I think the one in stolen souls replaces it.
Street Grimoire came out a month and a half after Stolen Souls did. If either replaced the other, it should be the other way around.

Check the errata? I dunno, man. I know an SG errata came out; maybe something changed there.

QUICK

You have 1 minute to name 10 spells you always pick for the starting mage character.

P. 170, COMMANDING VOICE CHANGE The version of Commanding Voice on p. 185, Stolen Souls, stands. This power is changed to Authoritative Tone, costs 0.50 PP per level (max 3), and is described as follows: Adepts with this power can speak in a way that immediately makes people want to believe them and follow their orders. For every level of this power, an adept gains a +1 die to any Opposed Social Skill Test that they initiate (normal limits apply).

>always picking the exact same spells
>always picking maximum number of spells

fuck off

Deflect
Improved Invisibility
Punch
Improved Reflexes
Heal
Manabolt
Physical Barrier
Trid Phantasm
Chaos World
Stunball (Or any other AoE spell.)

>10 spells
Improved Invisibility, Increase Reflexes, Heal, Stunbolt, Powerbolt.

Everything else changes character to character.

Way to go lad. That's the quality post we really need here.

Stun spell (bolt/ball)
Direct damage spell (personally I like lightning; bolt/ball) mana spells are good as they also hit spirits
Heal
Levitation
Invisibility
Improved Reflexes (don't need armor if they're not even going to shoot at you)

Everything else varies. I really like mage hands or whatever it's named because telekinesis is awesome if used creatively. I like illegal mind control stuff. I like instant orgasm or whatever it's called because of the sheer hilarity of it.

Ever get the feeling that maybe you should fuck off, jerk?

Even though he probably just wants to fit in too much, I'm still interested in his opinion.

Then what spells did you take for your characters in the past?

Is there any cyberware or bioware that makes you better at Charisma related things? The only thing I can find is Tailored Pheromones and that just increases your social limit (which should be high anyway thanks to high Charisma).

Trolls average 50 years, but unlike Orks they don't have the rapid aging effect. That 50 year age average is influenced by societal conditions, whereas the 40 year Ork is actually due to hard genetics.
A 14 year old Ork is physically and mentally in their 30s, but a 14 year old troll is just 14.

That being said, Trolls breeding fast and early does make sense.

>always picking maximum number of spells

Since every proper Mage or Shaman in Shadowrun takes Magic A, you get 10 free spells to start with regardless.

...

>That 50 year age average is influenced by societal conditions, whereas the 40 year Ork is actually due to hard genetics.
Is there a source on that?
The only chart I've seen about lifespans is the one where it lists orks at 40 and trolls at 50 (and the other metatypes) and the numbers are said to be gotten from extrapolating the genetic code of each.

I can only answer "starting mage what spells" so many times before I just don't have the patience for it anymore. Especially when worded in the most broad absolute of 'all the spells, maximum allotment, which ones always fill those slots'.

My last mage character had Fireball, Heal, Increase Reflexes, Stabilize, Chaotic World, Improved Invisibility and Shapechange, all alchemical formulas. The character couldn't cast spells, only do alchemy and summon spirits. It was a nice change of pace.

Yeah I just reread that myself. No idea how I missed that... Is there anything else that boosts it though? Tailored Pheromones is kinda... expensive, especially if you want it at Rating 3 (93000 nuyen!)

~31K nuyen per dicepool boost for attributes is pretty common for bioware (see muscle augmentation/toner and cerebral boosters)
Remember, you can always take used bioware for 1.25 the essence but 0.75 the cost, and since bioware is so low on essence it's barely even a choice. You can comfortably pick up R3 pheromones with C resources, leaving you with ~60K nuyen for lifestyle, transport, weapons, drugs, clothing, etc etc even without getting used pheromones.
Try to pick up first impression as a quality if you can.

Can Used Tailored Pheromones be implanted into someone else?

Yes, all normal bioware can come in the assorted grades.
Since it says fluffwise that cultured bioware is tailor made, some GMs don't allow you to take that at the used level, but pheromones are just standard bioware, so you can take them used.

Oh I'm talking post chargen. I grabbed First Impression and Exceptional Attribute (Charisma), but I'm trying to push myself above and beyond that. The only other thing I've found that helps are the suits from Run & Gun (the Berwick suit is definitely on my list to pick up next, especially if I can get it with Shock Frills too).

Thinking about it, how would tailored pheromones would affect stage acting? You're far away, and the audience can literally watch you through VR or AR.

AR wouldn't matter, so long as they're in the same room as you.

It would not strike me as odd if movie and live theatres, in a bid to survive, all adopted smellovision with pheremone emitters scattered throughout the audience to enhance the experience.

Jesus Christ how horrifying.

But at least now I know how to make a nice terrorist attack.

You know the second I wrote "Harlequin's illegitimate daughter" I thought to myself "I bet there is some character almost exactly like that already."

People in the front row might give you better reviews, but that's about it aside from the social limit bonus you get from the extra confidence.

I know you're post-chargen but if you're really looking to cheese how to be a face, play as an AI and take Exceptional Entity. It lets you have one of your attributes have no natural limit at all, so if you take A in attributes you can start the game with 13 charisma, which is already higher than any other race with R3 pheromones.
Here's an AI face I made a while back with some help from /srg/ who cheers on her team as a cheerleader in AR and distracts guards via impromtu dance parties.
pastebin.com/u687vu13

It's less "how to cheese being a face" and more "show up the smug elf face by being a better face whilst also being a troll, preferably in a better suit too".

Yeah, for trolls pheromones and a nice suit are your best bet, unless you want to be a race traitor and shave off all your troll stuff.

>wanna go see the 3d trid rerelease of Jurassic Park? Now you can actuslly smell the big piles of Dino shit and they release synthetic mosquitos into the theatre so you feel like you're really there! And if you pay an extra 20 nuyen they give you simsense chips so you can feel like you're really being bitten in half by a t Rex!"

I don't think I'd be a big movie buff in the Sixth World.

So, how viable is it to have a main weapon that is exotic?

By exotic i mean stuff that's not a pistol or shotgun or katana or some such. Crossbow, Spear, Flail, Powerfist type stuff

Is bow exotic enough? Because adept troll bowmen players were my personal nightmares in 4e.

Well, most runners just use one weapon anyway, so you should be alright.
If you get captured/have to go weapons and equipment OSP it can fuck you up more than normal though.

Yeah I don't plan on being a race traitor. My character's goal is to earn enough to buy back his family's ancestral home and restore his family's noble status, and his family are all trolls now so shaving off the troll bits doesn't really gel with everything else.

Plus all it does is raise your racial maximum, not your actual Charisma. It's annoying really, there's cyberwear/bioware to increase nearly every stat EXCEPT Charisma.

In 5e my favorite bowman is the four cyberlimb redliner robo-native.

"Hey Marv, look! That person with the armored leather jacket and the Mohawks and the talismans who looks like a Shadowrunner is also carrying around a crossbow."

That's how visible you are.

Yeah, it's odd that pheromones don't, but that's probably because of the range necessary. Either way, you'll manage just fine if you pay attention to situational social modifiers (memorize that fuckin' chart) and roleplay well.

>Well, most runners just use one weapon anyway
Nah, m8, you have to get your mission weapon which is usually the best you have, then your civilian weapon, which is usually some pistol or SMG or something. I also like to grab an easily-concealable sidearm.

Note to all mages: GET A FUCKING WEAPON OR THEY WILL SHOOT YOU FIRST EVEN BEFORE THE COMBAT STARTS.

Doesn't exceptional attribute raise the limit? I kind of forgot. Well, it's your best bet for troll face anyway along with those pheromones.

>It's annoying really, there's cyberwear/bioware to increase nearly every stat EXCEPT Charisma.

Which is kinda understandable. I cann se how muscle fibers and brain performance implants can be feasible. Pure force of personality is kinda more abstract. You either have it or you don't, and what exactly "it" is, can vary wildly.

I mean it might count as drugs but Reliable Matthew used Persona Chips to keep himself always happy and confident and smooth to sell used drones for a living. Also Skillsofts for face skills or for knowledge so you can better haggle in game.

I don't know if most of this is officially statted in SR though. Maybe some day we'll be getting a Face Book? Yeah I doubt it

Yea, but persona chips generally rewrite your personality with expanded use.

Matthew was special, apperantly

To be fair, pheromones do give you a boost in most situations that you use Charisma and an increase to your social limit, which all make sense, but why they did it the round about way rather than just giving it a flat Charisma boost I don't know.

Yeah Exceptional Attribute increases your racial maximum, but I have that already. I picked up First Impression too, which is nice (assuming I remember to use it...) but I want more. I'll have to look that chart over again, I know Intimidate is rather easy to stack modifiers for (and trolls usually get the +2 for size by default) but I don't really know what the others are.

That kinda makes sense, but it seems... weird, like they left a deliberate gap in the cyber/bioware section. I can't seem to find any extra books which help with that either other than the suit from Run & Gun.

That's all fluff anyways. I really liked Matthew ' s fluff of his personality and the Persona Chip's coalescing into a third entity that was neither and both. The pc would operate as the character but also while knowing the effects of the Persona chip meaning the actions would be a third person choice and that makes more sense than "I put the Porn Star Chip in and now I am the porn star."

The only thing that would affect our neurology would be the degree of dominance within the Persona chip, therefore allowing the creepy situation where unwilling Bunraku dolls would be unable to say no. But even then that sounds more like the power of BTLs overriding our bodies.

Reliable Matthew (and ,for the matter, Ten-Arms Ambrose as well) bends the SR rules a bit. Not that it really matters in a video game, it helps create memorable NPC's, but be wary of doing the samen in the PnP.

It would probably have been simple rules-wise to just give it a flat charisma boost. But I still stand by my first point, that Charisma is very nebulous and hard to replicate. You can get tools that let you go through the motions associated person, and are able to mimic charming behaviour.
Or in the case of pheromones, make someone else drop their defenses and make them open to being charmed by you.

But real gravitas and force of personality is something, that is more than just those little components.

>Ten-Arms Ambrose as well
How does Ambrose?

I always find it odd how people seem to ignore the ethical ramifications of pheromones, considering you're basically just drugging everyone you meet.

If you listen to his explanation, he's basically jumped-in into multiple devices at once.

You are right. I find that a bit strange, too. You would think that after word gets out, a certain negotiator heavily uses them, that meetings would be held remotely, or the johnson just appears with a little gas mask.

I can't see a justification like "but everyone has pheromones, mine are just industrial grade" pacify people, who are not down bith being manipulated in this way.

Ambrose: He jacks into his workshop and turns off RAS motion override. -2 to do real life stuff.

No rules break.

Matthew: personafix chip gives skillwire rating acting +4.

Done.

Not sure where the rules bending is.

You make a good point. It's just annoying that I'm looking at 20-30 karma a pop to boost anything social related (Charisma 4->5 is 25, Influence 6->7 is 35) and I'd rather use it on shoring up some weak spots (like my low initiative, or Perception) rather than having to blow my load on a one dice increase.

Workshop counts as ome device, omae.

Just like a turret mounted on a van counts as part of the van.

I think once you get past a certain level of johnson they would start using either discreet nose plugs or other non-obvious filtering systems to mitigate or provide immunity from pheromones.

Just take glamour.

Or have mage increase attribute.

Hence why the concept of theatres becoming pheromone equipped is nightmarish.

Honestly I just think theatres would be out of business. Any Hollywood jerk offs wanting to stay afloat would be secondary adopters to vr and ar tech. The real scummy ones would be btl makers.

Cinema has always sold itself as an event and as an event it's struggling enough without everyone in the world being able to plug their brains directly into a simulation of the greatest orgasm ever. Hollywood just can't compete with that shit.

Get enough in drone control and listen to how exactly his clinic works. Especially the part where you tell him even a brain augmented with a control rig couldn't take it.

>In a desperate attempt to save their old timey movie theatre, that has fallen on hard times, the last five employees decide to go into the shadows to keep the business afloat.

Queue a campaign with lots of movie quotes, and cinema related puns. Also grenades hidden in the popcorn bucket.

Runners:
"Ticket" A mage with magic flavoured as handing out tickets. Hope you aren't going to Armageddon's early screening.

"The Projectionist" A troll streetsam in a full body armor with built in illuminators. Uses a machine gun with the bullets being Flare - Tracer- Flar- buttered Popcorn.

"Custodian" Orc physadept using a heavily modified tuthenium mop. Has no traceless walk, but sneers at people until they walk tracelessly.

"Bubblegum" The concession girl. Team medic with a chest harness full of every type of slap patch, drug and explosives you can imagine.
Do not ask her for something without peanuts.

What do you guys think about a campaign where the PCs are part of the military of an african/eastern european nation (be they PMCs or national soldiers) when a coup attempt happens? I'd give them the chance of deciding which side to support (fuck, maybe they just want to get out of the country), and decide where/how to go from there. Lots of non-standard rewards for runs in the means of materiel and supplies, limited resources and availability, etc.

No shit I had a mission idea I shared on here a year or so back that was essentially the plot to Bowfinger. The shadowrun team has been hired by a struggling indie horror director Mr. Johnson to wear or install simsense recorders on themselves and stalk an unknowing up-and-coming Simsense Star as basically whatever horror icons they want to be. The Mage can rattle windows, the Ork street sam dons Murder Armour and pursues him slowly with a machete, the Face gets close to the star as a plant, etc.

Pretty damn fun campaign, allows runners to let their imagination run wild, tends to end with someone accidentally killing the simsense star and/or the police getting involved.

Is it my players or is alchemy underrated in general in shadowrun (5e)?

It seems like the best way to use sustained spells. Instead of worrying about focused concentration or a -2 penalty for every spell you keep, you can just prepare a few potions before the run and use them when appropriate since they last it for (Potency) minutes.