What Would Veeky Forums Choose?

I'm developing a wargame boardgame with 5 types of units. Armor, Cavalry, Artillery, Infantry and Support. I just can't decide if a player should be forced to use all 5 types, or if he should be able to, say, deploy two kinds of Artillery at the expense of his Support.

This obviously effects game balance pretty strongly. Forcing all 5 let's me plan the balance out better, avoiding scenarios where a player fields 5 Armor units, for example. But the latter option allows for much more control over your forces.

Each unit has characteristics like Morale (HP), Movement type and speed (Tracked, wheeled, mounted, etc), and those characteristics are customizable, so there is already a lot of control. The question is, how much control is too much?

tl;dr Predetermined, or Open Unit slots?

Choose one and roll with it.

Flip a coin if you have to.

Good vote. If I don't get enough opinions to make a decision, I'll just do this.

I should also mention that Armor, Cavalry and Artillery have a Rock/Paper/Scissors balance against one another, while Infantry is neutral a against all 3, and Support gives advantage to the other 4.

If you have rock paper scissors then best bet is to make them mandatory slots.

Helps you save players from getting completely fucked in army creation.

Force the 5, but have (at least) 2 different options for each if you can, for example, a support that's a bit more cavalry-y.

If you don't have point costs of some sort on your units, not limiting the types like this means that you can't do things like a faction with weak infantry and strong artillery, for example, since everyone will just throw the infantry away and double up on artillery.

There are three resources that players compete over on the map, which are used to pay for, upgrade and deploy units. Each faction has 3 COs with different traits a'la Advance Wars, so different strengths and weaknesses will come into play. Infantry had its own strength by being neutral to the three main types and being able to cross any terrain, etc, so they'll have a use.

I'd just like to avoid situations where one player fields 5 Armor units and forces the other players to counter him. But I guess each player group will have different preferences.

Wait, if you pay for units in game, during play anyway, even if you "force" having 5 types of units to choose from, a player can still just build one kind... so why not "force" the option of having access to all 5 types anyway?

So what's keeping me from going full infantry/artillery which give me a good chance against all types of armies?

Players have a board with 5 unit slots, and there are unit cards that get placed into each of those slots. Each card comes with a number of generic models that can be deployed to the battlefield for a cost. When those models are all deployed, you have to put a new unit in that slot to get any use out of it. For example, Battleghast Chargers is a Aggressive Cavalry unit with 4 Reserves (models). I can pay two Mana and one Influence to deploy one of those Reserves to any hex I control with a fortress in it. When I deploy 4 of those models, I simply can't build any more. I can wait until all 4 Battleghast Chargers are destroyed, or I can disband the remaining models, remove them from the battlefield and put a new Cavalry in their slot.

Cavalry would bloody your nose by moving faster than your Infantry and winning the match up against your Artillery.

>Cavalry would bloody your nose by moving faster than your Infantry and winning the match up against your Artillery.

>Never ran into an infantry army that protect it's own artillery while it snipes the cavalry.

Oh my sweet sweet summer child.

That being said, if you used terrain to your advantage, or built a wall of Armor to stop the Cav charge, or bought certain upgrades for your Infantry and Artillery, or used non-unit abilities like your CO's power, things may go differently, so it's not a forgone conclusion.

Cavalry units tend to have abilities to let them cross your units, move your units out of position, or just plain old fly. And you typically need to buy upgrades for your Infantry to get indirect fire.

>Charge across your unit
That what spear formation for m8

>Move your units out of position
If they break the spear formation m8

>Lul, I can just fly over your infantry. GG
That sounds expensive and that what the artillery therefor m8.

Not to mention terrain advantage that infantry can use and cavalry are useless against siege unlike infantry/artillery.

I mean, you are making the (probably erroneous) assumption that infantry has a spear formation in this game.

If infantry can't blunt a charge, the game isn't doing it right.

I'm just saying, I'm designing the system so that the types have certain weaknesses and strengths against one another. Infantry/Artillery is a sound strategy, but it isnt foolproof. If you don't think Cavalry behind your Infantry lines is a problem, play that way. A balanced force will tend to win against an unbalanced force. I would assume you have your own Armor and Cav units doing something elsewhere on the map, too.

There always an infantry unit that is design against cavalry like spearmen. OP could always give a trait or an ability to let spearmen form spear formation so they can get a huge advantage against cavalry but can't move.

Bottom line is that pure cavalry army is shit and anybody that tries to use it is going to get their shit pushed in against a decent army combination unless it's something extremely retarded like pure archer or artillery spam.

Who said anything about pure cavalry. You only need two Cavalry units, one to meet the Infantry and pull them out of place, and one to chew up the Artillery on the inside. Meanwhile I have a column of Armor surrounding your hex's fortress to keep reinforcements from arriving.

That is unless Player 3 is spamming Infantry and Support at me that I have to deal with our else be overwhelmed. I plan on this being a 2-5 player game.

>Veeky Forums arguing about a game
>the only known mechanics are "there are 5 type of units"

You may be designing it, but I'm trying to find holes in it.

A balance unit like infantry is perfect, because you may not get an advantage but you also don't have to worry about what you are up against either.

Artillery is there to prevent abuse. If I don't got artillery, but my opponent does, he can find a good spot, get comfy, and wait it out.

An infantry(balance unit)/artillery(prevent abuse) is the best army period. No weaknesses, just need skill and luck.

Go ahead, use my infantry/artillery army as a control variable in your wargame for balance purpose, but don't be surprise when you say,"That user is right again".

>I'm going to use my armor army to surround your fortress while my 2 unit of cavalry face off against your infantry/artillery army.

Who the fuck chase cavalry with infantry? This may work against an AI, but you dealing with a human player.

I'm not planning on them giving chase, but rather my Cav running them down, and peeling the Infantry.

I'm thinking about dropping Support as a type and making the 5th Slot free. You can have a second of one type, and Support units will get typed as the other 4 but without direct effects.

Good plan, was honestly about to suggest that.

You could let people double up, but not on the same unit.
Let's say some units are particularly awesome, and those are the ones you don't want to see spammed, like Dragonknights or something.
If you let players use up to one elite units of each type, then they could spam, but with a reduced efficency. The Dragonknight will have to be accompanied by a retinue of Horseknights, if not even Donkeyknights.
On the other hand, a mixed force can go with all awesome units, with elites in all 4 slots.

If you go that way, you'll have to be more careful when balancing units (if you're letting players build their own, maybe the elites get more point for the build), of course.

I was thinking of having Elite units that only have 1 Reserve, so you can only deploy one instance of that elite unit. Monster units like Dragons (Aggressive Artillery), or Hero units, or Naval Units...

>I'm going to run my cavalry into a spear wall and then retreat after taking massive causality.

You call that peeling?

You: I charge my cavalry into your spearmen number one and end it's turn.

Me: My artillery soften up your cavalry and then spearmen number two is going to move and attack your cavalry from the sides while spearmen number one finish it off. My spearmen number 3 move between your second cavalry and my artillery to intercept a charge.

More like
Me: I move my Cavalry #1 into your Infantry #1's space. Then I pay two Mana to activate it's upgraded ability, taking us both one space to the left. This creates a hole for Cavalry #2 to charge in and enter your Artillery #1's space. Then we resolve combats.

As the attacker, I roll 1d10 and try to roll under my Cavalry's Attack Value. Because Cavalry has Advantage against Artillery, I roll 2d10 and use the better for that combat. I roll a 7 on Cavalry #1, which doesn't score a hit. I roll a 2 and a 3 for Cavalry #2, scoring 2 hits and applying them to your Artillery #2. Then resolve Counterattacks.
Your Infantry #1 rolls a 3, and it has upgraded weapons, so it scores a hit with 2 damage. You apply them to Cavalry #1. Artillery #1 is indirect, so it doesn't get to Counterattack adjacent units.
Damage is applied at the same time. Your Artillery #1 takes 2 damage, and it's enough to destroy it. Cavalry #1 takes 2 damage, but it has 3 Morale, so it survives with 1 Morale. Two damage markers are placed on it, and combat ends.