Why is there a negro in Central Europe-esque Innistrad? Are there temperate climates on the plane? Is it still spooky?

I'm sick of your bullshit attitude.

It's fantasy, let it be inclusive. You're a fucking racist if someone having dark skin bothers you when there are actual lizard people and vampires in the same setting. Why are dark-skinned people a bigger stretch?

I mean, who is that girl and is she relevant?

I can't find any cards or characters in Innistrad that are dark skinned. So I mean, am I just ignorant and she has a background and a reason for being there, maybe she is from another plane or something?

Alternatively, they just put a black person in some flavour art to jazz it up since they're working with a very bleak palate. Intentionally.

Having someone with black skin & features allows them to pull the colour scheme reversal with the white armour without breaking the tone of the piece, and it's appears designed to draw attention to the centre where Sorin is without taking the focus away from him. What's the term, contrast yeah. You can see they've balanced it out with the white smoke/clouds in the background on the right, It's a clever way to have it framing Sorin without overexposing the background, instead by having it on separate layers it provides the illusion of depth.

Additionally, Sorin is a planeswalker. Not sure at what point in time this picture is, but regardless having a servant or subordinate who has a unique appearance and speaks an unknown tongue and claims origin in an unknown land, just adds to his mystique and general air of "Spoopy Vampire Lord" that has seen strange sights, fought stranger beasts, and done this in lands that are beyond strange altogether and would never be believed to exist if there wasn't proof of it walking around and talking.

Or it could have been some pandering, maybe they saw the article about Huffpo's staff diversity and said "Shit Jim, tossing some ladies in there isn't enough, make one of them black. Not like scary or alien black, like pick an famous Black American black."

Seems like a really small detail to care about though, and kind of discredits a lot of arguments you use against it being there that are more appropriate to apply to, say, the Jaycetice Team.

Oh, much better. You're addressing someone personally on an anonymous image board, claiming the moral high ground, still the tumblr terms - and you're working in more, repeating the message without repeating yourself, as well as prodding the classic Veeky Forums reaction spots. 5/10.

Why is there a bunch of fa/tg/uys pretending to be muscular men and sexy ladies saving the world? It's so unrealistic!

ITT, people bitch about realism in a fantasy cape setting.

The point of M:tG's setting is to be immersive and nothing drags me out when I have to ask where the colored women at?

That doesn't sound like MtG you're describing

>why are there niggers in my US American game? My ancestors worked hard to genocide the Americans and had a civil war about excluding the Africans from our expanding Union, why has their noble sacrifice been betrayed?

tl;dr: It's an US game.

>unless she came from the Americana Plane of the Multiverse.
She did. Every single character in the game does.

She's from the elemental plane of watermelon and chickunz

Dude, come on. Read about the Axum Empire which covered areas that had both Negroids and Caucasians in it, including the Red Sea.

The Ghana Empire (which while isolationist, was well known as the Empire of Gold among northern Africans and there was one dude who did a Hajj and gave away so much money he destabilized the economy of the Caliphate.

More contemporary empires? The Mali Empire in Western Africa peaked in 1350. Lasted until the mid 1600s. One of its most important cities was known as Timbuktu, maybe you've heard of it in older literature?

Oh, but you want to focus on Central Europe, well I guess you have the argument there.

A planeswalker did it.

WE WUZ KANGS AN SHEEIT

... Why does he want to focus on central Europe anyway?

Sure, Vlad was central European, but the general Germanic feel of Innistrad gives you a reference that is close to the Medditerrian sea.

Are you dense?

The point you're responding to is about Central Europe, what Innstrad is based off. Not the Kingdom of Aksum (ME trading ties), or the slaving empires.

How is listing a bunch of African nations and empires relevant to the thread?

Wait, no disregard that I suck cocks. Had one in my mouth right then while pausing for dramatic effect and I'm still not as big a faggot as you.

Exploration of Sub-Saharan Africa began in the 15th century. They actually called it the Age of Exploration. Ironically not because they didn't know about Africa or black people, but because the interior of sub-saharan Africa had yet to be thoroughly explored and only the Muslim conquest of Sudan that opened it up. You ever see a Sudanese person? Getting pretty dark.

There had been Arab slaving going on since pretty much forever, but it really kicked into gear with Islam. The kingdom of Nubia, named for the Noba people who migrated there in 4th century BC and are the current ethnic majority, was actually a Christian Kingdom. It survived all that time to the present even, although it's now called Ethiopia.

So the Muslim Caliphates were interacting and enslaving Africans for centuries. But would they sell to central Europe?

Let's talk about Wallachia. You know, part of Romania now with Transylvania and Moldovia. Wallachia came under the control of the Pechenegs, a swarthy people known for worshiping Islam and being Turkish.

So yeah, it's concievable that during the location and time in real life that Innistrad is based on, not just Africans but Negroids from African kingdoms could have been present there.

All of this is ignoring explorers, envoys, adventurers of circumstance or wealth, preachers and religious pilgrims seeking truths in distant places that have always popped up randomly.

No, there never were any significant or established Negroid communities or colonies that I know of. But there were individuals present, and the place you would see them would be at courts as a novelty, or because of their exceptional or unique skills, or in mercenary bands, or with goods to trade, or being entertained by the Church as pilgrims, or argue with as heathens, or to get them to accept missionaries etc.

>what Innstrad is based off

Is it actually based on it, or does it just draw some aesthetics from the area/time period, like 99% of fantasy "based" on something?

What's with all these mtg threads about race lately? It's always the same too, "No nigggers here,no niggers allowed anywhere but africa", or "WEWUZKANGS" shite. For fuck sake even that black, jungle elf in conspiracy got the same reaction. Then they go complaining about different races being shoved into settings that apparently should be all white (cause humans and snake people are believable but humans and humans with different features just isn't plausible) but not the other way around when Kaladesh is an indian set with a bunch of white people in it.
I've never seen people get so triggered over something so fucking stupid.

Remember to sage all stormfag threads

>Christian Eastern Europe having open borders not lynching anyone foreign looking near the Turkish occupied areas.

Sure.

Edit, apparently Germany is part of Central Europe.

Germanic people did interact with plenty of Western and Meddit... Fuck it people, so trying to be pure about such a setting just seems weird.

I mean, it's not like having black people in a fantasy version of something makes people assume anything about the real life counterpart.

she is a vampire. She can be what any color she fucking wants.

>das racis

Where do you think you are?

See that is a better argument, than a convoluted explanation of African civilizations (the only ones who'd make frequent contact would've been the Aksum, despite their trade relations I really doubt the Jewish and Christian population would've been welcomed with open arms through the Islamic world.

It's fantasy, who really cares provided a reasonable enough explanation can be bullshitted. But saying that having black people and Arabs walking around as anything less than highly suspicious foreign emissaries in Christian Europe at the heights of the middle ages is just retarded.

I posted so that I could post >49110252.

Dude was babbling about Rome, like there weren't frequent contact with Negroid Africans and even occasional colonization from Greeks and Phoenicians and the Goths around like 6th or 7th century.

The worst thing about this, is that they are technically correct. There were many African Empires that were at times much more wealthy and powerful and educated than European nations. Hell, the Mali empire had the worlds first constitution, and memory and rumors of it's peak made it into a semi-mythical place. Seriously, you know you've heard of Timbuktu. Do you remember where? It was a pretty fucking big deal back in the Victorian ages to the point that people tried to argue that "Aliens did it".

So many actual Empires and successes to use as role models and as a substitute for personal pride and achievement. All wrecked by Muslim conquests and slavers.

Ethiopia for crying out loud was never even colonized. I mean, Italy tried to colonize them so it's not like they fought they big boys like Britain or France or Spain or Russia, but still.

They were wealthy, stable, low corruption and educated. And also happily conquering and genociding their neighbours with just as much gusto if not more than European colonizers. Got fucked up in WWII though, and decided to try going back to ethnic cleansing afterwards instead of continuing to modernize. But I digress.

Instead of actually learning history and using the many appropriate examples, American Blacks instead try to insist that they were somehow significant or responsible for development in Europe. In an especially ironic twist, this is a very popular viewpoint among black Muslims, members of the very same faith of Islam that was responsible for destroying so many of the Kingdoms and establishing the slave trade as a norm in Africa.

Where da white mana at?

Same reason we get annoyed if you want to play a non standard race that doesn't mesh with the settings so well.

Would get pissed if it's Viking appearing from nowhere in a fantasy Asia setting.

That's not how vampirism works.

we wuz bludsucka's n' shieet.

Yeah and I still have an issue with what you lead to.

It's like saying you'd find a significant number of Greeks in ancient China, because they their got through India. It reeks of improbability/snow flakism.

It could happen, if they were Christian. Dark skin was more likely to get you in trouble, but it wasn't a freaking death sentence.

In fantasy, it can be much easier for that to pass. Skin color among humans matters a whole lot less when the guy across is a freaking orc or a tiefling.

We're talking about one black person standing side by side with the top one percenters of their setting there, not about "significant numbers". That lady's the minorest of the minorities.

>Even if the Romans brought coloured people into Western Europe which doesn't make much sense to begin with (why hire mercenaries from the East and bring them north when you can hire Germans in the North to fight in the North).
Because you can't trust auxilia to do things in their native land, send them to the other side of the world where they don't speak the language and have nothing but the logistical support system you're providing and you get obedient soldiers who don't give a shit who you oppress because all they want is their pay and citizenship at the end.

>Auxiliaries would be recruited close to where they were fighting.
Depends when exactly you're talking about, but for the majority of the time you're wrong.

Hey man, my first argument about why the character would be there was this post .

It's not even a card or has an identity beyond being the black chick in this art piece (that I know of).

I just want people to actually know what they're talking about, because there are defensible arguments to be made for having a black person present in the lore, both in relation to the actual possibilities in the lore and for meta-reasons about maintaining the "flavour" of the settings.

Like, you could argue that it wasn't unusual for there to be people from really fucking far away present in medieval courts, or mercenary armies, occasionally as slaves or servants captured or gifted to travelers and traders. Maybe not a whole lot, but enough that the existence of black people was known among the classes that had access to education, and would be involved in trade and politics. So it would be stranger for there to be no travellers at all, much less a Noble Court not having a couple exotic travellers. Don't like admiting it matches the meta-flavour? Lore states the entire plane is Vampires and white people because no sun or whatever? Good thing there's fucking PLANESWALKERS, look there's one right there. Non-planeswalkers can even sometimes travel planes, there's magic and technomagic and lost forgotten devices and strange horrifying devices and wizards everywhere with no sense of right or wrong.

Turns out History is a science, and it's changing as we get more data. Egypt used to be considered a major empire, incredibly powerful as a military, cultural, and economic force. Because they wrote a lot of records and those are what we found. Now that we've found more of their contemporaries writings, we see that they are more consistent with each other than with Egyptian records. Yeah, ancient Egyptians pretty much lied their faces off and were much less . . . everything, than we believed. That's some "We Wuz Kangs" shit that went on for 2000 years.

Arabs worst.

WE WUZ DRACULAZ AND SHEEIT

And like I said it reeks of bullshit in terms of the analogy of Europe. It's Fantasy, dimension travel or some bullshit is fine for Innstrad. But saying because it could've happened in real life setting it's based off is just a cuntish way to do it.

I'm not talking about them in Europe I'm talking about them getting there, through that large, racist, slave mongering fundamentally Islamist territories in between. Plus getting across into Christian lands where racial tensions and xenophobia are high.

Again, it reeks of bullshit. Just because there were trade routes between Asia and Europe doesn't mean I'll let someone play a pissed of Irishman in a game set in Feudal Japan, sure one could've possibly got there but it still feels more like someone who just doesn't care for the setting.

In short use the 'it's fantasy, magic' explanation. Not the stretch of the imagination that has black people appearing in Europe commonly enough to be a feature before modern transportation systems.

/pol/ GET OUT.

WE DON'T FUCKING CARE.

We'd get pissed if it was a Dwarf originating from an Elven city with no decent explanation.

Less to do with racism, more to do with it fucking with the setting.

Welcome to the smut free Veeky Forums you never asked for.

They got rid of smut so they could be /pol/.

No you wouldn't.

You would wonder what the fuck he was doing there and come up with an actual explanation instead of complaining.

Why always to do with mtg though? Why can't it be a game I don't give a shit about?

literally one black person in a card art everyone triggered allow
>but muh realism
the one black person shown is an immortal vampire, which means at any point in the plane's history one black person had to get to story area
>but muh privilege
I know it's scary seeing a picture of a black person but she dies literally four sentences after being introduced
>but muh superior Aryan genetics
go back to community college with your "superior" Aryan blood

>I've never seen people get so triggered over something so fucking stupid.

I, on the other hand, just witnessed it in your post.

>Settings are based off famous European myths.
>Annoyed that modern racial demographics are applied.

Do a fantasy Bantu setting and throw in random white people into the tribes people, it'll have the same effect. An unexplained break to the settings narrative just annoys people.

No it won't. Because it won't be posted by a /pol/tard.

Kaladsh is full of white people and nobody's complaining, they're just making the same shit joke repeatedly

>be medieval
>not murder moors on site
The fuck is wrong with you?

I make the setting and arbitrate. If a character doesn't suspend disbelief enough without a rational explanation to it I will reject it.

I'm not saying it isn't possible, only it's such an anomaly and will be treated as such. By not giving a decent explanation and expecting me to pick up the slack it only proves their lack of interest in the setting.

>he disagreed with me, that means he's triggered

Culture, language and religion was different from one tribe to another, the Romans hired Germans for centuries to fight other tribes of Germans.

I was going to address that topic but I thought it was obvious you wouldn't swap people from one side of the world to the other.

From Britain to Gaul would be sufficient.

>And like I said it reeks of bullshit in terms of the analogy of Europe.

Nig, Africans were present at all European courts in such small numbers. Even Mozart's Freemason's lodge had an African member. Its perfectly in line with the period it's quoting in that image.

>We'd get pissed if it was a Dwarf originating from an Elven city with no decent explanation.
Yes, go on and shitpost about Carrot Ironfoundersson.

That is actually not true, I very much dislike Kaladesh for that reason.

Loved the old Arabian Nights set though.

>instead of ignoring the thread like any sane person would do you were so triggered you had to come into the thread and bitch about its existence
>then when someone calls you out on it you deny that you're assmad

It never gets old

You might dislike it but I have seen literally no complaints about it. I've seen more people complaining it'll just be brown people than I've seen complaints that there's white people

>It's like saying you'd find a significant number of Greeks in ancient China

Ironically there was a significant number of Jews there thanks to Alexander, who retain a separate continuous identity to this day.

I never argued significant. But the ones that did go would be dis-proportionally represented due to both rarity as well as the different views of identity regarding ethnicity and culture. Nationalism wasn't really a thing for most of history, and even when it was there were important and significant differences in how it was expressed and defined.

Like when people say Greece was a democracy just like America. No, Greek democracy was direct democracy instead of representational at one point, then representational, than Roman. Ignoring the fact that only Citizens could vote, and citizenship was only available to Men, who weren't slaves, and lived in the Polis, with other qualifiers such as a minimum amount of individual wealth, or taxes paid instead, or political affiliation and participation.

Hell, American Democracy has changed drastically and several times alone but most people don't know that.

So you can't assume that Medieval Gentry and cultures would react the same way as we would to foreigners from other nations or ethnicities. Definitely not race, because that didn't exist as a recognizable concept back then for people.

It would be far more important about the wealth and social status of the person regardless of their culture or appearance. It was assumed that men who ruled did so by divine right and inherent superiority. Sure that got messy at times like with the Crusades and Islamic expansion, but even then it was more about religious affiliation than and intrinsic quality. Better to break bread with a Persian that had converted, than a Frank who had lapsed in his devotion, or embraced a heretical creed.

Added complications are that the term Moor was used inconsistently for only northern non-Negroids, but also for just any African.

Oh that's not me, I ignored your faggotry. that's some other user calling you a faggot

So take it up with them, I'm agreeing it's stupid.

>Obvious high medieval plate armour
>Brings up Mozart born 300 years later

ITT: People complain about a single individual being in an improbable location

Like the way Russians use 'blacks' to describe anyone even remotely swarthy. Probably because they have basically no social contact with proper sub-Saharans.

Oh I've no problem with you, your opinion is apperently consistent at the very least and doesn't reek of stormfaggotry. Unlike the whole trend of bitching over literally anything that isn't white in magic

>Carrot Ironfoundersson
Notice how I said no decent explanation, his presence is explained well enough in the setting.

As for the first point how does Mozart's company affect something based on the high middle ages? I'm not denying a few Africans existed in Europe in the middle ages but again it's anomalous enough that it warrants an explanation beyond head canon.

>people
>of colour
>people

Nigger there werent even blacks in northern africa back then, you even being north of the sahara is a modern occurence, that will be rectified

Why blue is way more OP?

I will agree people seem fairly hypocritical about it, while when their ethno-cultural (not necessarily theirs) get shoe horned in other places they're fine with it, but when their's is getting reskinned they're up in arms.

>high middle ages
>plenty of folks with 15th-16th century fashion elements
>one albion who's wearing scifi armour
>two Dark Souls ripoffs
>a woman dressed in a fantasy 17th century piece

Reminder that the High Middle Ages were the age of mail, mail everywhere and that image looks like it's trying to quote 19th century paintings of revolutionaries.

Holy shit, guys there's even an Albion there. They're like 1:20.000 rare.

Dwarf in an Elven city? Clearly he was on a quest to help his cousin reclaim his ancestral treasure and home from a foe that had driven them out in his fathers day. Partially for greed, partially for glory, partially to avenge his father who disappeared with some others who had been broken by the tragedy, leaving behind only a note that promised they would redeem themselves and scattered writings about secret doors, ancient oaths and possible allies who abandoned them and were not to be trusted again.

At some point, they journeyed unknown through Elven territory and offended the King first by disrupting his court, next by refusing to explain their presence, third by claiming debt for they were one of the allies that did failed them first when they were attacked, second when they needed and were refused refuge, and a third time when they offered no aid or hand towards the Dwarves vengeance and return to their ancestral home.

This cousin of the King uncrowned, a true friend and companion in this dangerous task that held no surety of success or even survival, much less reward, was nonetheless there for love of his cousin and fellow dwarves. for love of his King Uncrowned but still of noble bearing and demeanor, for love of his people and the wonders they had built and left behinid, and of their future. This dwarf who had not just lust but love blinded an elf maiden who saw it shine.

While he had to leave behind the city and the maiden, she managed to talk to him about what she saw, and when he answered they found themselves sharing love between them as well.

Now his quest is done, there was loss but also success, and while riches and status there were his to claim he could only do what he had always done and followed his love back to the city.

And there he stayed. Rough, crude by their standards, a dull stone among fair and shining folk, none could send him off because beside him for love the Maiden blazed fairest of all, of any ever seen.

Albino.

And the belief of a relationship between Albinos and vampires is a common one in various cultures around the world.

>Notice how I said no decent explanation
"The kingdom completely forgot that they had a queen and a king and a heir right after the vehicle had toppled over, so the future king was raised by dwarfs."

I would accept that if the player gave me that. But the complaint I laid was expecting it to fly with no decent explanation.

Because Americans need to shove black Americans into everything for (((some))) reason.

actually...

The Kingdom didn't know it had anyone left of the royal lineage and it's a satirical take on fantasy tropes. Which on the Discworld only makes it a more viable explanation.

Let's put it another way: what would be the benefits of having no black people whatsoever in Innistrad? It's not a historical setting so it doesn't need to stay true to any source material. What we lose by having a black girl among the adventurers here? Really?

If I remember correctly, this is the same setting with the 2.5-storey tall hypno-toad, various Frankenstyle monsters and, lately, variety-store tentacle monsters?

To be honest, can't say I mind. Oh, but if you really need a reason, say a Planeswalker from Amonkhet shagged someone a bit back.

Hell, if she wasn't there we wouldn't have the excellent entertainment of watching neanderthals try to articulate why her presence upsets them.

Sage, report, hide, forget

It's funny how the racist's history of the USA can basically be summed up as: "White people dinuf and aren't dunuf."

> Implying Arabs and Muselmen and Moors in Northern Africa didn't enslave blacks in the sub-saharan and sell them off back in the cities to work as if they were beasts.

> Trying to obfuscate the fact that these Muslim cultures and states were the ones who established that people who weren't from Abrahamic religions weren't people but beasts and that slavery of sub-saharan Africans was their natural state, and that they weren't just different from them culturally or ethnically, but intrinsically as a matter of spirit and body.

The reason they were present then and are present now is because Islam is a crap fanfiction of the Torah made by a SJW with all the hypocrisy and fear of criticism as well as the kind of murder modern SJWs wish they could use to convert or silence others.

And since it was used by and on Arabs, they pretty much used it to justify being cunts. They view relationships as being tiers of opponents that only ally against greater foes.

"Me against my brother. Me and my brother against our father. My family against the tribe. The tribe against the other tribes, and all of us tribal groups against the cities, the nation against the other Muslim nations, and all of Islam against the world. We were all of us alone at all times, and without an enemy to stand together against we were unable to turn our back to each other."

Ever wonder why North Africa and the ME is shit? Arabs can't help but backstab each other if they see weakness. Israel won because nobody was willing to pull troops from their allies borders for fear of invasion, within the nations the rulers steal with one hand and point at Israel, America, and other Arabs with the other and say "They are why".

At least when a Persian calls you brother he doesn't mean that you'll be the last one he betrays.

Giant European Hypno-toads are an important part of US history, user. When they had finally made the crossing around 1500 AD, they convinced all the Americans to leave so that the English could dot an empty continent with free farmers.

And in that sense WotC is doing God's work, providing us with countless hours of entertainment at the behest of our...less fortunate brethren.

Statistically speaking, lower rates of rape, murder, and theft.

Assamites don't become "people black" as they got older, they become "black black".

It's from the movie The Hobbit. Remember, the one dwarf, I want to say Gimli, has a romantic subplot with an elf chick they inserted for that purpose? I didn't actually see the movie, but I remember the bitching about it.

Oh, was there ever bitching.

But yeah, he's the youngest and surprises her that he can be charming and witty with words, she's never before met a dwarf and was prejudiced but like in an ignorant way not a malicious or "I went to school in a dwarf majority district and got beat up every day for having pointy ears' or "I'm a meth-head redneck elf that's on the bottom of the totem pole, and has no actual skills, assets, or achievements of value. But at least I'm better than a dwarf, and I'll justify that by intrinsic elf qualities that I pick, because if I compare myself to other elves, or dwarves on anything except how elvish they aren't, then I'll lose."

I believe they ended up together at the end of the movie, when the elves come to extort, er, claim a share of treasure for the dwarves trespassing and shit.

>implying there is anything wrong with racism.
>mfw "refugees" are leaving in droves from my homeland willingly because of Finns being racist as fuck, whereas the "so open and tolerant" countries like Sweden and Germany will become mudslime shitholes in the next century due to sheer demographic shifts that they have allowed to happen in their lands.

Racism wins again!

Nah, he died.

Well, vampires do often come in black, I don't see why you're complaining

nice digits desu

Honestly, I like arguing this stuff. It's subjective to the extent of making any argument for or against pointless and irrelevant. Which gives a lot of latitude for picking what you want to argue and how to argue it.

Anyways, who is the dark chocolate in the pic?

/pol/ is preferable to smut tho.
Smut fags need to die in fire.

You're all forgetting that Innistrad is not Earth, and shares neither its geography nor history.

Traders from Nephalia could easily be swarthy foreigners from a far-off land, and settle in on the coast, or migrate further inland after a generation or two.

This is a continent where "christianity" was founded and widely instituted about a thousand years ago, and the primary tenants of the religion involve the eradication of non-human monsters. Literally any normal human is met with far less suspicion once you can confirm they're not a vampire or werewolf.

But see, the functional thing here is that you're guarding against a dangerous ideology. And if you're doing it because "brown people", that might work now, but what happens once the "mudslime shitholes" you're near start resulting on European converts, and then those European converts come to Finland, and they don't look like Arabs? Guarding against one dangerous, flawed belief system with another dangerous, flawed belief system is always going to leave gaps to be exploited.

>WE WUZ DRACULAS N SHEEEEEIT

If hitler had won the war none of this would happen. Can you imagine a world without filthy niggers, kikes, or zipperheads?