As you sit at the table and begin to make your character...

Well, spoiler alert, this was just something I was thinking of doing a test run of. The loss of hit die is across the board, so everything, including monsters, has radically reduced health at higher levels, because damage sponge systems are some shit.

I'm a freeflow kind of DM, and I like more theatrical, memorable games, so the loss of HP is really to unnerve the players than actually make the game stupidly hard. Now instead of just waltzing through trash mobs and traps, they'll be a bit more paranoid about that random hit, because HP is much more precious now.

I roll a wizard with 9 Con.

Rolled 5, 4, 6, 5, 1, 4, 1, 5, 6, 4, 5, 4, 4, 1, 5, 5, 3, 1 = 69 (18d6)

Sweet, let's roll

I was thinking just rolling a cleric and keeping the party in Hit points all day erry day.

Turns game to rocket tag, who plays first slays first, initiative and burst damage become the best things ever. Not great for D&D (but I love this shit).

Reconsider and/or add some sponge mechanics such as weapon parrying, damage mitigation through some use, and so on.

>STR 15
>DEX 10
>CON 12
>INT 13
>WIS 10
>CHA 9

fuck yeah warrior master class

How does dual-classing work in whatever system this is

You'll probably need to tone down damage as well. Anything more than a single dice will probably be deadly.

I think you could mitigate this by using the armor as DR system. That could let the players shave off a few points from each attack, and it helps ensure that the high hit die classes that have heavier armor don't totally lose out on bulk.

Meh. Could be good or could be shit.

Well, I mean, id like to think the party will just have to play smart about things. Suddenly that dire wolf is fuck all scary instead of a bundle of xp and lol d6+2 bite damage.

Shit, people normally play like they're part of SWAT, going through rooms and hallways as slowly as possible to make sure nothing jumps out and murders them all. I also don't get off on killing PC's. It's all about the mind games, less so about me power tripping.

There is that, but lets say the party is careful about where they go and what they encounter. They could start in the city dealing with cut throats using daggers. That crazy barbarian in the hills using a giant plow as a sword is suddenly something they don't want to leroy into.

My players go full SWAT, almost every battle. Shit's fun, but you godda let them have a few boons so they feel in control, like nullifying attacks, sharing damage, tanking or flashbangs or something.

Though, if your players aren't SWAT they're gonna have a really shit time. Train them up with how surprise rounds are amazing, and a couple of levels down the line spring an ambush on them.

Go find a group that isn't playing d&d or Pathfinder.

Fair. I'm mainly talking about stuff like high level demons that have uber longsworss that do 4d8 damage for some reason.

You can have stuff be strong, but the players are unlikely to get much more than 60 health unless they really focus on it, and most are more likely to be hovering around the 30s or 40s. A greatsword swing doing a solid 12 damage is going to be dangerous, one of these bigger creatures that does 20 damage a swing and has 4 attacks is basically a tpk

Dialing it back down towards more normal weapon sizes, or at least making it easier to get some damage resistance would help give a bit of wiggle room.

Rolled 6, 3, 5, 4, 3, 1, 3, 5, 3, 1, 6, 4, 3, 4, 3, 6, 1, 1 = 62 (18d6)

Rocket tag, which is already a problem, becomes the only game in town rather than the major game in town.

Wizards & Fighters now do not have radically different health. HAHA suck a dick fighters.

No but really this is just a big middle finger to martials if you're playing a D&D derivative (which I assume you are because hit dice).

ALSO a character with less than 10 con goes DOWN in hit points as he levels up.

Also rolling character.

Str: 14
Dex: 8
Con: 11
Int: 11
Wis: 10
Cha: 8

I guess I'm a fighter.

No but seriously this dicks over martials, because one of their selling points is much larger HD (1d4 for a wizard, 1d12 for a barbarian).

>Step aside first-level wizard, craftsman will save the girls

Invalid Wizard casts Expeditious Retreat!

True. That's why I suggested using the armor as DR system, so that martial would have that extra bit of bulk going for them.

As well, save or die spells are less useful, as enemies won't have nearly as much health. It makes it a bit easier for a fighter to easily slay enemies, while the Wizard will be needing to use more defensive spells to stay alive.

That said, I wouldn't use 3.5 for this personally. It's not a great system even if you tweak the balance.

Make armor part of your AC, but also allow it to reduce damage.

Make parrying and dodging a much more active part of the game too.

I developed a failsafe for low HP games.

Lemme post the rules.

-Successful reflex save when using shield allows user to block projectiles and touch attacks (base reflex save + shield armor bonus Vs. targets attack or DM DC)

-Casters require no materials (save for holy items for divine casters), non-spontaneous casters must have a spell/holy book and must find a place to learn the spells
they want for each level, requiring 1 day per level of the spell learned. To learn the spells, depending on the setting, it can be easier or harder to find spells to learn,
either being located in arcane colleges, forgotten ruins and tombs, or within other realms/dimensions. Cantrips/Level 0 spells are always considered to be pre-recorded in
a non-spontaneous casters spell book.

-HP is now based on Constitution score + constitution bonus -/+ size. So if a character is medium, has 14 Con and a +2 bonus, they have 16 HP. If they are small, they
recieve a -1 to HP, if they are tiny they recieve a -2. Like-wise the opposite is true for larger enemies, where Large characters have a +1 bonus to total HP, huge have a
+2, and so on. Characters can not have less than 1 HP.

-Any form of armor or natural armor now also acts as Damage Reduction. For natural armor, any weaknesses the creature may have nullifies damage reduction from their
natural armor. Bludgeoning weapons ignore half of any DR rating, piercing weapons ignore DR upon a critical hit, slashing weapons may dismember limbs upon a successful
crit (Fortitude save vs Damage after damage reduction taken into account)

I also modded out casters to play differently, but don't have enough space to fit it. Death is also a lot more permanent.

Keep going

-Reviving someone does not work if they; died of old age, were decapitated, melted, disintegrated, petrified, cut in half, immolated, exploded, crushed, or eaten (Those who
are frozen can be revived only if they are not shattered) (miracle and wish spells do not function in any of these cases)

-Casters are limited to the level of spells they can cast of 10 + (spell level) based on their associated ability score which they use to cast spells, so a Sorcerer with
14 Charisma cannot cast 5th level spells. Sorcerers now pick 2 schools of magic that they are magically gifted in (Abjuration, Conjuration, Divination, Enchantment,
Evocation, Illusion, Necromancy, Transmutation) and may cast any spell from those 2 schools if they are the proper level, in accordance with their allowed spells per day.
For balancing reasons, Universal spells count as a "school".

wait, with that ruleset...does that mean that you die at lvl 7? 6 hp lvl 1 -1 per lvl

Question: If one single attack downs a PC to -10, what's he to do?
Bargain fate points, lose a limb or something? Pure death by chance would be extremely cheap in rocket-tag D&D.
That's my greatest fear; one-shotting a PC right-out feels incredibly cheap. Maybe if they're out of Luck/Fate/Stamina?

I disagree with your HP system, for it doesn't differentiate between classes and it feels like size isn't that big of a deal. Also, Constitution gets "double-dipped" for HP.
Maybe add Con + Str mods to base Class Hit Die? That should be in the range of 6 - 18.

It *could* work and I tried homebrewing PF about 6 years back (what a futile task), but there are much better options out there, even within D&D (2e or 5e).

>Question: If one single attack downs a PC to -10, what's he to do?

Instant death. But you have to really sell it.

>The Ettin swings in your direction with its great club

Based on the circumstance, if it's the result of the Ettin not aiming and swinging wildly, a Reflex save could be offered if the Ettin were to actually hit them, so, a hit that would normally demolish a rogue or sorcerer could be dodged

>You deftly dodge out of the path of the Ettin's enormous wood and bone club.

OR

>You fail to react in time, the Ettin's massive club smacks against you and flings you across the room, causing you to crash into a wall. You collapse in a heap as blood begins pouring out of your shattered bodies mouth.

If you make it spectacular enough, it can soften the blow.

Make a pastebin for this, I might run this for friends if I can get the solid numbers

>I disagree with your HP system, for it doesn't differentiate between classes and it feels like size isn't that big of a deal. Also, Constitution gets "double-dipped" for HP.

I could make it Constitution score + constitution bonus -/+ size + Hit Die, instead.

No, you don't die till -10. But permanently being at -1 would be a permanent coma.

Also, this is for Wizards, I left this out:

-Wizards no longer need to memorize their spells, instead relying on their spellcraft skill. The check to cast a spell for a wizard is 15 + the spells level. While they no
longer need to remember spells, and can thus cast as many times per day as they like, failure to cast a spell causes a Wizard to age take non-lethal damage equal to 1 x
(spell level).

Still not sure how balanced it is.

If he wants gritty fantasy he shouldn't be playing D&D.

pastebin.com/cDfjjn3R

There's the paste-bin.

causes a Wizard to take*

I literally have no idea what you are even talking about.
Is that some 3.X related bullshit?

is this a ruse?

Fantastic. I'll run this by my group and see what they think.

That goes from Wizard with +0 Con (14)
Wizard with +3 Con (23)
Fighter with +3 Con (29)
Barbarian +5 Con (37)

It's a tad flighty compared to the old calculation (but still on the low scale), and heavily depends on how much damage per round etc. a character can take.
Main gripe is Con double-dip, making Con the god of HP gain and an extremely important stat for absolutely everyone.

Still, this ensures a base of 14-22 of HP on any character and that's nice, so I think it's ok.

pastebin.com/sEtkVt6t

Here's an alternate version where I tweaked it to make things a little more clear.

I designed it with a static HP score in mind, in a Sword and sorcery setting.

play a character with negative con bonus and watch the world burn.

This is a non answer.

A better answer would be to stop trying to turn 3.5/pf into something that it is not.

So a nerf that primarily effects martials? Just what the system nedded.

"I'ma just make three or four backup characters now, 'K?
"No, not cohorts. Replacements."

If DM is someone I've played with before I'd play a wizard, not much different than usual desu. If it's a new group I make some excuses and drop out, this shit reeks of tryhard muh challung bullshit.

Increase casting time up one step for all spells. Bonus becomes move, move becomes action, action becomes full, full becomes two turns. OR maybe just make all spells not a full action full and have full take two turns. increases chance to interrupt spells.

Now we juzt need some way to lower high damage spells, otherwise this is all for not. Have a damage spell do its ase dice type in damage and incease up to its maximum damage by having the caater channel for a number of turns. for example fireball would deal 1d6 if cast right away, but if channeled for 5 turns would do 5d6.

I wonder why we are playing D&D instead of a lethal system.

Wonder how he plans to handle someone with a penalty. It would mean elves can't live because they have that natural penalty and all.

Nerf spell dice more or less the way your nerf hit dice. A 5d6 fireball would do 1d6+4

Most weapons use one die for damage, so there's your answer for the people who complain about fighty types getting screwed. Go ahead and nerf BFS tier weapons, too: that ridiculous greatsword that does 3d6 now does 1d6+2.

I was thinking about similar thing, but as a means to convert existing spells and creatures from D&D manuals to another setting.

So far got this:

CON score becomes HP
>No more taking 20 hits with 2hander to make a scratch
Armour based AC turns into DR
>It doesn't protect your character from getting hit landed on
>It protects you from damage coming from that hit
All of dice multipliers become flat bonus
>10d6 Fireball turns into 10+d6 fireball
>The better you are the better control of power you have
Also
>Classes are lifted and feats become stat / skill restricted
>Magic has its own skills (required to learn spells) based around spell schools

Considering giving armour some positive / negative traits when it comes to protection against magic:
>acid bonus vs armour
>fire bonus vs cloth
>ice penalty vs armour
>...and so on

This. My bard stacks all the cards in his favor before he starts a fight alone, and always tries to talk first.

Maybe thats the point, and he really hates elves

So much this. All the sudden that fireball you saved for half on kills you. A 5th lever martial normally would get singed, now they're dead. Your rules are basically Caster: The Game

I do a 360° and moonwalk out.

As I do that, I apologize but this is not the game for me.

On a more serious note: why play D&D when you could play GURPS or... any other system, really?

I start writing secondary and tertiary characters.

Does it apply to monsters too?

Make sure to put a high stat in CON, or at the very least avoid a negative con score.

Probably roll barbarian.

Put my highest score into constitution?

>ALSO a character with less than 10 con goes DOWN in hit points as he levels up.
That's what you get for playing someone with a frail body. The rigors of adventuring take their toll.

This.

I'm going to want a statistical breakdown at all levels, visually graphed.

If it checks out, I'm in.

/thread

Then, to answer the real question you should be asking:

You're going to have to also rebalance damage and number of attacks.

My advice would be to run the numbers, and come up with a generalized adjustment table for attack damage and another for spells, and another for dr, by level.

It's going to take actual work if you don't want it to be a cluster fuck.

Run e3 Pathfinder, instead of e6 or e8.

I corrected your image for you OP

>Not great for D&D (but I love this shit).
Literally the way the game began, even though maybe I understand how you feel.

>>, initiative and burst damage become the best things ever

really encourages sneaking up on people to get surprise rounds, no?

Modern day D&D editions don't paly the way 1e does, so you're trying to jam a square peg in a round fuck you.

Early D&D could be pretty gritty, at least until you got to higher levels.

I'm not talking about 1e I'm talking about 0e.

>Armour based AC turns into DR
It's a good idea to up damage if you do this so as not to overly-penalize low-damage weapons.

...

Well I sure as shit don't have a negative CON bonus at chargen!

There are better ways of constraining hit points.

>Scholar has less health than an actual invalid
Woooow.

He hasn't mentioning supersede ng the "minimum 1hp per level" rule.

>It's a good idea to up damage if you do this so as not to overly-penalize low-damage weapons
Basically STR and DEX bonuses would also add to damage done in their respective fields.
In addition to that Armour DR could still be damaged (read: DR lowered) through smart use of magic / enchantments / traps.

So martials lose yet another advantage (the bigger HD).

As if I needed any more reasons to play a wizard.

Underrated post.

>levels
>hit points that increase with levels anyhow
>judging from game terms most likely some d20 crap

I laugh at his face for being a faggot who HAS TO PLAY D&D even if his ideas are not compliant with it.