Song of Swords: Meanwhile, in Poland

Playing an SoS game in Rokugan before my club Halloween party. Pretty good day.

Huh. I'm seeing the new ads at the top.

It's both for me.

Well clearly Veeky Forums/Revcontent just hates you.

4chin isn't making me money so prease buy 4chin pass

Why don't we post more Revvy?

Who is Revvy?

Because best girls must be conserved.

isnt revvy into femdom?

When it pays the bills. She's also got a solid case of prison gay.

How does that answer the question?

No idea, I don't know what it is

revy is a character from the manga/anime black lagoon

Oh, so what's special about her?

Lads, is it time to give up? Is Soon a lie?

It's memery, Jimmy joked about her being best girl, apparently everyone who watches the show disagrees.

Nay. I have it on good authority that Soon has reached its ninth epoch

>jimmy attempting to expand his waifu folder
How about you release a game first you homosexual?

Speaking of releasing games, chapter 12 of BoB is out.

grandheresy.com/downloads/

...

Seems legit. Hopefully we get an sosbupdate soon.

>We've all seen With Fire and Sword at this point
I have not.

This looks very barebones. I don't like that Reflex/Wits doesnt fighters react and move faster in a fight.

One v you infidel.

Cancerous, characterless shitter that makes all musclegirl-fags (i.e. everyone in this thread) furiously erect.

God damn I wish that show had been better.

The whole film is on youtube, subtitled. It's really good.

Since there's a thread I may as well pop my quick question in:

In the SoS book it says that Charisma is whatever 3 stats divided by two. Is that supposed to be divided by three? I have a player who keeps throwing like 15+ charisma dice at every problem. I keep telling him 'charisma isn't mindcontrol' but my wife put me on a low salt diet and his reactions are endangering that.
I mean he's getting saltier and saltier

I know they were famous for using a sort of short spear, I remember learning the name at some point in a history class but I can't remember it now. They were also obviously known for being sick with the saber.

I also know that Sienkiewicz did embellish the savagery of the Cossacks significantly, even borrowing from the United States' conflicts with certain Indian tribes to make them seem more savage. The real Cossacks were very disciplined and fearless fighters, not at all a rabble of thugs. Well, maybe they were that too, but they were a very orderly rabble of thugs.

They also used tabors during battles making them close to untouchable by cavalry.
The same tactics was used by hussites.

Yes, there were disciplined groups of Cossaks. There were some that stayed loyal to the crown (Poland) after Chmielnicki uprising, because they were true soldiers, and they felt that soldiers duty is above all.
But vast majority of these people were poor and simple minded peasantry. They spent most of their times farming, hunting or fishing when they weren't riding for one or the other land lord.
Put a weapon to their hand, take out the law and group morality goes to hell.

That depends if you mean the movie or the game system.

Who would you rather bump uglies with, eskarne or revvy? Eskarne has the looks, but I think Revvy would be able to keep things interesting longer.

You should stop. I do not know what you are trying to accomplish here, but I detect that you are posting in poor faith.

>Since there's a thread
There's always a thread.

I have no idea so bump.

It is intentionally by 2.

Anyone tested this out yet?

There is an example of skirmish rules in action so yes

I like that Space Pinochet coexists with Space Hitler and Space Mussolini in Ballad.

Wait, is this all true? Do space-Cadorna's dumb ideas actually work too?

It's more like space-Bismarck, because he's like immortal now or something.

Space Hitler is probably the court painter or something.

Nah, the Lucani don't get completely fucked. It sounds more like there's a Space Messe or Space Baistrocchi in charge.

>Italy as an actual power
wew lad

No Decimation? Lame.

Yeah, Space Chile has some generalissimo who throws a bunch of commies straight into the underspace on his birthday every year.

Were the Unkindlies official material or homebrew?

So... when the game is gonna be finished?

Last time I've checked, it was supposed to be done by end of October.

but why, though? Why is Charisma so damn high?

Because convincing anyone of anything was really hard before.

I'm pretty sure they're official, Jimmy has spoken of them in lore before and released the rules himself.

Yeah they're super official, their blood brew stat boosting stuff was the first real taste of magic we got.

Fellow people who will never run an SoS game because their group only runs narrativist shit, where would you set an SoS game if you could?

I'm partial to Dace myself. Lots of opportunity for bloody republican action, and you can shoot Jimmy's waifu.

It will be done in June 2014.

>first
>implying it's not the only we'll ever get

It currently is by two, but it should probably be by three.

The social combat system really just needs a more thorough rework. It's not as bad as pre-Ballad initiative, but it needs something.

>The social combat system
We don't have social combat system, do we?

That's rather what I'm getting at.

"Use your charisma to mind control" is rudimentary social combat.

Rudimentary social combat would be "I initiate defensive mind grapple, 8 dice. Next turn I trap his mind with words and break his brain zone X my charisma dropkick next exchange, Level 5 Wound, he is my loyal puppet now"

I'd be down for that.

Dace: Horrible country, full of ratniggers, brutal satire of "le serene republic" meme. Has Gizka and the hedgehog snek man.

Krajina: Slavs oppressing the Eternal Anglo, longbows are illegal, sad eels. Pretty great campaign stories from this place so far.

Kaselreich: Cursed forest, horrible Imperial bureacracy, Germans. The Kasonic Order sounds pretty great for antagonists or allies.

Iber: Spanish swordsmen, Moors on Chocobos, Elf-Basques who eat people.

I'd do it in the Reich because my players don't know anything about Medieval Germany so it'd feel very fantastic to them.

Historical:
Fall of the Ming
Napoleonic Wars
Renaissance city-states, dicking around as condottieri or perpetuating pointless family feuds

Vosca:
Intrigue, Honour and Wine in Galli
Burdinadin clean up team and auxiliaries sent to investigate a Glade gone dark
Super Sentai Paladin Team Go!

Other Fantasy:
Island hoping Bronze Age relic collecting
Some pointless war for salt
Mage-Agents of the Crown sent on covert operations for Queen and Country

I ran a KODP themed game set on a bunch of islands, which were populated by iron-age tribes.

It was actually set in the Broken Sea of Tattered Realms, the tribes were the proto-human and Dinnic cultures that eventually came to populate the rest of Vosca
Also I'm Jimmy Rome

I love the anachronistic medieval special forces stuff that always seems to come across as an excuse for MGS with knights, which I am totally down for. Best places for that would be Dace as we saw with Vlatkofecht, or in the slivers for the Clach frogmen. GOATfecht also did it great in Kurtiye, so really I think anywhere would work.

Jenoesa seemed like a good spot too. Crusades solid snek anyone?

I think separate time scales are important. One of the things that make WoD social combat a shitshow is how it's assumed that all social combat will occur over the course of months and everything is balanced around that.

I feel like Near and Far modes of social combat might be important. Middle one isn't really necessary I don't think. Grand strategy is emergent, so there's no reason to make it specific to Far. Far should just be everything where more than 1-2 encounters are planned for and leveraged upon, because any system is going to break down if it tries to plan too far ahead, but SOME structure is nice.
Additionally, the manipulation of crowds should be separate from the manipulation of individuals. At least for Far modes, manipulation of crowds heavily depends on one's ability to administrate, rather than pure charisma.

I propose the adoption of some pseudoscientific principles of social manipulation. They tend to be more evocative, intuitive and easily implementable within narratives, despite being factually incorrect.

If SoS is already turning slightly modular, I would posit that brewing ideas for the engineers of the human soul could lead to fun

I'm inclined to agree. Though nobody likes microexpression reading as a mechanic, makes it too hard to justify non-modern people being able to deceive at all.

That'd be similar to the Game of Thrones RPG, could work.

...

Ah yes, the Protectorate is clearly a feasible long term government entity.
Nothing to see here, move along.

I can't remember, did the Void have a Spanish Civil War type thing, or is the only voidSpain lore we have that they flipped South America to dump all the pesky natives with half the fuss?

Who the what? Explain this lore to me.

I think the Not!Spanish empire was more successful in general, but we have no real indication of what went on with them during recent times.

In Laserwhaleverse, Chiron keeps a bunch of conquered countries as semi-autonomous protectorates who they use to fight proxy-wars and to avoid expending their own manpower early in conflicts.

The problem is this requires that these countries be heavily militarized, so Chiron is basically encouraging a bunch of people who hate them to stockpile arms and raise huge militaries. The arrangement is not sustainable, and will almost certainly result in another huge war.

AFTER-HALLOWEEN SPOOK TUESDAY

youtube.com/watch?v=z4YH1xzF35g

There is a town in Galli, in the Duchy of Lutancoup, where people go missing and forgotten.
Not homeless people or drunks, but respectable members of society. Town officials. Craftsmen whose assignments are due, tradesmen whose debts must be paid. They simply vanish. A Dacian steel firm was the first to notice, when an enormous shipment of forged pickaxe heads went unpaid for, and filed a complaint with the Baron of the region. When it went unanswered, they filed a complaint with the Count. When that went unanswered, they filed a complaint with the Duke. When that went unanswered, they closed off all shipments to the country until the King sent them a reply:

"What is a Lutancoup?" the reply came, "and where in my demesne does it reside?"

It is in the center of the country, not a few leagues south of the capital. Yet no man in Galli can name the province, nor can any recall its space existing. What was thirty leagues has become fifteen. What was fifty has become ten. The place has been erased from every Gallian map, and every Gallian mind. But the Dacians, the Illegosi, the Kamens, they remember.

What sits at the dark heart of this nonexistent province? Men have been dispatched to find the truth. One group of five returned as three, and insisted they had found nothing. They also insisted that there had only ever been three of them. Many agents did not return at all. None could attest to events--even, in one instance, under torture.

Only one man returned with information--the mad servant of a Gallain inspector, who spoke of screaming and mouths in the streets that ate his master.

The King of Galli has quietly placed a large reward on answers. The Dacian Steel Export Guild has started assembling a team of madmen to investigated. The Unkindlies have recently reported that a raven from the King's coop may have gotten lost in Galli...

kek, finally this spooky shit was giving me a headache.

Wait are you Blind Hitler dude?
Narrativists should fucking love SoS.

that's at least 4 spook.

I'm thinking about, finally, introducing this game to my group. Starting with random fechts, instead of full blown scenario.
Some ideas:
>Tavern brawl and/or avenging lost honor in renaissance Italy. Caravaggio-style dueling dickstabbery ensues. Not many scenarios better suited for introducing players to this very core concept of SoS.
>Romans, after some nightly debauchery, are returning home through Suburbium. Suddenly they find themselves prey in a decadent manhunt run by patricians craving the excitement thrill of taking someone's life.
>Late medieval jousting tournament. Probably lighthearted one, like in a Knight's Tale Are there even jousting rules?

been watching some re:zero ya fuckin weeb?

Well, microexpressions aren't pseudoscientific, just not studied rigorously in-depth enough yet.

I'm thinking more in the vein of manipulating people's humors (individual Near has an obvious way to do so, but aggregate humors could work for collective Near, and transubstantiation for Far for example) and playing to the related character traits.
Social skills let you decipher a person's temperament, the ways in which he's most easily persuaded or dissuaded (maybe use early models of rhetoric and assign a preference for each method of argumentation, with WIL giving points that can be distributed or something?), as well as attempt to transubstantiate in case their temperament combined with their preferences don't allow for an argument in favor of your own goals, or just roll with modifiers based on using these aspects properly.
Maybe taking some cues from video games with social combat systems like Desu Sexu: Human Relations?

It's disgustingly convoluted but could be fun.

The problem arises of keeping it from turning into a boring rolling simulator of "find the square, put in square hole"
One could conceal the numbers and simply imply through descriptions what they are, but that makes the communication of the GM and the players (and the social acumen of both, as the GM needs to know what behavior implies what, and the players likewise), so this is a poor option

Another could be to make social combat interactive like regular combat, have the defender do stuff too. It does make social combat drag on a bit more, and usually social combat is a 1-on-1 thing so others might get bored, but I think using the mechanics of declaring orientation and emphasizing these might help. But then you can end up with rock-paper-scissors if the orientation is too important, and an unimportant waste of time if not.

This isn't official art, is it?
Because it sure looks fitting

It's art from Degenesis, though yeah there definitely is some overlap.

Well let's capture a classic example of real social combat, in the format of a debate. Fighting each other for dominance of a crowd.

youtube.com/watch?v=UKiBk3zG4CY

In this we see speaker A set up a simple "Insult" manoeuvre analogous to a strike or thrust to damage B in the crowds eye's, B counters with a "Comeback" manoeuvre analogous to a riposte a risky play but B is confident enough that his reply can raise the stakes with quick wit and embarrass A.

Ahah.

>Crowd erupts into cheers
Jesus fuck we've become Rome.

While this is a clear social combat and easy to model, the problem is that a pure "debate in front of crowd" format is kind of inflexible and doesn't cover most of the cases in which you'd want such a thing. Crowd HP isn't really appropriate in most cases, and making clever and quick jibes like that either means that the bulk of the social interaction won't be heard by the players but will be "then I say something clever" or will put the onus on the character to match his character's ability to think on his feet, which may not properly align with stats. Not that this problem is entirely avoidable.

Perhaps this is the ultimate fate of all great democracies.

USA isn't Rome until self proclaimed successor states start cropping up.

>I'm thinking more in the vein of manipulating people's humors
SoS is so setting-independent though, it'd be a shame to change that.

>Maybe taking some cues from video games with social combat systems like Desu Sexu: Human Relations?
That game has shitty social combat though.
Really, this is the stem of the problem: There just aren't really examples of good social combat to draw from. The dancing jibes of Socrates and Voltaire should be as fun and dramatic as the dancing blades of Gilgamesh and Hercules, but there is literally no game where that is the case, and thus no good place to draw inspiration.

Perhaps more than the organisms of other games, we should consider the jibes and jests of the negro as he engages in his rap and his dozens.

>all great democracies
You mean merchant republics

I really do think drawing something out from the standing combat system has utility, though not a one-to-one paste.

You could have brief exchanges like jabs a counter points and quick wit, but also long term moves like the point you want to push or the track you're taking in that part of the discussion. You're style and personality could form something like school or stance giving individuality to opponents and yourself.

You can set hard limits to discussion lengths, attack your opponents ego, character or even the substance of their argument if you're really desperate. For proper debate you could have swinging audience opinion dependant on move and hell you could even zoom out further and make a whole election or fight over getting a bill through parliament one big single social combat.

Have some social combat from Bongland.

youtube.com/watch?v=QSAlcr7SEbg

>>Romans, after some nightly debauchery, are returning home through Suburbium. Suddenly they find themselves prey in a decadent manhunt run by patricians craving the excitement thrill of taking someone's life.

«Emperor Nero, that crazy fuck, had a habit of taking his bodyguards, dressing them and himself up as poor men, and going slumming.

»In the poorly lit streets and cheap drinking dens he would get into all sort of hilarious antics. Provoking fights, punching a random passerby in the face, you know, the usual stuff powerful people like to entertain themselves with.

»In the background you can see one of Nero's bodyguards picking up a candle that fell out of the victim's lantern - an item too valuable to leave lying around.

»On the left a typical night life scene in the slum. Two drunk young men from the better part of town are distracted by one pro, while the other pro does his part of the job.

»Notice the detail on the wall - the penis depictions could either be inlaid into the wall for luck (which the penis symbol represented) or might have been a kind of road sign pointing the way to the nearest brothel. To me it represents a very important milestone in my career - the first instance of getting paid for drawing a dick - something we all like to do, but now I'm a pro at it!

»Painted for Desperta Ferro magazine»