Shadow Run General

Nope, actual question. I never played Shadowrun, iI want to start, therefor I asked the general. Take your memes back now.

With the exception of some inexplicably missing Technomancer stuff, 5e is the cleanest and most complete from a mechanical standpoint, and gives the most reasonable (read:least punk) vision of the future from a lore standpoint.

To be honest, large bits of the setting are static enough between editions that older lore books are still useful for 5e and they have no incentive to release new versions. I would suggest starting with 5e and looking through the setting books from older editions if you want a "complete" view of the lore.

>...the bonus of a control rig of an equal rating. The AI is also capable of loading, converting, and using drone autosofts (AI-driven drones use the attributes, skills, and Matrix initiative of the AI). Note that AIs with this quality are only able to operate a particular type of drone or vehicle this way (e.g. aircraft, ground craft, watercraft); any other type of vehicle must be controlled remotely using the Control Device action.

Came to ask the same question. I've heard 2nd edition is good but I also heard 5e was best. I'd be playing with a group that's new to RPG's in general and has never played Shadowrun before, so what would Veeky Forums recommend?

Sorry, took a nap.

I decided early what kind of game I wanted to run and all of my work went to that concept. That made things marginally easier. My general advice would be to establish early what your players will respond well to and what you are comfortable doing. Be familiar with the art of handwavium and try to pinpoint the rules you expect to use frequently and put them aside.

Is a cyber hand worth it? Even if the character is not a rigger?

Do you mean the Hand of God minmaxed shooty arm? Or just getting a cyberhand in general.

With the cyberhand attachment, found in Rigger 5.0. It's basically a detachable, controllable/autonomous hand.

Hand of god is basically max strength, agility and armor cyberarm correct?

>Hand of god is basically max strength, agility and armor cyberarm correct?

Yes, though personally I've never seen the point in going all-in on STR; it's a handy way to shoot, it won't give you the ability to do anything worthwhile in melee. If you get cornered by a razorboy, you're dead whether you can punch with 3 STR or 6 STR.

I've never seen that Scuttler hand used at the table, but I'm hard pressed to think of a great way to use it. They say it's a good way to sneak a drone into an area, but in most such cases security is layered such that someone would notice your hand walking away, and in any case there's not a ton that a single hand can do on it's own. Personally I've always gotten along well with some Fly-Spies and other micro/mini drones; cheap enough that you can have several, and disposable enough that leaving one behind and booking it when corpsec gets suspicious doesn't cripple you (literally the case with the Scuttler).

I was considering the fact that it basically negates cuffs, and the fun you can have combining it with the grapple hand. detach, grab, and reel back.

Minor recoil compensation.

Great advice, this.

The Fist of God thing people talk about is a full arm with max customisation and max enhancement, or 9agi 9str in the case on a human, throw some spurs and that's a 12P AP -2 attack,that's bound to inflict some hurt. And then you do that to a Troll (used limb to save money and keep the availability legal) and you're inflicting 16P with a punch, the accuracy of which is your physical limit, in the case of the Troll assuming no investment in base str (let the Arm do the work) but one off max for reaction and body (5 & 9 respectively) that's 8, 9 if they put any points into their base strength because rounding. Seems like it would have a point to me.

Anyone know a GM looking to help me with a solo campaign? I sorta want to act out a character's prequel. Uuuuugh... Im sleepy... Hold let me type out the damn premise.

>Solo campaign
>Did you mean: Choose Your Own Adventure book?

For real, though, if you've got a character made, find an actual game to play him in, and see if the GM will do a prequel session or something, rather than getting someone to run an entire solo campaign for you. Solo shit, like that, which isn't being run by the same GM who would run an actual game(explicitly for purposes of planting plot hooks and seeds for shit that will happen in the game), might as well just be written out as backstory(with your own plot hooks scattered in, of course). Maybe roll some dice along the way to help you figure out how shit goes down, but that's about the extent you should go to, otherwise.

What said.
If you are trying to figure out something about how the character acts or make up some back story we can always help you brainstorm though.

>3hours later
nigga he ded

>2077
>Not injecting long haul directly into your eyes

So do all Night Ones look like Nightcrawler or what?

>That filename

God i have this just now, got an whole group of new and more advanced players. Everybody got an week to create their char and hand them to me for the O.K..

At the beginnign i offered everybody help with chargen and quite a lot took the offer and where grateful. Also told the basics like 12+ dice to be good at something, legwork is everybodys job... etc. etc.

One Player ask me if he can be prototype transhuman from Ares.
>sure why not.

Goblinized while renraku extracted him and broke free with his new oni body.
>okay also cool.

Sends me his sheet two days late, the day after tomorrow the first session starts.

Got the Sheet and open it.

Oni with mostly mediocre physical attributes for an Gunslinger. oh and the mental stats... OH BOY

1 Willpower
1 Logic
2 Charisma (because oni can't go any lower)
Also 1 edge.

>Mate, wtf is this shit ? why do you want to play a character wit the survival chance of an matchstick in an forest fire ?

Jeah, this will be bore fun to play, also i abuse drugs to get an bonus for combat, and abuse them to qualify for "dead emotion:fear"

>mfw, no, you know what ? i'm way to nice for this shit, go to a forum, ask for advice, do what they tell you and come back.

Why are there people like this ?

Tfw have fellow runner decker with 4 logic who refused to hear my advice and abandon doc wagon plat for cerebral booster 2. He is a good guy and I want him to have fun but he is too afraid of his char dying.

He wasn't a mage was he? Because 4 logic works if you can boost it with spells. Hell, if you go that route it's better to have 4 logic than 5 because of the way that Enhance Attribute (Logic) works.

Well, they don't have tail and their hands/feet are pretty much human, but yeah basically.

Exactly where in the pastebin is it? I can't seem to find it.

But melee is a shitty option unless you go full autist. Not only would you not have the dicepool to overcome the dodge of a razorboy, they'll have way more IP than you; you'll be cut to ribbons against someone who knows what they're doing.

The whole point of the cyberarm is to take a non-combat character and make them decent at fighting with only an investment of nuyen, and the best way to do that is to pump AGI in your arm and use a machine pistol (with a bit of armour and the extra box the replacement limb gives you as a nice side benefit). Going full 9 STR and getting spurs gives you a decent punch, but 'decent at melee' is not worth much; against a real melee opponent you're still dead, and against non-melee-focused enemies it's still better to shoot. is the best reason I can see about going hard on STR.

I'd just like to point out that extremely few deckers are also mages.

So, I asked people and they said if I wanted to play a scary AI overmind, try homebrewing it into a cyberpunk system.
So here I am. How do I play a scary AI overmind type of thing?

1) Be GM
2) Run Renraku Arcology
3) never try to do it as a player, because Deus-tier AI are impossibly powerful

Man, I can only ever play these things as a gm. It is weird to me that supremely powerful wizard is a player role in many games and this isn't.
Oh well, a break from paranoia would be nice anyway.

AIs exist as a thing players can be in Shadowrun(see: Data Trails), I think he's just trying to say that being 'scary AI overmind' is likely to put you beyond the rest of the group.

Oh, that is nice. I dont mind a bit of a nerfed AI, since I know shadowrun wizards aren't dimension making supergods.

That was more of a pet peeve gripe.

I'm putting a line between "AI as presented in Data Trails, which are basically just a program that moves from one device to another," and a real AI overmind like the classic SR AI such as Deus and Megara, which are immensely powerful distributed intelligences that rule the digital world and made a good attempt at blowing up meatspace.

Can I be some kind of cast off or fragment of the second one? Is that kosher?

I don't know about kosher canonically.

The basic origins of PC AI are either "Program that kept learning (and was possibly affected by Resonance fuckery) until it became a metasapient AI, pseudo-human in their basic mindset", or "e-ghost, someone who was jacked into the Matrix and ended up having their mind-body connection severed, so now their mind floats around cyberspace."
There's also "protosapient AI that are basically feral programs" and "xenosapient AI which have thought patterns so far removed from what humanity understands that we can't communicate with them" neither of which are playable for obvious reasons

The big classic AI don't fit neatly into any of the categories. At one point Deus did basically break itself apart and hide in various bodies to go underground; you could say you're a fragment that never rejoined, if the GM allowed.

Melee is a perfectly good option if you're already in close quarters and have a tricked out strength/damage score, it should just never be your primary unless you have a weapon focus. Someone with a super-arm and a cyber-spur can - for example - charge down a flight of stairs to delivery a 12P stab while enjoying both Charging and Higher Ground.

That's really solid, when you're in a position to use it, and you can still be packing your Steyr TMP or whatever the fuck the rest of the time, when you're not.

Well, okay.
Maybe if Im luck I can be some kind of castoff terminator or something.
Otherwise, back to forevergm for me.

I should clarify- The Network (the distributed fragments of Deus code) was a bunch of metahumans. Deus put itself into their minds subconsciously, turning these people into Nodes who would subliminally interact when they jacked into the Matrix.

Though on remembering, some of the Nodes realised what was up and went independent. I'd need to reread about Crash 2.0 to find out whether or not the independents got rolled up when Deus recompiled, but a GM could probably be persuaded into "My Node didn't get jacked into the Stock Exchange in time, and when he did jack-in post-Crash the data was released and ended up as a metasapient AI."

It's still not an AI overmind (you'd absolutely need the Pilot Origins quality if you want to have a decent drone body in meatspace, and even then AI are surprisingly shit at being riggers until and unless they do come up with some good errata) but it's something.

If drones suck, I guess I can just run hacker overwatch from a less combatative body.

AI are worse at hacking than they are at rigging.

The issue is that AI are super-fragile; while a regular metahuman can have their device tank some damage before their own flesh is on the line (and they can go coldsim to keep it at Stun), AI almost always take damage to their Core Condition Monitor, and overflowing that track causes Essence loss. It means that AI are very easy to disrupt if they get into any sort of Matrix fight; someone in /srg/ once worked out an AI that basically serves as team mascot, using Leadership tests to boost other people's dicepools, as the most effective and safe way to do it.

You can go with a bunch of drones if you want, just always be ready to jump out of whatever body you're in back to the RCC (which for preference is in the chest cavity of the cybertroll) and hope the DM doesn't take Matrix combat seriously enough to try and trap you.

>AI is neither good at hacking or droning
>What they are really good at is cheerleading
Wat. That is baffling.

Shadowrun game design!

But basically the reason AI suck in the Matrix is the same reason Technomancers do: everything else in the Matrix is balanced around having a meat body separate from your icon, both in terms of "where your augs are coming from" and "what you're willing to risk."

AI/Technos die in real life if they die in the game, and they have no meatbody to use all those shiny augs that make you better at hacking (well, Technos do, but it's verboten because of the Magic/'Ware split), so they're just fucked.

They truly are.

I don't understand why anyone thought this was good design.

Though, i guess if cheerleader is viable, I can play overwatch guiding my humans around to complete objectives. That is kind of a weak role though, especially if I can't do some hacking to get floorplans and guard comms.

But at least technomancers have sprites they can use as diversions/meatshields/workhorses, and they can pull some nifty stuff with echoes and whatnot once the player wrap their heads around how technomancers work.

An AI hacker is like a street sam who refuses to wear armour.

Can't ais get armor somehow? A cyberdeck or something?

They can use the Matrix monitor of whatever device they're on. The issue is that they need a really good device to be used to their full extent (an AI is limited to the devices it can be on based on depth), which is very expensive if you want a couple of them. Switching between devices is also two actions, and a third to reboot (assuming you already have enough marks on it). Finally, if the device you're on goes down, you lose Essence (unlike regular deckers, who take dumpshock but still end up getting free of the Matrix). Not to mention the troubles with AI programs.

tl;dr It's difficult to scuttle from one device to another in combat, each one is a flimsy shield, and if they break you get fucked up.

Though we should mention the 25-karma Exceptional Entity, for going a fair way at breaking things the other way.

>get anthrodrones
>drones don't take stun damage
>put on armour jackets
>drones now ignore small arms

Be a wall of bodies

I would like being a wall of bodies. A designated goon squad is super useful in heists.
Is this rules viable?

Up until you get demolished in the matrix and your goonsquad starts shooting at your allies, maybe.

Yes, except you will probably need more than armor jackets to be immune to small arms. Stick-n-shock exist, as do tazers and bigger weapons than a semi-automatic pistol.

It shames me, but the ai might have to rely on a decker.
Can't you just give them the fancy cyber armor everyone loves so much?

Drone armor isn't intended to stack with worn armor according to the devs - but technically, by RAW, it does.

But what is the point of all that skin armor if armor layers don't stack?

>Stick-n-shock exist, as do tazers

Drones don't take stun damage.

Doesn't need to stack. Armour Jacket+Helmet is 14 armour, which is not shabby for 1100¥.

Corpsec will probably start carrying AP rounds the second run you try this, but it's still viable once.

Drones take electric damage as physical, not stun.

Not really. If takes a lot of armor to be able to block a well-aimed high-end assault rifle.

>Drones don't take stun damage.
They always take Electric damage as Physical, though.

I know shadowrun is very money reliant, so I have to ask.
How long can you keep up the wall of bodies? How easily can you repair damaged and scrapped drones?

>Drones don't take stun damage.

They do take electricity damage, which both S-n-S and Tazers do.

Keep in mind that, unlike work metahumans, vehicles and drones roll to soak first, then compare the remaining damage to their armor, not the other way around. So they're actually extra tanky.

The game even goes so far as to suggest you ignore attacks outright if buying hits would be sufficient to downgrade it into stun, rather than rolling every time, with dice only being rolled if hit-buying weren't enough.

They're not as tanky as an ork with four cyberlimbs, but they're actually seriously tough as fuck once you start stacking on some armor.

So, has anyone tried playing Anarchy yet?

>How easily can you repair damaged and scrapped drones?

Not easily, especially when you'll either need to buy a big workshop and some other drones to do the work yourself, or pay an NPC to rebuild (or convince someone to spend lots of karma getting Mechanic skills to a reasonable level). Rigging is a money pit at the best of times. The only thing AI have going for them is that they don't need to spend money on personal stuff like weapons and armour, specialty clothes, etc. (except for lifestyle) so they can go all in on constantly buying new devices/drones.

Replacing busted drones isn't cheap, especially if they're kitted out anthrodrones.

It also depends on how much money your GM hands out for your average run. If they're going by the recommended core book rewards, you'll probably be losing money on runs where you lose a drone. But a lot of people agree that those rewards are really light on nuyen, so your mileage may vary.

Damaged drones are expensive to repair and drones that hit 0 HP need to be replaced entirely - there's no repairing therm once they're rendered entirely nonfunctional.

That sounds not ideal.
Oh well! Better start trying to make money on the side.
Can you make money with like, doctoring, or mechanics, or anything?

Run Faster has rules for having a commercial lifestyle. IIRC, you roll to reduce your lifestyle costs per month as an abstraction of your profits.

>Commlinks, cars, gear, and other goodies can all get trashed in the dangerous Sixth World but there is always someone with the skills and supplies to fx them back up. The same general costs apply: ten percent of the original cost per box of damage being repaired for the materials.

>The labor is the really expensive part. A skilled mechanic will charge (Skill Rating x number of hours for repair x 10) nuyen plus the cost of materials for the work.

Either a Commercial Lifestyle or the Day Job negative quality are ways to represent a non-shadowrunning side hustle.

Well, if that helps deffray drone costs, I might just have a viable character that is close to what I want. Robot army is the best.
Too bad about the price and the hacking though. Is there anything besides deckers to help with not getting my troops hacked?

Just keeping them offline (or effectively so, such as via jammers), at which point you can't give them any commands and they're running on dogbrain.

Is dropping jamming for an instant to give orders viable? Or would that take too many actions?

Also consider the Dealer Connection (Drone) quality

That sounds valuable. Good idea.

Rigger 5.0 included new, explicit rules that once a vehicle or drone is trashed, it straight up cannot be repaired, only replaced, and new rules always trump old rules. It has its own separate repair rules too.

>Splat comes out for a thing
>Nerfs it
Blast and damn

If it makes you feel any better, they improved normal repairs by including rules for stealing a junker and chopping it for repair parts, and as a whole Rigger 5.0 is an overwhelming improvement.

Can you use those junker vehicles to fix drones?

>Nerfs an already weak role
Feels bad man

Check the archives

General questions regarding team organization - from the player's perspective.

Do you usually have on person on overwatch? One person coordinating teams? Everyone just rushing in together?

You can use junker drones to fix drones, as long as they're in the same approximate category.

>overwatch
That's what drones/vehicles are for. Overwatch/surveillance is the Rigger's actual role.

Play Eclipse Phase you goon.

Is it just me, or are cfd plots vastly improved by using snatchers instead?
I want to run a plot centered around snatchers.
In my dreams, I can play one like random hajiid, but will settle for making players deal with it.

As someone looking into Shadowrun. Can someone explain to me what to major difference between the editions are, as my group wants to get into it after we finish our current game. Most are used to d20 systems.

Also looking to build a goon squad of drones as an AI charecter, so the topic at hand really intrests me, can you tell me what that quality does?

And any general advice on what my dice pool should be, and how I calculate pilot since AI don't have reaction?

Oh one final question I guess, is shooting gunnery or the normal weapon skills?

Sorry.

So I've played some Shadowrun before. I played some 3E and quite a bit of 4E/Anniversary. My characters have thus far been only been Comabt or Matrix related. I have almost completly ignored the magic part of it, except when the GM kicked my ass with it and even then i only researched the fact that those shock rounds are good against ghosts.

i might play it with an other group in the near future and Im considering to play a mage or shamen.

Now, before I look into the rules I have this question to you fa/tg/uys:

How viable would a character be that is based on "The Order" aka the cult from the Silent Hill games?

The main question is how much I can fluff the spells, the spirits and the source of my powers. I know there exist all sorts of mages that base their powers on real life religions and most of the orders teachings sound almost pseudo-christian so i think it might be viable, right?

I know how lazy this thread might seem but I am not asking anybody to build character for me though I wouldn't refuse if somebody did. I just want to make sure a charater like this would even be possible before I start makingone only to hit a wall half way through.Also I'm completly drunk right now, I just got that idea and I can't focus on reading the rules until I sober up.

The edition will either be 4e or 5e, it's not decided yet.

>Cost: 3 Karma
>At some point in your wide travels and extra-legal activities, you met someone who has access to retail vehicles, and your connection means that you get vehicles at a discount. When selecting this quality, pick a class of vehicle (ground craft, watercraft, aircraft, or drones). Each time you purchase a vehicle of that class, you receive ten percent off the price. The discount is taken after the gamemaster makes adjustment to the price based on Availability. This quality may be taken up to four times, once for each class of vehicle.

It basically is a quality that's worth it if you're buying a really expensive vehicle, or are buying tons of drones in bulk. Not that it is different from having a contact that is a drone/vehicle dealer, of which you'll probably have as well.

> Vehicle Gunnery
>The rules and modifiers for ranged combat apply to vehicle-mounted weapons. Vehicle-mounted weapons are fired using Gunnery + Agility [Accuracy] for manual operation, like door guns on mounts, or Gunnery + Logic [Accuracy] for remote operated systems. A Complex Action is required for shooting weapons mounted on a vehicle in any firing mode.

>Drone Gunnery
>Drones attack using their Pilot + [Weapon] Targeting autosoft rating (p. 269), limited by Accuracy. Drones must have an autosoft appropriate to the weapon they are wielding in order to attack. They cannot fire a weapon untrained.

>Core, p 189

Gunnery if you directly control, Pilot if not.

Gunnery is for mounted weapons.

If you jump into a drone with "normal" arms and these arms hold a gun, you can use your appropriate skill to shoot said gun, eg Pistols.

You could play a face if you get an anthrodrone that's realistic enough.