Warmachine/Hordes General - /wmhg/

I mean, +1 FURY is already a pretty solid buff for him, so maybe.

>This game was supposed to kill 40k
Not even GW can kill their own games, and god knows they're trying.

merc partisan. He'll mirror the Caine3 release.

I've never seen anyone but an idiot claim that WHM was going to kill 40k. They appeal to very different players, for one thing.

If anything, WHM has managed to establish a pretty solid niche of competitive players, which put it on the map for all the people who just didn't like GWs casual aims.

Yeah well that niche basically just killed off it's own community because of their stifling attitude toward change.

They were pretty efficient at killing Warhammer.

>MK3 comes out, changes things and suddenly the game is dead

Except for all the Khador players, who have a playable faction for the first time since mk1/pre-colossal mk2.

New player:
I really very much like Warmahordes "Iron Kingdoms" setting, but was wondering if there was anywhere I could find a ton of fiction to read. Each battlebox comes with a short story, but I'm finding lore stuff to be a little harder to find than I have with other games.

Which books would be best for finding that sort of thing? I found the big list of books at the top of the thread but wasnt sure which parts was the right place to look.

Also, has anyone ever found themselves in the position of having 4 starter armys? I got the mk3 warmachine 2 player starter set, and since I bought that set for mk2 as well, I have a very small army for cryx, cygnar, khador, and protectorate.

The RPG books have loads of setting lore.

Skull Island Expeditions is their publication website.

Iron Kingdoms RPG books have a ton of setting stuff, especially the old books.

The Warmachine storyline can be followed by way of reading the books in order from Mk1, which can be pretty hard to figure out. I don't remember the specific order, myself.

Thoughts?

Karchev the Terrible

Behemoth

Kodiak

Kodiak

Marauder

Marauder

Marauder

Marauder

Marauder

Battle Mechaniks min

I've been out of the loop for a while. Would you mind giving me a run down on what's changed?

I play Khador so...

Why do people insist on spamming one unit? It's boring and ignores other effective models for what, one extra jack?

This thread is a ghost town. The player base has shriveled up. No one is left except for the dregs of the mini gaming world, all of whom are proud of how exclusionary they've become.

Okay.

First things first, Warmachine now has the global Power Up rule, which gives every jack in your caster's control range with a working cortex a free focus every turn.
That solves the big issue of Khador casters not liking to run jacks, because they need their own focus.

Combine that with the fact that almost all Khador jacks got cheaper, our casters got more warjack points AND all Juggernaut-chassis jacks went up to MAT 7 and you got a really happy faction.

Our Infantry units which were already good (Pikemen, Kayazy) are still good and Man-O-War Shocktroopers are finally worth their points.

Things in Khador that got nerfed from the transition to mk3: Sorscha2, Spriggan, Demolisher, Beast 09, Winter Guard Infantry, Great Bears, Iron Fang Kovnik

Things that remained shit: Old Witch, Decimator, Black Ivan, Kossites, Manhunters

Everything else was either buffed or stayed awesome.

Oh and Berserker-chassis are still shit, I guess.

>Why do people insist on spamming one unit?

I find the uniformity is aesthetically pleasing and more realistic in how an army would operate.

>what is combined arms

Depends on the organization level, With one battlegroup and its units assigned specializing in one role and another in a different one.

So you're admitting you gear your entire group to fight in one specific way? That's needlessly inflexible.
If there's any one thing your list is even a little subpar at, someone's bound to capitalize on it.

Thats why you normally have 3 lists to choose from; but even on a one off list, making sacrifices for fun is alright.

Combined arms isn't fairing so well in Mk3. Even when PP goes out of their way to design a combined arms-themed caster/lock, they end up being mid or low power.

The game yes. Skorne in ~2-3 weeks.

You've got it right. The only way to make him worse would be to force the Morg2 player to eat the entire metal mini in one bite after every game.

You probably want Ruin in there. Take out the Mechanics and 2 Marauders and put in Ruin and a few solos. The Widowmaker solo is a nice idea for Road to War.

Mono-Jacks without Mechanics is highly questionable.

Mechanics are the problem really. The swedish guys who first played the Mad Dog spam have some interesting thoughts on that; it's in one of the Moot Point episodes.

Shut up and play Guild Ball

So after thinking about it, I legit think the Rip Horn Satyr is a strong beast with Kaya2.

>Give it Forced Evolution
>Give it Primal
>Pop feat
>Stones teleport it forwards
>Satyr pops animus and charges the enemy caster, anything in the way gets pushed aside because of Bulldoze
>Get up to 6 PS19 attacks on the enemy caster because of Smash and Grab being free damage

Or you could just assassinate an expensive heavy like Despoiler or Behemoth then Kaya's feat pulls you back so you can frenzy in a safe place assuming you didn't just win on the spot.

Makeda1, Morg2, Mordikaar, Zaal1/2, Naaresh, and Hexxy1 all have the most to gain. My money is on Makeda1 or Morg2 because they were the biggest fuckups going into Mk3.

I thought you had to forfeit your movement when you get teleported

>Give it Primal
>Satyr pops animus
Can't have two Animi at the same time, so casting Primal in this instance is pointless.

>Stones teleport it forwards
>Satyr pops animus and charges
You have to sacrifice movement or action if the stones teleport you, so that doesn't work at all.

I mean yeah it's the best beast if you just ignore all the rules of the game and do whatever the fucking fuck you want.

You mean Cygnar Island Expeditions

I dunno, they're handy but in Khador they're far from essential.

Karchev actually works better without Behemoth. He wants more jacks and Behemoth is effectivly taking up the space of another jack without the extra 36 boxes

ded thread for ded game. 2017 will be the last year of warmachine

...

> →
bye

>Except for all the Khador players, who have a playable faction for the first time since mk1/pre-colossal mk2.

Am I like the only person who remembers earlier part of Mk2, where Khador high defense infantry spam was cited as an overpowered plague on the meta and served one of the catalysts for the introduction of the more anti-infantry focused battle engines/colossals?

People just have really short memories.

Just played 2 games against Ret as Skorne. It's really, REALLY fucking infuriating when a single Sentinel blows half of your heavy away with zero support beyond Issyria's feat. Like holy shit why is this allowed? The guy literally rolled 6 6 6 6 5 on dice-7, and meanwhile his Invictors were plugging shots into my solos and Nihilators because once again the terrain was off to the side of the battlefield so the middle was an open shooting gallery. At least in the second game the terrain was redone. I ended up winning because Makeda3 managed to basically solo Hyperion after tanking a punch from him.

DEF skew was always shit

>The guy literally rolled 6 6 6 6 5 on dice-7
So your made because an opponent was luckier than you? Are you actually retarded or are you just pretending?

>Wahhhh the dice in the game of dice were unfavorable to me

I once hit and one-shot Caine1 with Behemoth by rolling triple boxcars on a direct hit.

My opponent was so salty, he walked outside the store and yelled "AAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRGHHH".

Caine with no shield guards sitting within range of Big B? Your opponent was a moron

I hit and one-shot Caine2 by rolling 6 6 to hit with a Redeemer rocket and then 6 6 5 on damage. I had chipped off his focus with blast damage first, though.

To be fair, he was at DEF 19 or something and Behemoth was the only model in range.

And Behe was the only one that mattered. :^)

How did that work out in the fluff? Wasn't Magnus pissed at Cygnar because his favorite King got dethroned by an usurping brother?

Now that I think about it, why is Magnus not a Skorne model?

Magnus was originally working to put Vinter back on the throne. He went all "fuck Vinter" after Vinter let him be tortured by Morghoul.

He tracked down Vinter's bastard son, Julian, and long story short killed Vinter and put Julian on the throne.

Magnus2 was (kinda) a skorne model during mk 2. However, since he was a warcaster, it only mattered in multi caster games, so for simplicity they removed it as an option in mk3.

>so for simplicity they removed it as an option in mk3
Kinda lame it's gone. Yeah, nobody uses it, but it's not like his card has a lack of space.

I guess that makes sense then. Still haven't gotten around to reading all the fluff.

So I'm looking for a new caster for Circle. I'm typically a Kaya2 (soon 3) and Kromac2 player and like running heavy beasts. I also have Tanith from Journeyman league shenanigans. Kromac1 and Kaya1 are benched.

I don't want to play Una2 because it's a gimmick list. I know it's going to get nerfed and I don't want a half-dozen useless burbs sitting around. I'd play her if she worked... at all, with the Storm Raptor.

Brad is getting replaced and fuck constructs, so Baldurs are out too.

I haven't actually played with the Tree. Should I? Or should I look into something else more interesting?

if you play circle and you dont want to play with una2 or wurmwood what are you doing playing circle?

Una2 also escaped unnerfed

>what are you doing playing circle?
Believe it or not, the game has existed before 2016 and Una2. :^)

>Una2 also escaped unnerfed
She will get hit harder than Karchev in the Summer. Nobody's doubting that.

Okay, so I don't know what the best place is to ask, here or the WH40K general: I'm wanting to get into casting parts for wargaming (mostly terrain, but who knows), and I have a few questions:

Are there any good resources for me to get started with this?
Does anyone know what kind of plastic/resin other independent casters (i.e. not GW, Citadel, etc.) use?
Are there any pieces you'd specifically be looking for? Barricades, buildings, etc.?

Any help would be useful.

I'll never forget you Spriggan, rest in peace.

Big spoilers for the fluff here, forewarning.

So the way it pans out is that Magnus is ultimately loyal to Cyngar as a nation, not to any one person. He sided with Vinter because he believed that Vinter was the best choice for actually keeping Cyngar safe and powerful. This is why he stayed loyal to him during the coup.

However, he pretty swiftly figured out that Vinter was more interested in himself then in Cyngar, and combine that with Vinter betraying him, ended up cutting ties. That put Magnus in a pretty weird spot, he's no longer working for Vinter, but he still regards Leo as being too weak as a king(a point of view that had some real merit).

So Magnus figures out that Vinter had a son, and tracks him down. The Inquisition, or what remained of it, had him, and Magnus ends up taking him himself. This is likely a pretty good turn out for the kid, because while the Inquisitors wanted install him as the rightful king, they also wanted him as a puppet. Magnus, while he certainly wants to gain some real benefit, is honestly interested in making the kid a good king, not some puppet or crony.

This enters a big part of the story, as Magnus is spending his time teaching this kid to be a warrior and a strong king, while Caine is on orders to murder the kid, and doing his best to track him down. This ends up being a cat and mouse game for a while, before things manage to come to a head and Caine figures out that he ultimately can't murder the kid. So the two of them, along with a merc army, head off to where Leto and Vinter are fighting a civil war. Shit gets real for a while, before Magnus manages to fuck Vinter up hardcore, something everyone thought was damn near impossible. He almost murders Leto as well, but they manage to convince him not to.

So the kid makes his claim, and Leto, being the good guy he is, cedes the throne to him. This manages to smooth the rebels over, because while they had some shitty reasons for trying to oust Leto, they had some pretty reasonable ones as well.

So now the new kid's on the throne, and seems to be a good mix of his dad and uncle: He's not as gullible or soft hearted as Leto is, but he's not the absolute bastard that Vinter was.

This, after some time, scores Magnus a spot as a general in the Cyngarnian army, a post that creates some tension among all the people who fucking hate him. Beyond the personal grudges, there's also the issue of morality: several of the generals, Stryker included, look unkindly on Magnus, especially his willingness to use some pretty nasty tactics, like chemical weapons.

On the other end, Magnus is being plenty pragmatic, and most of the shit he's doing makes strategic sense, while also avoiding some pretty nasty causalities on the Cyngar side. And there's also the point that even when Magnus is being a real bastard for decent reasons, Stryker is telling him to fuck off, even if his ideas and actions are totally justified.

I hope to god this is legit, because this is officially my favorite fluff I've heard so far

It's a summary of Blood of Kings and the first Act of War. Along with the book fluff from about Colossals on, I think.

And Magnus is basically IK Batman at this point.

Alright my dudes. Getting bored here at 3:46 on New Years morning.

So I got a question for anyone around.

What are the changes everyone wants the most out of Skorne?

What is the thing in the upcoming errata that you want to change the most?

Preferably something not actually revealed yet.

Just want to get an idea of what people expecting or want to see.

ask /wip/

Retribution player here.

I just want Helios to come out already.

Hey all.
Just jumped back into warmahordes and picked up a mountain king for cheap. Playing some friendly 15pt games soon and I wrote a list to try out the new caster, mountain king, and northkin shaman. Hows this look? I think the -4 def stack from the northkin chiller and the mountain king deafen will be effective.

Wow, thank you.

I always knew Stryker was a giant dumbass. Just look at that stupid Ginger, how can he possibly measure to Magnus "my personel nodes have doom missles" The Warlord?

>while also avoiding some pretty nasty causalities on the Cyngar side.
It's worth mentioning that he also prevented civilian casualties, because if he hadn't used those chemical weapons on Khador (which he only acquired because Khador tried, but failed, to use them on Cygnar first) it would have devolved into street fighting with a city's worth of civilians caught in the crossfire.

But boy scout Stryker of course ignores that and throws his hissy fit anyway.

Well, I don't think that's fair to Stryker. While what Magnus did can certainly be justified as a better choice, it doesn't change the fact that he did use some pretty terrible shit on the enemy.

I think Act of War was a bit too heavy handed on Magnus's side, because their relationship was always supposed to be a mirror. Both of them are absolute patriots, ultimately sworn body and soul to Cyngar as a country.

Stryker embodies the highest ideals of the nation, while Magnus embodies a ruthlessness and willingness to do anything for the sake of that nation. They're two sides of the same ideal, and should mirror each other.

Stryker is the one that will always rise to the highest peak if his nation calls for it, while Magnus will sink the the deepest pit for the same. So their relationship should reflect that mirror, with no clear victor:

Magnus asks Stryker just what he's willing to do to proect his nation, while Stryker asks Magnus at what point do you finally subvert the very ideals of the nation you serve and destroy it from within.

Making one look more correct than the other destroys that whole conflict, because it establishes one as right and the other as foolish.

>Stryker is the one that will always rise to the highest peak if his nation calls for it

Although the whole thing where Styker basically holds a shit load of (possibly) Cygnaran Menite civilians hostage and says "if you don't get the fuck out, we are going to murder these hostages" makes me question this interpretation of the character.

I've always read Stryker as a character that is willing to do some morally questionable shit for the good of Cygnar when he thinks it is needed, and that Magnus is further down that road and a little bit more honest about it.

Stryker has had some pretty shitty arcs. His notNazi shit was very poorly written in general, but I think their intent was to show that he was veering towards becoming just like Magnus, but eventually pulls himself out of it.

In it's way, I think his actions against the Menites were meant to haunt him, and why he's so vocal against Magnus.

It's pretty straightforward to consider Magnus what Stryker would have become if he'd kept down that route.

And that's why the glorious Motherland doesn't deal with this bullshit.

Chemical weapons? Eh fuck it, let's arm an entire division with that shit and get them in there.

>So your made because an opponent was luckier than you?
No, my opponent was running more pseudo SPD8 MAT7 PS12 weaponmasters than me. Oh wait I play Skorne I don't have a single small based weaponmaster unit and the best I can do is fucking Nihilators who even if you need 7s to hit only have a ~25% chance to kill more than one fucking model.

Infact the odds are much worse for Nihilators. I need a 5 on 2d6 to hit, then because the Sentinels in that game were ARM20, I need a 9 on 3d6 to kill. Then if I want to get a single shred of value out of my unit which exists solely for the purpose of Berserk, I need to kill ANOTHER model with 5 on 2d6 then this time I need a 9 on 2d6 to kill.

I am so fucking sick of how good Dawnguards are. I cannot believe they didn't get a single nerf in the errata. Dawnguards get +2ARM when B2B on top of their 15ARM, bringing them up to a defensive statline of 12/17, something usually reserved for heavies and casters. And do you know what Immortals get? A fucking soul.

Has anyone tried making Warmachine puzzles in the vein of chess puzzles? Like, it's your turn, model A has already activated, what's your best play from here.

>Generic anime face

It's important to note that the specific chemical weapons Magnus uses are implied to be Geneva Convention breaking stuff, and Vlad's realization that Stryker was willing to die rather than let Vlad's army take a second hit of the stuff is what convinces Vlad to retreat despite having the advantage.

How's this for a Steamroller pair?

>(Rasheth 1) Dominar Rasheth [+28]
- Aptimus Marketh [6]
- Titan Sentry [15]
- Titan Gladiator [14]
- Despoiler [18]
- Cyclops Raider [9]
- Cyclops Shaman [8]
Cataphract Incindiarii (max) [18]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (max) [7]
Paingiver Bloodrunner Master Tormentor [4]
Void Spirit [4]

Advantages to this list:
1. Clouds block LOS for charges, mostly their heavies to mine
2. Better equipped to pick off valuable solos and UAs
3. Deals with shit tons of infantry from range (3x Breath of Corruption, 6x Incindiarii shots which can be fired from outside max range but still do damage with a 6 1 or 2 on deviation)
4. Cracks armour very well (Enrage + Blood Mark + Feat + Dark Shroud)

>(Makeda 3) Makeda & the Exalted Court [+24]
- the Exalted Court
- Molik Karn [20]
- Titan Gladiator [14]
- Despoiler [18]
- Aradus Soldier [18]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (max) [7]
Swamp Gobbers Bellows Crew [2]
Gremlin Swarm [3]
Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor [5]
Paingiver Bloodrunner Master Tormentor [4]
Paingiver Bloodrunner Master Tormentor [4]
Void Spirit [4]

Advantages to this list:
1. Deals with tough infantry swarms very well (Trolls, Khador)
2. Gunlines rendered largely ineffectively due to a lack of victim targets (All solos either have Stealth or Incorporeal), and 2 free Shield Guards
3. Makeda herself can crack anything

What do you think, user-kun? n_n

Why make lists now, when the Skorne Errata are coming soon? Changes to warlocks will shake up list building

Because he might want to play some games before the errata comes out?

Everything is going to get buffed, so if I can make a good list now, in a few weeks it'll be an amazing list. Models aren't going to fundamentally change in their role.

Any copies of the troll PDF about yet?

Hah, epic "troll" there m8 ;^)

I am honestly impressed and astonished that you have this much of a grasp of the fluff and are completely unsuccessful in spelling Cygnar.

seconding this

It was in the middle of the fucking night on New Years.

And now I'm up way to god damn early.