Excuse me, Divine Valar, but if Sauron can't create souls and is only capable of destroying them...

Excuse me, Divine Valar, but if Sauron can't create souls and is only capable of destroying them, how does he create the orcs? I'm aware that the first generation of orcs consists of corrupted elves, but we see at least that the uruk-hai are being actively 'born' out of Saruman's mining and dark magic.

0/10

>"Well that's easy to explain Olorun. The movies aren't canon."

this isn't even Veeky Forums
this is a Veeky Forums question

It's not even a Veeky Forums question, it's retardedly assuming the movies were made the way Tolkien envisioned things.

>we see at least that the uruk-hai are being actively 'born' out of Saruman's mining and dark magic.

Can you point me to that passage in the book?

Tolkien is Veeky Forums, newfag

>I'm aware that the first generation of orcs consists of corrupted elves,
Not sure how relevant this is to the discussion, but new elves don't get new souls.
They get part of their mothers soul, so all the elf souls have gotten really small and watered down over the years.

I hope your mother gets cancer.

Doesn't that imply that there are superelves left who never gave birth?

>They get part of their mothers soul, so all the elf souls have gotten really small and watered down over the years.

That's not actually true. It's an Elven superstition that was "officially debunked" when the Elves started encountering elves who had been reincarnated after death.

If you want to read it in turgid, boring detail, you should search History of Middle earth for "Laws and Customs among the Eldar".

What happens to dwarves when they die?

They go chill in the dwarven afterlife 'the halls of their ancestors' and occasionally get reincarnated

Shitty forced shit isn't Veeky Forums though.

Even in 2017 you're still a stupid fag. Give it up already.

or, you know, original male elves

Born from mining? Born in a mine does not born from mining make.

Obviously I accelerated the growth of urukhai children to better make an army.

Dwarves are born in mines would you imply that dwarves have no father or mother?

Come back after you have a few white hairs youngling.

Oops forgot pic

Tolkien struggled with the question of the Orcs. As a catholic, he could reconcile his views of redemption with the idea of a truly evil race. He changed his mind over time about the nature and origin of Orcs and the nature of evil.

Quit trying to scrounge up lame conversation in your faggot thread, OP.

I'm not OP.

>If you want to read it in turgid, boring detail
this is a tolkien thread, and around here that's the best kind of detail

>DivineValar.forced
An Hero.

This a forced shit thread. Don't get confused.

You know you can edit posts, right?

>edits on my polish goose fancier ezine?

I don't have a Veeky Forums gold account, no edits for me.

>tfw original female elf

The 40,000 Year Old Virgin

Orcs don't have souls.

>40,000 years old is clearly skeleton
>Elf virgin clearly a skeleton lie

Neither did Sauron start with the Orcs, nor did Saruman invent the Uruk-hai.

Melkor started with both.

that has to be the shittiest version of that edit i've ever seen. Aslo

>ITT op is a faggot who has clearly never read the books.

They have redeemable souls. In a letter Tolkien explicitly refused to describe them as irredeemable which means they have a cause for metaphysical hope which necessitates both the initially corrupted elves and their progeny having a metaphysical place in the mind of Eru Iluvatar.

Blessed Quints confirm.

Remember to sage!

t.

>>we see at least that the uruk-hai are being actively 'born' out of Saruman's mining and dark magic.
Honestly, it's probably metaphorical 'born'. Hazing/induction ritual.

That was the movies solution for not explaining the breeding program used to make them.