/btg/ Battletech General!

I want a Light/Medium (max 45 tons) capable of jumping around, running, and showering the enemy with LRMs, while being a common enough design
I already know about the Valkyrie and Sling (too bad it doesn't exist in later ages)

Whitworth? It's not too fast, but it has 8 tons of armor, twin LRM10s and triple MLs. That might do for a starter.

What era? Immediate thoughts go to a Assassin or a Cougar Prime, and they stay available though most ages.

>Assassin
Really undergunned but you have to love the ability to just fly away whenever you get tired of a fight. 7(!?) Jump means it can just sort of float away.

Assassin can be modded to have twin LRM5s to be a bit more lurm-spammy, but yeah, the Whitworth is probably the go-to here, at least in early era play.

>no introtech Sling
I know this pain. It is a bad pain.

>wanting more introtech

I will never now this "pain"

...

There was a reference to some unit in the Combine that were pretty much otaku. Is there something similar in the CC? Does Space China have like, bootleg toys, movies and such like Earth China? I need to know these things.

You mean this?

Also, if memory serves, the Capellan industry was pretty much geared for military production with little to no "luxuries" (as in space TVs and stuff like that) made since Romano's rule until Sun-Tzu ascended the throne. Average Johnny Cap was simply said to suck it or talk to the friendly people from the Maskirovka.

That's awful. What is the average CC citizen's options for entertainment like? Could mercs or traders make a living smuggling in the other house versions of Levi jeans and rock 'n' roll cassette tapes like people used to do for the Ruskies back in the day?

It appears that memory served.

Romano was said to have nearly completely cut off foreign trade with other IS powers (something even paranoid Mad Max didn't do) but I do remember that the Capellan/Canopian border has/had a thriving smuggling market before Sunny's charm offensive and the opening of borders.

Well this...
answers my question here.
Damn Romano. I was about to ask a follow up question (and thanks guys) about what the disposable income of whatever constitutes the middle and upper classes of the CC citizenry were, but I guess- answers it.
Now I want to smuggle in FWL beanie babies or Suns roast beef sandwiches or wicked Lyran german pron and make some money.

>Dai Maxbuster

So much for this drink.
Why can't modern Battletech be this self-aware?

>FWL beanie babies
This has military use. It trains kids how to alpha strike.

Here's the stuff re: MoC/Capella smuggling from Periphery 2E.

Thank you. Time to be Han Solo and sell "spice" to those Capellans.

There was also some trade with the taurians, but not much, and it was mostly raw materials anyways

I want it.

If there was a plushie for a Locust or Penetrator it might be used for... purposes other than what the Chancellor wants. At least publicly.

Sadly the Dai Maxbuster regiment was destroyed in the Amaris war and didn't make the trip to the Kerensky cluster. One can only imagine Nicky K's fit on seeing the... "traditional" Kisarazu Air Base style nose art on their 'Mechs. Or how this would be explained in the Clan's Remembrance.

They probably would have been one of the Pentagon powers anyway.
"I don't care if you're the General's son, MY WAIFU STAYS ON MY MECH."

Has anyone done any art of this, actually?

Is Hello Mad Kitty waifu material?

If you want to see waifu dedication (trust me, you don't), just google Kit Bash pony.
A Steiner OC Donut steel whose porn numbers more commissioned pictures than all of BattletechxR15violation put together.

>we will never have Clan Kawaii Catgirl
>the only clan to use melee weapons, with gundam looking totem omnimechs, and Kamen Rider elementals
>constantly inventing ridicolous weapons, which turn out useless, or impossible to work properly, like laser swords, "combining" mechs, triplechangers, voice-based controls
>Frequent inter clan trials because those stravags from the other touman think Rei is better than based Asuka
>ASF pilots get appreciated a bit more
>Crusader clan because they wanted to reach Kuritan territory ASAP

>just google Kit Bash pony.
...why did I do this?
For the love of all that is holy? If I was a Drac I might commit seppuku right now.

I am so glad I didn't understand a thing from your post

>the only clan to use melee weapons

I once made a (really shitty) AU where there was a Clan that basically completely threw Zellbrigen out of the window as early as the start of Operation Revival whenever they faced Periphery or IS forces.

They had a melee-using TSM/Supercharger experimental design that they used against the Wobblies during the Jihad. They called it the 'Engelmorder' as a jab/potshot towards Celestial OmniMechs.

Ironic pic

This makes me think of that retarded little story in HB:HL about how the Capellan government gets all its people to buy cheap Capellan entertainment systems by fucking with the FWL company selling entertainment systems in the CapCon. Everything works out, Capellans flock to buy lower quality garbage, the CapCon faces no economic backlash or diplomatic issues, and Xin Sheng wins again.

But I mean this is the universe where the inexperienced Red Lancers beat a Clan force in the Great Refusal, and VSD was tricked into giving up Tikonov to a Warrior House, so I guess it works.

>Canopians literally have slaves
>criticize Capellans for human rights abuses
I love when BT reflects real life

>inexperienced

I think you mean "magical" because none of the shit about them makes sense.

>Literally do nothing for three centuries but fuck around on Sian
>Somehow have Elite skills
>Somehow be so terrifying in reputation and action that even Clanners shit their pants in fear and refuse to go within 30 metres of them
>Somehow have better equipment and special rules than the best-supplied, most experienced, and most hard core units of any other unit in the game, with the slight caveat that the Death Commandos (also a Cappie unit, funnily enough) can theoretically have better geat

Aren't the DEST the bestest most experienced and deadly unit, lore-wise? Honest question?

>I think you mean "magical" because none of the shit about them makes sense.

That is a better way of putting it.

I mean I wanted to like the CapCon, but a lot of their fluff since Sun-Tzu don't make no sense.

>The DEST's schtick, aside from 90% of them being Black Dragons

>Teddy C3's face after announcing another purge

>Aren't the DEST the bestest most experienced and deadly unit, lore-wise?

Nope.

Early fluff before the level of fuckery ComStar was up to was revealed and placed their special forces (Blake's Wrath/Light of Mankind) as the creme de le creme always had the Death Commandos miles out in front of the DEST.

The DEST's schtick, aside from 90% of them being Black Dragons, is numbers.

They're the most numerous special forces organisation.

I hesitate to say that the Dracs have the most special forces attached to line units on a state-wide basis because we really don't know much about what the RCTs or Marik combined-arms units do in that regard.

DEST units are extremely common as part of the infantry used in Forward ARC commands.

I would say that the Death Commandos have never made much sense either given how good Drac, Lyran, and Feddie special forces have always been shown to be as opposed to the insipid performances of the Commandos which largely consist of getting owned in the 4th SW and then having Loren Jaffray go rogue.

But whatever man, it's the CapCon. I don't even try to make sense of that any more.

So what's the commando teams powerlevel tier?

>mfw I only have a face because the Black Dragons let me keep it, for now
>mfw the Black Dragons blow up the most important manufacturing centre in the Combine and probably the second-largest in the sphere, for reasons that totally make sense you guys

They should have gone with the fluff from the earlier sources where who had blown LAW up was not certain but believed to be the WoB. The Black Dragons doing it still makes no god damn sense.

EXTREMELY HIGH HOLY SHIT GODDAMN

Their special abilities are:

-Pick any 'Mech manufactured in the IS by an IS power (not limited by era, and not limited by tech base, so if the DCs decide they want to upgrade everyone to brand spanking new Devastator-2s in 344 they get it, or they can time travel and field nothing but SLDF Royals, or as one user described their fuckery abuse the wording to spam Hellstars before those joined the MUL as available to the Cappies)
-Ignore any special abilities enemy forces have that effect opposing forces
-Choose two of: Forcing Initiative, Off-Map Movement, Over Run, and Banking Initiative
-Apply -2 to the initiative of any enemy force if they aren't elite.

The Red Lancers get:
-Cannot be moved adjacent to if the enemy unit is not Elite (Elite skills is not enough, enemy command must be Elite).
-Enemy units that are adjacent to a Red Lancer unit that moves to where they are shit their pants and must fall back if movement points are still available unless they are elite
-Off-map movement, Banking Initiative.

Meanwhile, the Otomo can torso twist between firing their weapons and making physical attacks so they have one hex extra to punch with, the Davion Heavy Guard get Forcing Initiative, Banking Initiative, and Over Run while the Knight of the Inner Sphere can't shoot into enemy rear arcs unless being fired on that turn and gain +2 Initiative with Forced Initiative and Over Run.

The DC and RL are better than everyone, because reasons. The reason is Loren Coleman was allowed to write for them.

>Literally Clan Hugh Jackman

except for that aerospace bit, that's sorta deviant

By the way, was there ever a definitive list of who was who in the Black Dragon leadership? I think one of the Jihad era books (the one with the conspiracy theories?) had some sort of list but that was full of caveats to the tune of "might have been" or "we have no evidence". Also, I actually wasn't the least bit surprised when Duke Hassid M.F. Ricol turned out to be a Black Dragon.

But yes, as a long time DC player it does suck that every time something good seems to happen to the Combine, the Kokuryu-kai bugger it up.

>Hey, Teddy K's the new coordinator, he's slowly making things better for the average Johnny Drac and actually making peace with our neighbours so we don't have to samurai all the time!
>"Unacceptable!" Cue coup attempts, invasion of a FedSuns planet, Franklin Sakamoto, the death of Teddy K's wife, the Alshain regiments kicking off a war with the Ghost Bears, the death of Teddy K himself, Ho-K burning out, a Black Dragon as the gunji-no-kanrei...

I think the closest to that was a list of suspected Gems somewhere in the JHS series that was pretty definitive.

I also remember good old Benny boy going full REEE at me on the OF for saying it was obvious that Kiyomori Minamoto was a Black Dragon because they hadn't made it explicit yet and actually believed it was going to be a shocking twist nobody could see coming so were trying to keep it under wraps.

Then doing the exact same thing with Kanrei Toranaga in the Dark Age.

Hey guys? If you want your surprise twists to be a surprise maybe just be a bit coy with that stuff? Like, instead of giving these people evident Black Dragon ties, having them blatantly advance the Black Dragon agenda, and generally go around waving "YOU DUDE I'M A BLACK DRAGON AND YOU CAN BE TOO" signs all the time have it be at least plausibly deniable?

That picture really lost its value after Sam started breaking down crying like a baby about being unable to pay rent and healthcare after AS cancelled his me-so-edgy show.

based

>a list of suspected Gems somewhere in the JHS series

This must be the one I was thinking about. Seems like I'll have to go through the books again.

I thought it was JHS, turns out it's in Blake Documents.

P. 43.

Capsule summary: Hassid Ricol, the head of the Order of Five Pillars*, Tai-sa Li Dok To**, the LAW CEO, a shipping magnate, and Paul Omishita.

*Theodore's staunchest allies the whole time and the intelligence service he relied on over the ISF because the ISF was so thoroughly infilitrated.***

**Warlord of Samarkand, a reformer, friend of Theodore and extremely strong supporter of his, because that's prime Black Dragon material right there. Also somehow a Colonel despite being a Tai-shu everywhere else.***

*** "We r teh bestest at fact-checking and pruf-reeding, honest!

How do I post mechs?

You're gonna have to be more specific.

you have to really believe in the concept of a bi/quadpedal warmachine

Download Solaris Skunk Works (link in the OP).

Build your giant death robbit.

Go to File->Export 'Mech->To Text.

Open MS Paint.

Put it in a text box and select something with a fixed font size like Courier.

Save file.

Upload to the chan.

And voila.

>Capsule summary

Sweet Omi Kurita, they really didn't pruf-reed even their own stuff, did they? That Li must be a typo and it's really that commander of the Second Sword of Light (Tai-sa Li Sak To, maybe a relative/child of Tai-shu Li) who was mentioned in Turning Points Luthien.

And the other Gems? A former Sorenson's Sabres member turned ISF, some megacorp bosses, and quite tellingly no mention of the self-appointed Kanrei Minamoto.

And that Blake Docs list was the one I thought of, right up to the "several Gems are still at large".

Fanon propaganda isn't a valid source, Feddie boi.

thanks m8

"Slaves" doesn't mean kept outside 99% of the time, picking cotton in the fields dressed in rags, not fed but the bare minimum to stay alive, and so forth.

MOC slaves almost always enter slavery voluntarily as a way to survive or as a way to pay off debt, and there's a host of legal protections on the way slave-owners can treat them. They're much closer to the house servants of the British aristocracy in the 1700-1800s than to American black slaves of the 1850s.

Slavery entered into voluntarily and where the slave is well-kept and can commonly provide enough benefit to their master to earn their freedom isn't anywhere near the territory of "human rights abuse" that depriving entire planets of any and all non-military production is. Or, you know, disappearing (read: executing) people who aren't sufficiently thought-pure. Even if you make the argument that both nations are committing human rights abuses, the Cappies are committing worse ones by several orders of magnitude, and on a larger scale to boot.

I'm still a little miffed as to why they went with Ricol being a Black Dragon really. His whole thing was always "fuck the rules, the Dragon comes first and shit needs to change to make it stronger."

He even conspired against Takashi and tried to have him killed.

I think they needed a big bad to head up the Black Dragons and he was the biggest name around.

Li Sak To would make more sense since the 2nd Sword turned out to be Black Dragon central. OTOH, the 2nd Sword turning out to be Black Dragon central after enthusiastically embracing Theodore's reforms because Takashi was finally no longer around to challenge them in the loyalty versus pragmatism debate, even after their Bulldog losses, still reeks.

>slavery apologist who thinks only plantation slavery is the real thing
Fuck off, Americunt

>Walking Crotch Edition edition
Well, it IS called a Penetrator... I'm surprised they didn't mount a ERLL in the CT, really.

Plantation slavery and outright sex slavery the only kinds that matter. Neither of those is present in the source material about the MOC. Sex slavery present in the fluff about the CapCon, though. Nice glass house you have there, Cappie.

Having to wake up in the morning and help your owner get dressed and be generally ready for minor tasks that need doing around the house isn't any different than being a housewife with kids, or working a blue-collar job where you can't afford to quit (which is something like 70% of American workers). The only thing that's different is the name of the master and name of the institution itself. Get over yourself.

I believe that is a bangmaid not a wife

Having another crotchgun 'Mech would infringe on the copyrights of J. B. BattleMechs Inc, proud manufacturers of the Dragon Fire.

>the biggest name around

And a reputation for doing some shady shit going back decades. But even then, I've always thought of him as an independent operator, not some "these reforms are bad!" type of hard arse conservative.

>loyalty versus pragmatism debate, even after their Bulldog losses

Turning Points Luthien said Tai-sa Li turned BD after his unit was denied honour and replacements after the Combine-Ghost Bear War. So he turned to the faction that started the war? And this whilst commanding THE regiment that should feel service to the Combine was more important than recognition and gongs all round.

The various Regulars I could understand, but some of the other BD turncoat units didn't make sense to me. The ichiban upholders of DCMS honour, the 2 SOL? The Proserpina Hussars, famed for their non-political "the Combine first" nature, who turned - because?

>Having another crotchgun 'Mech would infringe on the copyrights of J. B. BattleMechs Inc, proud manufacturers of the Dragon Fire.
I am shocked I can't find any evidence the Dragon Crotch Fire isn't produced in mass quantities in the Fed Suns.

Something about the REEEing regarding Canopian slavery always bothered me. Why does nobody ever REE about Marian slavery? That's outright Roman-style slavery where the slaves are worked to death, killed, or used for sex, instead of the indentured servitude with legal protections in the Magistracy.

Or the Draconis Combine, for that matter. HB:HK points out that slavery was legal during the following dates:
2270 - legal slavery on New Samarkand
2421 - slavery still legal
2825 - slave camps on Richmond
3011 - slaves being sold and bought
And it's still being done in the 3030's: in the GDL novels the Snakes are rounding up men for the labor camps and women to be sold off world to military brothels.

Oh, and as per A Time of War page 66, a character of any affiliation who meets the STR and BOD requirements can take "Slave" as their Stage 1 Life Module (i.e., early childhood background); thus, slavery - whether called that or not the effect is the same - is apparently alive and well in the modern BT universe in literally every faction.

Shit, even Madcap concedes that slavery is alive and well in a de facto sense within the CapCon. Pic related, top half.

Finally, the MOC specifically has slaves. The canonical answer about them is that they are only people who VOLUNTARILY sell themselves into slavery. See pic, bottom half. If everybody has slaves (ATOW), and the MOC ones are only slaves voluntarily, then that STILL puts the MOC as better in the human rights department than the Marians, DC, and CapCon, and no worse than "equal" to everybody else.

You literally sound like an apologist for the CSA. All you'd have to do is warp a few more realities. Your argument is exactly the kind they use.
Hell, your shitty arguments about their "legal protections" are what the Marians have too.

What is the CSA?

Confederate States of America, I think. Rebel scum that rightly got crushed.

>dat signature and profile pic

Confederate States of America. They and their modern apologists said slavery was a good thing. That since blacks had sold themselves into slavery and it was culturally accepted in Africa, it was ok. Also shit like this dumb cunt
said: >Having to wake up in the morning and help your owner get dressed and be generally ready for minor tasks that need doing around the house isn't any different than being a housewife with kids, or working a blue-collar job where you can't afford to quit (which is something like 70% of American workers).

Hell, during the 1850s they even said the industrial servitude of US workers was worse than chattel slavery.

All slavery apologists can literally fuck themselves, the dumb pieces of shit that they are.

Marians are a fairly tiny blip in the grand scheme of things, they're a much lesser state than even the Magistracy.

The Combine though still does it for battlefield captures. The men are used for labor, the women sent to brothels. I imagine that Theodore ixnay'd a lot of that shit after taking over after Takashi, since he was the hard line traditionalist that would condone that. Which is even worse than what the Marians do, as it's subjugating POWs and civilians caught in the crossfire to servitude.

CapCon doing slavery is pretty much a given. They're a combination of China and the DRPK in terms of the party line. Get outside of the party line and to the re-education camps with you. They've even borrowed a few pages from the Soviet-era manuals.

>Having to wake up in the morning and help your owner get dressed and be generally ready for minor tasks that need doing around the house isn't any different than being a housewife with kids, or working a blue-collar job where you can't afford to quit (which is something like 70% of American workers).

I'm curious, though, how is this statement not largely true? I've got a 4 year old, and watching my wife (stay at home) work around the house, it sure seems true to me. It's not like she can easily leave or let the chores and care of the kid go by the wayside when I'm gone on business. She chose to be a stay-at-home mom, so I'm not seeing a big difference in the way her life works vs the way an indentured servant would work.

Also, you people should have let the Confederates leave and form their own country. You'd have been better off.

>yfw Canopian law enshrines rape and sexual slavery

what a tolerant and progressive state

I think part of it is that the Dracs are really under-developed in the fiction, which is a problem for the FWL as well.

When you only have a tiny handful of well-known characters and units to hang your plotlines on, and seriously can't be fucked reading your own fluff, the number of characters and units available for use is really, really tiny.

It's like how in history things would be ascribed to the most famous king or noble(s) of the era, even if they were dead or had actually done completely the opposite thing.

Basically for Black Dragons you've got the characters already identified as such and as potentials characters like Li Dok To, Ricol, and Minamoto who've been given a tiny bit of fleshing out and are in important positions. And for readily identifiable units you've got the Swords of Light, Proserpina Hussars, and not much else.

No need to, the Dracs and Lyrans were quite happy to export them in job lots in exchange for a whole lot of nothing in return.

>Also, you people should have let the Confederates leave and form their own country. You'd have been better off.
Leave. Now. Slave-holding rebels deserve annihilation, and their apologists are not welcome here.

Dracs execute PoWs, though.

Either as they try to surrender (SUCKERS!) or at the end of a campaign and before completing annexation or retreating (DOUBLE SUCKERS!).

"Smart" commanders sometimes don't murder people as they surrender so that they can get more units with broken morale to wave the white flag then execute them later in numbers.

Yet people keep surrendering to the Dracs, because what is logic.

Makes sense. Either it's certain death, or nearly-certain death. The latter has a better chance of not dying, albeit remote.

Sometimes it feels like Dracs commit war crimes because they're "riding the tiger" and can't stop now because who are they if they don't?

>as per A Time of War page 66
>If everybody has slaves (ATOW), and the MOC ones are only slaves voluntarily, then that STILL puts the MOC as better in the human rights department than the Marians, DC, and CapCon, and no worse than "equal" to everybody else.

This is largely my argument as well. However, it's not about to convince anyone of something they aren't already convinced about. The last time this subject was raised, it was *insisted* that the CapCon doesn't have slavery: they have non-voluntary servitors which are born into the caste and treated like slaves in every respect...but since they aren't called "slaves" they don't count. Therefore, since the CapCon doesn't have slavery, it is ATOW which much be wrong. Likewise, the DC doesn't have "slaves", they have "Unproductives" and "Comfort Women". Therefore, it is the sources must be wrong.

Facts and sources are simply irrelevant to the discussion.

Mainly, this people get pissy about the, "tranny fetish faction", and the MoC's institutionalized take on slavery at the faction level (instead of the planetary level) is just some additional ammunition to rail on about. Posting sources and facts aren't going to help; people just want to rant.

For extra-fun times, bring Clan bondsmen into the discussion.

>Implying that a country run by a bunch of women wouldn't *totally* keep slaves to do all the heavy lifting and spider-killing or just out of spite if they could get away with it. Amirite?

After the Dracs doing it every time from the 4th SW on and apparently even through Theodore's reign you'd think someone would learn.

I ascribe it more to "lol, evil dracs" in the early stuff and Ben's wild CTRL+C, CTRL+V ride in the modern era.

>Why does nobody ever REE about Marian slavery?
I mean, by the fluff most everyone who remembers they exist hates them (or used to, at least. Dunno if by the dark age they have picked up their very own Kit who made that un-happen)

If you'd let the south go, you wouldn't have so many racist shitheels in your country now. That's what I meant.

Thanks guys.

>(who cannot refuse her, under Canopian law)
So... land of fatties and fuglies fanfiction? That absolutely frightening.

>No need to, the Dracs and Lyrans were quite happy to export them in job lots in exchange for a whole lot of nothing in return.
Roast beef sandwiches?

>Oh, and as per A Time of War page 66, a character of any affiliation who meets the STR and BOD requirements can take "Slave" as their Stage 1 Life Module (i.e., early childhood background); thus, slavery - whether called that or not the effect is the same - is apparently alive and well in the modern BT universe in literally every faction.
It's not like there aren't people being kept as slaves in every first world country under the radar, and it has nothing to do with it being legal or not in any given place

Worst part is we have shiftless namefags fanboying for them:

>It's not like there aren't people being kept as slaves in every first world country under the radar

And every country with slaves is outright evil for not stamping it out. I see no reason why every nation in Battletech with slavery isn't evil as well. "Under the rader" is just apologizing for it; claiming that it's totally not the nation's fault. If it happens in your borders, then its your fault, and every citizen shares the guilt and should share in the punishment.

Hang on there, sparky. What faction do you play which doesn't have human rights abuses in its recent history?

>For extra-fun times, bring Clan bondsmen into the discussion.
I feel like that one mostly doesn't get talked about because there are enough things higher than it on the "why the clans are a dumpster fire of cartoonish evil" list that nobody ever really NEEDS to bring it up to prove a point

Clan Ghost Bear and Federated Suns are my mains.

Normally, I wouldn't bother. But since we just got them back, here's your (You). Enjoy it, user. That has to last you the whole year, and if you jack off all over it now, it won't be pretty to look at a few months from now.

>You can like a faction and not like everything it does