Why does chaos always job to he tyranids

Because Chaos smells

People who think it doesn't make sense. They have a point, why dosent the hive mind always have the swarmlords tactical ability?

40k racebaiting threads.
> you mad chaosboi?

Where'd the cadia thread go?

>tyranids clearly the bigger threat to the galaxy as a whole
Are we really sure about it? Of course, there might be much more of them, like the latest Hive Fleet being just scouting but do we know for sure? For all we know that might be it.

And we know that daemons are pretty much infinite. We know the threat that Traitor Astartes are. We know that there's also the enemy within aspect of Chaos.

criminally underrated post

There are two kinds of people: Herohammer fags that don't understand the appeal of Tyranids, and war scholars that understand the appeal of Tyranids.

One of them likes OMG EPIC SPESHUL CHARACTER ANIME DUELS like in the shitty GW books, and the other is has a more mature appreciation of the setting, which is best represented by the significantly better FW books.

>Carnac butthurt

The ones who think anything about the swarmlord is acceptable are the ones with no fucking taste, user.

Best Tyranid lore was pre-Cruddace. Newfags go home or download the old PDFs and find out what you've been missing.

I'm really starting to hate the phrase btfo...

Rofl

Implying the Tyranids aren't the ultimate jobbers

>implying the swarmlord isn't a betrayal of the core ideal of the tyranids.

When other factions job, it fucks them over in the long run. When tyranids job, they adapt and come back even scarier. Read the shield of Baal books, the tyranids actually don't job, and manage to utterly annihalate a very well defended star system in just 3 days. Several times during the books they note that the tyranid invasion this time was far worse than ever before, adapting in ways the imperium couldn't anticipate.

Tyranids only job when Cruddace is writing them. Abaddon's recent failure on Cadia cemented his status as 40k's ultimate jobber.

its ok the tau will always defeat the nids because they outadapt them

Because in the end, the Tyranids will job against Chaos. In the end, everyone will job against Chaos.

WELCOME TO 40K AGE OF SIGMAR MOTHERFUCKERS

The tau would be utterly fucked if they faced the tendril of leviathan that invaded he cryptus system, they've never had to face any of those new creatures before. Plus, the gorgon was a very small hive fleet and didn't actually get out adapted. The tau lost tons of ground and things only turned around when their fleets and the imperium fleets destroyed or chased away much of their bioships. Without the reproductive capabilities of the ships, they were forestry much limited to gaunts and other small simple forms that could be spawned on planet. Without their previous adaptive capabilities and having to face the very different weapons and tactics of the tau and imperium, they were finally defeated.

except they did get out-adapted, its specifically stated so that this fleet, which was super best at adaptation, got out adapted

Stop lying and kill yourself already Carnac

Tyranids jobbing Chaos?

Tyranids lost more battles to Chaos daemons than the other way around. Tyranids are hard countered by daemons.

That's not Carnac. I am Carnac and I agree.

The latest Nid codex says Gorgon had more adaptive ability than any other Hive Fleet before and since. Leviathan doesn't even approach the adaptability of Gorgon.

I would like to thank you for parroting my talking point and supporting the point of view that Tyranids suck.

tyranids wipe everything.
chaos dies because no more emotions.
necrons kill tyranids because tyranids leave them alone (no biomass)
or just repopulate after tyranids leave

fuck off Carnac

>Carnac
>ever saying anything that isn't a spew of hatred about the tyranids
Learn how to use "le Carnac may may" correctly before you look this retarded again, newfag

Really? Such as when? Because the only 2 times I can recall them fighting ended in a stalemate that was never resolved because the imperium enacted exterminatis, and a clear tyranid victory on shadowbrink. The tyranids are actually a hard counter to daemons, and were able to adapt to all of their reality warping tricks thrown at them in a matter of days. Shadow of the warp+ not having any souls + being able to adapt to daemon trickery like no other race can = a pretty hard counter to daemons. And that's without any of the new developments from shield of Baal and forge world

>There are two kinds of people: People who disagree with me, and and elitist assholes.
FTFY

No, no, continue parroting my talking points. Do my job for me.

Chaos doesn't need emotion to exist, though.

>lost more battles to Chaos than won them
>A single Chaotic event did more damage to the Imperium than years of Tyranid noming
>the Black Crusades did more damage to the Imperium than the Hive Fleets that's why they are always top priority
>Tyranids avoid warpstorms and the galaxy is being ravaged by warp storms in the End Times with the Eye of Terror threatening to expand all over the galaxy
>Tyranids were out-attrition'ed by the Admech in the funniest way possible. The implication that a Forgeworld has more material and flesh than a tendril of a major hive fleet

Sideshow forever!

To name a few.

Multiple times in the Daemonkin codex.

An event in the DE Coven codex ends with daemons mass spawning aboard the hive ships of a Leviathan tendril and then slowly tearing it apart.

Shadowbrink is unique since daemons lost their momentum due to being gradually drained of power and dtarved due to lack of nearby mortals. Prior to this they were wrecking the Tyranids to the point the Tyranids had to go to range since they cannot outfight daemons in melee.

This no longer going to be an issue in the End Times since the walls of reality that's keeping the daemons out are thin as ice and are breaking beneath the rage and laughter of the Chaos Gods

Forget to add that Chaos had rotted the Imperium to the core. The underbelly of the Imperium is tainted beyond recovery and in the End of days what Chaos has planted is bearing fruit.

The subversion of the Chaos Cults of the Imperium far outstrips the genestealer cults, and has far deadlier implications.

i don't want to be this way

>Prior to this they were wrecking the Tyranids to the point the Tyranids had to go to range since they cannot outfight daemons in melee.
Its almost as if they learned from their losses, adapted, and changed their tactics to have the advantage in battle. Literally how every tyranid battle goes. They get wrecked in the beginning, adapt, and come back better. Gorgon was a unique example in that they had the most precise adapting, to the point where they could almost negate entire weapon systems. But fastest, most specialized adaptation doesn't nessecarily mean best. The adaption displayed by leviathan in the cryptus system had much bigger long term implications as to what they can do in future battles, and was overall better than "lol immune to pulse rifles" level adaptation.

They didn't adapt in the cases they lost in or not enough to make a difference. Anyway...

>Despite its relatively small size, Hive Fleet Gorgon posed a dire threat to the unsuspecting Tau. Gorgon still possessed ships enough to overwhelm the Tau space fleets patrolling the borders of their territory, and could unleash untold waves of warrior-organisms to overrun a planet. It was not because of its numbers, though, that Hive Fleet Gorgon would prove so dangerous. More so than any hive fleet encountered before or since, Gorgon possessed an ability to rapidly adapt to new circumstances on a biological level, emerging from every lost battle with a new clutch of organisms perfectly suited to overcome the foes that had defeated their predecessors. It would come to define the very nature of the war against the Tau: adapt or die.

-Tyranid dex 6th ed

Leviathan and Gorgon are both adaptive. The difference between them is that Gorgon did it faster and better. What screwed Gorgon was its size and its lack of sufficient biomass to quickly adapt the bigger nids.

If lets say Naga or a tendril of Leviathan in that time frame. The Tyranids would most likely be outadapted by the Tau scientists.

Is it no wonder then that the Tau have taken cared of numerous splinters of Behemoth and Kraken with relative ease.

I enjoy you, Carnac. Never change.

>>cadian general and his forces that BTFO chaos for over 180 years got wiped out in less than 3 days by tyranids
More like the hive fleet got BTFO in 3 days.

>98% of the cadians wiped out in 3 days
>tempestus scions wiped out to a man
>over a whole company worth of blood angels killed
>mephiston out of commission
>Tens of thousands of sisters killed, including their leader
>every planet except the necron tomb world consumed by tyrnaids.
General Dhrost was a highly respected cadian general who lead forces on and around his home world for over 180 years against chaos. Even with a sizable army, a well funded native army backing him up, and a trio of alpha level psykers, he was only able to beat the first 2 waves of tyranids before being absolutely annihilated by swarms of synapse creatures.

The tyranids only "lost" due to a very specific set of conditions, and even then the hive fleet wasn't fully destroyed. immediately after the shockwaves stop, tyranids are already pulling themselves out of the rubble and begining their feast anew. The only thing they achieved is beating the fleet down to something that the heavy defenses of baal might be able to stand up to. If they didn't wipe out a chunk of the fleet, they would have stood absolutely no chance at all. And its stated throughout that the necrons and blood angels never had a chance at a military victory, the entire book was just a series of missions spanning a few hours. they fucked off before the tyranids could adapt yet again.

It's okay it's a tie. The Cadians destroyed Hive Fleet Scarabus without losing a single company. So that makes up for this.

The tyranids continue to get better

Then explain why the Tyranids didn't recognize the daemons in Shadowbrink and had no previous tactical knowledge to draw upon when fighting them.

Take note that Leviathan and other Hive Fleets had fought in numerous events against daemon armies. One of the recent ones is the M'kar one which featured the same fleet in Shadowbrink and had the Tyranids fighting daemons in war above a daemon world.

Are you talking about the massive hive fleet that was on course to Baal? The one whose only defining trait for over a decade was "Will probably wipe out The BA and all their successors unless an absolute miracle happens"? And you're isolating one tiny bit of an ablative faction to use as proof of "chaos" being shat on?

Holy shit, m8. That's like me pointing out the Sororitas leader, whom has purged heretics for X centuries valiantly only to die to nids. Clearly all heretics are jobbers then, amirite?

No, you mongrel. The damage done by that hive fleet has absolutely no relevance to anything else in the setting - not even other nid hive fleets. It's a plot device that was way over hyped and now has an inconsistent power level compared to the rest. It's no different than Shadowsun's plot armor killing the Raven Guard Chapter Master, who had successfully hunted and killed countless leaders of every faction imaginable. Is tau then glorious master race, and everyone else simple jobbers? No. It's "PLOT" and nothing more.

The dark eldar captured an entire planet in the middle of its tyrannification, with the full might of a hive fleet present and defending it - and I mean literally captured it, shoving the whole thing into Commorragh and having it orbit the city like a nid-crawling moon. Are nids then jobbers? Probably. Everything jobs to dark eldar. They are beautiful and perfect that way.

>Probably. Everything jobs to dark eldar. They are beautiful and perfect that way.

Actually, Dark Eldar job to Necrons.

And there isn't a single recorded occasion of Dark Eldar defeating Necrons.

Why is your name Carnac, Carnac? The only thing I ever found on it was that it's the name of a planet in the 40kverse but that's about it.

youtube.com/watch?v=qX-YfuVQmX8

Not the guy you replied to, but for the Dark Eldar to really defeat Necrons, they'd most likely have to be on the attack.
Dark Eldar have literally no reason to ever attack Necrons as far as I can see.

To be fair, the deldar don't fight necrons. There's only what, one case of them ever accidentally raiding a tomb world? The one with the archon whose daughter dies, iirc.

It's interesting though. The dark eldar are the only faction I feel who could completely and utterly beat necrons. They have the best technology in the setting. With the most recent necron fluff, this was finally set in stone. Dark eldar darklight can prevent reanimation, assuming they don't just explode a planet, trap it in a pocket realm of webway, use that mirror where "anything reflected in it is transported into the heart of a sun," etc.. Presently, almost all Commorrite weapons are designed around flesh - taking an especial fancy with poisoned splinter weapons that can tranquilize prey or kill them, as the wielder wishes, and their armors are built with the understanding that anyone who falls will just be brought back by a haemonculous, so make it faster and faster. If they were to invest in darklight and the energy fields they use all the time (against each other in Commorragh), necrons would not be an issue.

Speculatively. There's no slaves in hunting necrons, so it's hard to imagine a kabal rallying itself to fight them. Not even Vect could manage that. He could, of course, dispatch some of his 1,000,000 wraithguard he has stashed away though. Necrons fall to distortion weapons like all the rest.

Actually, it one of the cases it was an attack. A Dark Eldar Archon raided a Necron tomb with his kabal seeking to steal one of those giant green power crystals.

His kabal was wiped out to a man including his daughter. He was the only survivor.

iirc they didn't know the Necrons were there.
Or at least not in significant numbers.

What is the source of that story again? I'm on a deldar binge and just finished Path of the Dark Eldar series, and I want to reread that one.

Mistress Baeda's Gift

bad writing and inconsistent fluff

Of course nids are Jobbers

Thanks, m80.

>They have the best technology in the setting.

No... that would be the Necrons.
Wraiths have beams weapons that can instantly zap objects into throw away pocket dimensions.
Not as a weapon, (though it's used as one) but because it's easier than having to take out the trash.

Has there ever been any stories in which a hive tyrant took on a greater daemon? That's a fight I'd love to see

they deal with those the same thing they deal with anything else

Throw Carnifexes at it.

Yep, the escalation says that the Eldar only understand basic concepts of Necron technology. It's generally beyond their understanding.

Then you have Necrons referring to Eldar as primitives and mocking their inferior technology.

Closet thing to it is the Swarmlord beheading a daemon prince, IIRC

actually it would be the tyranids.

Tyranids haven't shown mastery over space and time that competes with the Eldar and Necrons, or even DAoT humanity.

>that pic

More pls

mastery over space and time are irrelevant to the goal, the speed at which it occurs is irrelevant, only that it occurs.

If you're just going to make up arbitrary self created definitions of what technology is, then there's no point discussing it with you.

Their ftl works by literally bending space-time too their will.

Going by 2nd edition lore, the Tyranids goal is to survive and survive forever.

Gaining mastery over time means
that they would achieve that goal.

>having magical powers= technology

Nope.

I know but still it's not at the level of the Necrons and Eldar.

>swarmlord beheading a daemon prince
Tell me more

>Wraiths have beams weapons that can instantly zap objects into throw away pocket dimensions.
The deldar literally have that too. Have you never opened a deldar codex before? They have multiple suns they built dyson spheres around orbiting Commorragh - and when they figured those suns were too bright, they shoved them in pocket dimensions with an adjustable opening so they could control the brightness - while still capturing the energy of the suns with the dyson spheres. Oh, and remember the "orbiting" part? Orbiting pocket dimensions.

They also built a device that can plunge worlds into pitch blackness, and they use it against night lords for fun. Vect put a black whole into a pocket dimension and gifted it to another archon as a party gift. The aforementioned mirror that hurls anything reflected in it into a sun. And lets not forget the haemonculi - Fabius Bile spent 10,000 years trying to decode and understand geneseed. A haemonculus coven did it in 3 years, found it boring, and instead weaponized one of the mutations from it (Black Dragon's bone curse).

For what it's worth, the deldar say the same about crafterworlders.

The thing most people forget is that the deldar, unlike the eldar, never lost their technology from the Fall. They changed directions with it, but they didn't lose anything. Not only are they still at the height of pre-Fall technology, the deldar have continued advancing since then. The only thing they cannot do is psychic technology, like bonesinging - not because they lost the information of how (they didn't, as their archives and libraries are described as complete), but because they cannot use their psychic abilities without risking Slaanesh.

they're fully capable of self directed evolution at a pace the Necrons never could, and the imperium even in the DAOT couldn't either.

>implying biotechnology isn't technology

They don't use the warp for FTL you mong

There isn't much to tell. It's a one line sentence from a WD article about the Swarmlord.

>They don't use the warp for FTL you mong

Actually, in the recent Cassius novel, Tyranid vessels fled into the Warp or via narwals.

>cassius

Fucking who?

>Fled into the warp

They don't use the warp

>Via Narwhals

Thats not how Narwhals work. Its slower than FTL and you can't exactly use it to flee

ALSO

>Tyranids
>FLEEING

Oh look its Black Library, back at it again with the godawful writing from writers who don't get the setting

Hit me with some of those backflipping terminators with multilasers senpaaai

>FTL not at the level of necron
That's been retconed. The necrons have no FTL anymore. They are described as only having gateways that they built on planets that utilizes a bit of the Webway. Not that that makes any sense - this means that the necron empire expanded at sub-FTL, taking tens of thousands of years to get anywhere despite being a shorter lived race than humans, IE multiple dynasties just to travel between worlds. And being a quarrelsome race - it would be multiple dynasties just to go from ones homeworld to the enemy's, and by then they'd likely have a new dynstasy of their own.

Silly, but that's what GW wants with the necrons now. Without those gates, they can only travel "the long way. But that's okay because they are immortal robots!" Forgetting, of course, the necrontyr were not immortal robots when they did all their expanding, colonizing, and fighting, and they built the gateways with the help of the C'Tan in the war.

>deldar: use pocket dimensions to deal with massive space problems
>necrons: use them because too lazy to take out the garbage

You're not exactly inspiring confidence that deldar are more technologically advanced.

If they were, why would they try to steal Necron tech as was brought up previously?
Why don't they have the ability to teleport around literally at will, have swarms of nanoscopic machines to repair their stuff, have basic infantry weapons that can destroy anything that exists, time altering melee weapons, time altering personal shields, and all the other stuff necrons have?

>‘I cannot know, exactly,’ he admitted. ‘Two years ago, when we broke the back of Kraken, the aliens’ bio-vessels fled in a hundred directions, slipping back into the warp or disappearing into dark space too dangerous for us to follow. The hunger I sensed could originate from any one tendril of their hive fleet. Or it could be a harbinger of some new dread set to be unleashed across the galaxy.’

related text above.

>Fucking who?

Important and old anti-nid ultramarine. Featured heavily in Deathwatch material last year.

>They don't use the warp

Not according to the novel.

>Its slower than FTL and you can't exactly use it to flee

They are slow within systems. Outside systems they are fairly fast.

>>FLEEING

splinters of defeated Hive fFeets tend to flee in all directions. It is mentioned numerous times in the fluff.

Faggot.

Again. I know. Even with that consider the Tyranids not possess the Necrons mastery over space-time.

Also you forgetting that once the Necrontyr/Necrons arrive on a planet they open up space folding gateways that link them other parts of their dynasties. Allowing forces to travel in mere moments to new lands to conquer.

Fucking who?

>Not according to the novel

WHERE'S MY BACKFLIPPING MULTILASER TERMINATORS user

>They are slow within systems

No. They're slow at the start and it builds up speed over time, thats why it works for FTL, and not normal travel

>flee

There's a difference between running away and terror, and choosing instead to splinter away and become an insurgency like threat

Fleeing implies running away in terror

Fuck i hate the black library, its so fucking bad

Necrons don't posses Tyranid mastery over biotechnology and self directed evolution

fyi, not the guy you replied to

The current Necron FTL situation is illogical and broken.
They had their magic inertia-less drives taken away, yet the lore still treats their attacks as if they'd suddenly shown up via that method in multiple instances, instead of using the method you correctly described as being "canon"
They also have lots of time bending devices, so why those are just ignored for space travel, I have no clue.

I'm not saying you're wrong,
but it's basically a moot point until GW fixes it imo.

Wow, a race in 40K believes they're the bestest and that all other races are primitive savages, what a surprise! By your logic the Eldar could claim the exact same thing that the Necrons do

Eldar openly admit Necron tech is more advanced.

>Fucking who?

Not knowing who Cassius is is for a nid fan what Cadian fan not knowing Abaddon.

>WHERE'S MY BACKFLIPPING MULTILASER TERMINATORS user

Blacklisted and removed from BL years ago.

>No. They're slow at the start and it builds up speed over time, thats why it works for FTL, and not normal travel

Slow within systems. In the 6th ED codex it's said that the Tau managed to outpace the Tyranid fleets chasing them by many days. And it was within the same system. It took the Tyranids many days to travel from one planet to the next in the same system.

>There's a difference between running away and terror, and choosing instead to splinter away and become an insurgency like threat

Regardless of the reason, they fled to avoid destruction.

>If they were, why would they try to steal Necron tech as was brought up previously?
Because as was outlined in that story, the archon responsible was not part of "the social elite," IE, he's not a part of High Commorragh and only has what can be produced by the slave factories of Low Commorragh.

>Why don't they have the ability to teleport around literally at will,
The DE are the only faction in the tabletop able to do just that.

>have swarms of nanoscopic machines to repair their stuff
Slaves do it for them. As is very obvious from every DE work, while they have the technology to do so much more, they aren't in it to win it. They deliberately armor themselves lightly so that fighting resolves more around the skills and prowess of the fighters (both kabals and cults), or they wish to test whatever experiment is currently suiting their fancy (covens). And just like the necron, they are deathless, so long as they have the strength of will to resist Slaanesh's call. Which is most of them, considering every after-action report shows the deldar reclaiming all of their dead from a battle.

The story with the archon's daughter is strange in that her expired instantly, when it says in codices that they usually have over a day to reach a haemonculus.

> have basic infantry weapons that can destroy anything that exists
They do. Darklight. Both in lance and "holy shit it's so big that we need to make indestructible energy shields around the blast just to make sure our supersonic bomber ships can get out of the way" bomb forms.

>time altering melee weapons
Because they have time-altering armors instead.

>time altering personal shields
Oh. Well, see above. The guy wearing it prefers having a real man-to-man fight before activating the armor, so that's one reason for weapons.

>all the other stuff necrons have?
Like?

The only race that the Eldar do not play superiority games with is the Necrons.

No seriously. I've never heard of Cassius. Ever. He must be irrelevant.

Seriously have never heard of this fucker.

And I've been playing since 3rd ed.

>I am so proud of my ignorance I will ignore the validity of your statements by repeatedly reminding you I am unaware of the full scope of the argument as if that negates the parts of it I dislike.

Apparently you can't read, and are obsessed with arguing something that is easily refuted by just reading the codex of both races.
I'm not, so enjoy the thread by yourself.

No seriously. I don't know who this nigger is.

Is he some space marine special character is something? Cause I don't keep track of those. The only one I really remember is papa smurf.

If he's some fucking space marine I seriously don't care about how cool you think he is, he really does not matter.

Its not like he's Lord Kryptman or something, who is an actually far more relevant character to the Tyranids and arguably one of the few who understands the true threat.

And for kicks, just some more stuff the DE do have that's more practical for them

>blades that instantly vaporize whatever they touch, leaving only the armor (for souvenir) and soul (for consumption) intact
>A nanoplague that turns whatever is touched by it into glass. They use it for beautiful glass sculpture.

That's your response? You listed things that they either do have or don't need, and then claim high ground when you're refuted? To isolate just a single line, "basic infantry weapons that can destroy anything that exists."

If you read both codices, or anything supplementary, you'd know about what darklight is and what dark lances are. If you read anything about dark eldar, you'd know that while they can produce dark lances easily, they take them only for dealing with enemy armour and much prefer hyper-velocity tranquilizer splinter weapons to capture enemy infantry for their slave pens. It's not that they don't have it, or don't have it easily available, or whatever - they simply choose an alternative more suited for their goals.

You're being silly.

>inconsistent lore
>setting basically never change because Game Workshop want to maintain the statu quo
>codex will always say "this faction is the most powerful in the galaxy"
>all faction have a "this faction will win if..." clause
>heavy bias towards the space marine because they sell the most
Is there something more pointless than discussing power level in 40k ?

Really arguing about who is the most advanced out of eldar, necrons and nids is kinda pointless, they all surpass the others in certain feilds. None are overall better.

Actually, Chaos tends to beat Tyranids when they surprise them. Stuff like opening warp portals in the middle of Hive Fleets or turning planets into Daemon worlds mid-invasion usually fuck the Tyranids over. In protracted engagements, Tyranids win because they can out adapt Chaos and the combination of SitW and lack of souls kill daemon's momentum and cause them to fade back into the warp.

Ultimately, Chaos is currently the bigger threat due to the thinning of reality and such. However, Tyranids are a bigger scope villain who will be the BBEG should Abaddon's 13th Black Crusade fail.

The Tyranids defeated four greater daemons in Shadowbrink, one from each God. The Nurgle one got fucking shot to pieces by Exocrines and Tyrannofexes.

The two strongest factions in 40k are undeniably the necrons and the dark eldar. Since the Imperium is the protagonist of the setting, they get both the attention and have the most potential for an underdog victory, but in terms of technology and fighting strength, the necrons and the dark eldar are on the top. Nothing in the setting genuinely threatens them except each other, and they actual engagements against each other can be counted on one finger. Sure, the nids can give the necrons a bit of a scuff while the dark eldar treat them like nothing more than curious pets, but then Slaaneshi chaos gives the dark eldar a bit of a scare and the necrons are totally indifferent.

In fact, so secure here the dark eldar that GW had to invent the Khaine's Gate dilemma to give the DE any sense of struggle, despite the fact that it makes no sense with prior lore for both the Webway (why don't they just collapse that part of the wbway like they do with every other incurable rift?) or Commorragh itself (why don't they just abandon that subrealm and destroy all the portals leading to it, like they did with Shaa-dom?). Alas.