WH40K newb question

New player here.

Can I start with Adepta Sororitas? My friend told me they're not newb friendly. Do they even have a codex? Why would they be in the core set books teasing me if I can't start the game with them?

Thanks Veeky Forums

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Oh, and one follow-up question: If SIsters are gated due to some kind of skill level, cost factor, or something else, then what would be a closely related Imperium army that I could start with that would be closely related to the Sisters on the Imperium hierarchy or flavor-wise.

Please don't say Space Marines.

>Can I start with Adepta Sororitas?
You can, but I wouldn't. Besides the newly re-released Saint Celestine and a single limited-run Canonness, all their Infantry models are metal. While these metal models aren't bad sculpts per se, they're VERY dated at this point and quite expensive. A single SoB infantry squad at HALF strength will cost you TWICE AS MUCH as a squad of most other armies' infantry at FULL strength. Some models are even out of production entirely, forcing you to get lurk ebay or the like for them. And as already mentioned, for the price the models themselves do still look very old. It might be hard for someone new to the hobby to make them look good.

From a crunch perspective, SoB sit around the mid-tier in terms of balance. Not too strong, but not too weak. They can clobber Ork and non-meta Tyranid armies with ease, but will have serious problem versus top-tier armies such as Space Marines, Eldar, Tau, Necrons, etc. They have a number of problems, but a number of strengths too. Read up on their Tactica on 1d4 if you want a more detailed and biased breakdown of them from a crunch perspective.

>Do they even have a codex?
SoB have two codexes where you can find their rules actually, and BOTH are legal to run. Codex: Adepta Sororitas is digital-only and is the older of the two, and Codex: Imperial Agents is a physical release that includes SoB (among other factions such as Inquistion an Assassins).
Rules differ only slightly between the two (C:IA does NOT have rules for Celestine, but otherwise has more detachments and Formations for fielding the army).

(cont.)

If you're going to get sisters, don't get the GW models. Raging heroes currently have a kickstarter going for their own set of sisters models, which are much better than the GW models and are plastic. See: kickstarter.com/projects/loudnraging/tgg2-light-and-darkness

Only drawback to starting SoB is that 99% of their models are metal and more expensive than other miniatures. Also most of their players are weird.

Cont. from >what would be a closely related Imperium army that I could start with that would be closely related to the Sisters on the Imperium hierarchy or flavor-wise.
Inquisition, though they run into many of the same problems as SoB (dated, expensive, and/or hard to find models). Inquisition is generally more free to make/convert their own models however; as long as the model looks like it'll fit in with the setting (as well it's role), most players should be cool with you using it. They're in Imperial Agents along with SoB, so you won't have to go too far out of your way for their rules (which are about on par with SoB).

I find that Skitarii play very similar to SoB (I play both armies), and they ally quite well together. SoB have an abundance of great transports and template weapons, while Skitarii have no transports or template weapons of their own. Conversely, Skitarii have some of the best anti-air in the game and some great long range shooting, two things SoB desperately lack. Their models are very detailed, very new, and very easy to get a hold of. The only thing is that the Adeptus Mechanicus (the organization that lords over the Skitarii) are at odds ideologically with the Eccleisiarchy (the organization of the SoB). While this doesn't stop them from working together, be aware that if some Toy Story or Indian in the Cupboard shit starts going down, your models may start giving each other the stink eye.

Deathwatch is also another army to consider, but I won't go into detail since you dont seem to care much for marines. Go against Xenos (instead of heretics like the SoB do) and are a pretty elite force (each model is stronger but more expensive).

Militarum Tempestus are another one to check out, but they are more of a force to ally into your main army than to run by themselves. Anti-marine specialists that aren't really that great at killing marines, but they might be worth checking out.

(cont.)

Cont. from and Overall, if you're DEADSET in love with SoB, buy Codex: Imperial Agents for the crunch and pirate Codex: Sisters of Battle for the fluff. You can find new and updated rules for Saint Celestine in "Gathering Storm: Fall of Cadia" if you want to bring her (which you should, she's a beast and probably the best SoB HQ)

Then find some way to some models. You can either shell out the big bucks and get them from GW, try to find some official ones second-hand for cheaper, or get some third party knock-offs like suggested (though I'd be wary of using Raging Heroes models as he suggests. Many people, myself included, think they don't fit the 40k artstyle and aesthetic at all. I prefer the Eisenkern Valkir bodies from Dreamforge Games combined with Heroic Scale Female Heads from Statuesque Models (pic related), but I can understand why people hate them. It comes down to personal opinion on this.)

It's as nice to see someone playing SoB at the shop as it rare. They aren't exactly a hard army to play, just one that's hard and expensive to get a hold of. They don't really get all too much love from GW (though this may be changing, they got 3 new things in the past few months), so just be aware that your army may not get an update or new models for YEARS at a time.

Can you give an example list of a skitarii sisters army? Not op but someone new to 40k who is 90% sure that's what I want to play

Before doing that I'd look at the Castellan detachment from the new Fall of Cadia book. It lets you freely mix the choices from Sisters, Space Marines, Imperial Guard(Astra Militarum), Stormtroopers(Tempestus Scions), Inquisition, and Imperial Knights with few restrictions. That would be a good way of playing some sisters but also filling out with other cheaper (money wise) stuff. You could transition to more and more Sisters as you build out your force.

Here's the rules (1/2)

...

Sure, I guess. What point limit you looking to play? I usually make lists for 1500.

1500 would be great! Ty

Here's a quick one.

-Adepta Sororitas - Combined Arms Detachment (860)
>HQ
-Celestine, The Living Saint (Warlord) (FoC version) (200)
>Troops
-Battle Sister Squad (120)
---5 models
---Flamer
---Combi Flamer
---Sororitas Rhino
-----Dozer Blade
-Battle Sister Squad (120)
---5 models
---Flamer
---Combi Flamer
---Sororitas Rhino
-----Dozer Blade
>Fast Attack
-Seraphim (85)
---5 models
---2x Hand Flamer on one model
-Seraphim (85)
---5 models
---2x Hand Flamer on one model
>Heavy Support
-Exorcist (125)
-Exorcist (125)

>Skitarii - Formation Detachment - Dominus Maniple (330)
-Dominus (135)
---Eradication Ray
---Infoslave Skull
-Skitarii Rangers (65)
---5 Models
-Onager Dunecrawler (135)
---Icarus Array
---Mindscanner Probe

>Skitarii - Skitarii Maniple Detachment (310)
-Skitarii Vanguard (155)
---10 models
---3 Arc Rifles
---Omnispex
-Skitarii Vanguard (155)
---10 models
---3 Arc Rifles
---Omnispex

Raging heroes models look nothing like sisters. If you want third party sisters you need these girls.

Author of Basic idea is for Celly and the Seraphim to chomp mobs, Battle Sisters to capture and defend Objectives on foot, Exorcists to provide Heavy Support from your backfield.
On the Skitarii side, Dominus is there to keep all the vehicles in good shape, Rangers are there to bodyguard for Dominus, Onager is for Skyfire, and the Vanguard are to steal the Objective Secured Rhinos from the Battle Sisters ASAP and then go tank hunting with Haywire guns.

An alternative, more Skitarii-heavy list would look like:

-Adepta Sororitas - Combined Arms Detachment (640)
>HQ
-Celestine, The Living Saint (Warlord) (FoC version) (200)
>Troops
-Battle Sister Squad (135)
---5 models
---Flamer
---Combi Flamer
---Immolator (MM)
-Battle Sister Squad (135)
---5 models
---Flamer
---Combi Flamer
---Immolator (MM)
>Fast Attack
-Seraphim (85)
---5 models
---2x Hand Flamer on one model
-Seraphim (85)
---5 models
---2x Hand Flamer on one model

>Skitarii - Formation Detachment - Dominus Maniple (340)
-Dominus (135)
---Eradication Ray
-Skitarii Vanguard (75)
---5 Models
---Omniscient Mask
-Onager Dunecrawler (135)
---Icarus Array
---Mindscanner Probe

>Skitarii - Skitarii Maniple Detachment (520)
>Troops
-Skitarii Vanguard (140)
---10 models
---2 Arc Rifles
---Omnispex
-Skitarii Vanguard (140)
---10 models
---2 Arc Rifles
---Omnispex
>Heavy Support
-Onager Dunecrawler (120)
---Neutron Laser w/ Cognis Heavy Stubber
---Cognis Heavy Stubber
-Onager Dunecrawler (120)
---Neutron Laser Cognis Heavy Stubber
---Cognis Heavy Stubber

Trades in the random power of the Exocists for some 48" S10 AP1 Blast Dunecrawlers to snipe vehicles and heavy infantry, Battle Sisters squads get to keep their Immolators, and Skit Vanguards Scout then footslog toward tanks immediately. Omniscient Mask is on the Vanguard Alpha to give the Dominus (who should be attached to them) Fearless and Hatred, along with Instant Death versus T4 or below models.

Grishnak models look great, but only come in a small variety of poses at the moment. When the range expands they'll be an easy first pick.

This guy:
knows what's up.

As newb not just to warhammer 40k but things that are Veeky Forums related in general(e.g. Dnd,servercrash,shadowrun,boardgames,etc.) I have an idea that might alleviate the problem of veteran players explaing things to newb players I call it the-
>ADOPT A NEWB CAMPAIGN
>each Veteran will be randomly paired with a newb to whatever game is being discussed
>it will be the veteran's job to teach the newb in the games,customs,stories and traditions of Veeky Forums
>it will be the newb's job to be a good student and become an upstanding member of the community

These are perfect, excited to base something off these. Thanks again user

Raging Heroes is simply not an option if actually want to play Sisters who look at all like 40k Sisters, so they are by far #1 outside of first party GW models (honestly, their basic bolter sisters actually look MORE like the lore ones than GWs do).

Grishnak are actually really cheap compared to GW, the best way to honestly get started with Sisters is to buy a few sets from them to cover your Superiors, Special Weapons and basic bolter Sisters and you can then supplement them with GW heavy Weapons and Icons and you'll have a pretty nice army starting point.

Any way to incorporate dragoons?

Long time SoB player here. This list has gotten me through for essentially 3 generations, though you have to use the Digital Codex due to Celestine.

Don't mix flamer and heavy flamer because of the way wounds are resolved you end up getting less value.

Might actually be the most noob friendly gameplay wise to learn 40k, not neccesarily win at 40k though.
Codex is simple and to the point. Limited wargear and lots of similar stat units.

fuck is a core set book

I can sum all that up.
1 don't be that guy (look it up)
2 1d4chan is our wiki
3 thin your paints

The heavy flamer and flamer will still cause slightly more wounds on average against MEQ because of the S5. Against anything with a 4+, the HFlamer is superior because there's no save.

Heavy flamer hits 7 MEQ, wounds 4.67 of them, then 1.5 fail their save. The flamer then hits 5.5 Marines, wounds 2.78 of them, and .98 fail their save for a total of 2.5 Marines.

If you hit 7 Marines with 2 flamers, that's 14 hits, 7 are wounded, 2.3 fail their saves.

Against T4 4+, you have 4.67 unsaved wounds from the HFlamer alone plus another wound from the normal flamer vs 3.5 wounds from two normal flamers.

The only time two normal flamers come ahead is against GEQ where you kill one more model.

Im looking to make a thousand sons list and looking for recomendations

so far i got the war cabal plus a heldrake vidicator and the helbrute+cultists formation

Yeah, and I see two ways to do it.

You could remove one Seraphim Squad and drop the Hand Flamers on the other and buy two in the Fast Attack Slots of the Skitarii Maniple.

Alternatively, you could drop 5 Skitarii Vanguar in both of 10 man units and buy two Sydonian Dragoons (each with a single Phosphor Serpenta) in the Fast Attack Slots of the Skitarii Maniple.

Another word for the BRB in the eyes of the uninitiated I presumed.

You have to resolve each weapon seperately, so if anything dies from one of the flamers it could impact how many the other flamer type can reach.

If you take two regular flamers you count how many models are hit at the same time usually resulting in more hit and more killed.

I'm aware. You should read my post again. I'm straight removing the models killed by the heavy flamer when making my calculations. The heavy flamer + flamer still wins, and that's discounting the possibility that positioning could cause the normal flamer might hit more models.

Oh I see, somehow you know how the models are laid out on the table each game.

And when are you hitting 7 MEQ with a flamer.

While this is a cool idea, the whole "you don't get full credit unless you max out all the FoC slots" in a detachment with THREE LoW slots is fucking moronic. It's literally never going to get played that way. The entire recent GW trend of giving detachments and formations bonuses if you take more shit in them (obviously to move models) is one of the dumbest things they've done to an already inconsistent and bloated edition.

I was being generous with model count and assuming that the flamers were right next to each other hitting a large number of the same targets which heavily favors Flamer Flamer over HFlamer Flamer because if your templates hit different sections of a unit, the models removed from the heavy flamer have even less of an impact on the normal flamer than hitting the same section. Even in that scenario, the HFlamer Flamer wins.

The heavy flamer still wins when you hit fewer models.

They cost an insane amount, are made of metal and have been left behind with rules.

To answer your second question: There isn't one.

OP i'd recommend grabbing the new celestine box! I have it on good authority that plastic sisters are coming! And if they are wrong celestine will still be useable in any imperial army