Warhammer Fantasy General

Not according to the lizardmen army book that you didn't read.

Actually, it was Be'lakor, an ancient human who asended to daemonhood, who attracted Chaos to the world. So humans are at fault

I haven't read all the lizardmen army books, no, I've only flipped through one or two. What're you getting at?

...

Depends on whether you want to use two-handed weapons or not. That said, the main benefit of the Great Weapons is that they have Impact, which allows you to roll two dice and take the better result.

This doubles your chance for Ulric's Fury, and adds an average of 2 damage. It also means that your damage output is a lot less swingy.

That said, Halberds are almost always superior, aside from the possibility of them being unwieldy in tight spaces, which is entirely a narrative issue that may also apply to many Great Weapons.

>the Old Ones created humanity
Oh, well, I guess shut up me, then. I'll just be over here, shutting up, in shame.

>picrelated
what if you forged coins out of gromril?

The War of Vengeance, which the elves call the War of the Beard, started when Malekith got his men to dress up as high elves and raided dwarf caravans until the king sent an envoy to complain formally and demand restitution.

Now, the dwarfs didn't know that the dark elves were a thing. Did the Phoenix King tell them? No. Did he ask for information? No. Did he pay restitution? No.

Instead, he demanded the envoy grovel on his knees to even be considered. Now, rightfully incensed, the envoy raised the restitution due to the dwarfen kingdoms for the unrighteous insult. The Phoenix King responded by having the envoy's beard shaved off. To give you an idea of the significance of this, imagine if one were to hold you down, cut your cock off, and sew it to your shirt so everyone could see.

This insult was so unspeakable that the dwarfs went to war. What ensued was an empire-ruining war that the elves lost, being literally driven into the sea. The Phoenix King begged for his life like a coward before being struck down. The dwarfs have the true phoenix crown to this day.

You anti-elffaggots sure are a bunch of retards.

That said, Drachenfels was apparently some kind of hominid that existed before the Old Ones.

So as far as we know, the ice-age world before the coming of the Old Ones was inhabited by Cavemen, Dragon Ogres, Dragons, Thundertusks and Stegadons.

You can't argue with elves.

there's even a trope about it so you know it's true.

To be fair, Caledor II was a grade-A prick.

sure thing. elves are always grade-A in anything
superior race, dude

>The Pointlessly Tall
shouldn't dwarfs feel that way about most things in the world, including some halflings?

He was also chosen. So you can understand the deep dwarfen distaste for elves.

Explains the constant anger.

There's something supremely satisfying about the War of Vengeance. I think it's the way Caledor II dies followed by the claiming of the Phoenix Crown.

I love reading about it.

I don't see what this has to do with Chaos. Rather suspected that you would bring something up from the End Times.

Is there a good link for mobi files of old world novels?

It's canon that Chaos never would have gotten a foothold in the Old World if not for the war depleting the two most able resistant species.

This logic only works from a meta-perspective. And what about lizardmen? Ogres?

>And what about lizardmen? Ogres?

What about irrelevant shitter races?

That's another meta-answer.

Like it's canon that Old ones didn't create the humans? Kappa

Shouldn't this thread be in Veeky Forums?

Elf

I think the Vampires not drinking wine thing is related to wine having symbolic value in Chriatianity.

And you are a Stegosaurus.

He was stating facts, is that a stupid thing now? Clearly a massive war broke out between the Dwarfs and Elves and clearly it was the result of the High Elves' King being too arrogant to tell the Dwarfs about Dark Elf trickery, and clearly when the Dwarfs ended the war, it ended with the killing of the High Elf King and the Dwarfs taking his crown.

If you think explaining an event or incident that happened in a story or setting is stupid, then you are even more retarded.

The retarded thing is to somehow link this to how doomed the world is, to chaos and to make it somehow all about elves despite the whole origin of the conflict being written grey and making both sides stubborn assholes, while there are several races made to fight chaos. I mean I could say after the dwarves defeated the elves they could have crowned themselves the defenders of the world and take their role, but no, let's get fucked by goblins and rats, they said Ultimately blaming everything on the elves like you are some kind of massive dwarfaboo without self-consciousness.

And dwarves not knowing about the civil war is the most retarded thing. They knew about it, they just didn't understand it fully.

The lesson of the fluff is that both elves and dorfs are unreliable. Only trust humans.

t. elgi

Yeah, let's trust the number one chaos worshippers in the world.

The conflic has always been written as both being stubborn asses and one armybook always depicted the other side as being unimaginable cunts that acted completely petty and unprovoked. That being said, the ball was always more in the Elves' court at the start, since the Dwarfs didn't even knew what the fuck was going on. Later on, dwarfen stubborness would've never allowed for a diplomatic end.
It's a story about how too much pride fucks you over in the end. The War of Vengeance/Beard story has always been one of the best things in the fluff, because the Dwarfs clearly win this. It's not a moralistic fingerwagging at how both sides were absolutely wrong and got their just desserts, one side just won no matter whether they were right or not.
And then the Lizards fucked everything up.
Seriously, fuck Lord Quex.

>Yeah, let's trust the number one chaos worshippers in the world.

And their main foe.

Half the fucking elves worship a god damn chaos god, while the other half do nothing but slavsquat around a fucking toilet in the ocean. Let's not get into the bush niggers.

Dwarfs help, granted, but it's not like they have the folk to spare most of the time.

>has always been one of the best things in the fluff, because the Dwarfs clearly win this
Always saw this as the writers balancing out that the elves were doing all the awesome battles against Chaos and world saving before, giving the dwarves finally some time to shine by beating up one of their kings that even the elves' own sources claim to be an idiot.

Chaos' main foe are still the lizards with their fucking horseshit tectonic shifts and clamping down on the chaos gates and other shenanigans.

Kislev is doing a great job at protecting the old world from the worst and the Empire is getting the brunt of the big incursions by virtue of mass and position alone, but let's not act as if humans are the one true anti-chaos weapon.

>Chaos' main foe are still the lizards

Nope, it's the Elves.
They were the ones who saved the world from Chaos in the first place.

So, it's the Elves, the Humans and the Lizards, sometimes the Dwarfs or the Ogres and maybe Orks, but it's never the Halflings?

The lizards helped, though. Something something the vortex spell got strengthened by a Slann somehow.

Elves put a a magical containment shield in place after the original one by the Lizards was broken.
Elven waystones or Lustrian temples are basically the same thing when it comes to battling chaos.

Lizards cannot go where they need to go though, since the climate change that came with the opening of the portal over the chaos wastes fucked them over for being cold blooded.
The only ones able to pick up the slack cause they are super wizards were the elves. They are not nearly as good as the Slann were though.

Another cool thing about Lizardmen is that the Saurus Warriors are basically biological robots. The guys are completely useless for anything but murdering stuff.
And in the temples they've got laserrifles and energy shields if you read between the lines. In Oldhammer Chaos Warriors could get projectile weapons and power armor too.
Anyway imagine Lizards were clever enough to use that stuff.

pew pew lazerguns!

Hey guys, I wanna get into Warhammer fantasy. You guys think Mordheim would be the best introduction? Seems to have less cost because it's squad based.

The stupid lizards are the reason the dwarfs are so badly hosed.

Sure. But you will also need a bunch of buildings. Which might require effort depending on how nice you want them to be.

You can make ruined buildings both easily and cheapily. There are also printable buildings available.

The worst thing about it is that they don't even know it, so no entry into the book of grudges.

You need a lot less miniatures, but a lot more terrain. It's also fun but the quality is debatable. To get into Warhammer Fantasy, I'd reccomend picking up the fluff and maybe models from ebay if you like them and play any good, generic skirmish game with them. Head over to /awg/ if you want rulesets for that.

That's why I said that it "might require effort". The effort is optional.

>Malektih and Snorri make contact with barbaric humans
>Malekith argues that they might fall to Chaos and feed it
>Snorri convinces him that there is promise in them

the End

>I don't see what this has to do with Chaos.

Elves and Dwarfs were both created by the Old Ones to combat Chaos. United, Chaos would've easily been repelled. Instead, baseless elven arrogance doomed the world to the state it's currently in, forcing both dwarfs and elves to slowly circle the drain.

Basically, imagine if you didn't have one Rome, but two Romes, and the fall of these Roman Empires would never have happened if not for the fact that one of them had to go and - again, for no reasonable reason - wave their cock in the face of the other like an autistic arrogant degenerate.

Awesome! Thanks for the info guys. I'm trying to get a group of people into it, do I'll probably have to foot the bill on armies.

>Elves and Dwarfs were both created by the Old Ones to combat Chaos.

The Old Ones didn't know about Chaos at the time.

>baseless elven arrogance
>dwarves dindu noffin
Yes, that's exactly how it is written.

And everything could have been prevented if the High Elves just stuck to their god-given laws and accepted Malekith as holy shit why didn't they gas Morathi

They didn't.

Elves attacked their peaceful trade caravans repeatedly.

Dwarfs sent an envoy to demand an explanation and reparations.

Dwarfs increased the reparations due when the Phoenix King implicitly admitted guilt and insulted the envoy.

Dwarfs declared war when the elves mutilated their envoy.

You know wars get started over mutilating diplomats and raiding trade caravans, right?

>Elves attacked their peaceful trade caravans repeatedly.
This is kinda wrong and I'll give you a little hint why: Elves as an unified faction didn't exist as this point

Both acted retarded when they pissed each other off, both acted retarded when they didn't consider that someone wants to set them at each other. This is not the story of elves being at fault for everything.

Can we please stop having these thread images with walls of text. Warhammer Fantasy has bucket-loads of great artwork.

Elves were elves, to the dwarfs, at that point. All the High Elves would have to do would've been to apologize and explain the situation. Instead they commited the highest possible disgrace imaginable upon an official ambassadorial envoy. They could've just as well have spat the King in his face, raped his wife and shaved every dwarf in existance.

>to the dwarfs, at that point
Doesn't excuse both of their behavior.
>the rest of the post
Christ, dwarves are easy to offend.

>All the High Elves would have to do would've been to apologize and explain the situation

>implying Dwarves would have apologised if the Chaos Dwarves had attacked the High Elves

It's a damn shame that Chaos Dwarves aren't more important, or any kind of evil dwarves. This race wouldn't seem so one-dimensional if evil dwarves would be much more prominent.

apologizing for something you didn't do is not a good idea.
however refusing to explain the situation and purposefully humiliating the envoy sent to clear this mess up just speak volumes.

I'm with the dwarves on this one, even if they tend to be full blown autists about other stuff.

You meaan the totally legit and understandable behaviour of the dwarfs? There's nothing to excuse.

Impossible to know, really. The Dwarfs exhibit a great sense of shame for their lost kin. Elves seem to be completely shameless. It's entirely possible that the mountain dwarfs would apologize and offer restitution, just to bury the whole thing, and would still consider them part of the people.

That said, I believe the dwarf split came after the War of Vengence. At least someone said that a couple of threads back when we were discussing Hashut.

Oh, they're autists alright. But the War of Vengence was caused by 110% condensed elven fuckery and arrogance. Dwarven autism have sundered entire holds, and is the reason the Chaos Dwarfs even exist. But the War of Vengence was a pointless war that allowed Chaos to take hold, and doomed two entire races to slow, lingering death.

Fuckin' elves.

Dwarven autism started this war too, them not being able to understand a "no, none of our elf guys did it" and then throwing a tantrum. Well, two tantrums, the first when they couldn't understand objections, the second when their precious hair got removed.

After almost destroying the world in the first place because one elf lost against hist boner.

The current status is done by elven arrogance and dorfen stubbornes.
Elves being to arrogant to say they fucked up and dorfs being too stubborn to forgive and start over.
Those two pricks took themselves out by being little cuntish children.

>still putting the obvious bait hook "no end times" in the OP
>still responding to AoS trolls
>still responding to oldfag trolls and gongards
>in the current year
>mfw
Jesus christ, its like you people never learned. In the past 3 threads i saw more bitching about the fact that that line is there in the first place than actual discussion about end times. No one even talks about end times, and if they do it dies after like 2 responses. AoS is straight up off topic and theres a whole thread for that, which isn't full of gongards. Putting that line there just makes it so easy for AoS trolls and oldfag trolls to derail these threads

Just stop whining about it like a woman.

>dwarfs win
>immediately BTFO by goblins and rats
>elves lose
>lose grip on the beast and orc infested old-world, consolidate power in ulthuan, still remain the strongest, most far reaching force of order all the way through to the end

Dwarfs eternally cucked, even in victory they get blown the fuck out

>mutilate an envoy

>wtf you can't declare war when I respond to a valid complaint by committing an act of war!

deluded elgi wazzock

kek, elves had the literal favor of the creators of the world and could barely hold onto one island against their exiled BDSM brothers in Canada

Yeah, whine like a proper man!
Pussy

For the sake of joining this dick-waving contest between fictional races
It seems only elves are a match to other elves.

Because the Lizardmen only followed the orders of the Old Ones.

Humans were a failed experiment, but they kept failed creations around like messy inventors.

Well, that and the dwarfs, who beat the elves completely and made their king piss himself and beg for his life.

>complain that elves have killed members of the dwaren race and demanding clarification
Valid.
>having a bitch fit when the elf rightfully says that none of his own people did it
Not valid.

Though shaving the beards was too much, but I don't know if the elves at that point knew what this would cause. At the same time Caledor II isn't thought of highly by the high elves.

Well, after these elves have gone through several wars between each other, the high elves being already in decline because of that war with other elves, and after these evil elves instigated this war.

Don't know how the war would have ended if the elves remained an unified force, but the dwarves should be thankful that the dark elves exist.

...

>Don't know how the war would have ended if the elves remained an unified force, but the dwarves should be thankful that the dark elves exist.

Just as the elves should be glad that the chaos dwarfs exist.

There were no big wars between the two.

That doesn't change the fact that if the dwarfs and chaos dwarfs had never splintered, they would have an even stronger military force with which to fight the elves.

The Chaos Dwarfs didn't help the elves by decimating their own kin through war.

That doesn't change anything, though. The dwarfs were lessened by the loss of the dwarfs who would become the chaos dwarfs.

You cannot say "the dwarfs are lucky the elves weren't united" when the dwarfs themselves were a fractured people.

The dwarfs that eventually became the chaos dwarfs were nowhere near in number to the elves that joined malekiths cause, and had no real impact on the rest of the dwarfs other than shame. thats part of the reason they're so salty. The dwarf golden age came after the chaos dwarfs had already split away, and there were no massive, generation draining wars between the 2 factions.

If the elves were still united, that implies malekith is still king, in which case the dwarfs are absolutely fucked. elves would probably have the strength to go on the offensive and besiege holds and actually win.

>when the dwarfs themselves were a fractured people
As far as I remember the split between the elves were basically 50-50 or at least on such a scale that massive wars were possible, while the chaos dwarfs were some few dwarfs going eastwards and staying, when some of them thought this place sucked and went back. It's not comparable.

Snorri was pretty fucking right. Humans are the best defense against humans, otherwise there would have been nobody to protect the Waystones and Warpgate.
WotB would have happened anyway and all Elves would have left the Old World. Dwarfs would stick to the mountains. The only occupants would be an exponential amount of greenskins.

So what lore unit, or character do people want to get the Ghorst treatment next?

The Dwarfs were never informed that Dark Elves existed. They only knew of an Elf civil war of some kind, and sold arms at reduced price to the Phoenix King's side because they figured the king was a legitimate authority. Because nobody explained to the Dwarfs that the king was an unnatural position and the queen was legitimate ruler.

The reason the war happened was literally because nobidy explained to the Dwarfs that a seperate faction of Elves attacked them.

The Starbreaker shouted down the nobles calling for Elf genocide and sent an envoy to Caledor II to ask why Elves dressed like his men attacked Dwarfs. Caledor II refused to even speak to the envoy. Angered by the insult, Starbreaker told the envoy to ask for the gold stolen from the caravans (fair, since it was basically forgiving the Dwarfs killed in the attacks). Caledor II had the envoy shaved and sent back.
The envoy was a relative of Starbreaker, and he had to take the Slayer Oath from shame.

THAT is why they declared war.

The war began due to Malekith's trickery and Caledor II being a huge bag of dicks.

Meaning buffed or get added to the game?

I'd love to see Ushoran, Abhorash, Neferata, Isabella, Krell, Bugman, Thorek, and Alrikson. As well as the Bloodswains, Coven Throne, Goblin Hewer, and Thunderbarge.

>Basically, imagine if you didn't have one Rome, but two Romes, and the fall of these Roman Empires would never have happened if not for the fact that one of them had to go and - again, for no reasonable reason - wave their cock in the face of the other like an autistic arrogant degenerate.
So basically what happened to Roman Empire after the split?

>If the elves were still united, that implies malekith is still king, in which case the dwarfs are absolutely fucked.

Probably not, because Malekith before his fall into lunacy and depravity knew and loved the dwarfs, and considered them peers - unlike almost any elf.

If he were king, the dwarfs and elves would probably still be on good terms.