Demonic black hole

If it could drown, yes.

Doesn't matter if it was pulped instantly, from the daemon's point of view it takes literally aeons. Relativity fucks with time at high velocity or high gravity.

Second.

Take pride in your player's ingenuity. You presented them with a difficult problem, and they came up with a very clever solution, rendering the daemon's ability worthless. As or, it's dead or trapped in a place worse than death.

Congratulate the players on their cleverness, and move forward.

I think you should spin it so that yhe black hole becomes reversed when possessed and anything that it have swallowed started getting ejected but is now demonic.

I don't know if it would help, but this sounds like an excellent opportunity to turn the daemon into a 'warp siren' or something. The astrogators of passing ships are drawn to fly towards the black hole, their ships being destroyed in the process. Could be something to throw at them in ten sessions.

>applying the laws of relativity to 40k
You're doing it wrong.

Pat them on the back, start the next arc.

You've got time dilation wrong, the infinite time stretching is only perceived by an external observer. The demon would hit the black hole pretty much instantly.

Yet from his POV, time outside would accelerate until all the remaining time before the heat death of the universe was just a brief flash.

It is also a greater daemon of tzeench. Literally made of unreality.

Not sure that matters, since canon strongly suggests that while the warp may blow them this way or that in time, they can't actually time travel intentionally.

>the infinite time stretching is only perceived by an external observer.
They players and the campaign are those observers. The demon's not their problem anymore.

>they can't actually time travel intentionally.
From my understanding, more because they have trouble grasping the alien concept of linear time and strict causality than an actual inability to time travel. Or maybe they already know they didn't time travel back to stop this, given the fact that it's actually happening now, therefore they won't/can't.

So what would happen if the daemon was blown up by a demo charge? It turns into another demo charge? And when that blows up, is it killing itself? Does it then possess/turn into itself?

Could turn into the specific thing that killed it, AKA the shrapnel that delivered the lethal blow or become a sentient piece of flame/plasma (I don't play 40k so I have no idea how the weapons work, nor am I entirely sure how explosions work).

Depending on how you want to run it. The shrapnel would effectively trap it in a relatively small and harmless object (unless it can float/move under it's own power but that's better than a gun). Or if it possess the 'flame' you could then either dissipate and thus be permanently defeated, or become a living moving nightmare of fire and death.

Alternatively, depending on how powerful this thing is (it's a demon and demons are magic so I'm just covering all the bases), it could then reconstruct it's 'body' thus recreating the demo charge, allowing it to become a sentient bomb that explodes and reassembles itself at whim...

Wait a moment...

Alright, that's enough. This thread has gone far enough. It started out a bit silly with the whole question about what if a demon possessed a black hole, but then those later posts were very silly inded, and that last bit was even sillier.
Now, nobody loves a good nerd argument as much as me, except perhaps my wife, and some of our friends, and the man who runs our LGS, oh yes and Kevin Smith.
Come to think of it, most people like a good nerd argument more than me, but that's beside the point. Now let's have a good clean healthy elf slave wat do thread.

Let it become a warpstorm or something like the eye of terror. Depending on how you want to scale your campaign, you could have war like the medusa campaign or even worse.

"Perceived" is the key word here. As in, perceived due to gravitational dilation on space time.
The black hole can still start moving towards them at the proper time the demon possesses it.

Nope, an infalling observer doesn't perceive anything wrong with time.

Technically, due to relativity shenanigans, the Daemon would from your point of view never actually reach the hole. From your point of view it just endlessly approaches the event horizon, slowing down as time dilates.
From its own point of view, it would eventually pass the horizon, but by definition nothing beyond the even horizon can directly affect the outside universe. The edge of the event horizon is effectively the edge of the universe.

You are right that his own personal time will appear to flow normally -- if he were on a ship he and everything onboard would be in the same reference frame and perceive their time as "normal" -- yet all around him time will appear to be going far too fast.
Actually, without a ship or even a body, I doubt he'll perceive anything but the blur of galactic history above and the black of the event horizon below.

This. The character has essentially been Gemma'ed.

It's immortality has been turned against it so that it's trapped forever in an inescapable situation. The only way forward is for Tzeentch to admit defeat and return it to the Warp.

Good thing black holes aren't exactly objects then, isn't it?

>control the color yellow
i don't anything wrong with that
in fact, it could be an interesting setting, where colours actually belonged to certain entities or soemthing

also, go read Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. there's a hyperintelligent shade of colour blue. it's a scientist.

The black hole would simply tear apart the thing that was thrown into it.

wat do?

so if you shoot the demon and it becomes the pistol, and you then lock the pistol away until it rusts away, would it become rust, the process of oxidation or time itself?

Physyc singularities cannot be possesed.
/Thread

It would shoot the lock off and escape.

>tell her everything is alright
> say she doesn't need to yell me how she got into slavery
> she just has to eat this
> give bowl of eggs and a bottle of water
> stay to make sure she eats them all
> every last one

You monster

Is this how the Illuminati did Kaurava?

The demon would become the bullet not the gun, though.

He would be destroyed before time dillated sufficiently for it to matter, you fucking retard.

The demon would become the hand.

What do you mean a "possessed black hole"? You understand that a black hole isn't an object, right? Just a field of infinitely high gravity?
If the daemon is able to possess gravity itself, then you might as well as name it as the new Chaos God and scrap the campaign away, that thing can forever rule over the universe.

What are you dumbasses doing?

A sentient black hole that launches elaborate plans to consume all life in the universe?

You run Fifth Element up in that shit.

A grizzled former Commissar
An Eldar super weapon, blown up by Orks before deployment
An earnest but mostly ignored techpriest
And of course, a completely unchanged RUBY ROD!

>I'm a massive no fun allowed dillweed

This is 40k, where Chaos can make living demon planets

If OP wants the black hole to be turned into an actual hellmouth that's entirely fitting and potentially awesome

At the centre of the black hole is an interesting device. From the Dark Age of Technology infact. It was an experimental reactor that 'collapsed' and created a black hole that destroyed the planet and star system is inhabited which resulted in a huge black spot in the development of black hole devices and their adoption as grenades.

The demon possesses said device and turns it off which results in a now insanely dangerous portal black hole generator being possessed by the demon.

The demon can't fuel the reactor itself due to a limited scope of operation but it can still contact mortals and cultists who then work on processing said fuel.

Cue investigation and game against Chaos.

*adjusts glasses*

AKCHERLY the concept of a demon world is HIGHLY SCIENTIFICALLY IMPROBABLE. As demons cannot exist they cannot, in fact, create warp storms.

I REFUSE to acknowledge the concept of DAEMONS, CHAOS or the WARP

um, AKCHERLY A BLACK.HOLE GENERATOR COULD NOT POSSIBLY EXIST, please educate yourself about BASIC SCIENTIFIC PRINCIPLES

t. Interex

>player has a semi-clever idea
>people don't like my idea to ruin any success my players have
>better act like a stale meme until my detractors go away

If you're gonna shitpost because of how buttmad you are can you at least spell the meme right you fucking mongoloid?

if "lets throw a demon, which comes from the warp, into a space asshole" is a "clever idea" you're probably a moron who doesn't understand 40k

and if "what if a sealed evil comes back bigger, leading into.a new quest" is "ruining success" i.think 40k, the setting where chaos is an eternal force of corruption, might not be for you

I'm as much a "massive no fun allowed dillweed" as OP is, because he wants to turn any idea the players have against them.

Perhaps I'm wrong, but it sounds like the OP is just pulling a "What, my players want to dispose of my unkillable daemon that I so brilliantly designed? Impossible, I'll instead just arbitrarily rule that they made everything worse. Yes, that will teach them".
And I despise that. Also, our concept of fun may differ, user.

im not the one butthurt i can't win 40k forever

newsflash fucko, vortex weapons are a thing in 40k, they aren't instant win buttons

holy fucking shit listen to yourself

"i can't win forever with one weird trick.the inquisition doesn't want you to know, STOP DENYING ME SUCCESS WAAAAAHHHH"

"I WANNA WIN 40K STOP SAYING THE PLOT ISNT OVER MOOOOMMM IT ISNT FAIR"

>applying the laws of relativity to 40k
>You're doing it wrong.
No he is doing it right. 40k is what it is because of laws of relativity, if not for them 40k would not happen.
It is because of this laws that humanity needs to use warp travel instead of really big engines that would propel ships to speed greater than c, and it the reason why emps was building human webway.
If not relativistic constrains there would be no human webway project, no Magnus fucking it up and no emp forced to sit on his throne.
Also no astromanicon and so no tyranids.

Oh, sorry, I forgot that victory is always impossible against chaos. You got me good, user. Let the games continue.

>my players did something unexpected how can I make an awesome continuation of the campaign that's thematic
>STOP DENYING THEM SUCCESS

great, if you ever want a.recurrent villain you're just railroading

if you don't just let your players win immediately every time, guys, you're a shit GM! fuck meaningful conflict, push x to win game!

guys i shot lucius the eternal, ive killed slaanesh

I wasn't even being sarcastic anymore, you know.

>and due to relativity all that would happen is
Actually, due to relativity what would happen is the universe outside would reach heat death around the time that the daemon reaches the singularity at the center.

>ctrl-f "tyrant star"
>0 results
Come on, people. The settings already has a teleporting demonic sun controlled by Tzeentch. This is literally a rehash.

May I ask, user, where you got your PhD in astrophysics?

Throwing it into something nothing can escape, which has no mechanics by which the daemon (upon possession) can manipulate, takes away all external sensation (meaning the daemon cannot perceive with the universe he is now cut off from interacting with) and distorts time itself to unthinkable levels (which means the daemon has effectively forever to realize there's fuckall he can do) is a pretty smart idea. Even if the daemon could possess it, he'd just turn the accretion disc pink or something.

Now, if you wanted to say the disc is what killed the daemon (as let's face it, nothing's getting to the EH unspaghettified) and then have it possess the inevitable gamma ray burst that erupts later on when all is forgotten, turning a dozen planets into Daemon Worlds? That's a sealed evil coming back bigger. That's giving the players a win while having darker consequences. You can have your cheap "THE BLACK HOLE IS EVIL!!!!1one" meme, when I play games I like to plan big and when I run grimdark settings I play them for the dread and horrific realization of how fucked things are, not some baby's first "staple skulls to everything and stack the deck against the players" run.

I would say, since the demon was destroyed by the mass in the center of the blackhole, it forms a new body made of ultra dense matter, of planet size proportions?

What do you think the Tyrant Star is, user?

Your PCs just created the biggest threat that the sector's ever known, as Tzeentch crosses his fingers and goes "Just as planned".

Call it the Democratically Elected Black Hole.

Not him, and I only read about physics for fun, but that's pretty established stuff. Like, "first chapter about black holes" established stuff.

You do realise the whole idea of the warp is that it can change reality thus the idea of a deamon possessing or at least manipulating the fundamental forces of reality isn't exactly nonsensical usually that kind of stuff seems to depend on how powerful the individual deamon is. Plus OP said he wasn't hewing to close to canon.

>posess and overtake anything that renders its previous body unusable.
In that scenario his body is still usable but will be not much longer for his perspective.
But for outside universe before demon will be ripped apart by gravitational forces shitload of time will pass.
So player won, by time demon body become unusable they will be long gone and dead.
It is problem for future generations if there will still be any life by time demon gets killed by black hole.

>Just what could a black hole possessed by a 40k demon do?
The same thing that other black holes do, float in space helplessly and consume things that come too close.

If said demon's soul is immortal and outside the laws of physics then he could probably be like a siren that it tempts people into their death by luring them into the gravitational field of a the black hole then once trapped in the vortex he could make an appearance formed of the superheated gasses that are around the black hole and do some evil shit.

But otherwise not much, as boring as it is sadly barring some top tier level bullshittery. Daemons might be powerful but if they are powerful enough to just manipulate black holes then they can literally fuck all the laws of physics on an infinite scale at which point how did they get defeated at the first place?

>Perhaps I'm wrong, but it sounds like the OP is just pulling a "What, my players want to dispose of my unkillable daemon that I so brilliantly designed? Impossible, I'll instead just arbitrarily rule that they made everything worse. Yes, that will teach them".
I'm not sure where you're getting that impression because what I'm getting is the same as reusing an escaped bandit from early on as a later villain. He doesn't want to ignore the PCs success, he wants to continue their story with this character as well as set high stakes for future encounters.

Not really, I'm just pondering if it would really work to destroy the thing.

Wait, what if it instead possessed the Singularity inside the black hole?

Which would normally be totally A-O.K.

But the villain being recurring because it's immortal is lazy, and if you can't beat it by throwing it in a black hole. How the fuck DO you beat it?

You exorcise the black hole.

Getting it stuck in something it can't control or fight back in, and then locking it up or performing an excorcism.

destroying it with a sufficiently blessed item could work, but it would need to be holy enough that the demon can't jump into it.

Demon banished. Well done.

Absolutely nothing would happen. A blackhole is just a massive dip in the fabric of space-time. You might as well say that a demon has possessed the empty space around it.

The thing that destroyed it was:
>Not a physical thing
>Not in the power of the demon to possess
>Would ruin the setting on a fundamental level if this couldn't kill a daemon.

>in fact, it could be an interesting setting, where colours actually belonged to certain entities or soemthing

It's been done.

/thread

>Meh post at best
>/thread

You should feel ashamed of yourself

on the contrary making destroying demonic artifacts as easy as throwing them into a black hole would hurt 40k more than the alternative. Honestly if should grow teeth that instant and become a metal slow moving unstoppable sign of doom. Go full relativity. Make it instantly change and then go on the warpath in ultraslow motion.

Nothing would be as brutal as saying their victory forged mankinds inevitable defeat, even if that defeat doesn't come in this millennium

its a meh thread

What are you saying that this change would make 40k into a retarded setting that doesn't bear close inspection?
Because I have some bad news for you.

No, u.

Ftl exists in 40k solely because it existed in previous installations of scifi. No other reasons.

Seconding this

Daemons are completely timeless anyways. As it's ripped apart by the intense gravity it'll just be banished back to the warp.

Given that lords of change can fly with literal magic they might just ignore gravity.

Daemons can't possess black holes. If the PC's wanted to kill a daemon by dropping it onto a planet from space could the daemon possess the planet? Black holes are just supermassive objects, not magic portals.

Fck off. Daemons and 40k in general have got nothing on the power of black holes

. Black holes have a wide-ranging series of dangers that stars do not share. I'll list some.

Take for example a Sun-mass BH. The Schwarzschild radius for Sol is 3 km. Long before you got anywhere near that you would be shredded by gravity. If a deamon were to dive into the Sun, gravity would stop increasing once he was within the star and would start decreasing. Provided he could deal with the temperature and fusion reactions, he would be OK. However if the Sun were replaced with an equivalent mass BH and he were to approach it (let's say he approaches to 5km from epicentre) then he would be fucked to hell and gone, to use the technical term. He would be pulled to bits, essentially. It doesn't matter how durable he is, because the space that he is made up of is, itself, getting pulled to bits. When you get real close to a BH, all of the time curves go into the black hole, and so do you, and you are fucked.

BHs eat things, however they are fussy eaters. When something approaches closer than the BH's Roche limit it gets pulled to bits, into rings. The rings move extremely fast, and become ionised gas which is glowing extremely hot. If you think of Interstellar, they depicted a BH with what was actually an unrealistically feeble and weak accretion disk, and even then the astronauts ought to have gotten killed by the radiation.

Even small BHs are some of the most destructive objects period. BHoften have a "shock bubble" of radiation(pic related). I love 40k but we are talking about a place in which atoms cannot exist. Adamantite? Plasteel? That's great. Can it endure light speed impacts?

A BH can be expected to emit cosmic rays. A proton with the kinetic energy of a baseball? Oh yes! I'm very familiar with 40k ridiculousness but you cannot guard against this kind of stuff.

BH destroys the deamon effortlessly.

The point was that the daemon is destroyed by the black hole.
But what does a daemon-possessed black hole do?

Actually the other way around true to. Material world can change warp and manipulate it.

The same thing all black holes do. Try to take over the world by outliving it. The one black hole who that exists the lasts at the end of times wins.

And previous installations of sci fi have ftl because taking a thousand years to reach the neighboring system would make it fucking boring

Nothing. Just sit there and eat light and be incredibly bored

>But what does a daemon-possessed black hole do?

Create a universal singularity.

THE EMPEROR FINDS A WAY