MTG Modern General

Maybe you just stuck ass?

>>What control deck do you play?
Tron was the first deck I played when I started modern. Gave up when TC got printed, and built Abzan, which became Jund when K command was printed. Never looked back
>>What control deck do you hate?
Tron. Goddamn, I hate it.
>>What control deck is going to be the best after the meta shakes out?
Probably Grixis.

>tron baby can't play skred
Like pottery

>What control deck do you play?
Affinity with 4 Chalices and Dredge with 3 Brutalities.
>What control deck do you hate?
I don't hate control, but if I had to choose the one I dislike the most would be Tron. Tried it, should it after a week (I tried and sold many decks)
>What control deck is going to be the best after the meta shakes out?
Probably Grixis, Skred (or Tron)

Sold it after a week*

I started making an Eldrazi tron deck because I thought Eldrazi were cool. Why the hate for Tron? The deck isn't that fast, although my version probably isn't the most competitive.

tappedout.net/mtg-decks/shogg-tron/
Doing a local tournament next weekend, anything I should change drastically to have a shot at winning Veeky Forums. Im missing one Chalice of the void but otherwise I have the cards

>Why the hate for Tron?
It's just got the heaviest 1 sided match ups of any deck. If you're faster you win, if you're slower you lose. But since there's no good land hate in modern, if you are slower there's little you can do to improve your match up.
Normal tron at least is like that. I assume turning on main deck removal lessens this effect for eldrazitron.

It's Infect and Affinity that feel broken to me, but Ive only been playing pseudo competitive for about a year.

7 mana turn 3 is good but it still gets outsped by burn and infect all the time. What exactly is the secret to broken tron?

That's the point. You lose if you're slower and win if you're faster. This is why there's a metagame.

Like I said, decks that are faster have no problems. Anything slower has really bad match up, and you can't adjust your deck to be better against tron like you can with most other decks. Removal, counters, hand disruption, none of these things will win against tron unless you can produce a fast clock. And most decks are built in such a way that they can't significantly increase their clock without hurting the core of the deck.

Decks that player lower CMC's and more instant speed cards like Grixis and Jund have much more manageable match ups against those decks. Against Tron, though, those decks I mentioned struggle.

You're in monobrown, which is the same "problem" I have in my casual deck. You could speed it up with green (and ramp with things like Sylvan Scrying), but then it wouldn't be a colorless deck, right?

That's where most of the hate comes from, I think. You can fix your lands pretty quickly in the right colors and just start dropping hilarious threats and shitty things like Karn and Ugin

Come to think of it, your deck looks an awful lot like mine does now. If you're looking for critiques, I would keep more All is Dust in the mainboard, because it almost never hurts you and find something to swap for Kozi (Maybe ROE Kozi?) since his ability is dependent on equal CMC, which in your deck is /way high/; You might get value out of it sometimes, but more often than not you won't do anything with it.
Hope that helps, feel free to ignore

...

>>What control deck do you play?
uw tenuous soft-locks with small creatures control
>>What control deck do you hate?
mono-blue aether vial control with the spreading seas package

>>What control deck is going to be the best after the meta shakes out?
it's probably going to be uw tenuous soft-locks with small creatures control due to how hard it shits on angel's grace control, valakut titan control and karn tribal control.

>angel's grace control, valakut titan control and karn tribal control

Yeah I kept him for the hand refill but I think a second Ulamog Ceaseless hunger would be way better for the 10 mana. and I totally agree with All is Dust that thing is a huge fuck you, I love it.

What do you think of warping Wail im considering sideboarding but not sure what to sub in, I need some artifact hate but theres so little in colourless.

you're right on how restricted you are in colourles, I didnt realise until an ensnaring bridge slapped my shit

I run Warping Wail as a 4-of in the mainboard, but that's because my meta (like three friends at most) is so heavy on small critters and sorcery speed removal, like Wrath effects or similar. If nothing else it's an extra mana if you need it early game. Definitely a target dropping into the sideboard for the second match. If you're looking for replacements, I'm kind of at a loss for you. Defense grid is great for control matchups, but I don't know how prominent that is in your meta. Dolmen Gate, Distorting Lens (you could combo this with AiD and blow up lands / artifacts, below), Rachet Bomb (slow, but you could use it to blow up more troublesome artifacts).

As for more artifact interaction, I see Bane of Bala Ged in your board. Good choice if you can stick him.
Karn is a strong pick and he's already in your board
If you really wanted to be a dick about it, you could run Culling Scales (as long as your target is CMC 3 or less; Ensnaring Bridge is). This would be an extra funny pick because all your permanents are (for the most part) high drops so much like AiD, it's just going to help you.

If you're really desperate for removal, you could shoot for Universal Solvent or Scour from Existence. Expensive, but if Tron is online then they're both whatever.

They're all pretty tough calls and situational, sorry. Wish I could be more help

>>What control deck do you play?
Does fish count? I am debating going to 8 seas if it helps.

>>What control deck do you hate?
I'm fish.

>>What control deck is going to be the best after the meta shakes out?
I play fish.

>mono-blue aether vial control with the spreading seas package

I need to get Chalices, and I'm kicking myself because I failed to get them before they spiked. However, that's more for Legacy. Iirc, all I need now for Legacy is Wasteland, Chalice, and a Flusterstorm. Still, chalice is nice in the board when I got Vials.

You've probably been asked this every Modern thread, but can we see a list?

current iteration of the paper list i play. copter count has been variable but the card is strong in this deck.

How often is true believer useful?

comes in against adnauseam.

coupled with selfless spirit and aether vial it makes it really, really hard for the other guy to kill you with the lightning storm plan.

Oh I didn't think about selfless spirit, thought bouncing it was your only option.

They'll just lab man you.

Chalice of the Void is such a good card its a shame it got reprinted even rarer, I was the same, got two when they were around $12 thinking they were expensive then. Its my favorite counter to burn heavy deck that run the usual array of about 20 1 mana cards, or getting two and preventing all of an opponent destroy artifact cards. It's even more glorious when you get the ensnaring bridge out with it.

Also Mill gets a lot of hate but I think after a long streak of losses trying to make an infinite mill combo work, I've changed to straight aggressive strats with good results and I think I've finally got it as close to perfect as I can efficiency wise.
tappedout.net/mtg-decks/cranial-flush/

Im the only person playing mill at my local store and no-one has counters besides the occasional Aeons Torn. Does mill deserve the bad rep? It's got some good and bad matchups but it seems like a couple of new mill cards away from being competitive.

>got chalice'd on 0, 1 and 2 all at once today
literally couldn't play a single card in my deck

>playing a game against infect
>he locks me out of 1 mana cost spells which he quickly realises is most of my deck
>drop the naturalize, he uses proliferate to add an extra counter
>he drops the second chalice
mfw

>They'll just lab man you.
i have like eleven and a half outs to lab man in my mainboard, the half out being flickering a relevant creature with displacer to nab the lab. i mean yeah it MIGHT get me, but it hasn't yet.
to be perfectly honest with you the fuckin' shroud guys rarely even make it to the field because the adnauseam players almost always lose when i flop thalia down and jam a thoughtsieze monster up their ass. to say this is a 'good' matchup for me is a gross understatement.

Proliferating to respond to attacks on a chalice sounds genius but I don't think it's legal. The naturalize is declared targeting the Chalice, the Chalice checks if the spell is countered, it isn't, he plays the proliferate spell, it resolves and an additional counter is placed on the Chalice, then doesnt the naturalize resolve? the spell has already entered the stack without being countered.

You got bamboozled

>>drop the naturalize, he uses proliferate to add an extra counter

I... I don't think it works like that. I'm fairly certain chalice doesn't trigger because the spell is already on the stack while it has one counter.

Is my train of thought.

Neither of us were sure at the time, it should have been more obvious but I thought Chalice checking the naturalize was interrupted by the instant, so the proliferation effect resolves, then the Chalice checks and the naturalize resolves.

Found a new proxy shop, what deck should I buy into? Bant Eldrazi looks like a fun middle finger to the idiots in my meta, but I'm open to suggestions.

Yeah you can't proliferate, from gatherer
>The number of counters on Chalice of the Void matters only at the time the spell is cast. Changing the number of charge counters on Chalice of the Void after a spell has been cast won’t change whether the ability counters the spell. If the Chalice had the correct number of counters when the spell was cast, its ability will trigger. If the Chalice had too many or too few counters when the spell was cast, the Chalice’s ability won’t trigger.
If the card text was
>Whenever a player casts a spell, if that spell's converted mana cost is equal to the number of counters on chalice, counter it
then it would work I think

I would consider the second Temporal Mastery at least in the sideboard. You'll get some some hard if not impossible matchups, something like getting an extra turn without getting finished off might be exactly what you need. But you'd be better off with Serum Visions then at the cost of a turn 3, 3 card draw.

Wizards murdered Mill and the lack of Glimpse reprints is criminal when its so core to the deck. Startled awake was a scrub trap and im still occasionally running the Consuming Aberration or Sewer Nemesis

What is your meta?

It's more that the chalice trigger never hits the stack at all.

>you cast naturalize
>chalice immediately compares the cmc
>if they match - Trigger on stack
>if they don't - carry on
>they don't, so no trigger
>priority goes to you
>you pass
>opponent responds
>proliferate
>goes to 2 counters
>naturalize resolves

Eh, not quite. It would have to read something like:

>If a spell with cmc equal to the number of counters on ~ would resolve, counter it instead

I like seeing Void Winnower and Sundering Titan. This is a solid Tron deck, I think you need another Sanctum of Ugin, I run 4 without the Conduit of Ruin just because my meta is more about creature removal (too many dismembers) and I need a reliable way to find big creatures, although I suffer if im topdecking for a big creature and get nothing. I assume the 2x Chalices are because they're too expensive right? I eventually got the 4, you need them to stall out or even straight up win games against infect and burn, they are your holy grail.

Bad Infect and Burn players with a handful of Jund and Junk dudes that don't understand much beyond playing what's in their hand unfortunately. Already took last tournament with Dredge and now I'm liking the idea of making those playsets of Fatal Push worthless.

I don't know if they'd template it like that. I mean, it works, and resolve appears on cards quite a bit, but I don't think they've ever used a counter mechanic in that way.

Eldrazi seems fine then. If the bannings turn more people off infect tron would probably work too.

What's the most frustrating control deck one can build on a budget of, say, about 100$?

Went 3-1 with a Japanese Bubble Hulk list at FNM tonight.

Highlights:
T3'd Naya Burn
T4 Esper LlotV to hose my 'yard strat, tapped out next turn for Lingering Souls tokens & I flashed in Venser to bounce it winning next turn

hareruyamtg.com/en/k/kD05174W/

It's weird, but it works.

I suppose the other way works.

>Whenever an opponent casts a spell, counter that spell if its CMC is equal to the number of counters on ~

This should work because it triggers regardless of cmc and should check on resolution.

I just realized that there is a downside to this method, too. If you destroy chalice with another spell of a different cmc in response to adding a counter, the first spell won't be countered because it can't check the counters on resolution.

I ran Sanctum, but found 4 left me with no way to start the tutoring, 1 or 2 works with Conduit, you get it pretty fast with Eldrazi temple the trigger is on cast so you at least get to tutor for 5 and potentially keep a 5/5 and -2 less for that creature in the next turn, if you're lucky you also have a Sanctum out and you can get all you big players in your hand without blowing a lot of mana.

Seeing as we're talking about Eldrazi has anyone considered Planar Bridge as a way to cheat out a deck of big hitters

Pretty sure it can, the game has 'memory' about the last known information of a permanent before it went to the graveyard
>413.2f If an effect requires information from the game (such as the number of creatures in play), the answer is determined only once, when the effect is applied. If the effect requires information from a specific object, including the source of the ability itself, the effect uses the current information of that object if it hasn’t changed zones; otherwise, the effect uses the last known information the object had before leaving the zone it was expected to be in. There are two exceptions: (1) if an effect deals damage divided among some number of creatures or players, the amount and division were determined as the spell or ability was put into the stack (see rule 402.6), and (2) static abilities can’t use last known information (see rule 412.5). If the ability text states that an object does something, it’s the object as it exists—or as it most recently existed—that does it, not the ability.
I think this applies here

Did you ever need 3 seer's? I understand 2 so you can get a 2nd in case of removal but how often do you need a 3rd?

Hrm. Yea, you're probably right.

Why is Breaking and Entering have such shitty mana distribution, its second part is overpriced and no-one is going to have the mana or reason to play it. but the first half is the second most efficient mill card. Turn and Burn is a perfect example of the dual card done right.

Wouldn't Serum visions be better than seer? Does the job a bit faster unless im missing something with mass sacrificing.

Dragon Maze was a pretty badly designed set as a whole. I don't think there's really a correct mana cost for a mill//reanimate spell. Turn Burn is well designed because both halves are good against creatures and together they're really good against a creature. Breaking//Entering does 2 mostly useless polar opposite things on their own and 1 strong but over costed thing together.
You need seer to combo off

How do I beat Ravager Control with Naya Goblin Guide Control? I thought Eidolon of the Great Revel would suffice but turns out they vomit their hand and then activate Nexus instead of playing cards if they're behind on life

Nut draw with Destructive Revelry and/or Shattering Spree

Teir three masterrace

>>What control deck do you play?
playan some grixis humans control and mountain control
blood moon and bolt are the most powerful control cards in the game

>>What control deck do you hate?
can't stand urza control

>>What control deck is going to be the best after the meta shakes out?
idk, RUG 1-drops control?

lead with lavamancer and side four revelries

I like the Woodfall Primus tech in that l-
>Glimpse the Unthinkable
Now that's some expensive spicy tech.

How do you deal with card redundancies against anyone not running creatures or protection like Greaves shrouding. I find Tron punishes Path to Exiles and wouldn't burn outspeed you?

Both tron and burn arnt that popular atm
But against burn i have my spellskites atleast

Do you play on xmage? I may have played merfolk against you recently

>I picked up a deck and didn't instantly win! Waaah
No. The deck just sucked. It was a good meta call against Dredge and whatnot, but it's just not that powerful a deck.

>Maybe you just stuck ass?
I'm not really sure what you mean.

>tron baby can't play skred
I play tron a handful of times and I'm a tron baby, huh? I don't even really like tron anymore. Looking at my history, I was a little off... haven't played tron much since 2014.

It has favorable matchups against every linear aggro deck, which occupy pretty much the entirety of modern.

Like you auto-win against Infect, Affinity, Burn, Dredge, Tron, Merfolk and Zoo. How the fuck did you manage to do poorly with the deck?

>Like you auto-win against Infect, Affinity, Burn, Dredge, Tron, Merfolk and Zoo. How the fuck did you manage to do poorly with the deck?
I lost to not those. Like I said, I lost to a shitty brew... 4/4s and 5/5s... I don't remember exactly what, it was last year. Even the matchups where I did win, it just didn't seem that great.

I play in a meta with a bunch of poorfags, so I'm the only one that played Dredge. And there hasn't been any Tron in months. I haven't seen Merfolk in over a year.

Then by what metric is Skred Red a bad deck when you arguably aren't even playing modern?

I guess it's just that I play a lot of other shit that crushes. Decks that feel powerful like Affinity, Tron, Eldrazi, Breach Titan, Bant Spirits, and various decks that have been axed like Twin or Dredge.

I suppose it's just the feel. A week after playing Skred Red, I tried Skred Swans, and though it may be worse, at least I felt like I was in control of all my games.

I get what you're saying: my FNM scene isn't really modern, but I've played in actually competitive events (GPs, PTQs, etc.), so I think it's fair to gauge how it feels when I'm getting my shit kicked in by a garbage deck.

I like skred, but it does seem like red in general is the most likely to be screwed by someone playing the random life gain/normally bad fatties decks.

Your ad nauseam matchup is probably 65-35 without a sideboard, with the fourth thalia and meddling mages, its probably closer to 80-20 post sideboard. You don't need any additional cards dedicated to the ad nauseam matchup.

It has mainboard answers to MartyrProc and Soul Sisters as well, in the form of powerful removal and high-damage wincons.

>Dredge
>axed
>Bant Spirits
>powerful
What the fuck are you talking about?

>go to local anime store that does MTG, advertised as modern
>playing titanshift
>don't know what I expected but
>first round paired against a 450lb retard. when I say retard I don't just mean generic insult retard I mean the dude was there with his mom and genuinely seemed handicapped
>his deck is an 80 card monowhite pile built around the "combo" of putting a bunch of equipment on a platinum angel
>no trick or gimmick to achieving this goal, just make land drops and wait apparently
>tries to brag about how his deck was just a "little expensive" at $92
>gets mad as fuck and starts swearing and sperging out when I T4 him two games in a row
>next game vs monowhite life gain infect pillow fort ????? mess
>T4 him two games in a row
>next game vs a guy on 80 card rakdos werewolves and discard
>T4 him two games in a row
>Last round
>esper unburial-thopter-gifts
>oh wow, a real deck
>T4 him two games in a row
>Guy next to me was playing jeskai ascendancy and making the casuals mad as fuck but apparently he whiffed and lost to the rakdos werewolves/discard deck
>collect my 3 booster pack prize and leave

I wanted to give the place a chance because it's so close to where I live and the closest LGS is about a 90 minute drive... but holy fuck

>What the fuck are you talking about?
Not axed, nerfed a bit; whatever.

And yeah, I think Bant Spirits is powerful. I lost to it in a top 8 last year, then tried it a few times and that deck fucking beats face.

Is Knightfall or bant 3 drop good stuff a decent deck? The combo looks cool but I think I'd rather keep it at 1-2 for CoCo reasons.

Meanwhile it's the exact opposite at my store.

I brought some shitty Tron shell build and I got stomped, almost everyone plays there tier 1 or 2 decks, rarely seing worse stuff.

skred red is ultimately a meta deck
if you take the stock lists and go up against a deck that just spews out x/4s or wins on the stack, you're gonna have a bad time

skred is way too slow to have a favorable matchup against tron

I wouldn't mind that shop at all. I'd just make a good brew and win with fun shit. I'd honestly rather play against dudes who don't have tier 1 decks every time. Seriously, 3 fnms ago I played against dredge 4 times and then burn. It's retarded desu, I fucking hate it.

yeah, I'm thinking I might try taking something a little more tame if that's going to be the meta. although I still don't want to just roll over and lose to the guys with actual competitive decks, so it's hard to find a middle ground.

Its hard to find an imbetween for casual
>dont play competetive magic often
>get invited to a university magic night by a friend, never knew he played magic and visa versa
>I get there, a reasonable number of normal looking humans a couple of lost souls already huddled at a table, could be worse
>brought a modern hydra deck that just does dumb shit with counters and gets rekt by any removal
>friend loses the first game and just watches
>I dont realise yet but the majority of people were some friend group that started playing magic that day and only had store bought decks or had not even 60 cards made from random singles from booster packs
>Games are awkward and short, by game 3 it feels like Im some kind of monster ruining everything, but it seems more awkward if I suddenly walk out
>Second last game, opponent barely knows the rules
>we dont even play the final round
>Get given some booster packs I know were bought by this group of friend and intended to be given to someone they knew.
>I try to refuse
>its the most uncomfortable experience
I just wanted to play a card game

Meanwhile I can only play certain decks or get my shit pushed in by a dredge, jund, affinity meta at my local store and everyone is a bit too autistic and overweight.

This is the fucking worst feel.

Got lots of friends that are casual to magic and/or freshly started their adventure.

It boils down to this
One refuses to take any advice despite getting his shit pushed in by a person that plays for a month with a deck constructed from 2 lbs of random cards he bought for pennies.
He'll go ultra mad if you want to help him or teach anything.
Second thinks he's hot shit because he wins sometimes vs my casual brews to play with them, when I brought one of my FNM brews and was repeatedly killing him on turn 3 - 4 he threw a tantrum I'm a tryhard etc etc.

I can't either find middle ground it's either ultra casuals or tier 1-2 decks at my store.

I know only ONE person that I can play non tier 1-2 decks and he won't bitch or go mad over it, he just has fun playing with me and isn't utterly bad at the game.

I'd just make a brew, tech against the actual good decks, some graveyard hate and some storm hate it sounds like, definitely dedicate the entire sideboard to the good decks. Also are you going to a magic shop in North Conway? I used to go to one there with a fat mentally challenged guy who played angels, his name was Patrick and he would hit on my girlfriend

Sounds like your friends are autistic

What a well thought out contribution to the thread.

>Two 80 card decks
Jesus tapdancing Christ

no, it's an anime store in a shitty little town called Ardmore in oklahoma.

yeah, they were actually discussing how their decks were around 80 cards and they didn't want to slim them down to 60 because they would have to cut too many pet cards.

>skred is way too slow to have a favorable matchup against tron
what's mind stone?
what's blood moon?
what's crumble to dust?

Doesn't Skred run like 2 Moons mainboard?

That sounds like it would be an interesting experience the first time, but would get old really quickly. How many modern stores have people that primarily use casual decks?

Off topic, but what do you think of Titan Shift as a deck? I was considering playing it. Is it fun?

Ill host a fortnightly magic night with my roommates and we'll often get friends of friends who come with these fucking crazy decks (someones uncle came with a pack fresh premade deck from 1993). Exactly what you described happened last week, these two jockish men who had gotten suddenly hooked on magic got invited and they had these 80 or 90 card decks just full of ''cool'' cards they liked. No strategy or synergy they just had straight up the cards they thought had the best effects on their own. Both decks were 5 colour, one deck had 16 mana and no plains or swamps that he needed for a lot of cards in his deck, the other had enough lands and at least one of every colour but a huge abundance of junk black high manacost common cards from the Eldritch Moon set and a couple of shiny spirit cards that only interacted with spirits, which he had non of.

I showed them tapped out, they thought it was going to be wrestling and it got overwhelming for them fast

Shouldn't that peanut butter be a pool on the table? Whites invented jars.

>Titan Shift
Not him but I much prefer a straight up red wins, burn or cruel control. I had a bad experience where I borrowed a friends Titan shift deck and then burned myself out every game before I could win. I didnt do well with my tops decks but I find the archetype risky.