/CofD/ &/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

Right? It's like the gift that keeps on giving.
So they're the same rank as the Old Gods of the Thistle then? I mean, that does lend more credence to the idea that they may be protected by the Pax. Also, what made the Mummies and what rank would they be?

Use their magic in front of people without having reality try to fuck them? Not have to worry about summoning the stuff of unreality from fucking up their dice?

Except Supernal Truths and Ascension is the thickest form of immortality in the entire setting. You need the highest possible Omen to even counter/undo it. Nothing else will work.

They're not dependent because they already won their right to rule and are completely absolute in their personalized symbolism of tyranny and oppression.

The Sorccerer kings of Irem? ersonally I'd guess at rank 5-6 level beings, maaaaaybe seven since they're behind a splat and are basicly immortal even if they only exist in a private underworld realm....

Magefags are just shitposters. Mages being stronger doesn't make them shitpost. It's just their preferred angle of attack.

The Gentry/Gods of the Thistle are comparable to lesser-mid range Archmasters.

They never actually stated what rank the sponsors for Mummy would be. My guess is 7.

It's a matter of perspective. What's the point of being the ultimate tyrant if you have nobody to rule over? Then again trying to understand the political philosophy of an exarch is an impossible task.

Honestly you could get a lot of mileage simply by making other supernaturals count as sleepers for the purposes of Paradox. I also have toyed with the idea of a Hunter Conspiracy made up of Proximi that understand what Paradoxes are and knows how to manipulate them to fuck over Mages, a sort of Banisher Junior.

>What's the point of being the ultimate tyrant if you have nobody to rule over?

They DO rule over humanity. Their the ultimate tyrants because they ARE tyranny. They're not corporal beings, they're the living symbols of oppression. They're all around us.

>Use their magic in front of people without having reality try to fuck them?

Not saying that it isn't a step above but don't most other splats except maybe hunter shy away from 'showing off' in public anyway?

>Not have to worry about summoning the stuff of unreality from fucking up their dice?

Dem's just the breaks of a mage though. Bad stuff generally happens to all splats when fucking up a dice roll for something major/important

Having other splats ping as sleepers would be a good way to fuck with a party or as a mystery if it was only a small group of them.

I realize that, what i'm talking about it is beings which are covered under the Pax Arcanum, which the Death Lords are (Rank 7 as I was corrected), which means that the Old Gods could be as well. It would explain why they're still you know, around.
Weren't they implied to be from the Lower Depths? I may be confusing them with something else.

More or less this. The Exarchs are impossible to confront by any means without crossing the Threshold. You can't exactly punch the concept of greed in the face, now can you? As a previous user had once said.

The Death Lords and the True Fae are their own sponsors. The Archmages won't attack them because why would anyone want a cataclysmic war of the gods?

True most supernaturals don't just go around flashing their shit, but it they also don't get hard coded in the rules "Fuck you" roll to not have your power A) not work, B)hit you or C) summong some horrible monster along with various amounts of tainting your very being.

I'm more going for that most supernaturals can get away with doing their magic at someone in a enclosed place/if they know they're going to be killing them in a fight. If a mage is fighting a lone gunman in a room most of his spells are going to make the sleeper ping paradox.

>You can't exactly punch the concept of greed in the face, now can you?
Y'all Niggas need Exalted.

I'd have to check, my dood, I have all the mummy books because I'm a faggot that likes the game in theory... But well, we all know that shit ain't getting no play.

But you can punch the concept of greeds face in, along with at least 10 diffrent kinds of greed personafied spirits, demons or what have you.

The tyranny exists on multiple levels.

For example The General is the exarch of Forces. He is violence, conflict, and blood shed made manifest. But he's also the tyranny of gravity pointing down, friction slowing your car, etc.

I was the user about a dozen threads back asking people to explain exactly how the fuck that game is supposed to be played, the best I was able to settle on was Cultist time with Flashbacks for chaser. I prefer the more Stale Beer flavor of D:tD or cold coffee of H:tV in nWoD, but I can't get any one to play those with either.
>Picture related.
...Aswadim.

The Aswadim are too stupid to live.

You mean Ascension? A 'mere' archmage is nothing compared to the Exarchs.

I get what you're saying but I guess my question is more "is there anything another splat can do that a Mage is incapable of under the right circumstance?"

Like for instance I thought someone was pointing out a few threads ago that it's literally written in one of the Werewolf books that a Mage can do a bunch of spiritual magic that the best Werewolf cannot. This just makes me think that if I wanted to save the world as a Werewolf shouldn't I devote my time to making buddies with a mage and have him/her fix everything?

Paradox is just a part of being a Mage.

I always thought the best way that Mage ever put forth to explain everybody's favorite Exxies was in the Seers book, where the explained the concept of the Iron Seals and how they were th literal supernal representation of that Exarch essentially chaining the particular Arcana to a bevy of symbols which exceed the capacity of High Speech to convey and drive you mad if you study them too long.

Mages are the strongest supernaturals around in terms of potential, this is all very true.

The key word here is "potential"

>Has anyone here done a game set during the World Wars?
I'd kinda like too. IIRC, the traditions and technocracy both worked together in ww2 when they realized how many Nephandi were working with the nazis, and I just kinda love the idea of a The Man From UNCLE style teamup.

I mean, yeah, that's why they're trying to unmake themselves into the Abyss.

Ascension isn't the Threshold.

Werewolves can eat your face in melee.

Not only that, but that's also when the Virtual Adepts crossed the lines and joined the Traditions, forging them for the inauspicious 8 into the sublime 9 once more. It's a great time for skull-duggery and just straight spycraft.

But is it impossible for a Mage in a specific build under the right conditions to eat your face in melee better?

They define the High Speech which is in part why it's such a mess now.

>Potential

Once a Mage becomes a Master it's game over for the other equivalently statted splats.

>'I'M POOR NIGGA LUL'

Seems like a stupid premise for a Tribe, but I do love the idea of ghetto werewolves.

Yeah, the only ways I can see mummy working is with cultists/the semi-immortal cultists infused with mummy power and having the mummy pop up as the heavy or for DRAMTIC scenes. The other way is to play it in the Sothic turn where EVERY mummy is awake and the mummy community is vibrant and alive for the next... year or so I think. Honestly I don't mind playing a cultist, infused cultist or a ghost cultist which is possible in that game, but that reeeeally doesn't look good for a game.

Ah, yeah I don't think there is, I could be wrong but... Well Master mages are able to create and uncreate things at will along with every other thing they can do between initiate and master. But I've never really played assuming that every supernatural splat is represented in each games world as they are in their own line, kind of like how vampires, witches and werewolves in hunter aren't -really- those splats unless you go hard and convert them as such.

Yes. Someone back on the OPP forums made three Mage PCs designed to be better than Werewolves at melee. It worked out. It's just not every Mage is going to do it.

If you want, I can try to find the page for you.

No. A Thrysus can shapeshift their face to do it, although I doubt they would because I'm pretty sure they might get stuck with a taste for human flesh. Possibly.

Transformation spells are neat. There's a grimoire in the book of grimoires that can transform you into something called a Vyrd, essentially an albino, completely hairless, completely carnivorous humanoid with pointed teeth and enhanced agility and flexibility. You also become nocturnal. The changes are permanent too, and you'd have to use Life magic to temporarily regain your normal form if you wanted to go in public.

No, they didn't change sides til Turing was executed by the brits, which was after the war was over.
I suppose a Technocracy space marine might stand a chance, but that's mostly cuz space marines get really fancy magic armor. My money would still be on the werewolf tho.

Oh man I love that book, the uh... Whatever, Tales of the Vyrd or romance of the sun and moon. Just some stupid book about pre-historic alternate forms of humanity FUCKING a human that sometimes turns people into this fantasy(?) race.

I always kind of thought it was weird that Werewolves wield weapons while transformed

>What did you fucking say? Say it again. Then I'll transform into a hulking mass of muscles and rage, with deadly fangs and claws that can rip out your guts and carve you up real good.
>And then I'll cut you with this knife

Klaives and fetich knives have a purpose, usually that being silver weapons for killing other werewolves or werecreatures.

Mages can do quite a bit. they've got a large metaphysical tool kit. they got to deck themselves out

The specific splats can do their stuff more reliably and consistently

Why not? A weapon is a force multiplier, and werewolves have a lot of force to multiply. I'll admit that a knife is probably not much of an advantage over claws, given how big their claws are.

I know, that's just what I think when I see art like that. It strikes me as incongruous.

The Klaives are mostly used against other Werewolves and BSDs, that's why they're usually Silver.
You're also thinking of just the Wolves, go look at like, what Khans or Mokole can do.

By working for the Gate. The exarch that other exarchs think is a fucking nut. That's oWoD Tremere stupid.

Klaives are for killing werewolves with silver, which is technically a sin but you know. Their fetish weapons on the other hand can do JACKED UP shit, aka spirits of pain that make it feel like you got that tripple edged knife stabed in you or whips made of gold nuggets that channel true sunlight that cause mad damage to vampires.

Ananasi are hands down the most powerful if you're allowing any kind of white room build.

They can cheese their blood pool REALLY hard.

How about this, could a Mage under the right circumstance/with the right build make themselves into a Demon/Mummy/etc identical in every way but better/without the downsides?

It also depends very much on their Ruling Arcana.

They can be just as (if not more so) reliable and consistent then.

Not really. Though It depends. It's a silly question to ask. An Archmaster can specifically do everything a lesser Template can do though. The Practices of Entities and Excision.

That would take a LOT of Arcana at high levels, a lot of high duration spells and... Like it MIGHT possible man, but that would take autistic min/maxing that would get through out by ANYONE who saw it.

No.

Demon/Mummy is harder to do because of 'going loud' and whatever the mummy thing is called. But you can mimic most of their powers with magic.

The real question is why play a Mage if you're tailoring your character to be a Super vampire/werewolf/geist. It's not what the game is about.

IIRC Khans get an auto-hit gift and some of the highest Strength in the game.
I thought that once you hit Aswadim you're beyond the Gate, since you already got into the exclusive club when you hit Master and got you Diadem.

Sure, I know it's not feasible but most of the arguments on this thread don't tend to revolve around the 'how likely' as much as they do the 'could it be done'

Yeah, again this isn't a question of 'why bother' more a question of 'could it be done'

Like if I were given the choice to wake up as any splat tomorrow, would not the answer be "mage, duh because worse case scenario I could choose to become any of the others with my mage powers"

That's nice, but werespiders can do something retarded like, upwards of 150 actions/attacks in a single turn with the appropriate build.

Sure its not Mage-stupid, but its up there.

Swara can also get kind of cheesy when done right, but nowhere near as abusive as this.

Anyone got a good program, website, or something to whip up a M20 character?

I have interactive PDFs, I don't like them because they're so limited.

Something like a non-shitty Mythweavers would be ideal.

>more a question of 'could it be done'
This right here is why Mage is talked about more than any other game.
It allows the autists on Veeky Forums to do their theorycrafting/e-peen stroking because they don't actually have a game to play in. You see the same thing in the pathfinder general, people masturbating about mechanics but not playing the game.

Rite of Dedication makes the object in question grow to match the Crinos form. So knives grow to the size of swords.

That's more or less my point back here .

If there's no, "Well a Mage cannot succeed in a Werewolf or Vampire or Mummy story/let alone better than a Werewolf or Vampire or Mummy" then you'll never be free of the
>Mage supremacy
Shitposting

Great, thank you, shame we were talking about OWOD, Masters of the Art and it's implications. I guess you lose again.

I just thought of something. Why bother turning into a Lion or whatever with Life 4. You'd be way more dangerous/harder to kill if you turned into a sentient cloud of the plague or small pox.

Did you come all the way over here just to post this?

You're no better than the magefags at this point.

Blood Pump + Tick Body + Hydraulic Strength is a pretty standard and powerful Ananasi gift combo. Add in Pincers if you're playing a Myrmidon.

More than that, they don't even read the fucking books they exalt. You can hear a pin drop everytime someone mentions that - shock horror - Archspheres in OWOD *actually* cause Paradox!!! More than that, you *actually* have to make a dice roll instead of just declaring yourself king of the universe!!!

It offends them to their tiny cores. Even now, one of them is searching his folders for "except_thats_not_how_it_works.png" in lieu of intelligent response.

In any case, spamming the 2 word phrase "mage supremacy" apropos of nothing is a breach of global rules. I recommend such people simply be reported and ignored. It has the added bonus of hiding the shitposting from view.

I don't know. If Life spells aren't permanent, wouldn't the infection end with the spell?

What are the differences between oWoD and nWoD in setting and in overall game mechanics?

If I really, really, *really* strained hard, I *might* be able to care even less about your opinion than I do now.

But I doubt it.

nWoD is better.

We're talking about CofD here. Excuse us while we disregard your baseless accusations.

Sorry about the wait Anons, but here's the Sphinxes.
I'm not too buzzed about it, after the first attainment it just kinda peters out, even the section in the Legacy book acknowledges that many just don't care after they can see a hidden meaning in a coffee stain someone passed them.

Didn't bother with Yantras, they're usually pretty meh once you've chewed out a bunch
- Succeed on a skill test related to the spell subject
- Do some Legacy thing which is related that takes a bit of time
- Act in a certain detrimental way for a minor boost, or a bigger one if you get a condition
- Do something quick and easy which is still related to the legacy

Ultimately however, now that there are 5 bloody Attainments, and a lot of spells which just don't bloody work well without a load of reach/potency, or which are so damn easy there's little point having them as attainments, I honestly expect if they did put out a bunch of official ones, they'd have to break the own rules they established, or they'd be decried as being very "samey".

Got to say though, it's a glorious fucking thing writing the 5-dot ones.
Just go for ritual speed, and revel in the fact that you can point at a guy, tell him he's going to get hit by a car, and BOOM, he is.
And it's not even an Act of Hubris.
Guardians probably stay up late at night drinking because of Legacy Masters.

>Mage Supremacy
>Mage Supremacy
>Mage Supremacy

The infection would end but the after effects are lasting. Sort of like if I set a piece of food on fire with Forces. It's kind of pointlessly sadistic though on second thought.

Because sometimes you don't need to wipe out half of the population of Africa, you just need to kill that "White Witch", a pesky spirit with a highly specific Bane.

It's a niche example I know, but honestly Mages have enough things to do without getting into murder-dick-measuring competitions.

Good to know you're primed and ready to move goal posts, thanks.

You're honestly just so fucking pathetic. I'm sorry.

oWoD has a meta-plot which was shit nWoD is a 'toolbox' to build your own mythos. nWoD is a dice build system where a single success on your roll grants the effect. oWoD has a target number of successes.

>Power level arguments

How triggered are you?

>bitching about magefags
Congratulations. You're part of the problem.

Every time you reply to them, you sink to their level.

Every time you post and whine about them when they aren't even here, you sink even lower.

Even now, as I'm posting and whining about you, I'm sinking to your level.

Just shut the fuck up you massive hypocrites. Stop throwing fuel on the fire. Fucking making me throw fuel on the fire. Assholes.

Okay but can I make your asshole into fire with forces and life? The answer is yes.

I would still like to know this.

Mage is the most powerful gameline, but how does that mean anything when you don't even have to apply them to your Chronicle?

Why do people ignore the obvious? I'm convinced that magehate is due to them being stronger rather than them being an issue in crossover.

This is sweet. I love you.

Do Daksha next pls.

Same thing happens with Exalted. White Wolf/Onyx Path can't help but make power tiers in their games.

Solar Exalted OP as fuck pls NERF

>Why do people ignore the obvious?
Because they want to be mad. They want to whip out their dicks and try to do pissing contests with the Magefags, and then they get salty when they can't fucking beat them because they're just shitposters and the only way to beat them is to ignore them.

After the retardation of ascension I'm coming around to this viewpoint

Because this is Veeky Forums man, people come here to bitch and moan under the protection of being anonymous. I do it sometimes, I'm sure we all do to some degree, but the 'magefags' have this meme and they're attached to it, either cause they think it's funny or because they know it's a potent form of cancer.