Pathfinder General /pfg/

One of my players in Dragon's Demand took the Secrets of the Dreaming Dark book. She intends fully to go full-on Old One cultist at some point. Any recommended spells or rituals to fill this tome of forbidden knowledge with?

Howdy folks, newiiiish to Pathfinder GM here, with a "is this a poor descision, should I avoid giving my players too much oppnesss" question?

I told my players to BYODeity, and one asked for a Tower Shield as their Deity's favored weapon.

Should I allow this?

Ah, for a second I thought you were posting this and got excited.
Then when I saw you weren't I was disappointed

Tower Shields aren't a weapon, but I'd allow it.

No, but for the opposite reason: Tower shields are absolutely awful and there are almost zero 1pp ways of making them viable.

Tower Shields are a bit garbage yeah. One of the few 1pp ways to make them alright is the Mobile Bulwark style.

Damn that image is fucking cringey

No, because you cannot attack with a Towershield, so having one would be absolutely pointless.

Mobile Bulwark at least makes then sliightly passable

Is it really?

I like the sentiment about it but the it's pretty overwinded. Someone needs to do a rewrite of this for brevity.

"Surrounded? No. I'm just in a target rich enviornment, desu. Nothing personell, kid."

What are the most shit/underpowered things in SoP that need fixing? I hear Armorist is terrible.

>"You have me surrounded"
>"With solo exp!"

How do I become THE BEST peasant?

Incanter

Wizard peasant

>updates never

Armorist is a unfixed soulknife,thus kinda sucks.

Destruction requires specific builds to do damage well.

Most spheres are underwhelming on their own without support from their respective handbooks.

Incanter is a mess, that can end up too frontloaded

Other than that, its mostly an issue of knowing what your building for and how to use your spheres.

Remind me, can't you cast through your Deity's weapon even if your holy symbol is destroyed? Sorry, PFSRD is not letting me in right now.

Also we have a bunch of new players, so no one is going to be optimizing that hard this time.

Considering the topic. Lets go too fucking far.

What was the coolest, funnest, awesome-st thing you've done with a fetish in you games?

What happened to d20pfsrd?

iirc, you need a specific feat or enchantment or something to do that.

My favorite response to "we have you surrounded" I've ever seen is "all I am surrounded by is FEAR, and DEAD MEN."

So I generally separate combat into the following categories of actions:
>damage
>battlefield control
>debuffing
>support (buffing, healing, removing status effects)

Conceptually I have been thinking through design, and the idea that I finalized on is this. Every character should be able to contribute by doing 1 of these well and 1 of these not as well. Every class should be capable of doing any 3 well with the right build and all of them to some degree.

Out of combat I have thought through it in a similar manner with:
>espionage
>knowledge
>social
>survival

Again every character should do 1 well and be able to contribute to another.

In this way parties of 4 should be able to do all to some degree. The problem I see if when a character can do more than 1 well, as an example most full casters can do 3 well at the same time, for even all 4 well.

Where I think I differ from most folks in the character argument is that not every character should be able to contribute to every situation, but everyone should have a situation where they are the best at it and be able to at least contribute to some others. Anyone disagree strongly?

That comic really is a lot better than it ought to be. At least outside the art.

It's not "butthurt" when I can point to mechanical reasons that I don't like the game.

>Anyone disagree strongly?
No, you just described the principle underpinning of the Tier system, just more indepth

I almost gave in and started typing out a huge, long winded post about stating up and getting art for a demonic spire of corruption and fetishs tailored to me and up on f-list.

But then I remembered this is /pfg/ and not /erp/ so I deleted it all. Cute lewds and implied is fine for this, but let's not go full retard please?

On topic for it, a synthesist summoner with absurd charisma because I just stopped caring. All the tentacles ever, hitting on all the things.

Pack Mule Fighter, or Phantom Thief UnRogue.

You'll want Wisdom and max ranks in Profession (Farmer,) but from there it gets kind of hairy. Ideally you'll want something that portrays all aspects of Peasant life reasonably well, which includes being a huntsman - represented by stealth, tracking, an eagle eye and stealth shots for that "one shot, one kill" mentality.

What I am saying is the absolute best Peasant you can be is a ranged, Wisdom-focused Slayer with max ranks in Profession, Craft (Cooking), Survival, Perception, Handle Animal (take a trait that keys it off Wisdom, Brevoy Bandit does that I think) and Knowledge (Nature), done by taking Know The Land (a trait.)

>not every character should be able to contribute to every situation
What do you suggest said character does in the cases they're not useful?

Keeping in mind that behind each PC is an individual player who has set aside time and effort to be present for the entire game session.

I impregnated a Hamadryad and thus triggered half the conflict in the campaign.

This manga had all kinds of cute anime girls dying, and a single yuri sex scene.

Why?

Enjoy the company they have and the story that is being told.

>Slayer
>Not Favoured Enemy: Beast Ranger with a Cow animal companion

In much the same way as you as a player should be interested in the over all campaign just as much as you are interested in your character. Even then if you are unable to take action in a situation does not me you can not speak and give opinion. As well just enjoying the company of folks and the story of the campaign you're engaging in.

If everyone can contribute to every situation then you still have your problem, it just comes down to who ever acts first for any task that does not require a group. Picking a lock for instance falls under Espionage. If everyone can pick locks it does not mean that everyone is holding one tool of the lock picking set to get the door open.

Not pathfinder, but look at pic related and just think of the implications.

>hey pal you came hyped up for this session but you can't contribute to this scene and the players are finding it more difficult than I expected so I just need you to sit there for two hours and watch
>it's fair because I'd expect them to do the same for you

The Cow is not an animal companion! Animal companions do not make it a habit to try and kick their master!

Then you take Iron Will and Familiar Bond for a Pig.

Cow animal companion, pig (or chicken) familiar.

However you're running out of slots. A Cow, Chicken, and Pig would be best, but how does one get both a chicken and pig as class features?

link to a pastebin. i'm curious.

That is a failure of GMing. If everyone's areas of expertise don't come up at a reasonable pace then it isn't really a failure of the abilities but a failure of the GM to be able to tell an engaging story.

>Pig, cow and chicken
>Not an old bird dog

Packmaster Hunter. You carry your entire farm around with you.

It was none of those things, but I tried building and playing a full-on CN enchantment sorcerer for a "one-dungeon run" side game. He was intended to be an asshole with no sense of right or wrong beyond "does this benefit me, or the people I immediately care about?", to the point of shattering the minds of cultists just because it amused him to do so. The GM and other player thought it was kinky. I'm still at a loss for words.

Looking back, I could probably have easily improved on the build I had. Were it a gestalt, the character would have been so self-centered that Self-Pact Avowed is a no-brainer.

This, holy shit.

I played as the only non-magical character in a party of oracles, bards and magi, yet I felt damn near indispensable with how I'd be able to use Track to hunt down our quarry, talk among the local villagers (I was a provincial myself) and act as the party rock and voice of reason because I didn't go into a problem expecting magic to fix it.

>pig
>gives diplomacy
>I'm glad we could come to an arrangement, however would it be possible to sweeten the deal?
>nudge pig forward

I remember that character!

Or they could leave for another game that assumes people didn't sign up to watch a spectator sport.

Picking one lock, sure, that takes one roll and the party carries on.
I'm thinking more like an entire dungeon floor of traps where the rogue is the only one who can do anything while the rest of the party follows behind them, or games like shadowrun where if you couldn't access the magic plane you just stood around and twiddled your thumbs for the whole scene.

>If my idea of good game design goes wrong, it's the GM's fault for not running it the way it needs to be run to work, it doesn't mean my idea is bad!

This is getting a little silly, are we trying to go for comedically rural farmer, or something a bit more realistic?

Of these feats, what should I get for a witch?
Eschew Materials
False Focus
Spell Penetration
Craft Wondrous Item (going with Craft Clothing skill)

I first thought about Eschew, but then saw False Focus and, while it is nicer, Eschew is constant and you can't lose it like you can lose the focus item. The others are more of a toss up.
It's possible to get the Knowledge Religion skill after leveling and go buy a holy symbol for the focus, right?

A DM unable to accommodate a reasonably built character in either fluff or mechanics is a shitty DM.

>>If my idea of good game design goes wrong, it's the GM's fault for not running it the way it needs to be run to work, it doesn't mean my idea is bad!
In this care it really is.

A GM not being able to have your character's specialty comes up either means you made a character with the wrong expectations because expectations weren't communicated, the GM's fault, you made them despite expectations, your fault, or your GM has an inability to pace the game, the GM's fault. Homogeneous game design where everyone contributes to every skill check is absolutely buttfuck retarded. If you think that is the answer I shudder to think I share a hobby with you.

False Focus, spend 100 gold on a holy symbol tattoo

Spell penetration.

Craft Wondrous Item, but max your Spellcraft instead.

Only because I hate being on the receiving end of getting hints and teased without anything at the end.
pastebin.com/DcwkV0mv

>I'm thinking more like an entire dungeon floor of traps where the rogue is the only one who can do anything while the rest of the party follows behind them, or games like shadowrun where if you couldn't access the magic plane you just stood around and twiddled your thumbs for the whole scene.
Yes, that is a failure of GMing if they create an entire dungeon where only one player can contribute. Having everyone able to handle traps just means that you switch out who rolls, it's still a boring dungeon.

Wait, a tattoo can be used for a holy symbol to focus? Holy fuck that's awesome and I was already planning on ripping out any enemy's tattoos I come across with the witch spell.

A reasonably built character should be able to have something to contribute to every scene - not necessarily something that will solve it, but enough to not stand around like an idiot.

My main point is that saying that the above shouldn't be the case, and some characters shouldn't be able to contribute to certain scenes, applies extra design restrictions and requirements on the GM for a relative loss in overall party enjoyment - so what the hell is the point?

I don't know why you're fucking stupid enough to think that "able to contribute to skill checks that are not their specialty" is exactly the same thing as "contributes exactly as much as a specialist at all times".

>The Raiders in the /qst/ archive of Suptg. the world-building is mostly in the first four threads. It is not compiled.

>More Pillory when the other three stories are done.

Or maybe everyone can handle traps in different ways, and each trap involves an assessment of which party member or combination of party members is best suited to it.

Yes

What do the immortal or long-lived races do during before they are considered adults (over 100 years old)?

Ooh, on that i wholeheartedly agree; a DM should be able to craft scenes where one character or another gets the chance to shine, but a character should not be able to do every scene.

It's like with the character I mentioned earlier; my Slayer was a master at hunting stuff down or starting a fire (everyone else were city boys) or talking to a local farmer, but when it came to matters of magic or nobility or music I would step aside and provide commentary as needed.

Pathfinder is not and should never be a challenge to "win it," it's about being a good team player, and as long as you have something you're better at than anyone else than you can be cherished when that thing comes up.

I'm sure, since I tend to mention it when people dig for stuff like it. I don't know what it says about me that I still want to revisit the character, if only to have another chance to prove how much of a nigh-unredeemable asshole he was, or use certain spells more than once.

Of course, looking at Avowed has made it really hard to imagine him as anything but a gestalt character now, so I might have to start over.

That's still the same kind of game design. Just different boundaries for where you draw the situation.

See, your argument doesn't make much sense though. Unless the task requires multiple people you are going to use who is best at it.

Please explain a way you can design a game so that multiple people can contribute in a meaningful manner to singular tasks, such as a skill check when one person is the specialist and others are not.

In pathfinder this would be Aid another. However as I have said having areas you can contribute is important, like aid another.

Being able to contribute in every area is stupid, as it muddles the room for the differences between characters.

School, arts, and play.

My headcanon is that they spend a couple decades having babies with other members of their species.

An Elf is only allowed to leave the compound and explore the outside world if they "replace" themselves with a child or something sufficiently useful for other people having kids.

It also means your Elf waifu is a mother, but if that's an issue than you need to grow up.

I made a Tantrist Mage, and used Silent Stilled Componentless Phantasmal Killer on the GM's bag guy of the arc while fucking him.

The GM made me roll five concentration checks, and I made all five (with two rerolls using hero points) and the bad guy failed both his saves.

GM was pissed (and this is probably why three of my characters in different games he's run all suffered unusually specific deaths recently).

That's just awesome. I know what I'm getting next.

It doesn't make sense to you because you're fucking stupid and can't see where what you're talking about leads. Play Shadowrun and come back.

Farmers are hardcore.

And you never know when they've been veterans.

>Holy symbol for Arshea tramp stamp is now canon

Incanter is too frontloaded, but it's not actually bad if you don't just dip it.

Only thing it could do with is reduction of said frontloading, other than that it's pretty dang alright.

It's nice for 'I just want casting' things when you don't wanna worry about too many class features (And don't want to have to try and fit them all on your sheet if you're gestalt.)

Abstract the tasks to more than just skill rolls.

>Challenge: Very deadly bats inhabit a cavern and the party must retrieve a fragile item from the other side. The party has no stealth specialist.
>The mage casts defenses and buffs over the tank, and the tank runs in to attract the attention of all the bats. They can survive for a few minutes with the help of the buffs, but the bats are too violent to let the tank carry the item
>The ranger with the best speed then runs in, picks the lock, and runs out

Everyone has contributed significantly in different ways.

I don't know what to make for the SoM play test

When was the last time you had a "oh I've fucked up now" moment when misjudging how powerful someone is? The sort of moments where the enemy suddenly seems A LOT more threatening? Doesn't even need to be combat, misjudging an enemy's position or intelligence is nearly as bad.

And they can hand out a 24 hour one with the healing brand to boot!

I don't see how that is any different than what I am advocating. That's just good pacing that plays to people's specialties. A scene should not be monolithic so only a single skill or range of skills matter. That's also awful GMing.

And your way doesn't lead anywhere because games with mono-competency don't exist for the most part.

We were attacking a dinosaur cult one time.

There turned out to be a lot more of them than we originally surmised. Like... 30 of them that we alerted all at once.

We were gonna try and bottleneck them in a tunnel, but then they started turning into dinosaurs and the head priestess cast Heal.

Considering we were level 6, we ran like heck.

Reminds me of good ol' Tom

With elves reach the age of 25, they are the same height and weight as a seven or eight years old child. For the next 60 to 70 years in a state of autismal self involvement as their brains struggle to adjust from an instinct driven infant only just able to walk and perceive their environ, to a sapient and sentient being.

During this time of adjustment their senses are in disarray and they are more spiritually and psychically aware than they are when they become functional youths/near adults (they have Detect Alignment, Detect Magic, Detect Psychic Significance, and Detect Poison constantly, and cannot communicate as if under the effects of an Aphasia Spell). Teachers can set them down and teach them, but they must be taught through repetitious rote, rather than actually understanding what is being taught to them. They live in small creches, kept safe from harm and outside interference. They can form bonds, and these bonds grow and decay over the course of decades as they are trained and taught whatever the current elven mentors and teachers are interested in teaching. This gives them a breadth of experience that human children do not receive, and when they start showing interest in specific types of teaching they are given more complete training in those areas. Magic and combat are commonly taught during the last twenty years of this time of their life.

When they reach 80-90 years of age, they start becoming more sapient and capable of controlling their senses more effectively. This is also when they start to be able to communicate effectively, and they slowly become more and more interested in specific talents, training, and often class abilities that lead to adventuring. Elves are exceedingly protective of their children, and their creches are fiercely protected and guarded. Often there is a well trained warrior and a well trained wizard in attendance to a creche whose duty is to kill the children if necessary to prevent their enslavement.

I vastly prefer the old vader version. It's less... tryhard.

Had a game where I was the party bruiser and this happened once. We already had a plan in place. I called the battle plan, got hit with a resist element for fire, then broke the necklace of fireballs I was wearing for just such an occasion.

It always pays to plan ahead.

>SARENRAEHU AKBAR!

Agreed.
Especially because you know Vader. He's not boasting, he's not trying to be intimidating.
He is simply stating a FACT in response to a statement.

>Level 20 adventurer talking to a squad of level 1 bandits trying to rob him