Warhammer 40,000 General /40kg/

Nobody cares about SW stop asking

They're clearly some kind of vile mutant, even worse, they're attacking a proud son of ultramar!

well, it's clearly his fault. he shouldn't have walked around there alone, dressed like that

More like daughters of Sarpedon.

What is it about frogs that makes them attention whore like that?

Exactly. What kind of slut goes around in artificer armor not expecting to get raped? He's asking for it.

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What do you mean?

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>Ís

I hope they do something cool with the Iron Hands.

They are a cool and badass chapter usually way too underseen,

Stop, this isn't pathfinder general!
This is 40k general!

would this army work? it hurts my soul to leave my gorkanaut behind but i feel like i must. and fuck warbikes are so expensive.

and mek gunz? gw is ruining me.

Another Avenging Angels update!

>Name: Avenging Angels

>Founding Chapter: Dark Angels

>Founding: Third Founding

>Chapter Master: N/A, led by a triumvirate council of Interrogator-Chaplains

>Homeworld: Fleet-based

>Fortress-Monastery: Battle Barge Ascalon

>Colours: Silver, Dark Green, Black, Bone

>Specialty: Unknown

>Strength: Estimates placed between 2000-3000

>Battle Cry: In Death, Absolution!

We just need a specialty now. It's a shame it's so annoying to get Fearless for marines, because they seem like prime candidates for it, being the lunatic death cult Opus Dei marines.

I see where this is going

>usually way too underseen

on the tabletop or in lore? because on the tabletop they are more of a bitch to kill than necrons, T5 3+ 3++ 3+ FNP

Please tell me that is at least 40 point per model

What was the first battle nids vs chaos? And who won?

In the lore I meant, they should have a grand finale along with many other chapters and characters.

Maybe there are even too many of them now and some will just wait unseen until the end.

Fulgrim seems to be out of retirement and there are a bunch of guys who've got a bone to pick with him. Perhaps most notably the Iron Hands and the Ultramarines. Maybe something will come out of that.

Why would Tyranids or Chaos ever fight each other unless they randomly bump into each other? It's a distraction for chaos and a huge danger of biomass corruption for tyranids.

I don't even know how that got there.

damn, it's just an Ultramarine, I know they are anyoing, but kill one (also, they have Wardian plotarmor, so it's hard to kill them)

Convert the mek gunz out of trukk kits.

Drop the nob biker squad.

Drop the big shootas on the wagons, think about maybe dropping the klaws from the boyz squad and just using them as a cheap distraction?

You can split the boyz squad in half, get them a second bare bones nob and run them and the grotz in a second CAD. Drop the klaw on the storm boyz and that's around 250 points and a spare heavy support slot for your 'naut.

Purging heretics could be their specialty.

Thousand Sons are very fun to play and have beautiful models and sweet fluff.

You want a gold star or something?

28 points for a Command Squad vet + SS. 3 "points per model" to buy an apothecary for the squad.

T4 3++ 4+ FNP. Can get to T5 with 7 points for a bike. All of which is less than 40 ppm.

Grots are T2, EVERYTHING is going to fuck up their FnP

That Pain boy will do next to nothing because Grots get ID'd so easy, also you need more herds.

No, I have one already thanks.

Just sayin'. They ain't that competitive but they're shat on far too much.

>that's so "army with less models than grey knights that's only T4 with 3+ saves"

>captain with bike
>apoth with shield
>4 grav guns
>all on bikes

comes to about 330 points, so about 50 ppm for T5 3++ 5+ FNP, make them iron hands for 4+, have them in the iron hands decurion for 3++ and obsec

I wish GW actually did extensive play test and control for their crap.

We are going to end like fantasy aren't we?

How can we fix Tyranids?

Apoth can't take upgrades.

Ignoring the usual AP3 bolters and armywide 4++ everyone usually handwaves as not being relevant (and there are ways to go around some of these now), the TS curbstomp the GK during the psychic phase so they are pretty much better.

Quick question: Can Celestine lead a IG cad or do I have to get a separate formation for her? I have no idea how this works.

Isn't your scheme already taken by the Doom Legion?

i think you'll find it can, otherwise it wouldnt be allowed in ITC

Read FoC, that is one of the few rules that is pretty clear.

GK versus Iron Warriors tomorrow night ... i'm shitting myself over obliterators

Because no one relies on armour saves alone to save them these days, get a cover save or get taken off the table.
>s4
Unimpressive, I'm more scared of tau weaponry.

>TS curbstomp the GK during the psychic phase
But they completely lack ap2 weapons needed to actually beat them in a fight.

>2 terminator teams on an foc that only needs 1 unit

for what purpose are you doing this instead of taking 2 dreadknights with shunt

They only get to 3+ FnP with their Not-Gladius bonus and they only have 1W each, they're not too hard to take down unless they're ALSO invisible.

>yet another special snowflake overstrength chapter
Other than that i find the colors too numerous, quartered livery + an additonal color for pauldron borders is already plenty enough. This or the tabard, but both seems too cluttered.

Yep.

>they're ALSO invisible.

and librarius conclave is part of the decurion, have fun

>epub is in the op
I'm actually retarded my apologies

I'm still having flash back to the years before Fantasy got axe.

That's something I'd face only in a tournament and there I'll have the tools to deal with it.

Rolled up over-strength from the chapter generation tables. Dark Angels are one of the few that can justify it considering they basically operate as a Legion anyway.

Anyway, this is the basic scheme. They're not quartered. Just all silver, with black shoulders and green trim.

SHIT. Well, fuck the Doom Legion. It's not like every scheme is unique anyway.

>Convert the mek gunz out of trukk kits.

I was planning on using extra bitz from trukks to make some other kind of mek gunz. Traktor gunz probably.

>Drop the nob biker squad.
probably a good idea. i just like nobz but they are so shit.

>Drop the big shootas on the wagons, think about maybe dropping the klaws from the boyz squad and just using them as a cheap distraction?

the big shootas are there so they can be removed instead of my killcannon if i get a weapons destroyed result. i think thats worth 5 points.

i managed to keep the claw on my storm boyz (maybe a big choppa would be just as good?) and include the gorkanaut. guess i have to paint more grots...

Wont chaos have to deal with them sooner or later?

That is like when people defend bad systems just because the DM can fix of its fault.

The DM shouldn't be fixing the faults of the game system in order to have a game.

Not sure if I'm making my point

FUCK'EM

i dont see how its a bad system when almost every other codex can do the same thing

people will always gravitate to the most effective army list over time unless they intentionally gimp themselves

Nids can eat chaos
Chaos can kill nids.
Everyone is happy.

Now I can see it painted over an actual space marine miniature I like it even more.

*Fewer

>when almost every other codex can do the same thing

Tau and Eldar are not "almost every other Codex".

I like that, it's a good list.

I think big choppas are great on throw away squads, for 5 points it keeps them cheap but it makes the nob s7 on the charge allowing them to wreck rear armour.

You can move the painboy biker to the second detachment, drop the second painboy and buy another kannon. He can still start in the biker group as along as they're not in transports.

There are basically 4 armies that can do that level of bullshit. 2 are marines.

The thing is with how bad the balance is you end with the same mono list every single time. The game no longer is a war game and turns into "who has more dice luck"

Continuing with the example of roleplaying games, if everyone ends playing a wizard because mechanically they are outright better. There is a problem with the system.

If you say then just play the good armies, then why bother having the rest?

You don't seem to understand, user. Chaos has the plot powers of being invincible, undefeatable, multiversal, absoluteley selfsustaining and having already won. And basically, [your dudes] can either join them, or eat a dick. Or both.

Ah, well, there is a margin between "over-strenght" and "twice to thrice the size of a regular chapter", you could have for example one tactical, one support and one scout additonal companies, which would give the chapter master some nice flexibility, or 120-130 marines per company, or some clerical mistake making it supplied by two forge worlds instead of one for land raiders and terminator armors, or whatever is their preferd method of insertion.

As for the color scheme, it seemed the full left shin was black which made me think the livery was quartered. It indeed looks more reasonable that way.

I was even bored enough to do a really bad job recolouring some artwork.

and every SM faction, and necrons to a small extent

now all of imperium with castellans

then you can go the other way, simple codexes which spam an effective unit or codex tactic to be competititve, dark eldar, tempestus and kdk come to mind

Points drops across the board, fix flyrants so they are less Bullshit, remove/ fix the penalty of being out of synapse to make it less crippling, give us some more options for our monsters, better armour saves for elite units, EW for warriors. Oh and did I mention points drops?

Strong combos existing isn't bad design per se. The imbalance in the combos available to various races is the problem.
A single squad being able to have all those DEFENSIVE buffs is fine considering its going to cost you hundreds of points. The fact that Nobz, Carnifexes or Incubi can't be as good (even if you take out Invisibility) is the problem with the game but that's totally another piece of cake.

The point I was trying to make is that combos like that exist in every game (Even chess has noob-clubbing moves) but its something you only encroach in situations in which BOTH players are bringing their A game. Or if someone is a dick but you can just tell him to stop or never play with him.

>If you say then just play the good armies, then why bother having the rest?

because the good armies outnumber the ones that can do bullshit things, the 2 sore thumbs that stick out are eldar D everything and warp spyders and tau's riptide wing

you cant just say there are only 4 good armies when there are multiple types of matches which aren't kill points

Why even bother with choice if at the end of the day there is only one way to play the army?

The game is unbalance as fuck, but some reason people don't see it or don't think it is an issue.

It wouldn't be an issue if we just play the game with friends and could agree to not to abuse the broken stuff, but since the game is encourage to play with random people (if not why the fuck have GW store to play) we need somewhat balanced rules.

No they aren't
Every novel about them in 40k has them as total cunts to the people they are supposed to protect
They are pretty much marines malevolent but protected by being first founding
That's why their novels didn't sell and why no one want to write new ones about them

Welp, doesn't look bad

Also, I wish i could feel as excited over the hobby as you are with your chapter :)

Good armies such as?

IG, SoB and ? I'm trying to remember armies that are good but can't pull the level of bullshit marines, Eldar and Tau can do

Probably some edge worlds beyond ultramar as many of those end up as chaos humans from daot or chaos xenos
Or somewhere near the maelstrom as gnhags near ultramar
Then again there's also space hulks

Did we get RoPrimarch leaks already?

The difference is I'm shit at actual gameplay. So I spend way more time just with fluff.

>Why even bother with choice if at the end of the day there is only one way to play the army?

because that's an outright lie, this only applies to the very weak codexes (orks and tyranids) if you dont want to get stomped on turn 1 automatically

the only reason this meme is repeated over and over is because people are thicker than 2 planks of wood and dont make thier own lists, instead they look up some tournament winning net list (or go against one, lose, then complain)

the tau list i took to the last ITC event in england is strong in its own right, it has no markerlights at all, no riptide wing or stormsurges, no commander and was using breachers instead of fire warriors

I placed a solid midfield for my first ever tourney, higher than a fair amount of net lists, lower than another fair amount

you are trying to imply that the bullshit is the only way a codex can be strong

dark eldar are amazing in objective games without any bullshit and generally can have a solid chance of tabling the opponent in purge the alien

tempestus mimic dark eldar but trade cqc and mobility for much stronger shooting

necrons have the innate ability to never be the worst army and always finish in the midfield because they are necrons

renegades and heretics are insane sources of barrage for cheap and can pulverise enemy armies on turn 1 even with bad rolling

skirari are very powerful sources of haywire and go well alongside ad mech, who are strongish even without the abomination that is war convocation

inquisition are a generally overlooked faction which have access to tonnes of cheap dakka to overwhelm tau netlists

>Get a cover save or get taken off the table
They have invulns which is better and there are ways to go around the cover issue. Namely mobility and flame weapons. Astral Grimoire helps a lot on outmaneuvering.

S4 still has a 50% chance to fuck up MEQ, it's not bloody bad. Tau weaponry IS quite nice but it's still AP5. My experience playing both TS and Tau has me with a lot more faith in my rubrics when fighting MEQs.

>But they completely lack ap2 weapons needed to actually beat them in a fight.
We aren't discussing that, we're talking about psychic power, which the TS win at. Besides why would you need AP2 guns when you have AP2 spells or ones that ignore saves altogether?

>But they completely lack ap2 weapons needed to actually beat them in a fight.

ExSorc with Seer's Bane can run over pretty much everything GK can field against him.

Are you seriously implying that the game is balanced?

>Tau player meme keeps on happening

I think he's more trying to imply that the gaps in power between armies aren't as big as people think.

>Are you seriously implying that the game is balanced?

no im correcting stupid fucking statements, learn the difference

>Tau player meme keeps on happening

I also play dark eldar, tempestus, inquisition and GK

So yah he is saying the game is balanced then.

Poor guy.

>So yah he is saying the game is balanced then.

>saying the gaps in power are smaller than people make them out to be means that there is no gap at all

fuck off you know you don't have an argument when you started fabricating shit

>Flesh is weak
>No fap

Thread's on fire today! I know this is personal experience so it's not some objective fact but from what I've seen, WAAC-lists and the kind of scene /40kg/ thinks exists is only a small realm mostly separated from reality. These players and mindsets exist of course but nowhere near as prevalent as they assume.

Most people don't run cheese lists, most people don't play on perfect boards with ideal terrain, or do the very best strategic decisions during a game. I think people base the game's balance far too much on the perfect ideal vacuum scenario when its pointless since that's not how the world works. The fact it's a dice game guarantees randomness will always take a dump on you. Yes, statistically a unit can be better, which can be used to measure how good a codex is! But people never take into account everything else.

It's pointless because you can never factor in every variable. In an ideal scenario with everything perfect, yes, Tau will beat Orks. But in the same example, with everything perfect, I can also knock out Connor MacGregor with one punch.

But the gaps in armies is huge.

Try putting Tau vs Ork or Nids vs Eldar. Unless the Tau or Eldar actually go out of their way to nerf their armies the Orks and Nids are fucked.

I can win against most thing with IG/I/SoB Till the Riptide spam shows up or the Wraith, jetbike combo show up. Then it turns into hoping bad rolls or incompetence happen.

Not sure if you see the issue there? Some armies are flat out Better, cheaper and more efficient.

do nids have any vehicles?

Psi/hammerhand/sanctuary should solve the obliterator problem. What else does he bring?