Can anyone recommend a system where the primary resolution mechanic is a 2d6(+mod) roll?
I'm DMing for a group of new players (I'm new myself) and we tried D&D, but the d20 was far too random for our tastes, so any input on what other systems we could consider are or telling me it doesn't matter in the end would be cool.
Right now we're thinking Dungeon World because it looks like there's a lot of customization that can be done, but we're wary of it because we'd all prefer a game with more structure to the combat.
>Barbarians of Lemuria, House Rules / Patches for Legendary Edition (if you want minimalism of Legendary, but with the rules tightened up) -- mega.co.nz/#F!CtQR2bST!y_awB-GHCiL3CdK4iLCV7A
Justin Ross
I'll take a look, thanks.
Yes, I was fudging rolls all night after I kept rolling 17+ all night while the PC's missed 75% of the time.
Jacob Adams
>I'm DMing for a group of new players (I'm new myself) and we tried D&D, but the d20 was far too random for our tastes This is just silly. The d20 is no more or less random than any other die. Your chance to roll a 7 or over on 2d6 is approximately the same as your chance to roll a 9 or over on a d20. Yes, each +1 or -1 means a lot more on 2d6, and makes either success or failure much more probably than on a d20, but that's because the dice systems are using different scales. A +1 on 2d6 is equivalent to a +2 or +3 on a d20, but that doesn't make the d20 more random, just more granular. A +1 on a d20 means a shitload more than a +1 on d%, for instance, even though those are both flat distributions.
Generally speaking, however, D&D is designed in such a way that things are in contention, with a decent chance of both success and failure. *That* may be what you're objecting to, but it has little to do with its underlying mechanic.
Christopher Kelly
Personally, I'd recommend Traveller. While it's not fantasy, it's simple and easy to learn, and has one of the most entertaining character generation systems I've seen in a game.
Julian Price
>Yes, I was fudging rolls all night after I kept rolling 17+ all night while the PC's missed 75% of the time.
You have a 20% chance to roll 17 and over. That falls partway between your chance to roll a 9 or over and your chance to roll a 10 or over on 2d6. Percentage chance of success is percentage chance of success, regardless of what dice you use to simulate it.
Josiah Garcia
MaidRPG.
Landon Turner
Multiple dice produce results according to a bell curve, though, as opposed to a single die's flat distribution. So 1d20 isn't any more random than 1d6, it is more random than 2 or 3d6 (or, for that matter, 2 or 3d20). Source: system wars between GURPSfags and 3.pf fags.
Mason Walker
>So 1d20 isn't any more random than 1d6, it is more random than 2 or 3d6 No, it isn't. A bell curve just means that the same modifier will mean more near the middle of the range than at the extremes. That means if the flat dice system and the bell curve system have the same range, the bell curve system will move more quickly to probable success or probable failure. But that assumes you're using the same size modifiers with the same range, neither of which is a given, so they're an effectively meaningless basis for comparison (in much the same way that using the same size bonuses to compare a d20 and d% system are flawed).
Let's turn things around a little bit and compare 1d6 to 3d6. You say the latter is less random, right? The two systems meet in the middle, where they have a 50% chance of success (if you need to roll an 11 or over on 3d6, or a 4 or over on 1d6). So what happens when you give a +1 bonus to these rolls? You now have a 66.67% chance to succeed with the d6 system, but only a 62.5% chance to succeed with the 3d6 system. So it's really the 1d6 that's less random, right?
"No!" you say? "The scales are different!" you insist? I agree. You have to compensate for the different systems by changing the size of your modifiers. But the same is true going from a flat-distribution system to a bell curve system with the same range. In fact, I'd suggest that the truest way of determining what sort of modifier is equivalent is according to how "tippy" it makes the system. In other words, the very thing you think that makes one system more random than another. So really all you can say about a bell curve system at the end of the day is that the percentage by which a modifier affects your probability of success is not constant, but varies according to where you are on the curve.
Ian Cox
Little Brown Books. • Men and Magic • Monsters and Treasure • Underworld and Wilderness Adventures + CHAINMAIL for pic related and morale rules
Brayden Cooper
Actually specifically, 1 die produces a flat result equal to 1/n where n is the number of faces on the die.
A pair of dice produce a pyramidal distribution with a sharp highest value of probability equal to the median of the combine dice +2.
3 or more dice produce an increasingly shallow bell curve distribution. whose highest point is just higher than the median of the combined die + the number of dice you have.
So you are least likely to roll abnormally high or low with 2 dice, have a good chance of rolling anything but the highest and lowest value with 3+ dice, and an equal chance of rolling high or rolling low or rolling middling with just 1 die.
Sebastian Ramirez
Traveller, what said.
Brody Howard
I meant
Lucas Cruz
Big Eyes Small Mouth Super easy, very flexible rules on character creation, doesn't get bogged down into too many checks, or can be all checks depending on how you run the game. All d6 rolls, good application of how to apply character points to powers, equipment, and vehicles (mecha, motorcycles, whatever)
Xavier Nguyen
Perhaps you could just try replacing the 1d20 roll with a 3d6 roll. I've switched to this in the D&D games I DM and our group has been very happy with the results. The math seems more convoluted but since you're adding such small numbers it really isn't.
Angel Martinez
Advanced Fighting Fantasy is super easy to learn and really flexible with rulings.
Eli Perez
BattleTech and its related RPGs (such as MechWarrior 3rd or A Time of War) are 2d6 based.
Julian Baker
IKRPG. Don't play dungeon shit.
Joshua King
Sticky this
Nolan Green
Wow, who could have thought dice produced similar results when you fucked with the modifiers and made them nonlinear to do exactly that instead of comparing them against each other in a system that isn't fucking stupid?
Are you handicapped?
Brandon Allen
...
Chase Reyes
The point is that with a given dice system, the size of your modifiers determine how tippy that system is. If you want things to be "certain" (which is to say, trending closer to either certain success or certain failure), you assign a +2 bonus for a surprise attack rather than a +1. Since those modifiers are arbitrarily set by the system designer, they can set them to whatever they want them to be, in most cases basing them primarily on the level of "certainty" they want. So it isn't "fucking around with the modifiers", because there is no base level they magically start at.
It's like determining which of these equations gives you the bigger number: A * B X * Y
Even if A is bigger than X, that doesn't mean that the first equation will give you the bigger number, because there's another factor involved. And if you're trying to reach a certain number, and can set B and Y to whatever you want, you can get there with either equation. So let's say that A = 6 and Y = 4, and you're claiming that the first equation is better because it's easier to get to 24: 6 * B 4 * Y
But since I get to set the remaining variables to whatever I want, I can easily reach 24 either way. So I just make B = 4 and Y = 6. 6 * 4 = 24 4 * 6 = 24
And the same sort of thing applies to dice systems. If you're designing a game, you can a given dice system more or less tippy, as you desire.
Oliver Ross
My group's most played system is Mongoose Traveller so I'd give that a go.
Mason Turner
Stars Without Number mainly uses a 2d6 system, though you do use a d20 for attack rolls.
Justin Scott
If you don't mind other genres OP, Stars Without Number is good for space opera adventures, while still having base mechanics similar to old school D&D, while using a 2d6+mod system.
If you like fantasy/steampunk/alternate Earth, Pax Britannica is also cool
Levi Jones
My close male familial relation of nubian ancestry
