The 9th Age

So it's dying due to hurt feelings and nobody agreeing on whose feel is best? Color me surprised.

It's dying because they tried to fix a shit edition of the game rather than building from nothing, or from a good edition. Plus, it's a fan game without a model range, in a market where the two big competitors are backed by publishers and miniatures.

Why would the stocking of rule books and store promotion be such an important aspect? The whole deal with 9th Age is that it's made for the purpose of using whatever miniatures you like and the rules are free on the web. How many people nowadays don't have access to a phone, ipad or laptop?

Forgot to add that it's way cheaper to buy your hobby stuff on the internet and there are a fair amount of miniature companies such as Avatars of War who support 9th Age and continously creates new minis for the game.

There are official 9th Age miniatures though.

But why would you force yourself to play T9A, which isn't very good, when you can play any of the WHFB editions, or KoW which is supported, balanced and where you can use all the minis you want?

Because having a physical copy is useful. You can't have a bunch of physical tabs in a PDF, and a actual rulebook never runs out of juice.

Regardless people who make money by selling games will never push the game when they can't sell the game. Having free rules online doesn't stop them from having a paid physical version (See Malifaux, Infinity).

This op image painto a picture, this game was not made out of love for warhammer fantasy battle, but hatred for what came after, I can't say I'm fond of smegmar, but this is not the foundation for a good game or community

Excellent, do you have anything to substantiate that claim besides a single piece of fan art?

The general attitude I've seen here and on the 9th age forums coupled with the lack of substance or growing fan base

Dungeons the dragoning did better then this

Because having physical books is always important for some people regardless of the price of the rules. Having a company doing advertisement, marketing, and having their ranges in local brick and mortar stores where a sizeable part of the community meets are always important. Tabletop wargames are a social activity, it's not played in a vacuum.

How is epic 40k still going on then?

is it ?

What I'm getting from this is that best case scenario would be a more balanced 6th ed.

Yes and no, 6ed is still a clunky wargame even if it's fun and full of personality. What made 6ed a great edition was a sum of multiple factors
>decent if not perfect ruleset that allowed dynamic games
>excellent miniatures for the time (some of the kits from there are still sold, like orcs or marauders) still relatively cheap
>brick and mortar stores that weren't shit
>White Dwarf having more content than shameless advertising
>add-on books like Lustia
>events

I've been reading through the rules, they seem smart. They've taken out much of the RNG, like Orcs and Goblins don't have animosity, but instead have to take leadership checks to not chase after routed enemies. The artless books are functional.
The actual illustrated versions with fluff are very enjoyable, not in terms of art quality and layout. I'm quite interested to see the next books they make.
But, and I guess this is the most important point, I haven't played it yet. This is just be reading through the books.
It has made me consider getting out my Orcs again, though, when I've previously resigned myself to just playing skirmish games.

Also the fluff, of course

>6ed is still a clunky wargame

How would you suggest streamlining it?

It's, in good part too, falling apart due to administrative convultion. Seriously, go and search their org-chart and you'll see a labrynthine network with too many nooses with which the project came to strangle itself.

Also, the lore is crap. It's literally softhammer. We gave shit to AoS for the changes to the setting, but those motherfuckers did the same and all while being smug about it (we are becoming our own thing...)

This, I gave 9th a chance before AoS and 9th let me down, AoS may have goofy as shit lore but it's at least going somewhere with it

You're presupposing that people force themselves to play 9th Age.

It's no doubt useful to have a physical ex, but suggesting that it's a dealbreaker seems over the top. Non the less if people want a physical copy they can just order one from any of the guys that makes them on the forum.

>Regardless people who make money by selling games will never push the game when they can't sell the game.
I don't understand this argument. What is it trying to say? It's just a tautology.

>Having a company doing advertisement, marketing, and having their ranges in local brick and mortar stores where a sizeable part of the community meets are always important.
I see no reason why stores wouldn't allow the playing of 9th Age so long as they aren't bound by some exclusive deal with any of the tabletop makers. As stated before the game is meant to be played with what ever minis you prefer from what ever manufactorer you fancy. As such the stores still have customers in 9th Age-players.

I too am not to found of parts of the lore that has been revealed (especially the sneek peak regarding their Chaos Gods) but the overall world seems really promising. There's some good potential there if they don't fuck it up.

Go for pic related, forget the rest.

They fucking genderbent sigmar and made dump with the "OC" story.

Speaking as someone remotely interested In 9th, I must have context

All the old editions of WFB has issues. You all keep pointing to edition X and there is a reason some of those rules changed. And those editions are all dead or a door nail.

KoW is watered down WFB. It is boring and has no heart to it. And quite frankly it will never get any better than it is now because mantic can only puppet GW to make money.

9th is fan supported and has plenty of model support. It may not be very good yet, but at least there is potential.

Yes it is. So is necromunda. Both are pretty small communities though.

T9A models are nice. For rules I have a large preference for Armies Project's 9th edition, which seems like a "best of" 6e/7e/8e.

I also like the increased number of army lists, though sometimes the fluff in the army books isn't terribly impressive.

That isn't really true at all. The whole game was designed on the idea of maintain the WFB fan base.

Hating AoS is what everyone on the internet does because it blew ass and it still is pretty shit now.

Yeah, it blew ass but I've tried it now and it's not really shit. Maybe not to our taste but I saw a decent gameplay those days.

What's so inherently bad about switching the sex of their not!Sigmar? Seems like the easiest way to distinguish the character from the inspiration.
What do you mean by "OC"?

Its still have overpriced models warcraft models.

Terrible fluff

Dumbed down core rules that waterdown the feel of each model.

There are still tons of other skirmish games out that are just plain better as well.

>sometimes the fluff in the army books isn't terribly impressive.

There's only been like two army books with fluff in them so no wonder.

Why does it matter when a tabletop game is dead? No one cares that 3.5e D&D is no longer getting updates and shit, or even 2e. People have not automatically jumped onto 4e or 5e when they came out.

If I came for WHFB, I'd prefer some similarities.

In Armies Project's Warhammer 9th Edition there has been far more than 2 fluffed army books.

The "dumbed down" rules move pretty well in game to my experience, but this is a matter of taste more then objectivity

A lot of people jumped to Pathfinder when it came out (or after a short time for supplements to be released) because it wasn't dead.

But that's an RPG. In an RPG you only care if a game is dead because you want a continual stream of new product for it.

In a wargame, you care if it's dead because it becomes harder to find people to play matches with. It's like a less severe version of a dead CCG.

As far as I'm aware there's plenty of similarities but I get you.

I wasn't aware of this. Would you mind giving me a link to them? I'm not aware of this Armies project thingy and I'm a sucker for any kind of fluff for shit I'm even vaguely interested in.

I've played and enjoyed every part of the warhammer universe besides bloodbowl and yeah its fun and worth it

drive.google.com/file/d/0B_Redi9cZJ5iaXVibWFOWWlnTTQ/view?usp=sharing
warhammerarmiesproject.blogspot.ca/?m=0

17 armies so far. Mostly discontinued and obscure factions, since he already had army books for them for 8e it was less work to update them.

For your bog standard armies, at the moment you're looking at using 8e armies or his ravening hordes lists.

They issue is that they still have models that just feel the same. There is no stat interaction. You just roll dice and stuff disappears. It makes every model feel like it has no identity. This is death for a skirmish game, which is supposed to be all about your army.

And again, just because you like how the rules play doesn't mean there aren't a lot of better options. Combine everything together and the sum of AoS parts is still lacking.

I'm happy about it because I really like Dogs of War, Kislev, and Albion.

I'd like to see wood elves, but that might be a while.

Not sure I would go get stuff printed though, he's been periodically updating both the core rules and individual armies.

I'd rather use a tablet, and print out only pages of units I'm using for now.

My suggestion would be to use the ravening hordes lists as errata to the 8e books, for the armies without complete updates to apwhfb9e

I am saying that store owners won't promote the damn game as they can't sell people the actual game. There isn't any collusion, it is just common business sense. That is at least the reason the store owner nearby gave me for why he largely promotes KoW instead of 9th Age.

Ah I see. Thought that you were refering to the 9th Age.

Ah okay, then all I can say is no shit sherlock. There's a difference between promoting and allowing a game however. Thus this argument doesn't have any bearing on my point.

It does have a bearing though. It is important for promotion. Store owners aren't going to go out of their way to support the community for the game as opposed to others when they don't even sell the game. Meanwhile you can pick up a copy of the AoS General's Handbook at most shops, or order it through the shop as they will be more than happy to take your money. Lack of a rulebook my work for somethings, but for a game that you play in a brick and mortar location, it won't pan out.

>Thus this argument doesn't have any bearing on my point.
The whole survival of a game is a matter of local community, so it indeed does have a bearing.

If the local store owner runs games for beginners to try out new system, he'll do what systems he has in stocks, which are those he has in stock. He won't do outdated games, nor fan games.

>KoW is watered down WFB. It is boring and has no heart to it.
Hilarious, coming from a defender of the boring slog of a game that is T9A.

But you responded to a post where I said t9a had good minis but I preferences project's unofficial 9e for rules...

Prefer* fucking autocorrect

This post In case anyone is wondering.

Well it's kinda obvious that 9th Age is primarily a game that's directed at fans of warhammer fantasy. It's promotion is by design primarily done through word of mouth and the internet. That is why I don't see the validity of your argument. As a free game it's primarily suited for matches between friends at home and clubs and not game stores. This doesn't mean that the stores would have any real reason to stop people from playing it in their locales since they are still liable to buy minis.

Yeah, what I was trying to say was that I misread your comment.

Ah. Gotcha. Okay.

AP 9e is much more warhammery than T9A, IMO.

And it's not just a "streamlined 8e". It's a spin-off of 8e designed to bring back the best parts of 6e and 7e, including all the armies that have been discontinued, or were incomplete, like Dogs of War, and Kislev, and Albion, and Araby.

His list of future plans and expansions looks pretty great, too.