Warmachine/Hordes General WarmaHordes WMH

>IKRPG fluff paints Infernals as beyond the abilities of current Warnouns
Yes and no. The full force of Infernals working behind the scenes are probably beyond any mortal power (assuming they could manifest on Caen). But there are all different ranks of Infernals. PC's in the IKRPG could face down the weakest ones. They could have painted the Infernal Faction as some sort of expeditionary force or rising sub-faction for the purposes of making them a plausible foe.

> Cygnar are shooty and jack-of-all-trades
> Khador are raw stats and unsubtle
> Cryx are glass cannons who play dirty
> Protectorate are stacking buffs and denial

What is Scyrah's 'thing'? As a complete novice, I've heard conflicting reports about them and other than being filthy knife-ears, I can't get a coherent image.
Are they well-rounded jacks of everything, or super specialised?
Are they a Jackspam or infantry faction?
Are their Warcasters supposed to be a backpiece or central player?

You've gotten a mixed idea because Retribution is probably the most generalist faction. They have the most usable models in the game, I think, and can cover all bases. Jackspam, good shooting, good melee, even good magic attacks. It just depends on how you make the list.

In terms of gameplay, Retribution are fairly generalist, but do have some defining traits. They probably get compared most often to Cygnar, with whom they share some general design trends.

First, while they can do everything (or more precisely, can be built to do anything), Ret tends toward being shooting heavy. They have a lot of really good shooting units, most of their casters can buff shooting, and almost all their jacks come with guns. Some of the scariest shooting lists in the game's history have been Retribution lists.

Second thing is they tend to be fairly elite (like elves in every setting ever). They have a couple cheap-ish units, but on average their stuff tends toward the high-quality-but-expensive end of the spectrum.

Eh... I'm not sure I'd say they're the most generalist, if such a thing existed. They've got a lot of qualities that stand out among their (reasonably commonly played) lists:

- Heavily biased towards "elite" jacks with good (magic) guns, magic being notable as it gets by a lot of anti-shooting tech

- Dawnguard Sentinels are found in most lists -- single-wound infantry weapon masters that can get good ARM vs. shooting

- Defensive or dice skew feats are common

They probably have the highest proportion of playable models of any faction, although I think Protectorate has more total playable models. You can build them just about anyway you want.

Scenario: Linebreaker, Cryx won the die roll and gave Khador turn 1.

Who wants to make guesses how the game went solely on the lists?

I'd give it to Cryx because Feedback.

The Khador dude has two sources of anti spell tech, so my guess goes to Khador although Gaspies feat should clear most of the infantry

lol
>16 points of solos
>cries about getting smashed by Cryx tryx

I think dread rots are overhyped. You don't see people wrecking everything with Irusk2 + 50 dudes or Thexus + 60 dudes, do you? I imagine there's a reason for it.

I like the faction though. It has it's won things going that work.

Assassination top of 2 because Cryx is still broken as shit when you take the specific models that has been taken?

That's because Irusk2 and Thexus can't bring 50x PS14 weaponmasters with tough, with two units being PS17. Very few lists can casually deal with that much shit.

...

and thexus with 60 dudes was a thing for a while though I am not sure now considering celphalex arnt that common

I thought they were POW 10

Yeah but there's a bunch of shit in Grymkin that can buff your damage output when it dies, then the Heretic has Fury.

Go cryx!
Khador will win though if Orin stays alive.

There is, but it's only for that one round, plus your opponent has to kill them on the turn before you commit. If they get sniped out early or ignored it's not really useful. The prey trump card is pretty easy to get off though.

Even then, sheer volume of dice will ensure that they get work done at PS10. 4d6-9 against a Titan Gladiator will either outright kill it with a handful of throwaway trash dudes, or put so much damage on it that a stiff breeze will end it, such as Longfellow and his Black Penny.

So at first glance having to play the arcana cards in reaction to things allows casters with denial feats/spells much greater play against them

*turn 1 runs*

The Khador player blew the Cryx objective (Fuel Cache) up turn 2 with Behemoth+Snipers and aggressively advanced forward. The Khador Objective (Bunker) as conveniently placed behind an obstruction, so Butcher was able to safely camp behind it and the Kodiak Clouds to safely. The Kayazy ran into the units of Satyxis and Thralls to tie them up.

The Cryx player managed to cast parasite and deal a lot of damage with a few Satyxis and the Leviathan to Kodiak1, but was unable to deal with 2 of the 4 Kayazy tying up his stuff (Butcher was able to use focus to prevent any damage from feedback). The Kraken shot a minor amount of damage into the second Kodiak and Gaspy took cover behind an obstruction next to the Kraken (a mistake as seen later).

Khador turn 3, the Kayazy cleared out two Gunslingers and the other killed the Seawitch. Eiryss advanced forward and disrupted the Arc-node (for pretty much for the rest of the game.) The Kodiak1 farted 4 Satyxis away (which also blocked LOS to Eiryss due to positioning) and Ruin killed another one. Behemoth and the Marksman shot the Kraken for damage and the Kodiak charged it, taking out it's left side.

Cryx turn 3, the remaining Satyxis and the Leviathan destroyed Kodiak1 and dealt a point of damage to Butcher. The Kranken failed to get rid of Kodiak2, leaving it with two movement boxes and two right arm boxes. The Thralls ran to tie up Butcher and the marksman, while the last Gunslinger got lucky and took out a Kayazy. The Pistol Wraith missed the other.

Turn 4, Butcher flashed the Thralls and feated defensively. Kodiak2 and Behemoth crippled the Kraken again (it got repaired by the Necrotech every turn). Ruin and the Kayazy got rid of the last Satyxis.

After that, Gaspy was in a really bad spot because Kodiak2's cloud and Krakens's base blocked him off. So he cast Scything Touch and tried to kill Butcher, which didn't work out, resulting in a Khador victory.

Any idea how I can make a map to showcase where the models and terrain where? I forgot to take pics.

When did the Cryx player feat? never?

In the style of the user further above, see if you can guess how this game went. The scenario was Entrenched.

For the assassination. He pumped the Leviathan, Pumped the Kraken, cast Scything Touch, feated for defense and clobbed the Kodiak out of the way.

The Kraken was unfortunately positioned in such a way, that Gaspy had no way of getting LOS to Butcher3 (which probably didn't matter a whole lot, since Orin was near him with three counters.)

Betting on Skorne, but fuck that looks like a fun match.

The match was pretty awful for my Skorne. I should've pointed out that I won the roll and decided to pick sides based on one side having lots of forests. I didn't know how much shooting my opponent had. My Karax died in a single turn along with half my Nihilators. With my screen gone, Loki earned himself a free Gladiator, and Megalith just killed the Bloodtracker-preyed Archidon that swept around for an objective kill. He left a screen of 3 stones in front of his empty Tanith.

The win was assassination. My opponent's big fuck up was thinking Karn could get to Loki so he put the Gobbers in front of him to drop a cloud to block LoS. Karn used the Gobbers as a Sidestep springboard to reach and clear just one stone, making an opening for the Savage, one Exalted Guardian, and Makeda herself to slip through and barely assassinate. I had to min-max the shit out of my last turn and even cast Eliminator for the first time ever on some clumped Reeves to get the distance I needed.

It was not fun, it was miserable watching my board melt. My feat turn killed like 4 Bloodtrackers and managed a little fury. Gonna swap the Savage for a Krea and just dare my opponent to come close enough to Makeda to try and shoot her at DEF stupid.

where the fuck do i got to play in michigan?

conflictchamber.com/#be1b_-0shxh2h2h7h9h9h9h9hhhohlhlh9

Grymkin Army - 75 / 75 points
[Theme] Bump in the Night

!!! Your army contains CID entries.

(Old Witch 3) Zevanna Agha, The Fate Keeper [+29]
- Cage Rager [14]
- Cage Rager [14]
- Rattler [9]
Dread Rots (max) [12]
Dread Rots (max) [12]
Dread Rots (max) [12]
Dread Rots (max) [12]
Dread Rots (max) [12]
Twilight Sisters [7]
Lord Longfellow [0]
Glimmer Imp [0]
Glimmer Imp [0]

Glimmer Imps to buff Mat
Curse of Shadows if you need to buff PS
Scourge if you need to buff Mat even more
Windstorm to protect them a bit going in
d3 + 2 returning every turn
Can also toss out Pathfinder and +2" charge threat if needed
All warrior models have Rise

Seems fun. Not optimal configuration though.

Her blinding murder gun buffs MAT, too.

Also they can't just put up four Burning Ash clouds and crotch chop

conflictchamber.com/#be1b_-0shvh4h4h4h4h8h8h8h8h8h8h8h8h8hohphlhlhc

Grymkin Army - 75 / 75 points
[Theme] Bump in the Night

!!! Your army contains CID entries.

(King of Nothing 1) The King of Nothing [+28]
- Crabits (2) [7]
- Crabits (2) [7]
- Crabits (2) [7]
- Crabits (2) [7]
9x Dread Rots (min) [63]
Lord Longfellow [0]
Trapperkin [3]
Glimmer Imp [0]
Glimmer Imp [0]
Murder Crows [9]

Even Veeky Forums knows the list as originally posted is spam.

And Veeky Forums is quite right in that it deserves the trash.

What works well with Horgle? Aside from the mandatory Mauler/Krielstone and the obvious firebreathers.

another state maybe or you know google

Mountain King, a Bomber or two. Mauler is optional. Fireeaters are obviously great.

>grymemes
Its ok too memey on the minies
>Dreadrots
DA TOVARISCH. IS TIME OF VIKTOR AND MANY TEMPLATE, MAKE GAME OF BECOME BOMBARDMENT TO MAKE CYGNARIANDOGPIG JELOUS

So I want to get back into Warmahordes. Played Menoth in Mk1 and would love to know how are they in Mk3. Alternativly I'm thinking about Constance Blaze in Cygnar or some Cephlyx. Any advice?

>DA TOVARISCH. IS TIME OF VIKTOR AND MANY TEMPLATE, MAKE GAME OF BECOME BOMBARDMENT TO MAKE CYGNARIANDOGPIG JELOUS
Can you see through clouds?

Protectorate is - aside from some bad options (like Errants) - a damn solid faction. All of their casters are playable though Amon, HR and Sevy2 are the most popular.

Blaize is shit. Well, not really. She's not bad, but the options she wants to take are. Precursors are terrible. Harlan and Gallant are amazing, but that's just two models. Can't make an army from those. I anticipate there will be a Morrowan theme force (with new Morrowan stuff) somewhere in the distant future that will make them playable.

Cephalix are great, but limited. They will make a great half of a Mercenary list pairing. If that's what you want, go for it. But be prepared to basically build, paint and play two entirely different armies.

>thinking you need to hit when all you do is spam templates of various kinds
You can cloud wall your entire army.

Have you played into a Cloud Wall list before? You can't even target them. You'll have to run your own dudes into the clouds, turn them around and hope you miss them and drift into their army. It's an incredibly miserable matchup.

Thanks mate. Casters that intrest me the most are Kreoss 3, Reznik2 or this new Durant guy(I'm going on looks right now)

So Cephalix are no go since I want an unified look to my force and from what you are saying I recon running purely cephalix themed list is not optimal?

You can run pure Cephalix lists. In fact, you can only play Cephalix in a Cephalix-only list. But in the long run you will probably want another list to pair it with for events (if those interest you) and the best way to do that is to pair it with a non-Cephalix list.

In terms of Protectorate, go for whichever caster you like most. I can't give you too much list advice outside of the obvious stuff like Durant wanting a bunch of warjacks so I hope some Protectorate players can comment on that.

Well matters not. Ordered Durant and mk3 battlegroup. Guess I can't go wrong with castigator and revenger

Errants are only bad because Idrians do their job better and for less points. Kind of makes sense, since almost all special abilities that made errants in mk2 good are now on Idrians.

Are errants or idrians worth anything with Durant. After first glance at him I don't think so but I could be wrong

Well, as already said, Idrians are currently the better of the two options. You can't go wrong with getting one unit of idrians + UA, although I'm not sure if Tristan2 does much with them. They're your go to infantry for the faction though

Can I get a slightly different tier list than the usual; I'm after a fun, showy force rather than outright power. Something that offers many different playstyles and a challenge to use, with a steep learning curve.

As an example, Ret have outstanding internal balance, but are they challenging?
Trolls sound challenging, but that's because they are weak rather than skillful. Also, awful internals.

if you're looking for a steep learning curve Convergence might be for you. They have a resource system almost completely different from the rest of Warmachine and thier 'jacks' base stats change from caster to caster, meaning that even playing the same list with two completely different casters will change the game entirely

>Are errants or idrians worth anything with Durant.
Tristan2 doesn't do much for infantry in general, but then again Idrians don't need a lot of outside help. He tends to run fairly battlegroup heavy, for obvious reasons, with maybe one or two units supporting. Idrians are fairly self sufficient and can definitely fill that role.

Really the only unit Tristan has any meaningful interaction with is Bastions. The combination of inviolable resolve and regular healing makes him one of the few casters that can kinda-sorta-maybe make them work still. They're still far from automatic with him though.

I have a question between Doomshaper2 and Doomshaper3. It seems as though Doomie2 has a better spell list, but Doomie3's feat seems a lot better.

Both sound like they want to run very beast heavy in the PoD theme, but which one do people think performs better? Also, what models work best with them other than the usual Mauler+Stone. My first list is a Gunnbjorn list, but I want a list that does something totally different to pair with him.

You need an axer for both of them. Doomy 2 wants Rok for overtake and Berserk.

This is the problem I've been having with Skorne. Yeah, you can pull it off and your things are pretty good now, but it's not fun watching half your dudes die and having to be OK with it and it's not fun having to bring a bunch of shit assuming they're gonna die so youre few good things can get in to do their job.

I'm thinking of jumping factionb but I feel like an inconsiderate bastard considering they just got buffed.

>it's not fun watching half your dudes die and having to be OK with it
Suck it up. You should be OK with having ALL of your dudes die if that's what enables you to win. Just part of the game.

>it's not fun having to bring a bunch of shit assuming they're gonna die
That's early Mk3 Skorne you are descibing. Now we have a whole bunch of delivery methods. Our stuff may die, but not before doing their damn jobs.

Dude no, I expected to lose infantry in droves, just not in one turn. Mak3 is a super solo in the truest sense. With any other caster they would've lived longer, but that's the price you pay for a caster that can slaughter heavies.

What's the general opinion of PP nuking their forums?

Seems dumb to me.

it needed to happen for various reason. It's not good, but it needed to happen for them. Right now they are doing a lot of restructuring internally.

With the whopping 5 people in my local meta, the forums were an essential aspect of community and discussion for me.

Now they have gone full nazi on the forum rules and scrapped their best parts.

What makes you think it needed to happen?

From the sources I've gotten, it's part of their corporate restructuring. Resources are going into the CID and then things will smooth out

That sounds like a bunch of PR gibberish. It means nothing and only raises more questions.

There was zero reason they couldn't have kept the faction forums. When I was getting into the game, the faction forums were BY FAR the most valuable resource on the internet.

I have no idea how new players are supposed to get into the game now. The newcomers forum? What nonsense.

It's a contractual thing.

What on Earth?

"We needed to get rid of the most used/informative/enjoyable part of our forums because of corporate restructuring. It's a contractual thing".

Do you realise how asinine this sounds? It's this sort of shit that made me leave GW for PP back in the day.

I'm incredibly sad to even be considering going back.

>informative/enjoyable
First of all, fucking no. Faction forums are cancerous and a source of containment.

second it has to do with the contract with people running with the thing.

PP recognizes the issues, but they can't afford to do anything about for a while.

>Faction forums are cancerous and a source of containment.

Yeah, clearly nobody enjoyed them or got something out of them. That's why they were so unpopular. /sarcasm.

I know of two people in my meta, out of the 5, that are considering dropping PP. I'm a third. How do you think two people are going to fare long-term?

It's not just that they dropped them, it's the callous response of "thanks for posting, we encourage you to go to other forums".

Like fucking hell, that's a level of passive-aggression my mother-in-law would be proud of. Then there is the draconian new forum rules. So much for page 5, ffs.

I don't see how a "contract" means they have to delete their main online community hub and act like dicks about it.

> but it's not fun watching half your dudes die and having to be OK with it

Pretty sure I have never won a single game of Warmachine with more than 50% of my points still on the table. What.

You are just projecting hard.

Calm down. As you said, you do not know, so calm down.

>faction forums
>valuable

What am I projecting?

What are you referring to that I don't know?

Are you being intentionally vague?

Yes I am being intentionally vague.

You are projecting your anger and frustration to add passive aggressive responses from PP. To be fair they are guilty of that in the past, but this is just projection from your part

Contractual issues, which you've mentioned yourself that you don't see the connections.

>>Contractual issues

Contractual issues don't make you delete forums.

And it's not projection if I admit my frustration and call them out for their own behaviour.

Yes, "thanks for posting, you can go elsewhere now. bye" is a passive aggressive response.

There was no warning, no discussion, no feedback, no reason given. Just "this is how it is, deal with it". It's a poor implementation of an at best unwise decision.

I'll repeat for last time.

Calm down.

You do not know, so calm down.

Then enlighten me.

>yeah, we deleted our most popular forums because of CONTRACTS.

This is utter nonsense.

not the same guy, but yeah it kinda does make sense. if they contract the forums out to a company, which is extremely common, the company could have stipulated something that allows them to chop what they don't want to do anymore and force PP to take the buck without revealing why. That, too, is relatively common. This could be them dealing with that, so until the contract is up or they can renegotiate this is what we're stuck with.

So as of right about this minute, no more press gang program.

Enjoy your dying game

>allows them to chop what they don't want to do anymore and force PP to take the buck without revealing why.

A non-disclosure agreement where you have no control over your own forum? That would be the dumbest move you could ever make.

Also, I just found out that they dropped the press gang... I don't even know how to deal with this... So many bad moves in such a short time...

proof? I'm not a pressganger and I can't find anything on their official site/forum claiming this, so you understand why I think you're lying out your tiny urethra.

Not that guy but a friend of mine who is a press ganger just texted me that they were shutting down the program

Not him, but I found out about it here:

lormahordes.freeforums.net/thread/147/press-gang-disbanded

Their PG page is also disabled:

privateerpress.com/community/press-gangers

Guess you'll be sticking your tongue in that tiny urethra

looks like I will be, goddamn. At least they're trying to get something else in place though, I guess? I mean from a business perspective I can see why they're doing what they're doing, but idk. I don't super agree with it.

PPS_Jackson just confirmed in (and then locked) a thread on their official forums about it.

>I mean from a business perspective I can see why they're doing what they're doing

I, too, think that dropping a program full of FREE VOLUNTEERS that has done incalculable good to the warmahordes community is a good business move.

Also, I like to eat sawdust and have trouble tying my shoelaces.

They are trying to axe the volunteer aspect of the community and trying to get some kind of actual employee programs going. That's why so many community things are getting burned

if they're giving the pressgangers credits to buy things after they set up events, it's not really free. the pressganger at my store, which admittedly has a pretty sizeable community, has amassed enough "points" to only need to pay shipping on two 75-point armies. granted, I could be thinking of something OTHER than a pressganger and getting confused, but I don't think I am.

from what I'm guessing they're moving more to the system that WotC has, where they give a store more things based on how much they sell/have events.

>They are trying to axe the volunteer aspect of the community

I'm amazed so many people can obtain so many extra chromosomes so quickly.

Read this: blog.legalsolutions.thomsonreuters.com/top-legal-news/magic-card-game-judges-sue-for-lost-wages-claim-to-be-employees/

You can't legally volunteer for a for-profit entity. Given recent case law, the PG program would only last until someone was pissed off enough to file a lawsuit (which the defense of could sink PP).

It's shitty, but it's not entirely without reason.

That it comes at the same time as other restructuring, though, makes me think that PP is cleaning up liabilities (and having a volunteer program even superficially similar to one that caused a class-action lawsuit to another gaming company is a hell of a liability) in advance of shopping around for a buyer.

The only people putting any work into the northeast have been the press gang, and they've just been told they're not wanted.

I hear the next faction is going to be a ghost town