Warhammer

I can only say one positive thing about GW and 40k/AoS/WFB and it's that their miniatures are exceptionally well detailed and above and beyond competitors. But that's where it ends, they may be good but they aren't THAT good to pay the premium GW places on them.

I'm not going to trash the setting because I enjoy some aspects of it and everyone can like whatever they like, and I don't know enough about the lore to weigh in on it, but the rules are bad across every system.

I've played dozens of historicals/future/fantasy and never have I found a system that is worse than anything related to Warhammer, some have come close but they're redeemed in other aspects. 40k/AoS/WFB are just bland to the point where every battle feels the same as the last, and some editions are downright unplayably horrible.

I'd say the problem with both is that they are contunations of long running franchises and so internal problems with the rules systems and the lore have become the biggest issue each edition rather than inspired rules and designs.

40k has none of the rpg elements it once had from rogue trader days but it's also become less of a sandbox, it's like playing a premade minecraft map rather than making your own. AoS is an example of gw thinking '8th ed rules are complicated' so totally squatting them into as basic a format as possible but then losing a ton of potential for roleplay and also the flavour of the factions. Also objectives in both games are meaningless and dull.

It attracts people like you.

Because when people graduate to better games they have to unlearn so much bullshit.

They mostly hate it because they hate the new setting, and the business decision to discontinue the old setting. The gameplay is irrelevant to such gripes.

Okay, how many chances I should give it (to rules and setting) after GHB release?

Until you like it. If you dislike AoS you are literally a buttmad WHFBkiddie who can't let go. There is no other explanation.

Not that guy, but

Whfb flavor is the only good reason to play anything Warhammer.

AoS fluff is as bland as a bowl full of chalk dust.

>If you dislike AoS you are literally a buttmad WHFBkiddie who can't let go.
But if I already let it go since they launch event named "End Times"?

By "let go" he doesn't mean let go, he means "decide you like AOS" and give GW lots of money for their new product line.

And I thought I had layered the sarcasm thick enough.

Most haters can't stand how perfect Age of Sigmar is. Is the best game ever made. Prove me wrong1 protip: You cant.

Guess you never visited Infinity general and non-general threads about GW fantasy models/games

Sarcasm looks a lot like autism in text.

Okay, let me try again:

Age of Sigmar (™) is literally perfect and anything anyone could ever want from the Wargaming Hobby (™). It offers the full Games Workshop (™) Experience (™) and Premium Product (™) at a value price ideal for beginners of the Games Workshop (™) Hobby (™). Only those stuck in the past could deny the sheer awesomeness of the battles between epic forces such as the Ground Marine (™) Templar Extremis (™) Sigmarite Hammermancers (™) or the Blooddeath Goresecration (™) Deathslayer Organdonor (™) Bloodlords!

But seriously, why Infinity general?

Much better.

There's a guy autisticly screeching about all the stuff dnd got wrong in another thread, and insisting that if someone homebrews a dnd setting, they'd have to be retarded to not go through the books with a finetoothed comb fixing everything to conform to be true to real world myth and folklore and history.

You can basically never assume its sarcasm on Veeky Forums.

He also said "nobody plays D&D" and "d&d is not the standard".

if you want some funny to read. Starts after some user mentions using hobgoblins as a core player race in a d&d homebrew setting.

Generally on the if it looks like autism, it's not sarcasm.

Ok but what systems are better than warhammer?

What genre?

The other ones.

The one that is warhammer fantasy

>The one that is warhammer fantasy
Anything, since AoS is different ruleset

becuase both these things tend to fuck with grognards nostaligia of playing warhammer fantasy 7th edition and warhammer 40k second edition.

Why are there two chaos spawns trying to pass for the emperor and valdor?

Since it may be relevant, is Kings of War a good system? I want to play in a fantasy setting and after fantasy bit the dust I have been poking around for another system to play.

Isn't it basically WHFB but with slightly less bullshit? So, do you want to play WHFB or are you open to something a bit more different?

I think of Trump more as Roboute and Farage more like one of his brothers that dissapeared and we'll never see again

Personally I lean towards Armies Project Warhammer 9e.

It's 8e with elements of 6 and 7 brought back, and he's working on converting everything off now from old editions to 9e.

Plus, Kislev and Dogs of War have army books again.

I'll bite.
Why Guilliman?

>I think of Trump more as Roboute
Jew?

Well, isn't he yelling "Make the Imperium great again"? Also he's working with the Eldar (Jews)

>Whats so wrong with 40k?

It's a very poorly balanced game.

>Why do people hate Age of Sigmar?

It's a very poorly conceived game.

>But seriously, why Infinity general?

He probably just doesn't like Infinity. They're fine over there.

I've heard they're rather zealous about their game, so maybe that's it.

>It attracts people like you.
People who ask questions? Plz. stfu you dumb fuck.

Well maybe its because they're actually like it.

Its a common trait of fandoms.

Nah, this is mostly a myth drummed up by 40Kids.

The reality is, whenever we have a beautiful models thread, one thing is guaranteed - an Infinity fan will post some model they like, and then a bunch of 40Kids will jump on them, ranting and raging about how they need to stop pushing their game and it isn't good anyway and that model isn't so great because [insert bullshit reason] and etc etc.

GWfags have a huge insecurity when it comes to Infinity. No fucking idea why.

>No fucking idea why.
Because Infinity fans made few fun pictures about GW "premium prices for premium models"

>centurions are still real

Fuck, I'd almost forgotten.

Every now and then some faggot comes in to troll the thread with AoS shilling. Apparently being satisfied with a non-GW game is a Mortal Wound™ to some AoSers.

I gotta make one with a Mutilator.

One reason is that 40k is the one game everyone starts with, so its full of the worst kind of players.
And AoS is what happens when you decide the best way too reinvigorate a beloved but stagnant IP is to have the world explode and have it replaced with a completely different style of universe.

While Infinity models are fantastic, nothing seems to come close to the level of conversion and kit-bashing you can do with GW models.

GW has basically got the two systems the wrong way around.

Warhammer 40K was at it's best when it was a skirmish game with 30 to 60 models a side and a handful of vehicles.

At the moment it's like playing Flames of War in 28mm sometimes, too many tanks, everything is too cheap on the table top and too powerful and worst of all the number of books coming out adding ad hoc formations that don't really fit with the game means it's just a complete mess of intricate rules that most people don't care about.

Fantasy was also a complex game that had intricate rules.

Age of Smegma is too simple to appeal to these former fans and doesn't add enough depth for a melee orientated game for older fans. A skirmish game for Fantasy would have been better received if it had a tighter rule set, came with points and was set in the Old World.

In short, GW has got the two systems mixed up. 40K is far too bloated and AoS is far too underdeveloped.

Imo a lot of it is due to past sins like the prices reaching impossible summits, complimented with the utter shitshow of their finecast years (replacing metal miniatures with recasts made with a flimsy resin of inconsistent and mostly bad quality, which if your mini didnt suffer the effects of bad resin composition, had an equal chance of being plagued with air bubbles that distorted or destroyed detail). If I'm correct, I recall being able to buy Eldar aspect warriors for half the price they are now, and the minis are exactly the same as they were back then, just sold in smaller blister packs. A general sin like i said above is the pricewall that shuts out those of us that have bills to pay. Another sin was their pricey embargo on FLGS who carried their products, and absolute prevention of sales to the FLGS who attempted to sell their products for cheap, and those FLGS who had online stores. Further burning the tirefire that was their elitist totalitarian business practices, GW clamped down on rumormonger hubs (which why would you punish fans who clamored to spread excitement about ulcoming products) further widening the gulf between fan and producer.

By the time the WHFB End Times hit, disillusioned fans who felt somewhat abused by the shitty practices of the company, met it with mixed to kind of positive reactions until the end of the year when GW revealed that it was all an elaborate ploy to flush the old world down a proverbial public toilet of bad writing. Yes, a monumental event storyline That saw the absolute destruction of some fan favorite armies ended in what can only be summarized as:

>"and everyone died. The end."

WHFB folks wondered "wtf? What now?". And GW responded by saying "all is well, not to worry, just keep playing games with 'End Times' rules :) "

Because GW is not considered a trustworthy company anymore - even the improvements and steps forward they've taken recently have been criticized and poked over, and that's not even taking into account times where they fucked up. Their public image has tanked, and even the most hopeful fans can probably be pressed into admitting that GW has backed itself into a corner on so many areas.

There is also a contrarian attitude - people don't like the new shit, they want the old shit. It's easy to hate on everything that newfags are just getting into, and glorify an edition of yesteryear. Some people are happy for change, but other people never wanted it in the first place.

Personally, especially in Age of Sigmar's case, I feel like it's trying too hard to sound like its own unique thing. The game is rather bland, and the writing is chock full of weird phrasing and tons of names and phrases that feel like they're all trying to avoid copyright rather than actually try to sound interesting. Sometimes I worry that's what 40k is doing too, though it is able to rely on its continued existence instead of having to shove all sorts of new things out in a relatively short time.

You mean you are getting trolled by the slav shitposter. He uses AoS to troll Infinity and WHFB threads. He also trolls AoS threads. You are an idiot if you think he is genuine.

>Farage isn't Malcador
You fucked up, OP.

(2/?)
Then half a year later AoS came out with Stormcast eternals looking suspiciously like Blood Angel marines. Lizardmen came back from the stars into AoS proudly bearing their newly copyrighted name: Seraphon (which became the laughingstock of GW after a quick google search found the name a word for "foot-tickling-torture-fetish" for furries who had a preference to Pokemon feet. It was enough to make even Slaanesh recoil in shudders).
For a year there were just weeks on weeks of khorne releases, stormcast releases and furry feet tickling which made already disilusioned WHFB players groan more as their playthroughs with the infant AoS rules were summed up with indifference and disdain.
GW however despite their misgivings is seeing a small kind of rebound from their unfavorability sowed by the early to preteen 2000's. Theyve opened their platform to community suggestions and thats seen small improvements like their Generals handbook release last summer along with their first relatively successful community campaign. Warhammer quest is just one among their new fledgeling board game revival.

However the writing still isnt anything great, and the new world they made in AoS has a long way to go before it can come close of the density of the old world. It doesnt help that their stories seem to be driven more by miniature sales than the virtue of creating a compelling world. In this sense theres a distinct lack of crativity in AoS stories that other fantasy novels have. And obviously retcons within new lore be it in 40k or in AoS, is bound to meet with opposition from those who were invested in the older lore.

>why do people hate age of sigmar
because i played warhammer fantasy and it killed that game, people played it, then less and less, now im the only one at my local who even has armies for it

>
Personally, especially in Age of Sigmar's case, I feel like it's trying too hard to sound like its own unique thing. The game is rather bland, and the writing is chock full of weird phrasing and tons of names and phrases that feel like they're all trying to avoid copyright rather than actually try to sound interesting. Sometimes I worry that's what 40k is doing too, though it is able to rely on its continued existence instead of having to shove all sorts of new things out in a relatively short time.
This. This in my opinion is the epitome of bad writing with black library and GW. I'm relatively new to reading GW lore, and so I read Horus Rising which in its own way is an alright book. But then I picked up Curse of the Wulfen and the writing is just horrendous by comparison. AoS has the same problem: the names and the writing style is just abhorrent at times. I have grown tired of reading compound names that just sound terrible if you were to say it outloud "Vandus Hammerhand", "Thostos Bladestorm", "Harald Deathwolf", "Kjarl Grimblood"... wtf is this? This is worse naming than Harry Potter.

Frankly, I don't give a fuck if he's genuine, I just want the AoS shit to be gone from the Infinity thread.

What does he shitpost in AoS threads, BTW? That Infinity is the objective #1 and you should all feel bad? Would explain some of the reaction against it.

In a slightly less brief manner: because it's (subjectively) worse than WHFB, which would be fine if it hadn't killed WHFB.

It's objectivity worse though. I can look at the Lord of the Rings game or Lion Rampant and understand that it is a different a simpler skirmish game and know that it is not worse but different.

AoS is objectively worse, it's the most half arsed shit with no attempt to make the rules precise. I can appreciate concision in games, some great skirmish games are like 20 pages but AoS has no precision or depth. They wouldn't have even added points if people hadn't kicked up such a stink.

AoS is a monument to the fucking laziness of Games Workshop, this was their attempt to cut to the bone and have one guy in the entire rules development department.

Haven't played since it first dropped, but isn't the combat still "pile in and throw dice" like a simpler version of 40k's assault phase but with wizard buffs?

>revival
Top kek. Most likely "shit we need new Bloodvowl and Warhammer quest to keep rights"

40k is the worst wargame around, rules-wise. barring some mega obscure bullshit i know some sperg will try and bring up
However, it's also the most common. So new players take it up, play it, have a crap time and drop out of the hobby.

>40k is the worst wargame around, rules-wise.
AoS is worse.

>While Infinity models are fantastic, nothing seems to come close to the level of conversion and kit-bashing you can do with GW models.
While I do agree with you, recent GW kits are awful for kitbashing to the point that their only clear-cut advantage is that it's full plastic.

Best kitbashing kits are found in AoW or the Perrys nowadays

Can we alla gree that Age of Sigmar is better than any wargames currently produced? Better than Warmahordes, Infinity, WHFB and WH40K.

Kings of War
Old/fan editions of WHFB
That will give you all the regiment shuffling autism you need.

abysmalylowqualitybait.jpg

I agree wholeheartedly.
Dropped Warmachine since PP is blowing it hard and GW really picked up its game in the past year.

AoS is great as long as you are aiming to have fun. Powergaming spergs will hate it forever because muh hardcore strategy tactical genius hurr

So you are saying that two players trying to outplay each other with their painted plastic crack can't have fun? Sure thing m80.

I'm a fucking casual and never got into warhammer until I went into a games workshop. The rules for it looked simple enough (and I found out that age of sigmar is the new version I am COMPLETE fucking noob to warhammer)

Skaven are very funny and I fell in love with them the more I researched them and so I got a Grey Seer to paint for fun, and have ordered a spire of dawn box to share with my friend. He will play elves and I Skaven.

>Whats so wrong with 40k?

It doesn't know what it wants to be, rules wise. The mechanics of the game demand absurd and rather unsatisfying strategies. If the mechanics were designed to make for a satisfying war game, it'd be fine. If the mechanics were designed to reflect the rich fluff, it'd be fine.

>Why do people hate Age of Sigmar?
Look around tg and see how many people like 40k primarily for the setting. Age of Sigmar has the same shitty mechanics you'd expect from Games Workshop, but without a particularly well-established setting to make it even slightly appealing to the tg crowd.

AoS is at least not trying to be anything more then throwing dice and having a laugh
except for the general's handbook which people seem to think fixes all the problems somehow

Except that AoS ruels are probably the best rules ever written for a game.

You're treading the line between sarcasm and retardation pretty well, but you need to add some humor. Otherwise it's just pointless to funpost.

>AoS ruels are probably the best rules ever written for a game.

Maybe if you were playing it instead of being a useless neckbeard too fat to see his own foot ... you could see that I'm not being sarcastic at all. AoS is the best game ever made.

>AoS is the best game ever made.
Like DoW3, only three playable races

At least they are playable. Instead of having thirty unusable races.

>At least they are playable
Just like Ynnari, Space Marines and Tau

Jesus Christ, step out of the GWsphere for a moment.

Infinity, Dropfleet/Dropzone, Warmahordes, FoW, Malifaux... all of them have far better rules.

Simplicity =/= quality. AoS is so simple that every game essentially plays out the same way.

>Dropfleet/Dropzone, Warmahordes, FoW, Malifaux
user, why the fuck you told him these names, now he will shitpost in their generals too.

He's already doing that.

None of them are better than AoS.
AoS is the best Wargame ever made. You can't prove me wrong.

Really? I thought only Infinity general suffers from it.

Who needs to? Your idiocy and a lifetime of failure would do it better than we ever could.

40k and AoS exit in a complete shit tier all by themselves. Though WM/H is rapidly joining them.

Good games: Infinity, Guildball, Malifaux, Armada. Play one of those OP.

...

Basically all of them.

>Infinity.
You are a weeboo and a furry.

Oh man, I remember the sheer autistic rage when an user made those.

So just like AoS players.

LotR is the best thing GW produces....and no one plays it.

Says a lot about their fanbase.

there is nothing fetish in AoS. Is a game made for all the family.

Infinity seems to becoming the new alternative to GW judging by the amount of autism being spewed at them.

>Is a game made for all the family
I love you.

You are a walking advertisement for why AoS players are morons.

is that terminator using mining drills for weapons?
LOL