So, thinking me up a setting idea:

Could you imagine though, the skill and level of no fucks given an ancient society would have to have needed to commit to long term sea travel? Also, what if they discovered ways to hunt these beasties or live on the more docile ones?

Ancient culture 1: (set in a pacific islander culture) "Our people have been here a long time. Since our ancestors first traveled to these islands atop a great turtle whom had washed ashore many moons ago. A creature whose shell was made from mountains. The scales holding fertile soil for vegetation, and pockets of fresh water made from the scars of a great battle. We give our thanks to these beasts. For without them, our way of life would not exist. It is why we migrate with the great island turtle, so that it may carry the spirit of our people with it always."

Ancient culture 2: (viking perhaps) "The air is cold. Yet the fire in our hearts push us forward. The ground is tough like stone. But our fists are like iron. The land hold no fruit. Our flesh lives without it. The sea calls to us, and we answer, for there is nothing behind in the villages we call home. The ocean is more perilous than the cliffs that run along our island...but we fight back. The gods have seen our plight and delivered unto our plea for life with a great bounty. Yet our gods are not so easily swayed. They ask for proof of our resolve. They ask us to show them why we deserve to live in there fields. Our answer? To slay the creatures they have beset upon us. To complete the tests they have thrown into the waters! We will show the gods that we are not cowards as we feats upon the monsters they have fashioned! Their challenge to us is to survive on the beasts they have made! We will show our gods that we are worthy for their temples by drinking the nectar of life from the bones of the leviathans below!"

The true fun begins when these cultures brave the Far Waters and meet for the first time.

*their fields

Instead of canals, massive land bridges would be built.

Aircraft would become the focus of being fast travel options. Lace up them sneakers for amazing aircraft capability-modern day but even better in shorter time.

Remember folks, the reason naval travel was invested in was because it allowed far faster travel on massive distances, linking larger empires to themselves and others. With that gone, the air is now the new option for fast travel on long distances.

Now to your question OP. Yes, they can reach that point. But things would be differently designed. It wouldn't be to destroy other ships (yet) so aspects like electronic warfare and aircraft (funnily enough) are not as effective and would not be used. In fact, even torpedos would be minimized, as that requires launching a ship, a plane, or building pods alongside the ocean.

Instead, dumb deep-water bombs and mines would be used. Not the floaty chained ones. Ones that sink into the nests. Once nests are gone, heavy missile fire and smart bombs would be used on moving creatures. Slower ones would still have dumb bombs dropped on them. At this point, aircraft would make an appearance more closely, launching guided weapons. Of course, high-altitude high-capacity aircraft would be used for initial dropping of dumb weapons.

Problem is I don't really see how a non-technologically advance society could hope to even harm a proper leviathan.

I mean for iron age whalers getting killed/sunk by a friggin krill eater was a very real risk now make them both much larger AND more predatory it just ain't gunna happen.

Also based on OPs original statement (relatively) shallow coastal waters are still safe it's just the deep seas that are filled with death.

>Problem is I don't really see how a non-technologically advance society could hope to even harm a proper leviathan.

With guts and determination. Not meaning to make this a FYH thread, but I feel that people would find a way. Say....lure it into more shallow waters where you have created a contraption that will pierce its skull with a giant log spear weighted down by rocks. They wouldn't hunt these creatures ALL the time I believe. Maybe more of a trial of passage or a ritual to appease some god during a horrible time? Perhaps the village periodically experiences famine, and culturally they accept that the only way to properly feed the entire village without growing massive amounts of crops in a barren rocky outcrop would be to kill a large sea creature.

That or just going out to piss off a smaller creature as a coming of age thing.

Or hunt the babies and fear the parents?

Who knows? All I'm saying is that if a society were to be super based around the ocean, and there were lots of fuck-huge scary creatures in it, they'd find a way to cope and move on. It's our adaptability that makes us a top species.

I would have to concede though that a leviathan would be a formidable, if not impossible, foe. Maybe they would be able to feed a whole village with a giant crab monster instead?

They'd still be inhabited, just by the native tribes, untouched by the perverse romans

>In a world without sea travel, a. British Isles would likely be uninhabited
Didn't people move there while it was still connected to the mainland?

correct. At a time before the channel was below sea level

Hence why a somewhat modern day Japan would be fucked without the invention of the plane.

Oddly reminds me of my last Minecraft spawn.
I spawned on a tiny island in the middle of an ocean biome
To my north and immediate west were ocean monuments.
For those who don't know: ocean Monuments are home of very literally the only hostile minecraft mobs in the ocean, Guardians. They have a death-beam stare that targets any player they get line of sight on. Basically impossible for an unequipped minecraft player to deal with because they are underwater, have lots of health, and can kill you if they can see you.

Complicating matters, in the heart of the monument are three "boss" ancient guardian fish, which have a proximity-based curse effect that prevents you from mining if you come within 60 meters of them.

So, basically, i could move 30 meters off my northern coast before i was cursed and could not mine anymore, or i could move 45 meters off my western coast.

Needless to say, i sailed south and east, but i kept coming back to my spawn island, each time with better gear, until finally i had full diamond gear with aqua affinity and deep strider on them, and a shitload of great potions and a really strong weapon...

And what i discovered was: the guardians were goddamn pushovers when you are over equipped. Slaughtered them wholesale, killed their leaders, and then demolished their temples. They still spawn like hell though.

Poison bait on a raft sent drifting out into sea monster territory?

Once you've got airships and aircraft, what's the point of making a heavy investment in killing the sea monsters? The ocean is large and there's no particularly great way of locating these animals from the air. The ROI on an extermination campaign sucks compared to the ROI on a fleet of airships; in general, you're probably better off building more airships than you are killing sea creatures so you can make ships viable.

I'm more interested in the psychological aspect of it. The ocean is now a giant blank spot in human knowledge. What goes on in the open ocean? Well, people die; beyond that, who knows? There could be anything out there. Anything.

Waterworld.

But with big fish.

That too. Then just go drag it to shore, or harvest off of it until another creature shows up to eat what you killed.

Resources.

They exist underwater.

That's the only reason needed. Primarily oil. Enough to outweigh the cost.

>Resources
The sea monsters are the resources. See a plothook from GURPS War Against The Chtorr for further details.

Moby Dick 2000
A Japanese corporation is trying to find a way to exploit the Enterprise Fish. New weapon systems are being devel- oped for this purpose, especially a sonic emitter will maybe cause the creature to beach itself on a selected deserted island, where a few thousand workmen can strip the enormous creature at leisure. The corporation projects that even if they only manage to salvage 10% of the monster's meat and oil, the enterprise (no pun in- tended) will be a success.
The PCs can be part of the hunting expedition, which is trav- eling in airships (this is one whale you can't hunt from a boat!). Jobs include exobiologists (perhaps former U.S. experts lured to Japan by a competitive salary), flier pilots for scouting, and secu- rity experts. The character could also be American spies sent to observe and even sabotage the project.
In any case, the corporation will fail to realize that they are dealing with the Chtorran ecology, and something will go disas- trously wrong. A new species of animal (Chtorran flying sharks, for instance) will attack the airship and either damage it severely (causing it to crash-land on inhospitable and Chtorran-ridden land) or destroy it altogether, causing it to fall into the sea. Adrift in a ocean of monsters, the PCs have to find a way to reach a friendly shore.

>Once you've got airships and aircraft, what's the point of making a heavy investment in killing the sea monsters?

GLORY TO THOSE THAT SLAUGHTER THE FOUL HALF-GODS BEINGS THAT PROWL THE WATERS!

Also, friendly reminder: That fish has a jaw and tooth structure that is designed to grasp on to prey of equal or greater size than itself, or deeply slice the flesh of a creature much larger than itself.

That means this creature feeds on things in its size category, and regularly at that.

>Oceanic voyaging was just about impossible,
>inventions like guided missile boats, torpedoes, sonar

>>Cannot use ships for millennia
>>Develop advanced maritime technology anyway

Logic much, user?

Early morning bump for interest

"Guts and determination" are apparently the HFY terms for "magic". You can't guts and determination your way through this. Primitive humans just don't have what it takes. OP implied it takes GUIDED FREAKING MISSILES to have a chance against sea monsters, no amount of heroic spear wielders is going to so much as tickle them.

^This. Ancient human civilization was tremendously reliant on rivers for its early agricultural needs. It quite simply would never develop if rivers are inaccessible. No Mesopotamia, no Egypt, no nothing of that sort. Nomads and their herds of goats, that would be the extent of human society.

You are just automatically assuming humans have access to anything that can poison a sea monster.

OP implied shallow water is relatively safe (unless you go the half life route and it's filled with death lampreys), some of that shit could've been developed there.

I feel like this would really depend on what sea monsters exactly ARE in that setting. Are they just huge fish? The laws of physics kind of put a stop to the growth of even sea creatures past some point. Prehistoric water had some scary shit in it but you'd never see a naturally evolved creature that can swallow a galleon whole or whatever. This implies sea monsters are at least in some way unnatural, and that's a huge can of worms. Are they intelligent? Can they use magic? Are they immortal? How many different types are there? How fast do they reproduce? Are they vulnerable to poison or disease? What do they eat?

TL;DR not enough information, OP is a fag, pointless thread is pointless

As much as a meme Minecraft is, it's still fascinating to listen to everyone's different experiences as they play.

Stuff originally designed for airship use. Air-to-air missiles and cluster bombs.

Native people have hunted whales (albeit relatively small ones) since the dawn of history. It would not be extraordinary to assume that a bunch of skilled spear wielders could take on a bus sized sea monster, especially if it's an inexperienced, small baby sea monster.

It may take a lot of trial and error to find the best strategy to take one down but someone in real life had to be the first person to decide to stab a whale or lure them into the shallows for slaughter.

And as I understood OP, he stated that modern technology gave humans a chance at pushing back against the monsters, IE clearing them out rather than defending yourself from attack. Nothing to say a primitive culture couldn't take out a lesser monster.

>Native people have hunted whales (albeit relatively small ones) since the dawn of history
And orangutans can make really neat nests, and it's amazing. I still wouldn't count on one building a fighter jet. You're talking about operations on a different scale.

Among the whales primitive folk hunted were sperm whales, and those are less like gentle filter feeding giants and more like giant underwater moose that regularly hunt colossal squids.

And if you need a lesson on how dangerous they can be, just take a look at the Essex or any of the other industrial age ships that got fucked up by one, even with their modern tech.

If our ancestors could take on a real life leviathan like that with nothing more than pointy sticks, nets, and glorified rafts, than taking on a single moderate sized sea serpent or large squid would not be out of the question.

Sure a lot of people would die in these hunts, as they did in real life. But the threat of death has never dissuaded people from doing things.

Still not the same scale, unfortunately. Your metaphors are irrelevant in this case. Primitive people are amazing but the ancient Greeks couldn't have gone into space.

Please explain how a 20m, aggressive and territorial whale is any less dangerous than an equivalent sized sea serpent, fish, squid, etc. People certainly would not hunt the truly gargantuan monsters but moderately sized ones would be fair game.

And what does going into space or developing fighter jets have to do with anything?

>equivalent sized
This is where you've started to go wrong. Maybe five, six, ten times the size. Then armored enough that you need MISSILES to get through it and possibly magical.

And the examples I gave were meant to show that you're confusing your scales. Just because ancient people were capable of impressive feats doesn't mean they were omnipotent. There's only so far you can go EVEN on inspirational HFY slogans like "human ingenuity" or "guts!". Bronze age people couldn't build a fighter jet no matter how much guts they put into it, same as they couldn't kill a sea monster. And saying that they should because they accomplished impressive feats is like saying that an orangutan should be able to build a jet because it can build a very impressive nest (yes, the orangutan is very clever and crafty but a nest is just not in the same league as a jet).

I all really boils down to how strong OP's sea monsters are. You're just assuming that they are strong to the point that you need modern technology to even to scratch one. But you should remember, even if they were that overpowered, smaller specimens will have to exist. Either in juvenile form or as prey for the big ones; an ecosystem cannot function if it solely comprised of mythical monsters and there is no indication of "magic" in the OP to just handwave that away. Obviously you would not hunt an actual, island sized sea monster but because these smaller ones are around, why wouldn't you hunt them?

I understand the need to be realistic, to avoid masturbating to thought of overpowered humans, but there's a difference between being realistic and being cynical. The reality is simple, if gargantuan sea monsters exist, intermediate ones must also exist. Humans would avoid large ones to best of their ability while smaller ones would be another form of dangerous game animal.

Who said there's only monsters in the sea?

>Aircraft need Anty-Wyrm artillery.

New user here: I see your points but until we're given some more details by op I'm inclined to agree with the other guy.
First of all there are some hard limits on just how big a living thing can get and still be mobile and whales are already starting to approach that limit (blue whales are basically on the border already) so the only way these monsters could exist is with 'magic' so fuck knows what there capabilities are.

But let's say they're still natural enough to have smaller juvenile forms they would still need to travel far enough from their parent's hunting grounds for humans to even consider hunting them and even so you need some sort of stimulus to kick the whole industry off.

Keep in mind that with early whalers ancient people were able to get close enough to see the damn things and then return home to talk about it long before they hunted them. With the monsters pretty much anyone who got close enough to see then got dead. End result if everyone who ventures into the deep waters just fucking vanishes who's going to keep trying that shit you need survivors for trial and error to work.

Because if they're everywhere how the hell did humanity live long enough to develop missiles.

All of Australia would have never been settled. Even at its lowest point, people still had to take boats to get to Papua New Guinea and Australia during the ice age.

Don't get me started on Madagascar and New Zealand.

>The laws of physics kind of put a stop to the growth of even sea creatures past some point. Prehistoric water had some scary shit in it but you'd never see a naturally evolved creature that can swallow a galleon whole or whatever

Indeed, and even giant predators, like megalodon or Livyatan, didn't exactly pick on other sea monsters their own size. The 60+ foot carnivores mostly fed on 25 foot whales and dugongs. With gigantic 50+ foot whales there was too great a risk of injury from being whacked in the face with a tail, so they most likely left those alone. It's part of the reason it's been suggested they went extinct.

So basically make sure your smallest ships are 50+ feet long, stay out of the water when they're territorial, and you'd probably be okay so long as things are following the rules of nature.

Well OP has implied physics has been fucked slightly.