40k general, /40kg/

>aha GW you thought you got rid of us you fools!

You use your Power Fists in the shooting phase?

>Those veteran gamers out there will be keen to learn that much of the ruleset is based off of the classic Necromunda game, including some in-between game advancements and earning experience that can see your small recon-force grow to become an elite unit of honed killers.

So, yeah, Shadow War is Necromunda 2.0

How to fix basic marines:

>remove free transports
>possibly remove BDC/Gladius entirely
>replace with 30k style FOC modification
>buff all the chapter tactics a little bit and revise the old FW ones

>bring grav-cannons down to Salvo 2/4, 18" range, remove grav amp, drop 5 points
>bring grav-guns down to Salvo 1/2", 18" range

>plasma guns don't Get Hot if you only fire one shot (should be a universal change)
>plasma cannons should be small blast, no Gets Hot, and have alternate profile: Large Blast, gets hot on 1 or 2 (basically, bake in the bonus from haemotrope reactors and make those fortifications reroll Gets Hot).
>power weapons dropped to 5 ppm, 10 for ICs. Fists are 15 ppm. Also universal changes.
>pistols go to 10 ppm, 5 for elites (universal)

>combine all veteran infantry units into one profile that can take all the upgrades on a per-model basis, all still elite slots
>vets start as normal marines but are required to buy 1-2 of the following: BS 5, A2, I5, Special Issue Ammo (2 ppm all around)
>Special Issue Ammo works on storm bolters and sternguard heavy bolters
>Veteran sergeants in tactical squads get their 2 upgrades included in their point cost
>tac squads can drop bolters for CCW or buy CCW for 2 ppm

>nerf bikes (universal change)

>apothecary HQ
>scout HQ

I use them in the movement phase. FIST SHOCK

Congratulations, you did nothing to gravstar builds and killed every other build including the casual ones.

Gravstar? Like gravcents?

People still use those?

And by nerf bikes I mean bring them down to the level of jump infantry.

>People still use those?

No, but they will after those changes.

>And by nerf bikes I mean bring them down to the level of jump infantry.

You mean the trash units that nobody takes except as part of broken ass formations where they have first turn guaranteed deep strike and charge?

I'm fine with nerfing OP shit but you're going to turn marines into orks.

Make grav not affect vehicles

The only nerfs are

>nerf bikes
>dump free transports
>reduce grav shots by 1

Literally everything else is a buff. They even keep ATSKNF and with Rites of War and such, they could still contend as objective-scoring monsters.

OH GOD GUYS

SQUATS ARE BACK

SQUATS ARE FUCKING BACK

"Get's Hot" is no where near are bad as you seem to think it is, especially for SM.

Also, why would pistols be so expensive? They are currently 1pt for most armies.

>removed decurion
>removed objsec formation
>removed auxiliaries
>did stupid shit like dick around with useless wargear like plasma pistols when what you need to win games is mass melta or lascannons
>dicking around with useless fucking elite units
>buffing veteran sergeants on fucking useless tactical squads that no longer have any reason to be taken due to no gladius and will have to be double-paid in 5 man MSU

Maybe you should learn to play the game competitively before trying to balance.

The fuck do you have against bikes?

He's just a moron and doesn't realize non-RW/WS/Eldar/Nurgle bikes are complete trash.

Jump packs need to be buffed to +1T or something. They'd still be worse than bikes.

Jump packs shouldn't have +1T, but they should be able to be used in both movement and assault phase.

Doesn't fix the issue of MEQ not being worth their 13-15 points and you just removed all the things that helped make them playable.

Why wouldn't people just play Scout spam like late 6E with those changes. How do the marines beat Riptides and WKs?

The new dwarf boat looks like a noisemarine gun.

>How do the marines beat Riptides and WKs?
>Remove WK
>Remove RT

Sure, take away the other half of the Raven Guard special rules after they already lost their strongest one while White Scars get to keep it without it even being a Chapter Tactic.

What else beats Riptides and WKs besides other Riptides and WKs?

>Raven Guard
literally who?

>Remove Stormsurge
>Remove Flyrant
>Remove Imperial Knight
>Remove Magnus
>Remove Guilliman
>Remove Gargantuan Creatures
>Remove grav

Deal.

Not bolt pistols dummy, the ones they have to buy. Grav, plas, inferno.

On that note, let at least Salamanders have inferno pistols, hand flamers and heavy flamers.

Yeah, now you have to actually try when you play marines, you can't just swamp the board with everything obsec and win.

I should have mentioned this too, but I thought it would go without saying: no faction edit should be done in a vacuum, because that's how power creep happens. So Tzeentch Daemons, CWE (and now Ynaari), Death Guard, potentially R&H would all need nerfs too.

This. Well, maybe not remove, but push their points costs up by a lot (at least 2.5x for Wraithknight) take them out of all the formations they're in. CAD or you can't use them.

GC as a unit class could use changes as well.

>Yeah, now you have to actually try when you play marines

Too bad uncheesy marines are literally shit. "Try".

>Remove Guilliman

how about you remove yourself

>implying Battle Company isn't "slowly get tabled" the army

You're fucking bad.

>Not bolt pistols dummy

Then don't leave information out of your post like a dipshit next time.

Guilliman the Chaos Deleter

Marine bikes in general are good. IH Command Squad bikers are fucking dumb, DW bikers are annoying harassment units that can catch people in melee. Even without chapter tactics, current gravbike spam is good.

Hell, World Eater, NL, Cyclopia Cabal bikers, all good, or at least playable and slightly beneficial.

And the only other factions you didn't mention (who use bikes) were Orks and... I guess Necrons and Tzeentch have "jetbikes."

Dark Angels literally replaced C:SM as top army. Vanilla didn't even top 8 LVO 2017. Top armies are currently

1st: Eldar
2nd: Tzeentch Daemons
3rd: Tau
4th: Dark Angels
5th: Codex: Space Marines

You could avoid most of this by just making "No LoW choices" a game type.

>all these bikes that have all these extra bonuses are good

And the other 20 chapters who don't get bike bonuses? How are those? We see so many Executioners and Black Templars bikes dominating right?

Think.

Don't be a fucking retard. Why the fuck would he be talking about bolt pistols?

Because Gabriel Seth and Dante are so OP?

>And the only other factions you didn't mention
>Deldar
>Harliquin
>Scout bikes
>Squats

>not wanting to play an army of 24 point gunslingers

No one plays those chapters at the high-tier competitive level anyways. But if the average BT player used gravbikes in the average competitive LGS meta, it wouldn't be a waste of points (unless their whole meta was armorless daemons or some such).

Squats are fucking back

now where is the fucking army supplement

I assumed Deldar and Harlequins were part of Eldar.

Both of their jetbike units are extremely fast, and are now broken thanks to Soulburst.

>he said as if that would have been less retarded than the rest of his post

>These armies are already uncompetitive so let's nerf them the hardest

You should work at GW.

>But if the average BT player used gravbikes in the average competitive LGS meta, it wouldn't be a waste of points (unless their whole meta was armorless daemons or some such).

Why the fuck would BT pay that many points for NERFED bikes shooting NERFED grav guns you fucking dipshit?

Apparently, why else did GW put them in that slot?

Even though they were now Lords of War, they knew in their hearts they could never be Marneus Calgar.

>all dark eldar are now Yneed

fuck off

You mean Adarki Aeldari

hey man, listen, I've played like 5 games now in my Tau only meta, so I think I know what I am talking, stop arguing with my objectively correct re-balances to the game.

I was talking about the present, un-nerfed state of the game.

You may have missed the part where I said "buff most of the chapter tactics." That would include Black Templars, and basically all of them except IH, UM and WS.

You may also have missed the part where they get Rites of War.

You might have further missed the part where their vets get a cost reduction.

You may also have forgotten the bit where they could get IC apothecaries to join their blobs (though in BT's particular case that might be better solved if Grimaldus could join units with his Cenobytes, and if their chapter tactics or RoW let them get close-up).

I did not

Ok guys, so here is how you fix space marines:

remove all non-space marines

tell that to GW

>buffing chapter tactics instead of properly balancing the units

Should probably just remove CT and go back to 5E style

Back then Whirlwinds actually saw play.

>You might have further missed the part where their vets get a cost reduction.

Because making marines more hordey is the solution. Since when has points reduction EVER been the proper move? Fucking never, that's when.

>GW squats fantasy so hard the squat themselves materialise in it

>changing points costs on overcosted units?
>NEVER!

>have only one codex (Space Marines)
>Only difference between 'factions' is chapter tactics and special characters

Balanced!

>we will give you Squats but the price is the Old World.

>implying there has ever been a 40k general without at least one person telling GW to fuck off.

I thought I just did

So played my first game against a friends orks allied with skitarii as my tau. I got absolutely bodied. Had fun but holy Shit did I overestimate my own shooting and underestimate his ability to haul ass.

He drops a skitarii maniple and cad of orks (14 boyz on bikes with pain boy and warboss on bikes) and 3 trukks full of boyz. I deploy closer to my table edge in cover to get as much time to shoot as possible. His bikes move 24 inches and get a 3+ jink (that because orks and twin linked basically has no downside) and moves the trukks up the flanks. He scout moves with the skitarii and gives +3 BS (holy fucking Christ). Dune crawler deletes squad of pathfinders, vanguard pull down my infiltrated stealth suits (-1 cover save and tad rifles are no joke) and his sniper pens my devilfish.

My turn, all my shooting is wasted on horrible rolls, even with marker light support I rolled well below average and he was making save rolls left and right. Ended up exploding a trukk and killing a few boyz.

His turn tied my big units up in assault and that was pretty much the end game, I didn't think he would be in my Shit that quickly and my poor rolls made it so I never stood a chance.

/blog

>lowering point costs on elite units instead of just making the units worth their points

You're retarded and the reason why the game is currently Apocalypse levels at 1850. 1500 points used to buy you 20 marines, 5 terminators, a razorback, and a predator.

- Pathfinders
- Devilfish
- Stealth Suits
+ Riptides

There, he will never beat you again.

What if we made them worth their points... by lowering their point cost so what they did was worthwhile for what you paid?!

Snark aside, what would you change to make current Marine vets worth what they are?

I brought a riptide and ghostkeek both of which killed like 5boyz and a trukk. I failed 4 2+ saves with the riptide.

A supremacy armor would not have saved my poor rolling

The vast majority of bitching is bitching that marines will now get shit on by other degenerate builds like summon spam, suit spam, and scatbike spam, beacuse if a codex isn't degenerate it's not playable.

You don't make them worth their points cost by lowering their points cost, you just change their points cost to reflect their current worth. You never changed their worth relative to their starting point.

Fail logic.

-Get more Riptides.
-Field Riptide Wings.

Name something that's not Orks or Tyranids that doesn't shit on a marine CAD full of power armor without grav or cheese.

> Squats got Squatted
> Warhammer Fantasy itself got squatted
> Age of Sigmar happens, some Dawi show up
> 1 year later..
> Geedubs releases Squats for Age of Sigmar.
> It's literally Dawi in Power Armour

UREM BIZOL UDOZ, NANOTH OKIL OTHIL, GUZIL ZAMAM. NAZ-OKON AROL DELER LAM, AKUR AKIR AKAM.

AKUR AKIR AKAM.

And the vast majority of your changes fail to understand that marines are literally shit, EXCEPT for bikes, grav, and formation. And guess what, that's all you see in the competitive marine lists. You'd think a human being with an IQ above 50 would see the connection.

Imperial Guard without FW, Sisters of Battle, Dark Eldar, Necrons outside Decurion, non top-three CSM Traitor Legions, non-Tzeentch daemons.

...what?

>marine veterans are overpriced relative to their actual value
>therefore their cost needs to be adjusted downwards
>so we're going to lower the point cost and give them an optional, priced buff.

The above is exactly what I did. Marine vets, per model, would cost at minimum 3 points less, at most 1 point less if they take 2 buffs. Furthermore, the cost of upgrading them would be reduced.

I'm unsure what your point is. Just fishing for (you)s?

First off, the guy you replied to wasn't the OP of the changes ('twas I).

Secondly, my whole point is to remove the currently broken shit and allow marines to be competitive by:

1. reducing point costs for vets
2. more options all around
3. "Rite of War"-style FOC mods
4. keep their ATSKNF and include helpful line-holding/scoring stuff in those FOCs
5. Buff chapter tactics that need it
6. nerf the other top tier shit

first for literally every faction is for autists

So did anyone else hear about the breaking news from GW for the US today? For those that didn't, later this year GW is finally going to allow vendors to sell GW products online with a normal shopping cart experience, provided that the vendors have a brick and mortar store and do not sell for more than a 15% discount.

This is huge. GW is going back on a business decision they made in 2003.

I for one am looking forward to be able to order online AND support my FLGS at the same time, but at the same time this could be bad for all the shady ebay vendors who will now have to compete with legit stores.

Well it kinda would be
Or at least all the Marines would be on equal ground innit
I personally think modelling and painting should be what distinguishes chapters from each other with rules so far behind that they haven't even observed Cadia exploding yet

Who do you think the next daemon primarch to be released for 40k will be??

Leman Russ.

Fulgrim.

Squats are fucking back

This is why no one takes anons serious on this general or GW comments section

I suspect this could lead to some very good sales in the beginning. All the new web stores will rush to try to gain market share.

Does this mean that Australians like myself can buy from the US again?

technically you can now, but stores are not allowed to have a shopping cart. Right now you have to call up the store or order through a spread sheet, like if it was the 90s still.

What are the odds of the new Sky Dorfs being written in to the 40K universe?
The fanbase is rabid right now.

Either Fulgrim or Mortarion with their respective cult units, then Angron+cults and fourth either Fulgrim or Mortarion if they weren't chosen for the second release.

I have the 3rd edition rule book, you're fucking mad if you think that army costs anywhere near 1500 points.

Unlikely, but it might get them a skitarii/GSC release if they're lucky enough.

That will definitely rustle the SoB players jimmies

UCAT UDIR UCAT UMOM, OTIN NETAK OTIN NASHON, OR DEB AVUZ, RASH NUMOL LIBASH THOL!

RASH NUMOL LIBASH THOL!

OTIN NETAK OTIN NASHON, UCAT UDIR UCAT UMOM, OR DEB AVUZ, RASH NUMOL LIBASH THOL!

RASH NUMOL LIBASH THOL!

UCAT UDIR UCAT UMOM, ABOD BER, OTIN NETAK OTIN NASHON, ABOOD BER, OR DEB AVUZ RASH NUMOL LIBASH THOL!

RASH NUMOL LIBASH THOL!

silly user, none of those count!

Only SM, Eldar and Tau count!

Why do snipers and barrage not have pinning anymore?