40k: Guess that Statline!

Now that we have some basis for Reference, Let's all play a little game, shall we? One in which we attempt to guess what kind of Statlines our favorite units are provided.

For example, the Leman Russ no longer has rear armor, but is expected to be tough and durable and cheap. But something's gotta give: It can't be good at everything. So I suspect a low Armor save, but high Toughness and Wounds.

M6, WS-, BS4+, S-, T10, W16, A-, Ld 7, Sv. 4+

Yes. A 4+ Save. That's our critical weakness as opposed to rear armor. Or so I guess...

T10, W16, so you would need 48 Lascannon Hits to kill it?

Thats assuming lascannons dont do serveral wounds per hit

At Str.9 AP2, I'm betting on the Lascannon doing a solid 6 or 7 wounds per shot.

Knowing gw it will be d6 adding another point of failure when dealing damage.

Rubric Marines will hopefully be something like:

M 5, WS 3+, BS 3+, S 4, T 4, W 2, A 1, Ld 9 Sv 3+

With the 4++ intact and rend -3 instead of AP3.

Looks good to me, or maybe bring something from the past and have them move 4" but the Sorcerer gives them purpose, mso 6" while he's alive.

Khorne Berzerkers:
M 8 WS 2+ BS 3+ S 4 T 4 W 2 A 2 Ld 9 Sv 3+

Feel No Pain. Mark of Khorne is now +1A which is already added. Furious Charge stays the same.

I don't think they'll be rend -3. That's some serious bullshit. In sigmar you're damn happy to get -1. -2 is pretty damn uncommon. I can't see them being -3.

we'll have to see what bolters are like when they do the weapons preview

It wouldn't make sense if they weren't. 40k's AP system is deeply entrenched and you need to create some sort of equivalent that's better.

Not just talking about Rubrics here (if they aren't AP3 equivalent then you're getting rid of most of their schtick), but you can't seriously expect a lascannon to only reduce a save by 1, for example. They already said weapons will behave more like the fluff.

I would expect a lascannon to be 3s or 4s personally. Ap3 I could see being -2 maybe.

Plague Marines:
M 5 WS 3+ BS 3+ S 4+ T5 W 2 A 1 Ld 9 Sv 3+

I have a sneaking suspicion FnP will be replaced with an extra wound for these dudes. Gotta sell dem new models bro

Doesn't make sense. If they're seriously pushing "fluff is the metric by which weapons will behave" then Rubric bolters will melt marines.

-2 would still massively reduce their survivability. Just accept your meme shit legion ain't all that and get over your misconception.

We'll know in a few hours I guess.

Everything in the Tyranid codex: exactly the same as before. Maybe a few lower numbers. It's fair because they don't have to worry about initiative anymore!
Also, tyranid fliers get nerfed heavily, and so does the pyrovore.
Cruddace knows what's best for the Tyranids, after all!
muh bugs, muh poor poor bugs


what time does warhammer community put it's articles up?

No clue honestly, but I found out the article at around 7pm british time and I saw no-one talk about it on Veeky Forums aside from one post at about 6:25 british time.

Safe to say around 6?

M 5/6 WS 4+ BS 4+ S 3 T 3 W 1 A 1 Ld 6 Sv 5/6+
Add 1 to BS for vets, maybe +1 Ld too if we're lucky.

Battle Sister
M5 WS4+ BS3+ S3 T3 W1 A1 Ld7 Sv3+

M5 WS 3+ BS 3+ S3 T3 W1 A2 Ld8 Sv3+

M6 WS4+ BS3+ S3 T3 W1 A2 Ld7 Sv5+

Penitent Engine
M6 WS4+ BS4+ S6 T6 W8 A4 Ld7 Sv4+

He even LOOKS like someone who'd take a steaming dump on other people's fun for no good reason.

>all tyranid MCs 5 inch movement speed because hurr durr large things move slowly hurrr
>all tyranid armor 4+ or worse
>tyranids may only use the Hive Mind psychic power list, which sucks dick
>tyranid MCs have worse S/T/W than the Dreadnought

>can't be having Xenos being better than spess mahreens, now can we?

Prepare your anus for a 4th edition of disappointment, lads.

Of course their armor is worse and their MCs are worse than vehicles, why would squishy flesh be better than strong metal?
Don't forget about instictive behaviours! Having multiple kinds was deemed Too Much, so now it's just one chart! Guess which one

Look I dig that you've been the butt boys for a while, but couldn't you at least try to dig up some optimistism instead of being bitter cunts?

Not while Cruddace is still the 'Tyranid Expert'

im asuming ap 4 becomes -1 ap3 is -2 ap2 is -3 ap1 -4

Fire Warriors
M 5" WS 4+ BS 4+ S 3 T 3 W 1 A 1 Ld 7 Sv 4+

XV8 Crisis Battlesuit
M 10" WS 4+ BS 4+ S 5 T 4 W 3 A 2 Ld 8 Sv 3+

they're going to be -3 because they're currently ap3 you dumb gook

bolters will be rend 1

ap1 is going to be a fat meme like -6

Try WS 6+, 5+ at best.

We already have confirmation that Hormogaunts will be one of the fastest things on two legs. I'm cautiously optimistic.

>Fire Warrior
>Ld 7

Technically the old armor save modifiers were based on the strength of the weapon.

S4 is -1
S5 is -2
S6 is -3
S7 is -4
S8 is -5
S9 is -6
S10 is -7

The higher modifiers matter because you could get your save to 1+ because of it, and rolls of 1 always still failed. So what was the point of a 1+ save? To ignore -1 save modifiers of course

Not sure if they will be using this system.

All the better to get out of synapse range and eat themselves.

Fire warriors still hit pretty much everything on 4+ unless theyre grots or really good in melee.

Fire warriors are leadership 7, bro. The shas'ui made them 8

Kalabite Warriors

M8, WS4, BS4, S3, T3, W1, A1, L6, S5+

This is the new edition. My guess is Ld 4 or 5

When the tac marine only got bumped down from 8 to 7, you think fire warriors should get bumped from 7 to 4? I'm willing to think 6. Fire warriors are very disciplined. Having only a slightly lower leadership than space marines was always their thing.

My guess is that And They Shall Know No Fear is gone and marines have a higher leadership to compensate.

I'm betting atsknf will change to something like a 4+ save against models running from battleshock

>standard infantry
m8, no

you're going to get WS5+ you dirty blue rapist

Sure, let's give a martially disciplined race bread entirely for battle a shitty to-hit. Because... right... Veeky Forums hates tau.

Tau famously suck in battle not because of ws2, but because they were s2. ws2 really only meant they hit on 4+ against most shit unless it was a literal murder death kill rape unit, and most units hit them on 3+.

Initiative is gone though, so they don't have a melee weakness outside of WS.

>so they don't have a melee weakness outside of WS.

Fire warriors are str 3 and crisis suits are 5.

>bread entirely for battle

but that's wrong you fucking retard.

You're not space marines.

Nor are you Orks or Tyranids.

You're Tau.

Oh you poor poor idiot. I feel sorry for ignorance. Oh what bliss must your life be.

You're talkin out your ass of course so am I but...fuck off i'm right!. Just watch I'm calling it, no way in hell they are -3.

>And They Shall Know No Fear is gone
As much as I despise the rule for what it does, I do not expect it to go away, brought in line with this edition but that's it.

Reroll to battleshock is my guess. Makes them less prone to chip damage, but large casualties will still hurt them.

As another user has said, I expect it to be a save against the battleshock losses

I really hope they won't use that system because terminators would be useless.

they would have to be 3-4 times the price of a standard marines if thats the case,douchebag

They confirmed that the terminators have additional special rules to rise their survivability

So you gi by the fluff ?
Just so you know, in close combat a Catachan (Schwarzeneggers on average) should absolutely destroy Tau, like 1v3 EZ, Like Cakewalk kidsgame EZ.
Keep that in mind when you want to make Tau OP.

I would play this shit out of those penitent engines.

Though I'd lean towards M6 (Like space marines) being the default for them. The are power armoured.

M6 Battle Sister/Celestian, M7 Repentia M7/8 for the Penitent Engine.

I feel they'll keep it simple and have Termi saves max out at 5+ to simulate the old invo.

If they do the same for Iron Halo/Aura of Dark Glory/Sigil of Corruption I'd be happy with that.

Tau hit your army of shwartzeneggers on 4+, and wounded them on 4+. Meanwhile the shwatzeneggers got to hit first on 3+ and wound on 4+. Keep that in mind when you mention that being op, because them hitting shwatzeneggers on 4+ is not what made them op.

For an army of soldiers more trained and disciplined than your average guardsman, I don't think it necessary to give them a ws5+. That's conscript territory

Tau have always been shit at melee.

It's not unreasonable to translate WS2 to 5+ as that's what BS2 translates to.

>That's conscript territory

That's also where Tau at in the WS category.

But you go by the fluff user-kun.
Having them hitting on 4+ wont get tge catachan to 1v3.

Tau player BTFO. Youll be 5+ and thats it.
Fluff has no impact on the game.

ws 2 you fucking retard, stop being dumb

Don't worry, I'm screencapping all this for when their stats are finally revealed and they get a ws4+

You have fun with that you salty autist

Why would Tau, a faction well known for not only thinking melee is for idiots but for also being very bad at it be WS4+? That would put them along people like Sisters of Battle.

Sure thing, man. Whatever you say.

Do you promise to post the cap evenif you are wrong, thus proving you are a gracious loser?

They used to hit on a 4+ only because the old WS chart was retarded, so even a drooling retard without training could hit a marine on a 4+

Get ready to see FW WS 5+ and drones WS 6+

>claims tau arte mighty warriors
>get BTFO by 3 people

>Mighty Warriors

Its pretty funny

>Mighty Warriors
>WS 5+

Include me in the screen cap!

That's not actually that bad. Pretty much the same, and with the new Ld tests Ld 6 isn't as bad as it was.

I hope we get to keep platoons though....I just finished building my 3rd...

My guess was based on them just copying the stat line from SW:A, which seems in character to me.

In SWA scions hellguns don't have -3. In 40k they are ap3. Therefore if we follow SWA rubrics will not have -3.

Dark Eldar Raider:

M12 WS- BS3+ S- T6 W8 A- Ld7 Sv. 4+


M12 = Dark Eldar are meant to be fast, we are not fast currently, just middling.

WS- = Self explanatory.

BS3+ = What we have now, and have always had.

S- = Self explanatory.

T6 = S6 currently glances raiders on a 4+, I think they will remain like this.

W8 = Seems to be the equivalent of 3 hull points. I could see them booting it down to 6 though, which I would be ok with.

A- = Self explanatory.

Ld7 = It's crewed by Kabalites.

Sv. 4+ = What we get 99% of the time from cover anyway.

>I hope night shields make you ignore save modifiers.

We aren't talking about Scion hellguns though, we're talking about Inferno Bolts.
And Inferno Bolts are -3 to rend in SW:A.

So, in AoS whoever gets the charge strikes first. As a salty ork player I heavily approve of this, as I'm assuming that 8th edition is going to use AoS rulebase. My question is what happens afterwards?

>Unit who initially charged will keep striking first?
>Both units start attacking each other simultaneously?
>You do a roll off?
>Whoever has higher movement speed starts striking first in the following rounds of combat?

SW Blood Claws

M6 WS3+ BS4+ S4 T4 W1 A1 Ld6 Sv. 3+

>M6 S4 T4 W1 Sv. 3+
Like a generic marine

>WS3+ BS4+
They currently have 3 on both, but fick you, if vanilla scouts are WS 4 they should have it too. Lower BS or should it be called higher, now? to make them less versatile than the Grey Hunters

But with some kind of special rule that works like Rage

To represent their lower training and impulsiveness

I think that vehicles will still have Str values. For ramming (Which will likely be the melee attack). Getting run over by a land raider is a bit scarier than a land speeder.

In AoS it doesn't work that way. The players whose turn is running chooses a unit to attack with and do it, then the opponent chooses another unit and attack with it, than it's the first player turn again until all the unit have attacked. So potentially a unit could attack first while its opponent unit is the last one to attack that turn

In 8th edition the charging unit goes first every turn, but in the following turns the opponent can use command points, that are rewarded depending on how you built your army, to reverse the order and attack first

>In 8th edition the charging unit goes first every turn, but in the following turns the opponent can use command points, that are rewarded depending on how you built your army, to reverse the order and attack first

Ouch. So charging is SUPER important.

I would kinda like to see a couple of units (Those chainsaw bayonets of the Sisters seem a good example) that have skills or weapons that reverse the usual order to make them real prickly bastards to charge.

>vehicles charging is now just a melee attack
that's actually pretty elegant. They go first anyway, the enemy can attack and you can differentiate. I like it.


M6+d6 WS4+ BS2+ S6 T6 W12 A1 Sv2+/3++

I wouldn't be surprised if Dark Eldar get stuff to make them do more on a charge.

So you'd get something like:

>Crew's Blades(It's open topped, they can just stab you): 5 attacks at Str 3
>Biggass Pointy Bits: 5 attacks at Str 6 -2 Rend. Can only use on the charge.

Just throwing numbers as examples, not actual predictions.

BS 2+? That seems a bit too high. That's the BS that turned up on primarch in the examples. It's got the same BS 3 as most tau models.

I'd lean towards WS 5+ (It is WS 2) and BS4+

Said WS attack still likely hurts like hell if it hits but it's not exactly a melee monster.

Ork Kill-Ram
Giant woodchippers mounted on their vehicles
the possibilities are endless.

Plus marker lights will probably continue to be a thing.

Fair enough. I was just thinking in terms of ap conversions, which is how it had been phrased initially. Dude said Ap 3 would = -3. Since he quoted SWA I brought up the only thing I knew in SWA that had AP3 in regular 40k.

Or this old classic.

Trying to do AP conversions based on SW:A doesn't seem like it'd be all that fruitful, seeing how things that are AP 3 in 40k can be anything between -2 to -4 rend.

But looking at specific individual examples can probably give us some idea at least.

so if a lascannon is a d6, then what the hell is a basilisk (or any other pie plate weapon) gonna do??

2d6? 4d3?

It'll probably be d6 wounds per model like destroyer weapons rather than d6 per unit though.

Likely less than a lascannon. It's a less focused weapon.

Maybe d3 per model?

lascannons are D6 damage with a -6 save mod in shadowwar

Lascannon causes multiple wounds to a single target hit. Big blasts causes cause multiple hits to a unit, but less wounds per model hit.

It's not a new concept.