It's simple. We kill the Fetchlands

Stop trying to make fetchban happen. It's not going to happen.

Good thing mine are chinamen's work.

Maybe if Knightfall were oppressive that might be considered. But, it's... you know. Not.

As someone who has a good amount of Fetchlands I have to agree with the OP. When you consider the logic that Wizards has placed on banning stuff like Top, Preordain, Brainstorm or anything that makes decks too "consistent"; I would put Fetchlands at the absolute top of that list.

Brainstorm isn't banned and preordain is out just to limit the amount of 1 mana cantrips

I think the trend really is that they reprint these OP hard to obtain, expensive as fuck cards; making it easier to obtain and play the op decks. Now more people show up to tournaments with these decks, and instead of suggesting players adapt, and build counters to these decks, they just straight out ban them.

>tfw about to pick up a set of Chinaman ABU duals, LEDs, FoWs and Wastelands.
Just try to stop me from making whatever Legacy deck I want, Wizards.

I think there's an argument to be made for sure, especially in modern. Fetchlands are really consistant, and they have all sorts of random synergies like dryad arbor in response to lilliana -2.
I think a fetchland ban would be actually retarded, and printing better LD would fix that, but hey, new players hate LD.

Pls redpill me on the chinaman, how good is he?

What about just printing Stifle in Modern?

>/r/bootlegmtg

No arguments here, that would be great.

I don't think WotC wants to make blue relevant unfortunately.

Wot C only bans cards if

1- it enables a degenerate combo deck. Amulet Bloom and Storm are examples. They always ban the enableing cards, like Summer Bloom and Preordain to neuter the deck, but not kill it outright.

2- If a single deck has too large a meta share. Eldrazi or Copy Cat are examples here. The decks are literally too strong to not play and 35-40% meta share is overwhelming.

3- A deck is a problem for R&D moving forward, like Birthing Pod. Instead of having to always worry about how strong a new card interaction would be, they again ban the enabling card.

Fetches only enable strong, consistent mana bases, which WotC doesn't care about, and in fact encourage. 4 color mana bases lead to strong creature games which are "more exciting" to watch on stream. Also, time should not be an issue. Shuffling your deck should take 30 seconds or less, so even if each player fetches twice per game (which is pretty average), that's only 2 minutes per game, 6 minutes per match, leaving 40 minutes or so for actual playing.

Tl;dr: Fetches are fine, stop being pussies.

>kill fetchlands
>frontier

Depends on the card itself.
From my experience:
Wooded Foothills, Cavern of souls, damnation, Lili, Tarmo, that enchantment that shits out faeries, the old duals, stomping ground and Wasteland were perfect.

The others ranged from meh to shit.

What about the prices? Cavern of Souls for example.

2.50 each more or less, the more you buy less they cost. Comparing two fakes and a real one.

They should be reprinted ostensibly, though. Having to pay hundred of dollars for your manabase is beyond stupid.

Just print them every standard set in the Rare or even Mythic slot but ban them from the Standard format.

Does having English Caverns of Souls among all your Spanish cards make people suspicious at all?

You can fuck right off with your opinion.

Nah, everybody here has mixed languages in their decks. Some people are purists but most will buy just the cheapest ones.

I do agree with you, I think they should print the ever-loving crap out of them. However, WotC has to pander to large buyers of their sealed product, like StarCity Games, and those companies have to make a profit.

Should there be some price barrier for entry? Probably. It ensures that only people serious about the game will get into higher levels of play.

Now, are prices outrageous? Absolutely. Price barrier should only be so high. Probably around $500 should get you 90% of format staples for whatever former you pick.

Don't let shitty camera phone pics fool you user.

Which chinaman are we talking about though? Is it this guy? youtube.com/watch?v=70cbNJrs2Xw

They all just buy and resell their stuff, just find your favorite one on AliExpress

Yeah they won't pass if you try to sell them as the real deal, but playing them double-sleeved? Nobody in a year and a half has ever noticed

But SCG would still make a profit. They also profit from selling, say, Felidar Guardian before it was banned.

And if manabases in modern are accessible, the format would be played more, and the increased demand would keep prices decent. Even if they were ostensibly printed, Fetches would probably never run lower than 5 bucks.

And again, more players in the format moves the other cards, like Snapcasters, etc.

Yeah I wanted to know which ones you have good experience with so I don't buy something chock full of typos and obvious flaws.

Star City Trading (gotta love these unimaginative fucks) on AliExpress.

Its all chinese. You have to buy the most expensive stock they offer or they will basically put it on printer paper with 0 effort. Even with the good stock its going to be hit or miss. If it turns out to be shit theyll tell you if you wanted the cards to look real then you should have bought real cards. Its laughable when people post their fakes, say theyre fake, and when someone points out that there are blatent flaws like glossiness or discoloration, they get really defensive. If you keep your fakes under wraps its likely nobody will notice. If it is, you got scammed and need to feign outrage.

They're all going to have obvious flaws, if you're buying fake cards its unavoidable. If you think your LGS is autistic enough to call your ass out don't buy them. Across a table, double sleeved someone may not notice but if put to any scrutiny, especially with a real copy on hand, modern cards are fairly easy to distinguish from fakes in person.

I want to buy some expensive shit like Cavern of Souls and Plateau for my EDH deck, it's not going to be used competitively.

People have tuned decks to the point that they only run 1 or 2 of any given dual anyway. Taking away fetches will only drive the price of the duals up higher since people will need more copies to compensate. However, this is assuming the meta will still try to force multicolored decks. It's very well possible we could see a return to the days of more focused mono colored decks that don't want to fuss with an unpredictable land base.

Those two are good from my experience, also playing EDH? Nobody will notice.

Try emailing this dude: youtube.com/watch?v=ViqFftc4Jw8

Afaik all the best shops atm are just resellers of VZ or BL stuff.

Kill fetch lands AND this idea of Frontier.

Now we're talking!

I heard Chinaman had a harsh dip in quality a few months ago. Did he actually recover?

This, unfortunately. The day fakes become actually good is the day Moder and Vintage go up in flames, but that day is not today

Really? I haven't bought from them in a year, but I was hoping for them to improve their fakes.

instead of banning cards they just need to print more hosers

In all honesty, as long as you double sleeve or use double matte sleeves, you're never going to get found out unless they desleeve the card. Even deck checks at GPs and Pro-tour qualifiers are just making sure the cards in your deck match the list you submitted, and even then you only have to worry about that if you're a top 8 candidate.
Hell, at the FNM level you can easily get away with a high-quality printing carefully cut out and glued to another card. Think about it like this - how often is someone going to carefully look at a card you're playing?

The only time I have an issue with proxies is when people who know they have fake shit try to sell or trade it as the real deal.

Keep your shitty cards to ccg

>They finally got rid of the cancer.
>supporting the ban
Please go back to Hearthstone.

no

I have a better idea for a card:
Cost: 0
Sacrifice this, you win the game

that doesn't seem very balanced

>they/their
>until end of turn
>{T}1B
Please, at least learn the proper formatting.

t. Can't afford fetchlands

I agree, it should give you free mana and tutor for a counterspell on cast

>Frontier
Sorry dude, it's going the way of tiny leaders.

The only worthwhile fakes are the fetches. The ABUR duals are obvious as fuck, and people don't bother to weather those fuckers.

that seems like it would be even less balanced

>tutor for a counterspell on cast
Then people could counter it before the tutor trigger resolves, it should at least have split second too.

Marsh flats sucks tho.

Twin and Top weren't "problematic" and there was no buzz to ban Twin.

>Better than goblin guide
>A pinger that cant kill creatures

You suck at this.

I mean, god forbid people aren't able to get whatever colour of mana they want so they can play their 'Jeskai Black' 4-colour goodstuffs unmolested.

>No buzz to ban twin
This was during that period that they were just banning things that got above a certain percentage of played decks. Birthing pod got the same treatment.

Unlikely, beyond the monocolored decks already present. But we'll see more two color decks and less three color decks, in all likelihood. Not by a huge margin, but the change will be there.

it's not a pinger it's an aristocrat. and the minotaur could always be bumped down to a 1/2 or costed at 1R.

people always take card concepts too specifically instead of looking at the idea.

Birthing pod was actually a somewhat problematic card unlike twin though.

>aristocrat
it's really more of a syphoner. the aristocrats are the sac outlets in their namesake deck.

The spirit has no clause against "fail to find" so it is either drain one or swing two. It would be better if it was you searching but then it doesnt do anything. An aristocrat is a creature that sacrifices for a positive, temporary effect

Birthing pod was huge because it was a toolbox but the deck was plagued with issues with consistency if it faced hate. It was played around 30% of one GP if I remember correctly but it didnt get a disproportionate amount of top 8 spots.

It's still a problematic card that only gets better with every good creature they print. Not only that but the consistent toolbox approach is kind of busted. I liked pod as much as the next guy but it had to go.

Hmm if only there was a way to make more cards that hose ETB effects! Hmm...

>implying that they would ever print something for modern
>implying they would hose Timmy's epic etb
Ebin

I just shed a single tear.

Holy shit stop using Timmy as a scapegoat for ANYTHING
ETB creature's are spike's fetish if anything

Really, Timmy would be more excited by something with a big on-upkeep effect.
Who cares about getting something ONCE when you can get it EVERY TURN?

Spike's fetish would be a turn 1 mana dork, turn 2 eldritch into a hatebear that stops the most wide-spread deck in the meta.

No, Spike's real fetish is a single card, and that's Fact or Fiction

Yeah, make Staying Power a legal card.

Unhinged had some broken cards

I would shed no tears at a fetch ban, mostly because perfect mana + constant shuffling is a delightful recipe for pure cancer. However, a ban would be a really dumb idea, as by now they are a part of the image of eternal formats. Banning fetches is an idea as dumb as banning FoW in legacy, ie it would immediately cut interest in the format into a fraction of what it was, and tournament attendance would plummet. I would love to live in a world with no fetches, but that's just not a feasible idea. If you want a format without fetches, you're stuck with standard, which may finally be not-terrible again with the damn cat gone.

If fetchlands are hit out out of modern the sheer amount of asshurt may actually end the game. It's not quite like Legacy where a T1 and smaller more irrelevant decks are dead, every single manabase in a competitive modern deck is now gone, and people easily spend ~300 dollars on manabases alone.

underrated post

Not a single Frontier side event has fired at GPs since they became an option.
Paper Pauper and Duel Commander are more real than Frontier.

The day fakes become good they'll be sold as real cards, Chinese aren't retarded, they won't sell you a 100% passing Black Lotus for $2

Why don't you have people to be able to play 4c funstuff other than you yourself not having a good manabase and being a poorfag?
The new CEO wants Magic to be an esport in the near future and being able to cast your shit is way more exiting to watch than losing to being mana/colorscrewed.

It won 5/6 Modern Pro Tours. It was better than Miracles was in Legacy.

Neat, I'll run panoramas instead then...

why not? Nobody will buy them if they sell them at market price for the real card, thats retarded. They might increase the price a bit, but cards are dirt cheap for them to produce. They'll be making money anyway, there is no need to gouge their consumers and risk people going somewhere else

Fetchlands are cancerous. I don't even care about removing them from old formats, but when wotc makes their "post-modern" format in a few years (as stated by multiple wotc employees) they won't be included.

They're extremely powerful, so most players will immediately throw a fit about losing them, but now that top is gone they're the single worst card(s) for magic. They add far too much dead time to games and interact too well with too many mechanics.

If you can't admit they're more of a problem than a plus you're literally deluding yourself.

Don't be retarded.
Why would they sell 52k 100% passable Verdant Catacombs for $2M instead of $52K? Because they can and they're not retarded.
People buying fakes are not "their cosumers", they're a trash dump for the waste they produce while attempting to create forgeries that can be sold at full price.

>t. fags who don't have fetchlands
Go play Standard. Or does Evolving Wilds trigger you too?

eh, they are fine when the only things they can fetch out are basics. The problem is fetchable duals. If fetches said "basic island" instead of just island, or if no duals had basic land types, fetches would just be another dual land with a downside. As is, though, yes fetches are by far the most powerful land type in magic and probably should not exist. Unfortunately, older formats have completely warped around them to the point which I honestly have no idea what a modern/legacy would look like without fetches. I will also say that I think fetches were a mistake for power level reasons, not because fetching and shuffling takes too much time. Same thing with top, any competent player never went to time with top because they knew what the hell they were doing.

Have you been to thailand/vietnam/whatever other southeast asian shithole that sells counterfeits? Even the best fake rolex doesn't sell for the price of a rolex. Nobody will pay full price for a counterfeit when it costs the same as the real thing. That's the whole fucking point of a counterfeit

Shut up MaRo.

Because it's still sold as a fake.
It seems the one who hasn't had experience with forgery is you.
Everyone knows about the classic car clone market and a lot of collectors actually buy clones on purpose so they can drive them while leaving their invaluable originals safe at home. But nobody speaks about the modern car refactionary forgeries and how you might just be driving a car that's 80% fake while having paid for it as if it was original, untill you need to take it to the shop and get your insurance voided for driving with piracy.

Thats not the same at all. People buy fake magic cards because they are poor and can't afford real cards. They want specifically to pass them off as real. Nobody with a playset of underground seas is going to buy a playset of fakes just so they can leave their real ones at home.