MtG $$$$$$ COMPETITIVE $$$$$$ MODERN GENERAL

>pushes fair decks out
>promotes linear aggro
>no good way to hate it out
>not cancer

>Playing
Almost finished naya burn
>Brewing
Not brewing but considering going from naya to boros just to run a playset of lightning helix. But green gives destructive revelry so idk
>Metagame thoughts
Loving it
>Bans/unbans
Ban karn because fuck tron.
Urban bbe because it'd be funny.

Veeky Forums modern tournament when

(OP)
>Playing?
Mono green devotion
>Brewing?
Panharmoncon jank
>Metagame thoughts?
I just started. Tron is annoying but it's only 10% of my lgs
>Bans/Unbans?
I have no idea.

>no good way to stop Tron
>only strategy that can beat them is playing extremely fast aggro like Burn and Affinity
>sets a ceiling on the format, you have to go super low to the ground and beat them before they assemble their free win manabase
>even the decks that prey upon Tron/Cancer are starting to fall short with all the new goodies that were printed that slot into it
Hopefully Harsh Mentor can push it back down again but we'll have to see. Tron is the most degenerate cancerous deck in the format though, its not even hard to get it online either despite what babbies will tell you. If you start with even 1 piece in hand and a map you'll easily have it turn 4, two of the lands in hand can almost assure a turn 3 tron since between map and sylvan scrying thats 8 ways to find the other land not counting just naturally drawimg into it, then all you need is one of the many dumb payoff cards in hand and you are assured a win. I saw a game where a competent Jund player kept a good hand in the blind, his opponent was on Tron and didnt cast a single spell the entire game until turn 4 where he cast ONE fucking Ugin and won the game off that and no other spells.

Official unban tier lists

>Should Tier:
Green Sun's Zenith
Splinter Twin

>Could/Maybe Should Tier:
BBE
Dark Depths
Birthing Pod
Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Punishing Fire
Second Sunrise
Stoneforge Mystic
Umezawa's Jitte
Gitaxian Probe

>No Tier:
Artifact Lands
Blazing Shoal
Chrome Mox
Cloudpost
Dig Through Time
Dread Return
Eye of Ugin
Glimpse of Nature
Golgari Grave-Troll
Hypergenesis
Mental Misstep
Ponder
Preordain
Rite of Flame
Seething Song
Sensei's Divining Top
Skullclamp
Summer Bloom
Treasure Cruise

Fuck off. You don't speak for everyone. Especially with this pants on head tier list

How can you live being so incredibly wrong?

Not an argument

>GSZ
>should
>should maybe
>dark depths
>second sunrise
>jitte
>pod
>no
>preordain
How's that extra chromosome treating ya bucko?

...

>GSZ
Never happening
>Splinter Twin
Should but this would mean them admitting to a mistake so it wont
>BBE
Would be fine, might give normal Jund a resurgence. This is the most plausible unban and the one id like to see most.
>Dark Depths
Without meaningful land destruction or disruption this should stay banned. Its not the most broken thing on the list but its a strategy that is hard to fight.
>Birthing Pod
Not sure about this one
>JtMS
Yeah hes probably fine, a 4 mana walker isnt gonna make control good suddenly especially since tapping out turn 4 for a brainstorm or fateseal can easily be a death sentence against the aggressive decks in the format
>Punishing Fire
Would like to see this but I feel like its giving Jund way too much power. Maybe.
>Second Sunrise
No. Stupid 30 minute turn combo decks are annoying and unfun to sit across from. This can stay banned forever.
>Umezawa's Jitte
Way too good, completely warps the meta around it if it becomes legal. Never ever.
>Probe
Another no, gives too many free wins and takes the skill out of the game.

Saying, "Not an argument," is not an argument. Also, there's nothing to argue. That post was just objectively wrong.

Not an argument.

Id be fine with Blazing Shoal and Rite of Flame

Then you have no idea what you're talking about

This... Is a good idea.
Cockatrice?

Blazing Shoal is for Infect which is completely dead atm anyways. Rite of Flame is just because I want to play a Blood Moon deck thats actually decent.

>Using cockatrice when Xmage exists

>Playing?
U/W Merfolk
>Brewing?
Esper Delver, and if that fails, some form of Gifts
Some form of Death and Taxes, or maybe it will just turn into hatebears. Too Early to tell
>Metagame thoughts?
Control still sucks but i think the key is with decks like lantern and other Chalice decks. I would build Sun and Moon if i wasn't retarded and traded off almost all of my shocks
>Bans/Unbans?
Unban: Preordain, Second Sunrise. Maybe Glimpse and Twin if you're feeling crazy enough
Ban: SSG, Street Wraith, Ancient Stirrings
It doesn't matter though anyway because these changes will never happen anyway

Question for the thread though:
>What card sucks in modern that you really want to play with?
For me it's Gifts Ungiven

Too slow

What? The is the first I hear of this. If the opponent doesn't know how to skip worth a shit, then yeah no shit, same is true for MODO. That's why I host games at a 15min time limit.

>cockatrice

Ahahahaha no. Xmage is so vastly superior it's not even funny.

Why don't people run Heroic Intervention in Elves sideboard? It seems like the perfect answer to any sweeper the opponent sided in

POLL:
strawpoll.me/12888746

Ill play on Xmage. If we can get at least 6 people. Practice is always good.

>sets a ceiling on the format

I'm sorry, your durdley bullshit flavor of the week deck will never be good even if you had tron banned. Aggro is good because, surprise surprise, killing your opponent quickly is generally a good idea.

>Which card sucks that you want to play with?
Blood Moon, everyone says its an amazing card but the decks built around it suck ass

NuGideon is going to warp the format such that only tron or it are passable decks.

Eventually wizards will realize this, and ban tron, because it's keeping the truly good control decks that could fight gideon tribal out of the format

And finally, modern will be diverse and perfect.

Plus the small servers are usually never laggy

I play aggro so that argument doesnt work. It does set a ceiling on the format, decks like Abzan and Jund literally cannot beat Tron except through extreme luck.

So we have two so far, can we get at least two more?

>Birthing Pod

never
ever

>Other (Pls post) 1 vote

>Abzan and Jund literally cannot beat Tron except through extreme luck.

What? Why doesn't everyone play tron and aggro then? Why does anyone even bother with control or midrange?

Also
>inb4 b-but theres sideboard cards that you may not even see that dont actually stop them like Ghost Quarter and Ceremonious Rejection!
Only SB card that beats them is recurred Fulminators or Crumble and good luck getting to 4 lands for Crumble while they exile your lands with Karn.

Man do I love playing the Tron vs Junk matchup

RUG delver is the best blood moon deck. Don't let jerks tell you the deck is bad either

They don't. Do you even play modern? Most decks are tron variants are aggressive strategies

Rite of flame would push storm over the edge, never gonna happen. Just be happy with your turn to blood moons

Not on modo, but plenty of people play both jund and abzan at my shop

Because Jund/Abzan have good matchups against the aggro decks and a lot of combo like Scapeshift/Ad Nauseam thanks to hand disruption. Tron s not the only deck you'll play against but going up against it is an assured loss usually which is bullshit since it wasnt about skill it was about being matched against a deck like that, that preys on slower decks while also having decent game against everything else.
Ill elaborate on this further by saying that you can tune/make a deck to beat another deck usually, theres a guy at my LGS that has a hateboner for Burn and builds decks to beat it, but this comes at a cost of making your deck worse in the other matchups, notably in this example he generally wins against Burn because he has so many main and sideboard cards to fight it, however he usually never makes top 8 because he loses to every non Burn matchup because his decks arent constructed with a wide array of answers, the only answers he has are to Burn. With Tron this is not the case, the deck has a 90-10 win rate against any non fast aggro deck and still has game against Aggro thanks to chalice. Its a catch all deck that completely invalidates certain strategies because if you cant win before Ugin or Karn comes down then you cant win at all.

It costs a lot of money to switch. As the cost decreases (due to media format, such as Modo or xMage), the presence of tron jumps up huge amounts.

sfm won't be format warping but it may make non-green decks playing white better. If there's any problem it would be junk.

>Being this retarded two threads in a row

>Jund/Abzan have good matchups against the aggro decks and a lot of combo like Scapeshift

Pffffffffffthahahahhahaahaha
No

As someone who plays Jund and Titanshift, this is bullshit. Titanshift is a borderline unwinnable matchup

>the deck has a 90-10 win rate against any non fast aggro deck
This is a complete embellishment. I've been playing Esper Control for years and Tron is 70-30 in their favor at worst. It's closer to 50-50 now that they don't run Eye/Emrakul. I know it's harder for decks without Path and counterspells, but it's not completely unwinnable.

Basically Tron has no opportunity cost to having such a strong late game, there is no downside to playing cards that absolutely rape slower fair decks like All is Dust or Ugin other then a slight disadvantage against Aggro decks thats being shored up by Chalice. The reason I and most people have an issue with this is that it takes the player skill out of Magic, getting paired against Tron may as well just be recieving a game loss. It makes the game less about studying matchups, practicing, and playing tight and more about "Who did I get matched up with tonight?"

So assuming what you said is true, what exactly is the problem? Modern, regardless of what you play, is a pretty fast format. Doesn't some deck have to be the "cap" on the format? Even if you ban tron, something else will take its place and become hated, no?

Read this: mtggoldfish.com/metagame/modern#online

Affinity: 9%

Eldrazi Tron: 6%

Dredge: 6%

Storm: 5.5%

Burn: 5%

Death's Shadow: 5%

Notice anything?

All the decks in the 5%+ Range are either Tron, or fast aggro/combo.

>getting paired against Tron may as well just be recieving a game loss

Ah, so you're butthurt *and* bad. You make it sound like tron has a 90% win rate against the field, which it doesn't. Good luck out there kid.

No, the deck that goes the tallest in the format after Tron would be decks like Abzan or UW control playing stuff like Elspeth Suns Champion, but they have to have 6 lands in play to cast her not three. Tron should be banned for the same reason cloudpost is, fast mana is unhealthy for Modern. Karn is fair at 7 mana not at 3.

Not him, but my problem with tron is that by design, it is unfair and protected. Wizards, for retarded reasons, refuses to print good nonbasic land destruction. Wizards, for greedy as fuck reasons, refuses to print good planeswalker removal. Tron takes advantage of both of these, and as a combo deck, doesn't have to deal with removal as much as any other combo deck. If we got a wasteland reprint, or a Price of Progress reprint, or From the Ashes, or Ruination, I'd probably be fine with Tron.

Wait people are playing Storm again? What changed?

There are a number of decks that bukkake tron (affinity comes to mind), but any slightly more reactive deck is fighting up such a steep hill based on the completely undisruptable combo tron is able to assemble.

If you can't see that you might be a tron-baby.

Shadow is falling out of grace somewhat, which was a bad MU

Not butthurt, I play Burn so getting paired against Tron is usually just a free win, but again it doesnt feel good because it feels like getting a free win just for sitting down and getting paired against a certain deck, it doesnt feel like a battle like a matchup against Jund, Deaths Shadow, or Affinity can be. Overall id be fine with less free wins if it meant that Modern as a whole was healthier , even if my deck takes a dip in meta share because its "prey" is banned out id be fine with that.

This.
Coupled with the fact that theres barely any decent ld and no playable pw removal outside of dreadbore in modern. And other than crumble to dust or LD+surgical theres no good lines.

kek that cherrypicking
>t. Tron

Combo shits on tron if it makes you feel better

No it doesn't. Tron is the best combo deck in the format.

Death's Shadow was super fringe last time I played Storm.

Just looking at some lists online it looks like you get eight copies of Goblin Electromancer now and Gifts is a four-of which seems weird.

BAN TRON LANDS LET ME DURDLE

Modern is "who did I get matched against tonight: the format."
If you want things like player skill to be a factor then play a better format.

The new baral storm is much more resilient than old ascendancy lists, you get the ability to play a guy and go off at nearly instant speed, without the opportunity for a lot of counter play.

>LET ME DURDLE

If by durdle you mean play creatures at 3+ cmc and spells that aren't hard counterspells, then yes, let me durdle.

Sadly, there is no better format besides commander, which is currently full of autistics who will argue that whatever beats them isn't casual enough.

Thanks sheldon! I'm seriously considering just ditching MTG, it's pretty dated at this point.

Theres nothing durdley about playing the best beaters and hand disruption in the format and then losing to a turn 3 Karn because your deck wasnt packing enough Lava Spike effects.

I dont feel this is the case, theres a lot of player skill involved in some of the top matches like Jund, Abzan, Burn, Affinity, Scapeshift , Storm, and Company decks

>Sadly, there is no better format besides commander

Try legacy or even the new standard.

Legacy is super open RN due to the banning, and standard has a playable mono-blue control deck.

Honestly if they ban cards for not being fun to play against they should ban tron. Just being objective. I don't actuality care

Honestly, nobody sits across from tron and thinks, oh boy this is going to be a fun and interesting game of magic in about to play.

Just Thoughtseize the Karn lmao

Lol and then they drop Ugin and literally win off a turn 4 play and nothing else
Or they topdeck another Karn and slam that and start controlling the board state like a true control deck :)

>Company
Hurrrr I flip over my combo on turn 3 and instawin. Might as well just roll a die, would probably be just as skill-intensive.

It's not prevalent in north america as much, but the card does see play in some sideboards. It's decent/10.

What's your guys honorable mention picks from this set?
KLD for me was Gonti, AER I'd have to say Kari.

I'm sorta drawn to this card, like is it powerful enough as is? Why couldn't it have deathtouch and less power? Does it even need it?
And yet it still seems like shit.

I just want to play it with Devoted Druid and Finks and CoCos as a 1of young peezy snek lady...

>Hurrrr
Yep. Checks out. You're retarded.

>>Hurrrr I flip over my combo on turn 3 and instawin. Might as well just roll a die, would probably be just as skill-intensive.
You have never played with or against a Melira deck.

Pure shitposting at its finest.

>it's another "ban tron" thread

Sorry for your inability to understand context. If you muster both of your brain cells you may be able to piece together who that was in imitation of, CoCoshitter.

Really? Literally the last deck I played at FNM the guy just cast CoCo off one of his mana dorks and flipped over all three pieces. Really stimulating, skill intensive magic there.

>Deck X being bad against matchup Y
>Deck Y should be banned

Yup, /tg being bad as usual.

Awe, did you put that paragraph together all by yourself? So precious

I think the MU would be fun if modern actually had good hate for lands.

Yeah imagine that. It's almost like a good amount of players think it's cancer and format warping. But that probably doesn't mean anything.

CoCo only gets two creatures. Fuck off to whatever hole you crawled out of

We'll probably have this discussion every day until wotc reprints wasteland.

>it feels like getting a free win just for sitting down and getting paired against a certain deck

Gee, it's like if we are playing any competitive format ever? And as burn player, it's not like we are playing skill intensive gameplay anyway.

There's no diversity in Legacy, everyone plays BUG goodstuff.
Just look at the latest top 8
mtgtop8.com/event?e=15418&f=LE

>he doesn't run Seer in his Finks/Anti-counter CoCoCombo deck
I bet you run Ballista too. Worst CoCos I've ever seen tbqh famillia.
You're right about Druid combo being nuts though.

>wah muh tron

Yeah, really hard to tell how many people bought into DSJ here. What's that, thoughtsieze can't take lands? Awww, poor you. It sure is a fucking shame your deck doesn't have 100% winrate.

Legacy is delver/deathrite: BUG boogaloo edition. No format escapes gbx cancer now

I love how all the Tronfags come out of the woodwork when you even mention that Tron is cancer. Can't wait for it to be banned.

>flipped all 3 pieces
>CoCo only gives you two creatures
Really fries my chicken