I mean, if its your first time ever looking at the game, they're probably simpler and easier to grasp. MoS/MoF is way simpler, the game has much more concrete examples of how to use superior/critical results in any situation, movement and actions is way more clear in how they work and much less GM arbitration. The new pools mean that you don't just dump everything into MOX, depending on what your character does you might split them between the four (which makes it a bit closer to GUMSHOE honestly).
For us followers of 1E, I think there's still some questions and even concerns because the playtest is being gradually released so people will actually read each section and give feedback (some of which is already terrible) and parts of it are still in editing and formatting. We'll have to see the whole.
If conversion is so easy though, no reason you can't keep playing 1E and just reverse engineer the 2E materials - I suspect there will be several fan projects to that effect once 2E is fully fleshed out.
Christopher Sanders
Oh, and if you didn't like the size of EP's skill list, this edition is for you. Already confirmed Athletics and Guns skills, and fewer Pilot fields. CC is the next part they'll release in a few days, so we'll get our full skill list then.
Isaac Russell
Does athletics include freefall?
James Walker
No, Free Fall is mentioned as a separate skill under jumping (presumably for zero-g and stuff) and will probably say REF based.
Athletics looks like it bundles together all the SOM movement skills (Like Climb, Freerun, Swim, Flight) into a single package to roll when doing move-y athletic type things. Any time you move with some part of your body to generate force like hopping, swimming or even snaking, you roll Athletics. But you don't roll flight if you have a thrust vector system, you roll Pilot: Aerospace.
Jonathan Richardson
So dolphins will be good at freerunning now?
Hunter Evans
No idea. They're reworking morphs and morph bonuses, so it's entirely possible they don't do straight skill bonuses, but might involve using pools in specific ways, or just conditional bonuses (+20 to athletics... when you swim) but the morph would be limited by the fact that you have just Swimming mobility.
We also don't have CC yet, so we don't know how that system will work out either - it's possible maybe a Neo-Dolphin gets a bonus to Athletics, but it might be fairly normalized and not extreme and reasonable - "You're slightly better at athletic things because you're practiced with using your whole body to move", real basic shit.
Luis Turner
Not great. The "rest" mechanics in particular are highly suspect. Transhumanity has mastered its own biology, but still needs a nap to function properly? And the new dice system just adds needless complexity with the rules for margin of success or failure.
Ryder Ortiz
>Transhumanity has mastered its own biology, but still needs a nap to function properly?
Ah, I see you don't actually play Eclipse Phase, you just want to be angry about something.
Kayden Wright
Nigger what? I've played Eclipse Phase for the last three years, unlike every other faggot in this thread. I want a new edition of EP, not a clone of 5E with WoD's dice pool mechanics tacked on.
>b-but you could regenerate moxie by resting in 1E!
If I caught one of my players saying "I take a nap so I can get my metacurrency back" I'd have ejected him from the game right then and there.
Sebastian Martinez
Oh, so you're just an asshole.
Because the game has always been specific about how much sleep you need normally, and how mods like Biomods and Circadian reduce that time (and Synths don't need sleep) - and if you want to kick a player out for being "hey I can take a break and get my moxie back?" while on a long rover ride across mars or a shuttle hop, I'd eject you from my life, let alone as my GM.
You're also full of shit >I want a new edition of EP, not a clone of 5E with WoD's dice pool mechanics tacked on.
Fuck off with that nonsense. The basic mechanic of rolling under but higher on d% is still the same, you're just making up shit because you're buttblasted about some random games you didn't like. They called is a long and short rest, so what, boo hoo. Being mad about that is super retarded, they just picked some industry terminology. It's not like you didn't have to wait for shit to happen all the time in EP before, this is just an explicit "Take a 10 minute break, get some points back. You take a big break like you sleep for a day like you've always had to, you get everything back".
Only thing I don't like is the d6s, I really hope there's enough push back on that front they go to d5s. I already need a handful of d10s for tests/DV/SV I don't want to also add a bundle full of d6s to that mix.
Landon Stewart
ITT
Ryan Perry
>Fuck off with that nonsense. The basic mechanic of rolling under but higher on d% is still the same, you're just making up shit because you're buttblasted about some random games you didn't like.
Nice try kid, but you're wrong again
>Eclipse Phase: Spend a Vigor to gain an additional action at the end of the turn, after everyone else has already gone >Vampire: The Masquerade: Spend a Blood to gain an additional action at the end of the turn, after everyone else has already gone
>the game has always been specific about how much sleep you need normally
Yeah, and nobody gave a shit. It's Eclipse Phase: the Game of Transhuman Horror and Conspiracy, not Eclipse Phase: The Game of Tracking How Long It's Been Since You Had A Nap
>It's not like you didn't have to wait for shit to happen all the time in EP before
"Waiting for shit to happen" is the hallmark of a bad GM. Which means you either are one, or you had one, and either way your opinions about the game can't be trusted. Fuck off back to >>>r/eclipsephase
William Parker
>7 pages of rules released, 6 if you exclude the cover page >edition wars already
Truly we are living in the accelerated future
Xavier Bell
So, your games do not have task actions, space travel, egocasting or farcasting, healing, installing implants, resleeving, favors, fabrication, traumas, or any of the other gajillion things with explicit timeframes? If not I wonder what the fuck game you've been playing for the last 3 years.
You don't take 10 minutes of real time when your hacker needs to make a hacking test (hopefully, hacking is a little clunky so it's possible), but the game says pretty explicitly this normally takes 10 in-game minutes. Do you ignore that and have things just happen instantly, or perhaps do you ask what other people are doing with their lives while the console jock is using his virtual keyboard?
Time is a resource, one of the few things in the setting which is finite. I'm pretty sure the aspect of managing it well is supposed to be pretty key to conspiracy and horror, mate.
>Fuck off back to >>>r/eclipsephase
I've been here for years, I'm usually the guy posting generals
Also, again, they just phrased it the same as another thing - big fucking deal. It's the same effect as having SPD 2 when everybody else is SPD 1, just not constant - so far
Charles Fisher
>metaplot not advanced >you will not see Jovian Crusade stomping out the transhuman abberrations, RKV obliterating Titanian and Mars hives, and millions of human soldiers reconquering Earth
Here's another thing for people to rage over - Flex will be a pool morphs can add to also, with some low spec morphs offering literally no advantages but a point or two of Flex.
Julian Smith
Well even if the plot did advance that wouldn't be the result
Matthew Torres
Why would they release this? There's not enough content to even form an opinion on or understand, let alone play the game. People are just going to nitpick it to death since there's no way to know how any of it will work during play.
Jaxson Robinson
Use it with existing game rules
Luis Powell
>Nice try kid, but you're wrong again You dumb fuck, blood isn't even a dice pool mechanic, and you're using it as proof that this game has a dice pool mechanic?
Now you wanna be butt-blasted that they've effectively replaced Edge with an expanded Fate point system tied to morph, be my guest. But bitch about real issues, not imaginary ones.
Elijah Adams
Moxie is pretty much voodoo magic anyway, so I don't see why it would be affected by your biology.
Wyatt Long
What is Edge?
Brandon Cook
I don't like that at first glance but I want to try it out in play before I say it's bad.
Noah Nguyen
>blood is not a dice pool
Nobody said it was, and neither is vigor
>edge
What?
Nolan Richardson
>Nobody said it was
>not a clone of 5E with WoD's dice pool mechanics tacked on.
Juan Barnes
lol, I wonder what idiot came up with this. Why not base the game on GURPS or D20 instead ?
Owen White
still, it would be fun to see the Junta go full space nork fortifying the gravity well while the rest of the system passes them by.
Isaac Cooper
...
Dominic Hill
Jovians aren't NK equivalent. They are US equivalent militarily. We went through this issue numerous times. They have the strongest fleet in the system, highly advanced fielded army and one of the best R&D. All according to cannon.
Mason Carter
>We're releasing the playtest rules piecemeal so that you all have time to absorb the nitty gritty details >Please give us feedback even though we haven't released enough rules to actually play the game yet >No no, stop nitpicking guys! You should hold off on judging the pools mechanic until you've seen the morph and chargen rules! Well fuck me Posthuman, what the hell do you want us to do then?
Carter Gutierrez
>Well fuck me Posthuman, what the hell do you want us to do then? Abolish patriarchy
Michael Garcia
That IS their T-Day plan though.
Easton Morales
Can't fortify a gravity well in a setting with any decent level of space tech, you can just drop rocks on anything that can't move. It's safer to stay in orbit where you can move.
Ethan Martinez
Without force projection capability all the strongest fleet in the system buys them is a strong defense. As far as militaries go they're more like China than the US.
Carson Gray
Not US equivalent. They have the strongest military, but not the US style "can win against any three others easy" type superiority.
They also don't actually have very good force projection, but no one really does considering how space warfare in a solar system works.
Pretty he's talking about Jupiter's SOI pal
Asher Parker
That's pretty arguable. Rocks can be deflected. Rocks aren't great against scattered targets. Targets on a planet can potentially be hidden, unlike targets in space. Installations on planets can at least sometimes use the planet as a heat sink.
Jaxon Butler
>They also don't actually have very good force projection, but no one really does I would argue strongly that most do better. Resleeving and farcasting dramatically improve that situation. >But muh Jovian stronk transhuman spec operators ...have always been incredibly few by canon
Isaiah Miller
>, but not the US style "can win against any three others easy" type superiority.
US doesn't have it either, it's propaganda, burgerstani.
Carter Morris
Which Chargen subsystem is suggested for newfags?
Liam Collins
>But the sun never sets on the British Empire!
A decent part of the time it's only shining on a handful of pedophiles though.
David Taylor
That's true. Force projection is probably something like
Only reason I put the anarchists above the Jovians is because they have orgs which give them safe harbor across the system (Barsoomians/inner system anarchists/etc) and have done system spanning direct actions against weaker targets. They have a shitty fleet (if they have one) but can probably get a team more places the Jovians can thanks to that.
Transhuman Packages probably. Life path can work.
Camden James
Thanks senpai, I wanted to do the Life path one because it would be easier on the players and by extension me. We Rand through most of the package system but some of the less seasoned players were stumbling all over with it.
David Collins
I'm going to have to dramatically disagree with your assessment of Minerva there.
No, that's Titanian Commonwealth, where reading books about European culture is anti-progressive and results in reduction of rep points.
Carson Butler
...
Liam Baker
...
Oliver Edwards
Their main language is European
Aiden Phillips
Is this the racist slavposter again?
Brayden Torres
>>But muh Jovian stronk transhuman spec operators >...have always been incredibly few by canon We must be reading different setting then, because they are widespread in NPC's and adventures published by PS
Juan Gonzalez
>three examples is widespread
The Jovian infiltrator from the main book is in a flat
John Ward
>Their main language is European >Arabic was always European language you racist!
Sebastian Jones
It's some version of Swedish if I recall correctly
Camden Wilson
>The Jovian infiltrator from the main book is in a flat Cyborgized and has a back up
Dominic Hall
>It's some version of Swedish if I recall correctly >Dats Rite!
Tyler James
Wow. With infrastructure for A GUY the Jovians surely have unlimited force projection capability!
He's still in his original fucking body
Ayden King
...
Sebastian Davis
>spec ops >force projection
Anarkiddies think force projection comes in the form of meat men with guns because that's all they got.
Real polities (~great~ polities) project force with fleets of Faraday shielded antimatter toting battleships.
Julian Johnson
Ships don't occupy habs and faraday cages do almost nothing
I really get sick of people acting like they know anything about military operations.
I also get really sick of people without the reading comprehension to tell that I was saying that spec ops does not provide force projection capability.
Ian Green
>Faraday shielded Oh man our microwave ovens are worthless against them!
Fleets don't mean all that much when space defenses shit on them for a fraction of the cost. You get the same tech, but instead of packing tons of fuel you get to pack extra weapons, and potentially some stuff you can't fit into a space ship for size constraints.
Ryder Foster
Yeah but he only carries AP rounds so clearly he's retarded.
Owen Young
He just can't do math.
Which puts him on the same footing as Jury and Boyle.
Chase Brooks
Well, apparently people who play EP can't do math either - the addition of d6s is apparently because 1d10/2\d5s slow people down too much in play, as evidenced in many playtest games.
Asher Davis
...
Ryan Torres
...
Aaron Bailey
I said former USSR.
Noah Russell
But swimming is not the same as running. Mixing them up into an athletics skills can only end in confusion.
Nathan Fisher
>Transhumanity has mastered its own biology, Uh no, it hasn't.
Ethan Thompson
Can't tell if serious...
Connor Garcia
...
Nicholas Martinez
So how is everyone liking the new dice pool mechanic?
Well, if it was just the "wild card" pool, that'd be fine. Morphs which are more adaptable, or which teach you to be more adaptable so you can apply their benefits to anything. It's the narrative elements of Flex which make it weird.
But they say that this is a result of in-house playtesting, so we'll just have to see when we get to CC/Morphs before we start casting stones.
Samuel White
>Morphs which are more adaptable, or which teach you to be more adaptable so you can apply their benefits to anything It's not, though. Boyle says it'll be used to make the shit-tier morphs competitive.
Benjamin Jenkins
I mean, being stuck in a Case or a Flat will probably teach you some things about how to make the most of your life when the opportunity strikes - the fact that it makes you "lucky" to find people, objects or convenient set pieces when you need them is the weird bit - to me anyway.
Jonathan James
That's the usual narrativism vs. simulationism debate, and they clearly took a hint from narrativist games.
In the end it is not about how much sense does it make, but how fun it is. Can you create a story about it which a player will enjoy? Most players won't like being a clunky robot while the other players are demigods, and not only that, the system itself will make the other players much more effective.
The main way to solve this issue is allowing the system to make those chooses meaningful and fun, even if that means bending the narrative.
Parker Adams
I've mastered your mother's biology
Blake Davis
Personally, my objection isn't Flex as a pool. My objection is to Flex as a pool you get specifically by sleeving into a cheapo morph.
Robert Foster
The FATE adaptation already does something similar, as morphs cost refresh.
Jaxon Martin
>It's not, though. Boyle says it'll be used to make the shit-tier morphs competitive. I think it's more to make the shit-tier morphs worth their value, and to make values less arbitrary. Now, if you're getting some rare, but stat-low morph, you'll probably also get some Flex with it.
Alternately, they've divorced the morph system from a point system entirely, and just let you choose your body. Flex is the tradeoff for choosing a "lesser" form.
Boyle has assuaged my fears a bit by telling me that cheapo morphs don't get that many Flex points on account of their power. 2 at most. If pools are generally much larger than this, I'm fine with that decision.
Dominic Myers
Oh, I perfectly understand like, the mechanical significance. The idea is that there's no reason at all mechanically to pick the morph, so nobody will pick them except for niche RP stuff - and that would just make you worse off for no real reason other than verisimilitude.
To me and a lot of people, it just feels a bit weird I think described in a vacuum - because Flex is both the "wild card" pool for MOX-type stuff with any stat AND has like, a luck component. That makes sense for an underdog story - but it's a bit of a weird mesh when y'know, the other pools are clearly influenced by physical real things in the universe rather than meta aspects. I think it'll probably be fine once they actually show the components, but telling it to me without showing it is going to always sound kind of oddball.
Adrian Fisher
I'll even go far to say, Flex will only be REALLY weird if there's implants which affect your flex pool - without some kind of caveat like "You can only spend it to flip/upgrade checks on any stat roll".
Nolan Fisher
...
Evan Nguyen
...
Camden Torres
Imagine what Eclipse Phase could have been:
>dropping from the orbit in your assault pod, hearing the banging of the atmosphere, stamping your foot in power armor on the soil of Mars as laser beams glitter in the darkness, shooting at the screeching waves of oncoming transhuman mutants, rising the flag of Human Empire on their corpses, distant bleak sun shining its rays over the battlefield as another world is being reclaimed from the transhuman plague
>Yfw when Jovefags actually believe this would ever happen.
Robert Diaz
Generic HFY shit?
Landon Perry
b-but muh nanotech ; )
Anthony Clark
>dropping from the orbit in your assault pod Honestly I don't think Jovians would use pod morphs.
Ethan Wood
I'm not sure they would drop down, at least without almost glassing the surface to the point of absoliutely no movement or signals of any kind. Their resources are limited, their enemies' are effectively not. So overkill is a sensible move here. With replicators, nanotech, and forks/AIs, you just can't be sure that your opponent is actually taking meaningful losses and not just harasses you with disposable combat bots.
