/swg/ - Star Wars General

That is fair, but regardless of ratios, an Imperial Army or Stormtrooper was less expendable than a Clone, just as a Rebel trooper was, by the pure merit that they couldn't just be produced factory-like. Dark Troopers came into existence purely because the Empire didn't want to expend its troops so much and instead regain that manufacturing idea, just as the Rebels adopted droid units from Separatists that joined them.

Vader tells Tarkin that Alderaan's defenses were, quote, "as strong as any in the Empire", and other elements of EU fiction that don't contradict the film support the notion that at the very least Alderaan had very powerful defensive capabilities.

As for the differences of the nuking vs. blowing up, I do agree, but the situation still wasn't radically different. Alderaan had a huge Rebel-aligned population. Its own ruling families supported the Rebellion openly, and they didn't disclose this to any Imperial citizens, they didn't try to warn them away or get them to leave. Rather, they got treated rather poorly.

While it's still a travesty that many Imperials died with the Rebels there, there were enough Rebel combatants and more than enough Rebel supporters to justify it as a viable target.

As for terms, Leia was offered multiple times the chance to spare it, even if Tarkin seemed to lie in the end, so I don't believe it's unfair to say that they did at least try to negotiate. On behalf of Alderaan, Leia did indeed refuse.

I'm not one of the people saying Alderaan was justified or that it wasn't evil to destroy it rather than occupy it, but I do think there was a lot more going on behind the scenes that led to a decision that was perhaps evil in the end, but pragmatically so.

The Empire believed the cost of Alderaan would spare the costs of a full-fledged civil war.

Tarkin indicates that Alderaan would have been destroyed regardless of whether she told the truth. This is indicated by him dismissing Dantooine as a proper message, and further by them actually investigating Dantooine. Tarkin may have offered to spare Alderaan, but it was absolutely a feint. Nothing Leia said would have saved it.

Alderaan was literally a genocide - if it had been a single world of the Hapan Cluster or something it'd be more like the Hiroshima argument claims it is, since that'd be one part of a much wider culture/nation, which as you say could've responded and surrendered.

Alderaan literally was the slaughter of an entire people bar maybe a few thousand across the galaxy.

Alderaan was part of the Rebellion, even if they didn't declare it.

Even if you don't buy that they were still part of the Empire, though a traitor state.

Either way they weren't an independent nation or planet separate from everyone else.

Doesn't matter - it's still fully under the definition of 'genocide', regardless of how legal or justified you think it is. Iirc Alderaan doesn't have colony worlds.

In case anyone missed it last thread: Chapter 1 of the smutty squadronfic I'm writing is up on pastebin:
pastebin.com/zVMm6ERp

In today's news, user thinks you kill every single person in an opposing nation. Not even a regime change, just genocide (we're going to keep using that word) them all.

Is it Alderaan's fault for joining the Rebellion or the Empire's fault for blowing them up for it?

The entire planet didn't join.
The entire planet was genocided.

Which of these is at fault.
Protip it's the genocide

It is radically different, it's the space between nuking Hiroshima and having a weapon that will put the island of Japan underwater.

The Empire's, considering how many loyal Alderaanians defected from Imperial service after hearing about Tarkin's demonstrative "mining accident".

on a galactic scale Alderaan was closer to a major city or metropolis rather than an entire country

You don't get to excuse senseless collateral damage just because it's convenient.

>Vader tells Tarkin that Alderaan's defenses were, quote, "as strong as any in the Empire", and other elements of EU fiction that don't contradict the film support the notion that at the very least Alderaan had very powerful defensive capabilities.
Source this or fuck off

Which would hold up if the whole galaxy was one monolithic nation and culture - it wasn't.

That's like sYing it's okay to nuke France because it's only one part of Europe.

Not him, but it's from the novelization of ANH
"The defense systems on Alderaan, despite the Senator's protestations to the contrary, were as strong as any in the Empire. I should conclude that our demonstration was as impressive as it was thorough."

>Vader tells Tarkin that Alderaan's defenses were, quote, "as strong as any in the Empire", and other elements of EU fiction that don't contradict the film support the notion that at the very least Alderaan had very powerful defensive capabilities.
The hell you talking about. When did Vader say that? The EU literally says the exact opposite. That the only military units on Alderaan were imperial soldiers.

That is literately the entire point of the ship "the Last Chance " that Alderaan disarmed after the Clone Wars and put their military equipment on said ship.

Blowing up Alderaan is like if US had nukes in the civil war, and do convince the confederacy to surrender in year 1 he nuked St. Louis

For those non Americans. That is a city in Missouri, a slave state that stayed with the union. Many of its people supported and fought for the south including government officials but it never officially joined up and many fought for tg union

I posted this above. Thank you
For sourcing that. I literally never heard that before

Alderaan did have a very strong planetary shield, a defense, that's not in dispute.
They didn't have any WEAPONS, though

Are you denying Alderaan joined sides with the Rebellion and was a traitor to the Empire?

Surprisingly enough, when you betray a government you're part of and start killing its soldiers you aren't given warm milk and cookies for it.

>murdering civilians because their neighbours might be rebels is okay
I bet you're American

Considering playing as a bounty hunter in EoTE, anyone got any good media I should watch/read to get a grasp for RP purposes?

The SW Bounty Hunter game from a few years back ps2 era was pretty good.

Past that, any western is a good start.
Django Unchained is about bounty hunters, I've been wanting to make a bounty hunter based on it for a while

Is this the same novelization that claims Palpatine is a dotard figurehead?

Never played that one.
I was thinking Django honestly but I switched up to a gadgeteer last second. Noticed that bounty hunters don't have much humor unfortunately.

Justified is good for a Western-y themed BH.

Alderaan's population was around 2 billion people. Just for the sake of argument, let's say half of those could fairly be described as "rebels." There is no way the true number is anywhere near that high, but it makes for easy math. That means you're killing 1 billion innocent people.

Congratulations, you're worse than the Black Death, 1918 Spanish Flu, AIDS, Ebola, and Cholera, combined.

You can't compare real-world numbers with those of Star Wars though because the scales are so different.

2 billion in Star Wars is considered a tiny population for a major world. Hundreds of billions is considered average. More than a trillion is considered crowded, but not rare.

For A Few Dollars More

>killing billions of innocent people to make a political statement is okay as long as it's just a fictional metaphor for killing millions of innocent people

Star Wars: The Old Republic.

THIS.
I'm playing a Bounty Hunter inspired by Qyzen Fess right now.

If Kreia was a pretty girl instead of a decrepit hag, would she have done nothing wrong?

Yep

So you're playing a bounty hunter Gadgeteer, but also want opportunities for humor?

Go back to Django; I'm pretty sure Dr. Schultz has all the characterization help you need.

Pretty much this - maybe play him as that combined with Kevin Kline in Wild Wild West.

Except the game is utter shit.

It really isn't.
It's still one of the best MMOs out there.

What would the risks have been if the Emperor decided to go full lorgar and turn the Sith ways to being a religion filled with the bad stuff from nonhuman sacrifices to creating death cult soldiers?

That isn't saying much, user

I disagree. MMO's comprise one of the most competitive genres. If an MMO can't support itself with a high enough concurrent and paying player base, then it goes under. SWTOR has not only survived it's hardships, but thrived in making each expansion (generally) better than the last.
I'd rather play SWTOR than boring ass Battlefront.

>What would the risks have been if the Emperor decided to go full lorgar
Honestly, his higher-ups might've become convinced that Emperor Palpatine had gone insane and conspired to have him either committed or assassinated before his madness brought the whole Empire to ruins.

The Imperium of Man may have lost it's critical thinking skills and self-analysis to dogma and superstition, which allowed the cult of the emperor to grow; but the Galactic Empire was still fully capable of this.

No. No, it not.

>I'd rather play SWTOR than boring ass Battlefront
As would I, but that, too, isn't saying much.

Again, that's not saying much.

I liked it, I skipped over the smut part but enjoyed the other bits like Thorn Leader and the squadron flying. I know there's only so much you can do in a short format and liked what you put in to introduce the story. Good one, looking forward to more.

Thanks! There's a good bit of smut you'll have to skip over coming up (once I get it hosted somewhere proper, I'll tag the smutty chapters) but there's plenty of story I have planned!

Are we going to get a threeway soon?

not too spoil too much, bu next chapter is something of an orgy. Maybe not a full-blown orgy, but it is group stuff.

That's fair. Good to hear about the story aspect too, I'm sure it'll add emphasis to the characters and make the smut more compelling as a result. I enjoy Squadfics with OCs, and after Blade Squadron think it's cool to have something else to hang out for.

Orgy pls

If we're getting story bits in between, they definitely need some sort of squadron rivalry

I have a conflict worked out for Part 1 (the title will make sense, I promise) but that's a great idea for Part 2.

Make them rivals with Wholesome Squadron, it'd be hilarious

I've repainted every ship in my collection, aside from a few TIE fighters (Stock paint will stay, as they are scrubs) and 1 TIE Interceptor.

I want Paint Scheme advice for that Interceptor. One rule- No first Order, Kylo's leaked TIE looks too much like a TIE Interceptor.

So Veeky Forums, what's a good idea for a paint scheme for a TIE Interceptor?

Dazzle that shit up.

What do you mean?

Look up "dazzle paint". Ships put ridiculous patterns on their sides because they thought it made it harder to aim torpedoes.

That seems like it would be impossible for me. I'm debating doing it Royal Guard or 181, but that seems inefficient since I could just buy those directly.

Even as a decrepit hag as you said, she didn't do nothing wrong, except being retcon'd by a bunch of texan gnomes too brainless to understand everything's great about her character, and KotOR II in general.

My nearest store championships aren't until July, but I'm already think about which list to run. Of the two I've narrowed it down to, which one looks more competitive?

1.
>Rey
>>Determination
>>Finn
>>Kanan
>>Smuggling Compartment
>>Inertial Dampeners
>>Countermeasures
>>New title

>Norra Wexley
>>PTL
>>C-3PO
>>R2-D2
>>Alliance Overhaul
>>Vectored Thrusters

2.
>Biggs Darklighter
>>R4-D6
>>Integrated Astromech

>Captain Rex
No upgrades

>Braylen Stramm
>>Tactician
>>R3-A2
>>Vectored Thrusters
>>Alliance Overhaul

>Jess Pava
>>M9-G8
>>Primed Thrusters
>>Integrated Astromech

1 looks solid enough. Norra runs the risk of getting nuked by ordnance, but if you can get the offense going they can do some serious damage.

2 is pretty close to Worlds top 4 list, so one can do well with it. I probably would prefer this one and the gaggle of misfit pilots working together.

Favorite TIE model? Probably the Avenger, and that leads us into the flying bit.

I'm playing in a currently on hiatus 1ed WEG ST RPG campaign. At first it was intended to be a pretty abstract "movers and shakers" campaign, gaming out the development of the campaign world. It started immediately post-Endor. The theme was "20s China" and the characters local big shots; governor, Admiral with the one ISD I in sector as flagship, Stomtrooper commander and ISD commander.

Campaign started with the PCs getting the news - Death Star lost with all hands with the Emperor and Lord Vader on board, everything is fucked.

We eventually settled down as the "New Order Commonwealth" with the idea that the NO obviously had some good ideas but the Empire didn't give a shit about them. So the NOC is a military dictatorship with strong rule of law, speciesism is reduced, we're on year 9 or so of a 12-year plan to work up a constitution after which democratization will start.

And the NOC is pretty heavily militarized, with a disproportionately strong fleet that any real major player can still bulldoze over. It does have an unusually good fighter arm, after some years of development it got a "big, fast TIE strikefighter going", basically a TIE/Avenger without hyperdrive, called the TIE/Liberator.

After that there's been a bomber, a trainer, and a simplified interceptor with no launchers.

Anyway, at some point we started up an action campaign called "TIE Operators" about tactical operators tactically operating tactical operations TIEs in tactical operations. The theme was a bit A-team style, the character requirement was matching or exceeding both the NPC TIE pilot and the NPC stormtropper in all skills, the TIEs were fancy TIE/TOs that were pretty much full Avengers.

So I got to play a huge fuck-off space Samoan trooper with some high decorations on her record, a bunch of prosthetics post Space-Purple Heart. All was an excuse to name my character Bea Bar-Acus.

Oh, and I hadn't read the Expanse books at the time so Bea wasn't based off Bobbie Draper. Her homeworld was lowtech in any case, with more of a Jack Vance feel.

Not to say we've been shy at ripping stuff off. The worst ripoff was that the governor's player based "Moff" (we faked up an appointment to give him perceived seniority over neighboring governors) was based off Donald Trump. The joke was "Donald Trump as a statesman, ha ha ha"

Ha.

I just went 2nd Place with a Rey/Norra at my Store Championship on Saturday. Mine was way more aggressive than yours though.

>fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2017/5/3/built-to-spec/
>Fully Operational expands the crafting opportunities available to players and gamemasters by introducing a robust and flexible vehicle and ship construction system.

Time for those side missions to get extra juicy

>vehicle and ship construction
Ohboyohboyohboy.holo

Norra, Shara, Jess is doing good rn too.
I'm recording a podcast on Store Championship lists today. Mind sharing yours?

ohhhhhhhh baby

I'm holding off my interest till I see the actual rules

Gunna build the bestest Pinook ever

I'm not the only who doesn't jack off to FFG's mediocre crafting rules?

No prob.

Fat Bottomed Girls
Rey — YT-1300 45
Expertise 4
Finn 5
Kanan Jarrus 3
Engine Upgrade 4
Millennium Falcon (TFA) 1
Ship Total: 62

Norra Wexley — ARC-170 29
Push the Limit 3
"Chopper" 0
R2-D2 4
Vectored Thrusters 2
Alliance Overhaul 0
Ship Total: 38

I'll see if I can recall the list of the guy who won first. It was Triple Defenders, and he had x7 on two of them and /D on the third.

You can't retcon things that were never canon to begin with

People have completely forgotten that Legends had several layers of canon, and that all Old Republic stuff wasn't on the same level of canon as the majority of the EU.

given how many of the already statted weapons are impossible to reproduce under the rules, I'm not super happy with them. Current game I'm in, GM says the advantage and disadvantage don't cancel out. That's allowed for guns with pros and cons, and lets you do more with the advantage in exchange for drawbacks (y'know, like actual development)

I think that people forget that stuff used to overlap the events of other things in general and that the layers of canonization were established to say which was part of the story and what was "merely plausible".

Current Star Wars fandom seems to have such a strong divide between folks willing to accept the post-disney stuff and the others, its not the first time that this has shown up but its funny how it always seems to happen.

Man, the ISB order of Battle mentions Repulsorlift/Heavy repulsorlift squads, but has no art for what a transport repulorlift might look like.

At all, not even a suggestions. I get that they wanted to leave it open for regional variants, but really I'd have liked some examples.

youtube.com/watch?v=A9aETweCX1M
Talking about Store Champs shit.

Actually I beat the Triple Defenders when we had a match, but we were just under a cutoff and he ended up with better MoV by the end of the day.

Want me to amend that in an annotation or?

Nah, it's no big. Funnily enough, the 3rd place guy also beat me when we had a match.

The whole 'layers of canon' thing was idiotic as well, and just a bandaid at best to the rapid fustercluck that was certain chunks of the EU to begin with.

>just a bandaid at best to the rapid fustercluck that was certain chunks of the EU to begin with.
Just a reminder that Jedi Prince seriously thought they were writing the primary sequels to the films. And they had to be retconned into being the overall extremely minor antics of a bunch of fuckups. Outright character assassination of Zorba, Trioculus, Triclops, and Ken turned out to be the easiest way to resolve that shitshow.

>implying Jedi Prince isn't kino
One of my fondest SW-related memories is of me and a bunch of other seven year olds draped in various dark-shaded blankets running around a campground with tree branches, slapping the shit out of a bunch of other kids with bike helmets and water pistols, and burying them in mud "to capture Ken in carbonite".

0 days since jedi prince yadda yadda

>burying them in mud "to capture Ken in carbonite".

Well that just gave me the giggles
Never buried our playmates in carbonite, but there was a phase where there seemed to be a lot of us with air rifles, bb guns and painted bits of electrical conduit finding out the hard way that its pretty hard to parry a .177 slug being shot at you.
The savage beatings with our lightsabres more than made up for it though.

>Smashed knuckles, bleeding mouths and full body bruises
I have no fucking idea how I survived as long as I did...

Except nowadays is the first time that people try to tell others they can't follow old canon and they can't reject or question Disney canon. No one ever went that full-retard over it before.

I feel like defensive Rey is kinda a waste, you really just want to do as much damage as possible as quickly as possible, no? Expertise Rey has decked me a couple times now. and I've used that Norra build its a nasty heavy hitter.

Uh... what? All the games, books, and comics were on the same level.