How would you have reacted if the Primaris nuMarines could be female?

How would you have reacted if the Primaris nuMarines could be female?
What if it was handled well?

Laughed my ass off that GW caved to a screeching minority that doesn't give a shit about the hobby.

Wouldn't matter if it was handled well they'd have to uproot everything about the SM, yeah they do retcon but this would be a complete rewrite. With the current whining there's no way it wouldn't be seen as anything but caving.

It's like Amy Schemer new special, it failed so hard because it's garbage and unfunny. She whined and threw a fit about it being trolls and the cause rallied around her, coincidentally Netflix changed their rating system because of studies they had done before this incident. However because of the timing Netflix caught flax believing they had caved to Amy and her supporters.

There'd be no way to handle it without pissing off a good chunk of the player base.

How would you all have handled it?
I, personally, would make it so female space marines exist, but are heavily dimorphic. I.E. They support one another and have different skills from one another.
Say, females are often psykers, or have better aim, while the males are melee/firefight oriented.
Something like that.
But that's me. And I like to think that I'm not a cuck.
Sadly, pursuing this path is ill-advised since the bastardization of the left. It's sad to see how we have to infight now for the sake of making sure everyone is given an equal chance.

Fuck this is dumb. Just dont add female SM theres no need.

I'd just make it depend on how the chapter select its recruits.
If they just take the best, there's bound to be a couple females once in a while. No different from males, and once in, they'd be too busy training/meditating/training some more again for it to matter at all ever.

Just would have been another nail in the coffin

Age of Sigmar killed fantasy.
I expect this new round of fluff to be the beginning of the end for 40k.

Kind of just done with Warhammer at this point.

The problem is there isn't a way to handle it with the current atmosphere and timing, even if it wasn't this way they'd be rewriting the whole lore of SMs. For what purpose? What does it add to the SMs other than another source of fap bait?

Why not focus on the all female group the Sisters of Battle, people have been begging for years to get more for them. Why does it absolutely have to be FSM or it doesn't matter? Why not instead attempt to give the SoB more attention, to bring them more to the front and upgrade them.

To me the core issue is there is a faction in desperate need of attention and updating, instead outside groups have latched onto the all boys club and have issue with that.

You want more equal chance? Put effort into not trivializing an already neglected group and instead ask "why aren't they as prevalent?" Ask for more love for the SoB instead of a complete rewrite of the core of SMs.

I'm not sure "they're all men!" is core of the SM over "badass cyborgs in power armor with huge guns and chainsaw swords".

There's that too.

The real issue at the center of SoB is they are ultimately a sexualized ideal of a female militancy in 40k. It doesn't matter that it was entirely conceived and supported by men - it could have been designed by the fucking character designer of Bayonetta and would still run into the same issue. Female Space Marines more or less dodges the issue of sexualized heroines by putting bulky suits and helmets on "big friends".

Do I think its going to happen? Obviously fucking not, otherwise all of the female additions as of late to the 30k, 40k, and AoS ranges wouldn't have shapely figures and boobplate.

The real question you all should be asking is if GW has enough balls to make Greater Nurgle Daemons "big girls".

I dont give a shit about spoose murines.
Too strong to really care for. Also for super soldier they really lack any kind of tactics. Ffs their armor isnt even camoflaged. They are running around in bright blue, yellow and even in fucking hot pink armors.

How about the whole "sons of the emperor" "due to the geneseed using huge amounts of testosterone...." And the whole warrior brother idea?

On that note they'd turn out looking like men anyway so why is it a necessity that they be made a thing? Also fun tidbit there's a group called the daughters of the emperor the Sisters of Battle

Easy fix for you, the SoB get newer sets of power armor that go more with that idea. We kill two birds one stone, SoB fans get their new toys, and you can still have some T&A for reasons, and the outside groups mostly whining and pushing for this can fuck off and not buy it. Just like they were going to do even if FSM became a thing.

Also some dudes made camo marines

Some do use more tactics, others stick to the "shock and slaughter everything before it can react" idea.

Color doesn't matter anymore when everyone of their enemy has infrared vision, tracks by scent or some shit of that kind.

As has been said a million times before, a female space marine would probably be so inundated with testosterone, other hormones, and mental conditioning that they would be indistinguishable from male space marines.

More interesting would be a grim n gritty revitalization of the Sisters line. Maybe it's just me but I wouldn't mind seeing grizzled Dominions with Tank Girl style buzzcuts.

Super-Charged Sororitas?
I'd be fucking down.

Exactly, I never understood this whole push to get FSM when the efforts would be far more productive to revamp the SoB.

If it's gets the SoB attention alot of their players would go for it because they've been neglected for a long time.

Its just the idea of a space marine having femininity, that's so odd and disorientating.
Just looking at them, you see everything about their bodies is perfectly engineered to be absurdly big and powerful.

A female space marine would be like a female bodybuilder on steroids, on steroids.

do you actually believe space marines have a functional penis?
they are a bio engineered warrior race, who gives a shit about their nads

I was trying to think of how it could work aesthetically that it would even matter, and the conclusion that I kept reaching was that it would make them look like variant SoB.

Depends. Some chapters go through the genetic enhancement process as their candidates go through puberty, so they probably end up with some kind of super schwanson.

SoB are annoying because they're basically SM, except they're not super mutants who spit acid and eat brains to absorb memories, which raises the question of why SM go through all that shit. They could just recruit a billion beefy veterans and give them all SM-tier armor, surely that'd be better than the what, the million SM they have.

>do you actually believe space marines have a functional penis?
they are a bio engineered warrior race, who gives a shit about their nads

Tell that to the Space Wolves, and how it's been maintained that the geenseed works with male biology only.

Ecclesiarchy foots the bill for the Sisters' nice gear.

Terra already weighed the risk vs reward for vets and equipment and for that reason we have the Guard.

>Female Space Marines more or less dodges the issue of sexualized heroines by putting bulky suits and helmets on "big friends"
Wishful thinking. They'd get boobplate too and you know it.

you haven't been to many gyms, have you
the biggest guys have the smallest dong
BECAUSE of the shit they take
+4 str, m8
it's just a better chassis overall
a female olimpian's grip strenghth is about on par with an average untrained male's

...

>a female olimpian's grip strenghth is about on par with an average untrained male's

While I maybe aware of this, I know it simply fires up the defense arguments and shuts down discussion.Even if I agree with it because I'm originally from Veeky Forums

>Hand-grip strength has been identified as one limiting factor for manual lifting and carrying loads. To obtain epidemiologically relevant hand-grip strength data for pre-employment screening, we determined maximal isometric hand-grip strength in 1,654 healthy men and 533 healthy women aged 20-25 years. Moreover, to assess the potential margins for improvement in hand-grip strength of women by training, we studied 60 highly trained elite female athletes from sports known to require high hand-grip forces (judo, handball). Maximal isometric hand-grip force was recorded over 15 s using a handheld hand-grip ergometer. Biometric parameters included lean body mass (LBM) and hand dimensions. Mean maximal hand-grip strength showed the expected clear difference between men (541 N) and women (329 N). Less expected was the gender related distribution of hand-grip strength: 90% of females produced less force than 95% of males. Though female athletes were significantly stronger (444 N) than their untrained female counterparts, this value corresponded to only the 25th percentile of the male subjects. Hand-grip strength was linearly correlated with LBM. Furthermore, both relative hand-grip strength parameters (F (max)/body weight and F (max)/LBM) did not show any correlation to hand dimensions. The present findings show that the differences in hand-grip strength of men and women are larger than previously reported. An appreciable difference still remains when using lean body mass as reference. The results of female national elite athletes even indicate that the strength level attainable by extremely high training will rarely surpass the 50th percentile of untrained or not specifically trained men.

sexual dimorphism is a thing
it's why peacocks are so beautiful

Hyperion's got a huge dong tho

I'd be annoyed purely because it'd kill any hope of the infinitely cooler SoB getting an update. If they want women in an army they should add some female heads to the Guard (if they ever get updated) and release new Sisters.

>goes to the gym to stare at dicks
wew

I'd rather they release plastic SoB, guard, tau etc.

There are reasons Marines are male only 'warrior monks'.

Every other faction/race can be as gender diverse as the SJWs like, but if you allow female marines, you also have to allow male sororitas, and that's just retarded.

>Every other faction/race can be as gender diverse as the SJWs like, but if you allow female marines, you also have to allow male sororitas, and that's just retarded.

I don't think you understand how this works, boys only clubs are the only thing that need to be eradicated. Girls only clubs are sacred and you shouldn't even think of touching them.

>The results of female national elite athletes even indicate that the strength level attainable by extremely high training will rarely surpass the 50th percentile of untrained or not specifically trained men.

I can masturbate to this using my 'untrained' hand grip strength

It's retarded and it can't be done well. Men aren't masculine because they're men. They're men because they're masculine. Or to put it less obtusely, a woman who was masculine enough to be as masculine as the most masculine men would be indistinguishable from a man. Like a spotted hyena so hyped on testosterone she literally grows a bigger dick than the male of the species. That's what a female space marine would look like; a man with a bigger dick than you. Now that I think about it, I suppose if it was done like that it'd be amusing enough that I probably be on board with it just because it'd be really funny.

Though it would kind of make all those deadly physical trials they make their recruits go through seem kind of pointless. If any woman can be physically fit enough to qualify then guys would easily be able to demonstrate their suitability by just being unambiguously fitter than her. Then again... the deadly trials are ACTUALLY probably just there to pointlessly kill off recruits or something, so it may not affect them at all.

>they are a bio engineered warrior race, who gives a shit about their nads
Well, in one sense their nads are really important, but it's the sense most ignored in WH40K lore. That is, their ability to perpetuate their genes very effectively by impregnating instead of being impregnated. You'd think that the best way to breed a bunch of super soldiers would be to have some process of selecting the absolute best ones of each generation (such as through the current recruitment process, which we will assume actually accomplishes that) and then making sure those guys have lots of kids. Which space marines should be perfectly capable of doing. But instead they... do the opposite of that? Make sure that the males with the greatest space marine potential are removed from the gene pool through death or sterilization.

Weird, really. Wouldn't think the imperium'd be above a little eugenics.

The problem I see is SM aren't supposed to have such attachments and therefore they don't want the conditioning broken through some love trumps all bullshit.

The other thing is I don't believe that's how geenseed function, SM are a combination of geenseed and implants that make them what they are. They are distilled from their Primarch and by breeding it's very possible to introduce unwanted mutations or variations that dilute the effectiveness.

>Make sure that the males with the greatest space marine potential are removed from the gene pool through death or sterilization.
>Weird, really. Wouldn't think the imperium'd be above a little eugenics.
Considering the last time Mankind got a little too good, it cause the Age of Strife, it almost makes sense.

Mostly though, its all about the great machine of the Imperium being grimdark and destroying itself slowly but surely.

>You'd think that the best way to breed a bunch of super soldiers would be to
Big E specifically wanted to avoid this. SM serve humanity they dont surpass it.

>Order founded intentionally as a sisterhood
>Can't have female marines 'cause GENETICS

If you can't tell the difference between these two things, I don't know what to tell you.

In b4 'but that's how genetics DO work'.

No it isn't. You don't want realism, you want verisimilitude that supports your personal beliefs and world view.

>Make sure that the males with the greatest space marine potential are removed from the gene pool through death or sterilization.

Some of the recruits come from worlds where it wouldn't be uncommon to have had a few kids already before being recruited.
Especially considering they would have had be the top dog of their tribe to qualify for being a marine.

Though I agree that a formal program of freezing the recruit's...khm...'geneseed' for later reintroduction into the population would be a good idea. Though supposedly from what I've read in threads like these before the recruit's DNA is not the only relevant factor and you have to account for warp fuckery as well.

Part of me would have found it hilarious and I was kinda hoping it would happen because the sudden tidalwave of salty tears would have been delicious.

Another part of me would have been a bit annoyed with GW for caving to a handful of well meaning but deluded bloggers devoid of any sense of irony (the RWAs of the left)

But when push comes to shove. It's GW's story, they can do what they want with it. The gender of space marines isn't something I'm particularly invested in, so once the novelty faded I imagine I'd carry on as usual

There is no difference in design.
Marines are just faceless dudes who are warrior monks and all male by design. The genetics angle is just a justification for the design, because they are engineered, not born.
Sisters are all female to add a Dominatrix faction. The sisterhood is just a wordplay on men at arms.

>Order founded intentionally as a sisterhood
>Can't have female marines 'cause GENETICS

>Marines founded intentionally as a group of genetically modified soldiers that have both an X and Y chomosome to allow them to inherit traits of their XY forebears
>Adeptas Sororitas having 90% of the Marines' combat capacity but missing the slight edge that testosterone and 35,000 years of genetic engineering provides

If you can't tell the difference between these two things, you must be retarded.

I'd be pitching black library my story about fabius bile and emps children getting their hands on a femarines superhuman womb. Human women currently have a one womb per abominable monster limit because they're body cant handle it. But an astartes womb would be a gift of the dark prince. They'll get her high on giving birth to supermonsters. Constantly raped after churning out super abomination after super abomination in an eternal cycle. This plot will be discovered by the salamanders for since their so close to their families for extra melodrama. They'll manage to save the femarines from bile's clutches. But not the next batch captured by lucius

What are you talking about? All helmeted marines are female.

One faction of power armoured men, one faction of power armoured women.

how fucking complicated does it have to be.

Warrior nuns and warrior monks.

give sisters of battle their own genebulking for all I care, but they aren't space marines and never will be.

I wouldn't have let it happen. I'd have been explicit about "No female Marines, ever."

Like, I would literally add a note in the most recent Codex where Cawl says "As you know, it is impossible to make women Space Marines. The implants don't work with them, and there is a 100% failure rate. Instead, I've IMPROVED the Marines we have, expanding on the blessed Omnissiah's work. Moving on..."

It's not GENETICS.

They are designed that way to avoid any chance of reproduction beyond geneseed transfer. All males = no babies. It's specifically so this race of transhumans cannot replace humanity.

And even if you go all "just make them sterile", pic related.

The same way I'm reacting now. Angry,, but not because of the female thing.

Assuming for one second that Nu Marines make sense They don't it would have been the perfect place to introduce fem marines without disrespecting the original lore Anymore than numarines have already disrespected the lore.

Maybe in addition to guillimarines there should be guuillisisters. Makes sense, Big Blue has probably twigged that faith is one of the main things holding the imperium together, so why not show some love to the most faithful soldiers around and instruct some techpriests to figure out how to shove geneseed into them.

Then if anybody complains about female space marines after that they seriously need to be shot.

Just make plastic Sisters, goddamnit GW, it's that easy.

I play tau so I just bring more broadsides.

>How would you have reacted if the Primaris nuMarines could be female?

I'd quit. Female Marines are my litmus test for the SJWfication on 40k.

>What if it was handled well?

Impossible.

I suppose I would find it obnoxious in the same way that other changes are being made to make the Imperium more cosmetically appealing to the modern social ethos. It would at best be an arbitrary change and at worst undercut some of the churlish joy of indulging in one "problematic" idea among many that make the setting novel nowadays.

It happened already in aos.

>sex negativity
I'm sorry, but i can't see how that is in any way, shape or form a problem.

>What if it was handled well?
It can't be handled well.
This.

>Adeptas Sororitas having 90% of the Marines' combat capacity
Wat.

Fuck off.

see ya, dingus

Guilliman already shat on everything his douchebag biological dad believed in, like admiring and liking xenos or creating separate empire, he also always wanted astartes to have place in humankind besides being killing machines.

IIRC I think I saw a comment about them even being able to have intercourse. Memories fuzzy though.

I hate sjws just as much as anyone but quitting just cause of female marines is an overreaction. Yes I'm aware of the lore but I wouldn't quit the setting because of the change.

Practically boobplate has its problems, but they're your chicks afterall if you want boobplate I say have at it.

It would be great if gw had boobplate and non boobplate versions of SoBs, but I guess that's asking for too much.

I generally support the idea of gender equality in every aspect but no. 40k is basically a male safe space. Everything about it just screams so. It's kind of like requiring college sororities to have an obligatory male quota. I'd retcon the SOB if I could, too.

one of the main reasons of why pre-heresy ultramarines were akin to diplomats and even the east and west roman senate, though less backstaby and more reasonable

Lore changes all the time anyway. This'd just be another change among many.

maybe they will find a way to make female marines, all thanks to Sailor Celestinemoon

>What if it was handled well?

Literally impossible

40k isn't a male safe space it doesn't give a shit about gender politics.

You're legit retarded or a woman if you believe this.

>I generally support the idea of gender equality in every aspect
This is one of the biggest problems with society today. You're just spewing things that sound noble without thinking about them. True equality is impossible, because men (on average) are always gonna be better at and more willing to do some things, women (on average) at others, men and society in general want to coddle women and women in general want to be coddled. There is nothing wrong with these things, but all the misandrist abomination dykes that hijacked the feminist movement drilled this non-existent concept of oppression into the minds of women so they'd gain support for their agenda, which is ultimately the destruction of males.
>inb4 muh /pol/
Fuck off, it's relevant to the discussion. No one should be judged, hired or evaluated based on their gender but ability and actions, that's as close to true equality as possible. Literal equality isn't, and will never be, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

>xD bait thread lmao
fuck off

It's very obviously designed to fit a certain demographic's yearning for ultra-masculine fantasy their lives are completely void of. And it's done so masterfully. GW can get away with the ridiculous prices because they know exactly that their product is simply THE perfect product for their target group.

jesus christ calm down you fuckwit.
> No one should be judged, hired or evaluated based on their gender but ability and actions, that's as close to true equality as possible.
That's what I'm supporting. But if you think this is the case now (at least in CEE Europe where I'm from) you are in some serious denial.

>That's what I'm supporting
Then why were you talking about male safe spaces and shit? It sounded bitter and condescending.

Beacuse it is. Please read
It's not exactly an SJW type safe-space then. I didn't mean to sound condescending, it's the same thing for me. There's nothing wrong with some escapism from time to time.

I would just avoid them in my armies, simple as that.
I enjoy the whole manly men theme.

>no different from males

This is one of the biggest fucking lies told today and I say that from experience as an infantryman who has a female in my section. This is absolute horse shit and its likely to get me killed someday.

I said best of the best, user. If you take the thousand bests in something, you're bound to find a couple women even if the vast majority is still men. And no lowering standards until they fit in.

I would mind that. Punks and "Riotgrrlz" can fuck right off.

>no lowering standards

Too late, the "Soldier 2020" program is hitting right now and its going to make tomorrow's Army weak as shit.

Yeah but I was talking about a hypothetical SM recruitment drive there.

Top kek, what world do you live in? Decent male athletes completely blow away female world champions. If you're taking the one percent of the strongest humans on the planet woman don't even begin to come close to making that cut.

I know, the whole fem-SM thing is only an issue because of modern socio-political events that are external to the game and every time they're accomodated in a game setting or movie or entertainment of any kind end up ruining it.

Honestly? Wouldn't care. My wife has a Necron force that are all female. She didn't go and shove a bunch of greenstuff tits on them, they look just the same as any other Necrons. She just gave them female Egyptian names and reasoned that ALL the Necrontyr were put in the necrodermis, so logically quite a lot of them would in fact be female.

Female Primarus marines would be no different. They're going to look identical from the outside because of the armour. I suppose you could have a bare head one, but so what? Cawl's had 10,000 years to work on them; the idea of him using females as well as males doesn't bother me.

Now having female Space Marines is a totally different kettle of fish, because they're established as being male only. But Primarus? Eh, new fluff, can be whatever GW likes. Frankly given some of the hyperbole in this thread I actually wish GW does make some of them female just to piss you all off.

Wanna tell some stories?

I wish for you to lose the ability to enjoy absolutely any kind of entertainment or activity you fucking prick.

Oh boy, where do I start. I don't want to give away a lot of personally identifying information but lets just say Im part time. Im in a squad that carries and employs the heaviest weapons in a light infantry company. Female did an MOS-transfer into our unit. Been with us for a decent amount of time. Lazy as fuck, hides out in female-only areas. We were out in the field recently, rucking, doing squad movement techniques. Our job has us carrying 125+ pounds in weapons and gear. Thats at the lightest end. She can't keep up with us, dies going up hills, doesn't pitch in to help unless told to do so, and plays dumb about things. Its the most infuriating fucking thing that my country believes in this egalitarian bullshit so much that they're willing to risk my life for it. Females in combat arms are going to get good men killed.

Damn. Is there a particular event that really pissed you off or is it just the general laziness and weakness you described?

Would like to tell more, but with how few females are in combat arms it would be too easy to put 2 and 2 together.

Sorry, user, i didn't mean that. I hope your wife and you have a long, happy life.

no girls allowed in my marines, though

>female marines

Heresy. If you want female anything, how about you fucking release plastic Sisters of Battle so people can afford them you fucks.

This is silly, but the thing that pisses me off the most is that she can't even maintain her distance and position in a basic squad column formation over flat ground. Constantly falling behind and swerving into others' lanes. Has been talked to about it. Other than that just the laziness and weakness in general.

>Honestly? Wouldn't care. My wife has a Necron force that are all female. She didn't go and shove a bunch of greenstuff tits on them, they look just the same as any other Necrons. She just gave them female Egyptian names and reasoned that ALL the Necrontyr were put in the necrodermis, so logically quite a lot of them would in fact be female.
And this is perfectly fine because there isn't a mountain of lore saying that it can't happen, unlike female space marines.

>tfw your faction dealt with this shit a long time ago by eliminating turning your faction into angry walking space mushrooms
>get amused by watching other players argue over whether or not Female Space Marines should be a thing
As someone else already pointed out, just give the SoB their turn in the spotlight (and release plastic units for their faction ffs. It's beyond absurd at this point).

Sorry to hear that, user. What about interactions, is she at least fun to talk to? Not that it matters in a job where physical ability is everything.

Has the same armour save, use the same weapons, weaker in melee. How would you rate it?

Raven guard uses camouflage in their armors.

Though, you have to think if there is any point in visual camouflage of huge guys whose footsteps would make loud sound in almost any surface. And every race xept for orks must have pretty fucking great detection tools available.

>xept for orks
>underestimatin tha kunnin utiliteez ov proppa orky listnin' gubbinz

Rookie mistake.