MTG Magic The Gathering Ask A Judge - 「 W E D N E S D A Y W E E K 」

Good morning and welcome back!

Been looking through the cr during my spare time at work. I found a piece somewhere in replacement effects that said something along the lines of "if an effect tries to increase the amount of damage done, but 0 damage is being done, it does not increase it."

So does this mean if I control pyromancer's gauntlet and my opponent controls that r/w angel that halves damage, if i gut shot their face, am i able to apply replacement effects so the angel makes it zero, then the gauntlet tries to increase it but cant?

Also holy shit word of command is wonky

YOU won't be applying the replacement effects at all. THEY will. They're the affected player, since they're taking damage. They could either have Gauntlet add the +2, then have Sela halve that down to 1 (since it prevents 1.5 rounded up), or they can have Sela prevent half of 1 rounded up (down to 0) first. If they do that, Gut Shot is no longer attempting to deal damage to a permanent or player, so Gauntlet can't apply.

And yeah, Word of Command is fucky. It's a lot like Animate Dead- to explain it in "Player" is super easy: "I look at your hand, and make you cast it exactly as I tell you to.". It's just that the rules baggage to make it actually work is super verbose and weird.

Cool, thanks. Thats actually much more useful than I thought. I thought that the controller of the effect applied replacement effects. The more you know.

Nah. It's the controller of the affected object (or owner, if it doesn't have a controller), or the affected player.

If I have a 3/3 and my opponent lightning bolts it, but I really need it to stay alive, does it still die?

Also how many do-overs do you get in official play, 3 or 5?

...

What is the story behind Profane Command? You mentioned something about it last thread.

The house limit is 3 do-overs, sir.

So, way back in the day, Patrick Chapin won a game with some wordplay. He had a bunch of dudes, including a Chameleon Colossus. He cast a Command for X=6, choosing the modes of "target player loses 6 life" and "up to X target creatures gain fear until end of turn". He said "You lose 6 and all my legal targets gain fear", then swung out, including the Colossus... which did not have Fear, because it was not a legal target. His opponent assumed the Colossus had Fear because of the Command, and didn't block it, which meant that was enough damage for lethal- had the opponent blocked the Colossus, that would NOT have been lethal.

If I cast a summoning trap, and it resolves, would it be in the yard as a legal target for a torrential gearhulk that came into play because of said summoning trap?

Sorta. Trap would still be on the stack as the Gearhulk hits the board, because Gearhulk is cheated out as part of the spell's effect, so it's still resolving, which means it's still on the stack. After you look at your top 7, put a creature from among them on board, and put the rest on bottom in any order, THEN the Trap goes to the graveyard.

However, while Gearhulk triggers the moment it hits the board, that trigger won't go onto the STACK (and therefore, won't need a target) until after the Trap is done resolving. So by the time the trigger needs a target, Trap is in the graveyard, and is a legal target.

Thanks, Seems like something that could work in modern.

That seems a lot like lying about the board state.

Sasuga Patrick "Snitches get Stiches" "Bane of the DEA" "oh he just died on accident" Chapin

Reminds me of another game I heard about. Not sure who was playing but the game ended because of an esper charm. Player 1, pretty late in the game, cast esper charm EOT. When he cast it, he said "cast esper charm targeting myself". Player 2 immediately calls a judge over. Player 2 tells the judge "my opponent just targeted himself with esper charm. Player 1 said that was true and asked why it was a problem. The only mode of esper charm that targets players is the discard option. Player 2 just wanted to make sure player 1 couldn't correct himself. He had to discard his 2 remaining cards and promptly scooped.

Nah, it's actually legal. He said "all my legal targets gain fear", and let the opponent ASSUME Colossus was one of them. He never said he targeted Colossus, or that it had Fear, and the 'gamble' would have been wholly undone by a single question (like "Colossus has Pro Black, doesn't it?" or "Does Colossus have Fear?" or "So your whole team has Fear?").

Yeah, that was pretty reviled in the day. If I recall, it was discussed heavily and decided to be a 'gotcha' sort of thing, since technically he would have had to choose modes BEFORE targets. So in the future, something like that would be "I need you to clarify exactly what you're trying to do".

I have a buddy that's a level 2 and I've noticed he's become pretty full of himself. While not a judge, I'm no slouch with the rules and plenty of players hit me up with questions when I'm at the shop. I rarely get to respond if he's in ear shot as he cuts me off to insert his own unbidden, albeit correct, answer. I just wanted to know if that's a triggered ability or a replacement effect.

Seems like a replacement effect, since it's replacing the event of "you answering a question" with "him answering a question".

Ill have to point out the 'may' clause if he persists.

Let's say I have an Electrostatic Pummeler sitting at 1/1 with tons of energy in the bank and fling in my hand. My opponent casts an instant that will remove it.

Can I first spend energy to pump it and then cast Fling, or can I only cast Fling?

If i play a carthartic reunion while i have a flameblade adept in play, how many times does the ability trigger? Thanks

You can absolutely pump. After each activation resolves, everyone gets priority to do more stuff; it's not "lock in the stack and then it starts resolving". So you can say "I'm going to activate this guy N times", where N is however many times you CAN. After the last activation resolves, then you Fling. Then their removal spell probably fizzles.

Two triggers. It triggers per card you discarded, not per "instruction to discard some cards".

Great, that's what I thought re: pummeler. Thanks!

Happy to help! Notably, there's technically two ways to do it; saying "Activate Pummeler N times" is you proposing a shortcut where you activate it, your opponent has no response, the ability resolves, and you repeat however many times. No more than one activation is ever on the stack at a time this way, but your opponent can choose to interrupt that shortcut at any point. The other way is to say "Activate Pummeler N times, retaining priority each time". That'll put all the activations on the stack at once, one after the other, THEN pass priority to your opponent. The first one is the default- the other is an option available to you, but you have to explicitly say that's how you wanna do it. In formats without Trickbind, there's really not many good reasons to do it that way, though.

I have Diregraf Colossus in play. I cast Plague Belcher. Is the zombie token that gets created when I cast PB a legal target for the -1/-1 counters

shattered angel vs scapeshift

it is the scapeshift player's turn. he casts scapeshift. in response I use chord of calling to put shattered angel into play. he resolves scapeshift and puts valakut and 6 mountains into play. will I gain life first or take damage first? is it a choice? if so is the choice made by the opponent or me?

forgot image

yes it is a legal target

the Active Player puts their triggers on the stack first, then the Non Active Player does so. It will resolve in reverse order NAP's then AP's.
You'll get your life first.

At what point is a creature considered not attacking anymore? I understand the rules for getting blocked, and getting removed from combat.

But I want to know when the is latest I can play this card.

Yep! You get the Zamboni token when you CAST Bearer. That trigger resolves before Bearer, so it's "around" when Bearer's trigger needs a target. Enjoy your 5/4 Menace dude and bleeding your opponent for 1, for 2B.

He'll put his triggers on the stack, then you'll put yours. You'll gain 21 life in chunks of 3, then you'll take 18 damage in chunks of 3, assuming no Prismatic Omen. Net 3 gain.

Attacking creatures remain attacking until we move from combat. You can cast Built to Smash during the Declare Attackers, Declare Blockers, Combat Damage, and End of Combat steps.

"return a white creature you control to it's owners hand"

or what

Or nothing, really. If you're unable to do so (for example, because Darkest Hour is out, the ability will just shrug and do nothing. It'd be like saying "At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice an enchantment" while you have none; there is no repercussion for being unable to (if there was, it'd be listed- "At the beginning of your upkeep, DO THING. If you don't, OTHER THING").

So if you have no white creatures because of something like Darkest Hour, the ability will resolve and do nothing. IF you DO have a white creature, you'll have to return one- even if the only white creature you control is Eiganjo Free-Riders itself.

that makes sense, i'm just used to card that say "return a while creature you control to it's owners hand or sacrifice ~this~" but i guess this is technically better given the possibility of something like darkest hour.

Yeah. Kamigawa in general was fairly low-power, and for that timeframe a 3/4 flier for 4 at Uncommon was pretty strong, so that's MOSTLY intended to be a drawback- you'd need some other cheap white card to keep casting and bouncing to keep Free-Riders around.

You can turn that into an advantage, though- just couple it with something like Blade Splicer or Recruiter of the Guard to get value every time you bounce and replay.

And with that, I am going to bed.

Worms of the Earth, Dryad Arbor, and Countryside Crusher is on the battlefield.
I cast Clone targeting Arbor, does Crusher get a counter?

Countryside Crusher only triggers on land cards, which Clone is not.

I hope this isn't the wrong thread to ask this.

I finally got into actual paper mtg, and would like to build a simple first deck. Crocodile of the Crossing seems cool and I have 4 copies of him, so I'd like to try to build a deck around the -1/-1 mechanic. Cards like Exemplar of Strength, Quarry Hauler, Shed Weakness and the green Cartouche also revolve around the -1/-1 thing, so i thought of adding those. What else should I put in (from Amonkhet)? Black also has some -1/-1 cards, should I add that as a second color?

Clone doesn't target.

If you Clone a Dryad Arbor here, it's trying to enter as a land, but Worms of the Earth says that lands can't enter the battlefield. Because of that, and because Clone can't just stay where it is (which is what would happen if you, for example, activated a Groundskeepeer with Worms out), it just goes to the graveyard. The copy effect technically never kicked in, so it was never a Dryad Arbor, so it won't trigger Crusher, from the way I grok.

Generally, mono-color is tough because every color has some weak points. Using a second color to cover those weaknesses and complement the strengths is a solid decision. I'm not much help for deckbuilding, but a casual G/B -1/-1 counters deck sounds fun! Def put in Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons.

Okay I'm back, I have my list, and holy crap this was an epic journey for a newcomer. The idea about -1/-1 tokens hasn't changed but as soon as I began to build this I realized green/black was a must. And yeah, I have Hapatra.

Creatures:
4x Festering Mummy
4x Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons
4x Exemplar of Strength
3x Doomed Dissenter
3x Plague Belcher
4x Defiant Greatmaw
3x Crocodile of the Crossing

Instants:
3x Hapatra's Mark
3x Stinging Shot
4x Nest of Scarabs
3x Splendid Agony

Lands:
4x Foul Orchard
9x Forest
9x Swamp

Especially I would appreciate feedback about whether there's any point in running 3 copies of cards, or should I just go 4 with everything. And if so, what to drop?

I control a glorybringer. My opponent has a Heart of Kiran and a Gideon AoZ. Is there any reliable way for me to kill both (one with exert, 1 with combat), or do I have to settle for trading with Heart?

What I have learned in my 10 years of competitive play (the fuck has it been that long? Guess so, this basking rootwalla FNM promo is that old) is that when you're starting, the correct starting point is the "Rule of 9". Find 9 cards, get 4 copies of each, and 24 lands and you're good.

To that end, I'd cut stinging shot and plague belcher, add 2 more lands and convert the rest of the 3-ofs to 4-ofs. Should work fine against friends for KTF.

Only if they crewed the Heart of Kiran in response to you going to combat, before you declared attackers.

Nope. Clone comes into play as a dryad arbor, regardless of worms of the earth.

The wording on Worms seems to just say you cant play lands. Clone isnt a land until it comes into play, so worms will not effect it.

Hmm. Thanks, I appreciate your opinion. Dropping Plague Belcher does seem like a possibility, I originally included it because in addition to putting -1/-1 tokens into the table it has a minor sync with zombies. However, pretty much everyone keeps telling me that direct damage to players isn't worth it, so I could drop it to gain consistency elsewhere.

However, based on your input I came up with a compromise. The average mana cost has gone so much down since I began planning this list, I think I'm gonna be okay with 22 lands. Also, while this is not a super serious list, I think I'll keep the Stinging Shot to deal with flyers. Excellent scarab fodder too, if played on the right moment.

4x Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons
4x Festering Mummy
4x Doomed Dissenter
4x Exemplar of Strength
4x Channeler Initiate
4x Crocodile of the Crossing
4x Hapatra's Mark
4x Nest of Scarabs
3x Splendid Agony
3x Stinging Shot
4x Foul Orchard
9x Forest
9x Swamp

I don't see how the copy effect never kicked in and yet Worms prevented it. I understand that clone never entered the battlefield, but I guess it helps to understand when exactly clone becomes the copy. Is it part of its resolution, or is there a middle step between resolving and entering?

Is every single person in your meta running u/w flyers? Sure keep the shot. Buy you would be better off with fatal push or never//return.

G/b counters? Where is decimator beetle? You don't need to remove a counter to place one. It's a goddammed house with repeat activations.

Cut the doomed dissenters. I get what your going for, but it's too cute. There will come a time when you wish to cast anything else than it.

Yahenni's expertise. Almost all of your card when online are stronger than x/4 maybe 1 sided wrath. Easily sb out.

Hapatra is great cut one to two. A Legend in hand sucks when one is on the board. She is important but doesn't get better in multiples.

1-2 mouth//feed? Might get some card draw off there.

Looks like you are getting close just some tweaks to consider.

What exactly are the rules for counterfeit cards within tournaments? What exactly is the likelihood of someone being able to tell within a tournament environment? Asking for a friend

I'd like to keep this as much an Amonkhet deck as possible, but some of the cards you mentioned look tempting, and also pricey. It's my first deck so I'd like to keep the cost down (yes I know it's already really cheap). However if it turns out to be fun I'd be happy to tweak and improve it once I get to play with it.

Demolisher Beetle was an option earlier but I guess I was a bit intimidated by the 5 mana cost since everything else in the deck is pretty cheap. But I'll look into it. Someone on another forum also mentioned Blisterpod. Maybe instead of Doomed Dissenters?

Not running 4 copies of Hapatra is also something I was thinking of, maybe 2 would be enough, and that would give room for something else.

Would Yahenni's Expertise be a good choice with a table full of 1/1 token scarabs and snakes? Wouldn't it defeat the purpose of the deck?

Assuming the Heart isn't crewed, no. The Heart has to be alive for you to target it with the trigger, and they're probably not going to have animated it before you swing. So you'll attack, have no target (so there's no reason to Exert it), and they'll either let Gideon die or animate Heart and block for a trade. The only way you can get a two-fer is if Heart is already alive.

Incorrect. The Oracle text for Worms flat out says "Lands can't enter the battlefield". When you're dealing with cards that were printed 23 years ago, it always pays to check the Oracle.

Copy effect kicks in as Clone enters. Because it's kicked in immediately before Clone enters (this is why Cloning something that ETBs with counters won't 'skip' the counters- 'entering as a copy' is the earliest replacement effect for that), it's now trying to enter as a land, which isn't legal.

They're not allowed. If you're found to have fake cards, the Judges will investigate. If their investigation leads them to believe you didn't know you were using fakes, you'll just be given a Game Loss (your deck didn't match your list, since you didn't have those cards) and be given a reasonable timeframe to replace them with real copies. If you can't, you'll replace them with basic lands of your choice and your decklist will be changed to reflect that.

If the Judges suspect that you knew they were fake, you'll be DQed for Cheating.

*Decimator beetle. Brain fart.

Demolisher beetle would be cool tho

gA, what's your opinion on the leaked C17 Dragon Tribal Commander cards? As a judge and as a player, but in no official capacity.

As a Judge, there's not much opinion to have- they all seem to be pretty simple, rules-wise. As a player, I think they're fairly neat, though I wonder how they're gonna make a functioning 5 color manabase for a 35 dollar deck.